Daily Kos

Another Slimy Kerry Campaign Maneuver

by ElitistJohn

Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 01:36:30 AM PDT

You know, I've said I wouldn't do much for Kerry in the General, but now it's official.

I just heard about the latest slimy maneuver, this time here in DC. Tonight was the Gertrude Stein Democratic Club Dinner. The group voted for their endorsement in the DC Caucus for this Saturday. While, yes, Dean supporters were the greatest collection (followed by Kusinich, as I understand), there was no clear majority, so the Club made no endorsement for the Caucus.

Note, no one got it, so there was no one getting any gain out of this.

Then, after the dinner was over, the big whopping 20 Kerry supporters snuck back in after everyone left. Then a crony on the Board used an obscure by-law to reconviene and they voted the endorsement to Kerry.

Yep, a tiny minority stole another vote (Florida anyone?). One that wasn't even going to any competitor, and thus hurting them. As a result, the GS is now in a shambles of internal recimination (I guess the Kerry people didn't get that memo about "ABB" and "We're all in this together"...as I expected, that's only to bludgeon Dean/Clark people with.). So much for party building.

We won the DC Primary fair and square. We would have won even if the others hadn't cut out on Terry Mac's orders. We did while doing crazy things like putting back up opponenets signs that fell down the lamp posts.

Meanwhile sleazy Kerry steals votes in backroom tricks. I'm sorry, but character counts, and anyone who condones this stuff has all the character of Dorian Grey's painting. And this isn't a "rumor", it happened hours ago. No one can claim it's just Rove stirring things up.

I am officially done. Good job, John! I wasn't going to make any more donations to DFA until I saw what happened. Instead, I just kicked off a chunk of change...money that won't be available for any Dem Congressional candiadtes. I will only be making donations to DFA, or any 527 that comes out of it. So everyone thank Johnny Boy for cutting off that stream of revenue.

Congrats on driving away someone who took the initiative to surround the White House with campaign signs. Maybe one of those trust fund kiddies on your paid staff can come up with ideas like that for you.

All you enablers may now feel free to pull out all the "disloyal", "politics ain't beanbag", and other rationalizations you like. It just is a testament to the content of your characters, not an indictment of anything else.

Enjoy.

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Permalink | 37 comments

  •  Sorry (3.70 / 24)

    About forgetting to split the post so it didn't clog the Diaries page. You may also feel free to give me as many "Super Trolls" as you like. It doesn't change the facts posted.

    by ElitistJohn on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 01:37:53 AM PDT

    •  You made the CJR's blog! (none / 0)

      Your post was picked up by the Columbia Journalism Review:

      And a poster on The Daily Kos reports that Kerry supporters "stole" the endorsement of Washington DC's Gertrude Stein Democratic Club, by using an obscure by-law to reconvene the meeting after everyone had left, and voting to endorse their man. The Gertrude Stein Democratic Club? Now it's really in the bag.

      Noam Scheiber, writing on his weirdly-named New Republic blog, &c, comments on how the Meet the Press interview highlighted the president's problems with "the vision thing".

      In a moment of flashback, Mickey Kaus writing on Slate remembers that there's still, technically, a nomination fight going on, and acidly points out what a lot of our readers have been arguing: Wes Clark is getting an increasingly raw deal.

      And Michael Graham, writing on The National Review's blog, The Corner, notes "the general lack of passion, across the board" as Virginia's big day arrives....which feeds the assumption that John Kerry is a lock and the national primary process is already over."

      Obviously Graham hasn't been privy to the sturm und drang tearing apart the Gertrude Stein Democratic Club.

      --Zachary Roth


      Are you a Republican? A conservative? A dumbass? -- The Majority Report

      by Passing Shot on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 01:43:26 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  How (none / 0)

    do you know Kerry or his campaign were involved?

    Ronnie Earle

    by ct5voter on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 01:40:53 AM PDT

    •  Directly (none / 0)

      Other Dc for Dean people were there, and from GS members. Don't get much more direct than that.

      by ElitistJohn on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 01:42:08 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Well yeah, but (none / 0)

        How do you know the KERRY people were legitimate?  If they were this is huge.  Can they be identified?

        I mean, this just sounds, well, stupid.  Like the sort of thing the Cheat on homestar runner would do to get himself more medals or something.

        by abe ferlman on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 01:55:05 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Feel free (none / 0)

          To check in the am yourself.

          http://www.steindemocrats.org/

          by ElitistJohn on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 01:56:53 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Uh-oh (none / 0)

          Now you've gone and done it.

          Now we have to have a thread to figure out which Presidential candidate is which Homestar Runner character.

          I'll start us off:

          Marzipan - Kucinich (oddly enough)

          (If you don't know what we're talking about.)

          Mmmm... pants.

          by hyperbolic pants explosion on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 02:03:35 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  People do stupid stuff (none / 0)

          In my local state legislature district, one candidate tried to stuff the ballot box by adding a bunch of new party members who live out of state to vote absentee at the county Democratic party caucus meeting.  Why?  Simply because the bylaws in the county party do not have a residency requirement and this person could.

          by carlton858 on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 02:09:21 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  As a person who was at the Stein meeting... (4.00 / 3)

          ...I feel compelled to state my case.  

          Full disclosure: I'm a Dean supporter and not a member of the Stein Democrats.

          The meeting had great turnout - more than triple the average Stein meeting - and people wre passionate.  We sensed decent, if not overwhelming, support for Dean as we handed out stickers and literature on the way in.  The club had a 60 percent threshold for endorsement, so we figured that the most likely outcome would be a "no endorse" result.

          The candidate representatives spoke for their allotted two minutes, the Dean rep giving a passionate treatise on "electability."  The Kerry rep (the candidate's official GLBT coordinator) spoke for about four minutes without any warning or censure for running over time (all other reps were told "time" - perhaps it was just an oversight), and cited Kerry's long record of supporting (note: not sponsoring) GLBT-friendly legislation.  The Edwards and Clark reps gave great, even-keeled speechs about their candidates, and Kucinich's representative was received warmly.  Sharpton's rep was a no-show.

          Then the club members started speaking.  The Dean folk reiterated the "electability" issue and the fact that Dean has shaped the party platform (the "scream vs. echo" idiom).  The Kerry people went with the "he's already won" and "he's the only one who is truly electable" themes.  There were a few who supported others, but they were few, most calling for unity behind whomever wins the Dem nomination.

          Then the defections began.  Some folks who were solid Dean supporters said that, while their hearts were with Dean, their heads were with Kerry, and that they'd be casting their Stein club vote with Kerry.  It was a tangible blow to the Dean folk in attendance (both club members and non-club observers), but a dose of the new reality.

          Then the vote:  61 votes were cast, with 29 going to Kerry, 20 to Dean, 6 to Clark, 3 to Edwards, 2 to Kucinich, and 1 to Sharpton.  Kerry failed to win the require 60 percent for endorsement, all was going as expected....

          ....until somebody cited a club by-law that stated that a second ballot be cast if no candidate in a single-candidate outcome race achieved a plurality, then a second ballot may be cast by motion.  The debate started: people wanting to adjourn and go with a non-endorsement, people wanting to recess and pick up next week, people wanting the second vote now.  Frustrated people left, many of them Dean supporters.  The Kerry crowd stayed put, moving with passion for a second ballot.  Some people brought up the fact that this by-law was not pointed out before the meeting; other club members pointed out that, as members, they should be familiar with the by-laws.

          As a long-time Stein member said to me, "organizationally speaking, it was somewhat messy."

          And that is an extreme understatement.

          The president of the Stein tried to keep things in check, but he was lost.  The big issue was that, while the group seemed to be modeled around Robert's Rules of Order, the president and his cabinet were not familiar with all of the aspects of said rules.  Those who were more familiar fell in either of two camps: they tried to get the meeting to adhere to the rules, or they took advantage of the confusion to warp and twist the rules.  

          (Note/editorial: any group worth its salt that intends to follow Robert's Rules should have a copy on-hand at all times to resolve such disputes.)

          Additionally, newer members felt a bit intimidated by the veteran members.  Many of the veteran Stein Dems are passionate and loud people, whereas the newbies seemed less intent on rocking the boat.  So when the rules became an issue, it turned into a "motion-amendment-motion-second-point of order-motion-second-point of order" melee. It got ugly and dragged on for over an hour.

          Eventually, a second vote was cast, with Kerry winning endorsement by a single vote.  So the first GLBT endorsement for Kerry came from the DC Stein.

          The Dean folk, the Clark people and a couple of Stein exec board members tried to put off the vote, either by calling the meeting to recess or adjourning for the night.  But the Kerry folk stood firm.  They did not, as John mentioned "sneak back in," as the meeting had not officially ended.  Some of the Dean-supporting Stein members did leave after the endorsement results were announced and the meeting began to disintegrate - probably more out of frustration that the meeting was already overly long.

          At any rate, it wasn't an ideal outcome, it made somewhat of a mockery of a club that wants to be seen as legitimate, and if anything, the "victory" for Kerry is hollow, at best.

          Want rants? You got 'em: randomduck.com

          by DCFD Rudi on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 12:19:12 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  You're officially done? (1.57 / 7)

    You've already said like 200 times that you weren't going to support Kerry or the Democrats anyway. So your latest declaration falls more than a bit flat.

    by JamesB3 on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 02:03:59 AM PDT

    •  No (3.25 / 4)

      Though spinning the facts is as usual for you.

      I said I would likely not support Kerry (Until now there was always the chance I'd recant that when the time came...but now forget it). But as of now, I see no need to donate cash to anything other than this campaign for it's duration, and to the follow up 527. Anyone who endorses this clown is out too.

      by ElitistJohn on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 02:07:52 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Tit for tat, bucky... (3.25 / 4)

      Just because you didn't care for what he had to say, doesn't make him a troll, Jimmy.

      When you change the rating you gave ElitistJohn up from Troll, I'll gladly rate you up, too.

      Tilting at windmills, with the proper armor and enough firepower, can be a productive effort. http://www.43rdstateblues.com

      by Serephin on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 02:17:18 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Well, Captain America... (none / 0)

        when someone restates for what, the 50th time, that they won't support a candidate, then it does seem kind of trollish. It's like a Southern Baptist minister who decries porn as wrong and yet he can't quite stop ogling that Playboy. ElitistJohn has gone into "and this time I really mean it, no I do, NO, I do this time!!!" territory.

        BTW, you can rate me whatever you want. Feel free. I had no idea I was supposed to beg for your votes when I've done absolutely nothing to you. I don't even know you, although your penchant for calling me cutesy names would suggest you think otherwise.

        by JamesB3 on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 04:38:51 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Blog goon behavior (none / 0)

          when someone restates for what, the 50th time, that they won't support a candidate, then it does seem kind of trollish.

          And what you're doing is thuggish. Not as in "Rethuglican," but a thug. You don't like what ElitistJohn says, and though he is obviously not a troll, you ball up your virtual fist and slug him in the back of the head anyway, just because you can.

          You're a blog bully, punk. You and your little sidekick jbou have a nasty habit of slamming troll ratings on anyone you disagree with. You don't like a post? Fine, that's why there's a "Marginal" rating. But dropping "Troll" ratings like they were shitbombs is out of line, and it's an abuse of the system.

          You want to continue acting like an immature child? I can't stop you, but I will damn sure call you out on it.

          Tilting at windmills, with the proper armor and enough firepower, can be a productive effort. http://www.43rdstateblues.com

          by Serephin on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 11:03:35 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  What Seraphin said. (none / 0)

      Just coming off my own rating war from yesterday, might as well join another one in a support role.

      What FDR giveth; GWB taketh away.

      by Marie on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 04:53:48 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Umm... (none / 0)

    What is the Gertrude Stein Democratic Club?
    apostropher.com
    "A witty saying proves nothing." - Voltaire

    by apostropher on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 02:17:15 AM PDT

  •  Document, document, document (3.71 / 7)

    You already know this, I'm sure, but given the circumstances I'm going to say it anyway:

    Get as much of this as you possibly can documented, and do it now.  Get statements from everybody who was there and can attest to the fact that the group voted not to endorse anybody; that the meeting broke up in the ordinary way; that no one would have had any possible reason to know, let alone any actual notice, that the meeting would be 'reconvened' after they'd left.  Make sure that all statements reflect the fact that the original, legitimate head count showed that while there was no majority for any candidate, the biggest vote-getters were (i) Dean and then (ii) Kucinich.  Make sure you have hard copies of the minutes of both the first meeting and the second, surreptitious meeting, along with the bylaws showing how the procedure was managed.  If there were only 20 people present for the second vote, it would be good to be able to prove that.

    If you can't do it yourself -- and as I reread your post, I realize that you weren't present yourself -- whoever was upset enough at the proceedings to put you onto this should do it.  

    Assuming that your source is giving you an accurate account of what happened, it shouldn't be impossible to get at least this much evidence.  And if nobody does document it, the body politic will have to assume that it didn't really happen this way, and reasonably so; assuming that votes are fair and fairly counted unless somebody makes a fuss about it  is the only basis upon which the system can work.

    If any campaign is actually involved in this sort of behavior (and while I would prefer to believe that none is, the rumors are beginning to reach a troubling volume), it's precisely the sort of thing we all need to know about now, before it's too damned late.  If it's really happening, we need something that looks like strong evidence to a critical eye.

    by Iseult on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 02:19:52 AM PDT

  •  this isn't sleazy (2.33 / 3)

    It's politics, and comparing this to florida is disingenous.  

    I prefer peace Wouldn't have to have one worldly possession But essentially I'm an animal So just what do I do with all the aggression?

    by jbou on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 02:49:12 AM PDT

    •  it is sleazy (none / 1)

      It's very sleazy, especially for Democrats, who like to think of themselves as better than that.

      But the real question is, was it sponsored by the Kerry campaign, or was it just a bunch of jerks who happened to be pro-Kerry.

      It's finally here - AmericanGovernmentSimulation.com

      by bcarlson33 on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 02:54:24 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  This isn't sleazy? (none / 0)

      That attitude is what makes the Repubs think it's okay to demand votes on a bill the Dems haven't been given time to read, to attempt a vote when the Dems are out of the chambers deliberating, to get involved in state redistricting while not even bothering to hide the partisan motivation.  Why is it okay?  Because the Dems do it too.  And these Kerry supporters are proving them right.

      And you know what really turns people off on Kerry?  It's not the supporters who deny the Kerry campaign is coordinating the efforts -- we can at least pretend that these supporters are supremely naive, and would condemn the actions of the Kerry campaign if they were proven.  The real problem is the people like you who claim there's nothing wrong with it, even as you tell us that Kerry doesn't embody the "politics as usual" that drove so many supporters to Dean in the first place.

      The ironic thing, for "Mr. Electable" Kerry -- having to steal votes is a sign of weakness.  I can't wait for the Bush-Kerry contest to see who can be the most deceptive and steal the most votes from each other, because clearly neither knows how to earn votes fairly.

      "People who seem to have had a new idea have often simply stopped having an old idea" --Edwin Land

      by ShimokitaJer on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 10:39:07 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Actually kinda (none / 1)

    reminds me of some of the tactics in the HOuse these past months.... :)

    I'd say tho that this being the Gertrude Stein Democratic Club ... esp since last Thursday (was it?) when the MJC ruling came down adds a certain extra flip to it...

    by Marisacat on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 03:15:22 AM PDT

  •  This accusation is thin gruel... (none / 0)

    So I've posted a detailed response here, on my diary.

    Needless to say, I'm underwhelmed by this latest accusation of "dirty tricks" on top of all the other underwhelming accusations by supporters of candidates who did not win the early primaries.

    As I say in my diary, I remember when "dirty tricks" were really dirty. Being outmaneuvered does not a dirty trick make.

    Participate in the Authentic Journalism renaissance at Narco News

    by Al Giordano on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 11:25:58 AM PDT

    •  creates cynicism (none / 0)

      So maybe these aren't "dirty" tricks per se, but they are the kind of behavior that lends to the cynical non-participation we have in our country.  

      These tactics definitely discourage participation in politics -- I say this as a new member to the Dem party, who at this point am still questioning my commitment daily.

      by kiwing on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 11:49:29 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Proving again that Bush/Kerry are of same cloth (none / 0)

    Showing once again how Bush and Kerry are cut of the same cloth.

    Listen up folks!!!

    As things now seem to be shaping up, this November our nation will be faced with a momentous decision.  This decision will involve a choice between:

    a. a lying, corrupt, blue-blooded politician from Yale who led our country into a phony war for oil and empire, and
    b. a lying, corrupt, blue-blooded politician from Yale who helped the first politician lead our country into a phony war for oil and empire.

    Let us all sincerely pray to God that he gives our nation the wisdom to make the right choice.  

    "What is wrong with you?"--Jon Stewart to Tucker Carlson on "Crossfire."

    by PhillipG on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 11:30:05 AM PDT

  •  No Support For Congressional Dems? (none / 0)

    Maybe I'm misreading your entry, but you seem to be saying you refuse to support any congressional Democrats.  Or maybe what you're saying is this event caused you to give money to Dean that you might have otherwise given to a congressional Dem?

    If this is the case, I find that a little silly.  And I won't thank Kerry for cutting off that revenue stream, I would lay that at your feet.  You're the one choosing to cut off that revenue stream, so to speak, to Democratic candidates who had nothing to do with this event.  If you were talking about money to Kerry, fair enough.  But your entry makes it sound like you're blaming Kerry for you withholding financial support from Congressional Dems, and I don't see how they had anything to do with the actions in DC.

    Finally, do you know for sure that these supporters acted as official Kerry campaign workers?  I mean, were any of these people actually members of Kerry's campaign, or are they simply Kerry supporters that were members of the GSDC?  If they were simply Kerry supporters, than can you really blame Kerry for their actions?  Might they have acted out of their own enthusiasm, without the Kerry campaign's support or even knowledge?

    Not trying to troll, just some honest questions.

    John McCain says overturn the law that legalized abortion

    by aimlessmind on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 07:51:19 PM PDT

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