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So I was driving across Nevada, flipping through the radio and along came the Mike Savage show, crystal clear.  265 miles away from California.  It was very interesting of course, from a sociological perspective but also very disconcerting.

Maybe you're thinking, "well of course, quartz, what are ya, a maroon?"

"At times, yes..."

What was so disturbing to me was the first caller on last Friday's show.  He said his name was Sam and that he was a Coptic Christian from Egypt.  Savage obviously knew him as a regular caller.

As the conversation was pushed by Savage to the subject of Islamofascists, something very strange happened....

The caller's "Egyptian" accent disappeared!

He dropped into a dialect of "high redneck"...but for just a second....

I blinked and looked around; maybe it was just a hill our mountain, the signal cut out, and I wasn't hearing well.

But then, it happened again.

This time it was obvious.  Sam said, "they are multiplying like rabbits."  A very odd thing to say in Middle Eastern vernacular.  It was also said in "high redneck" rather than "faked Middle Eastern."

It was mind bending.  Faking an accent to disseminate hate.  An agent provacateur of the most radical sort.  Making up facts about Islam.  Legitimacy through lie.

Savage finally said something like, "Okay, that's enough Sam, we don't want to freak out our audience too bad."

Freaked out, freep out.

Superb diary by Nim is related to this subject.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/5/24/101417/432#98

Originally posted to quartzite on Tue May 24, 2005 at 10:06 AM PDT.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Recommended! (none)
    I think that would have probably made the hair on the back of my neck stand up...

    The Cognitive Dissonant... "Church and government differ only in the size and enforcement of collections"

    by Dood Abides on Tue May 24, 2005 at 10:07:57 AM PDT

  •  Little Green Footballs (4.00)
    as I understand it, registration is closed, they've got all the bigots and enablers of fascism they can take.
  •  RedState.Org (none)
    has banned me about six times already. My approach now is to just go completely against the grain in a calm manner. I only get trolled rated to hell with this approach.

    It pisses them off though.

    •  Please keep it up (none)
      I use "bans" as a chance to sharpen the words and positions..,..;)

      "You can't awaken a man who pretends to be asleep."-Navajo saying.

      by quartzite on Tue May 24, 2005 at 12:33:31 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Banned again (none)
        RonnieRaygun is no longer allowed to post.

        Try again with TomSawyer.

        I made a few points on the Conservative Laundry List diary and immediately got troll rated.

        •  Um.. (none)
          ..if you actually post something substantive, they won't ban you. I've seen your posts...you WERE trolling...

          Just $.02 from the other side of the aisle.

          In case anyone's curious, I'm jadedmara on Redstate.org.

          by jenabelle on Tue May 24, 2005 at 12:57:50 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Okay... (none)
            yet, trolls here are shot down with facts.

            I didn't see anyone kill off the libertarian with facts.  They just resorted to ad hominems *(go away, use drugs) when they had nothing left.

            They still didn't address the troll's points.

            "You can't awaken a man who pretends to be asleep."-Navajo saying.

            by quartzite on Tue May 24, 2005 at 01:18:21 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  yeah... (none)
            probably made some comments that could have been more moderate, but that wasn't the point of the exercise. I was at least hoping for a reaction before just getting banned.

            It seems difficult to start a debate there.

            •  Difficult to start a debate?!? (none)
              Have you checked out the site today? Josh Trevino is holding court with DKosers Armando and McJoan and getting beat up by the rest of the RS founders. Poor Erick is getting beat up by both conservative and liberal sides for comments about the CBC, and getting defended likewise by both sides. Josh also posted a story about how no one on RS supports confederates and gets challenged by others on that (including me, and i'm the most left-leaning Republican there, weirdly enough).

              And those are all on the front page.

              DissidentLiberal, yes, you'll get banned right away if you just come in and start ruffling feathers, because we've had our fair share of trolls and want to stop a problem before it starts. The same thing happens here, except more by the community (Kudos on that format, by the way).  The reason some RedStaters have survived on Kos is because some (like me) only post in response to a Redstate.com-type issue, and others, like doverspa, start out slow and establish that he's here in good faith and not to just distract and annoy. Doverspa's a trusted user now, by the way.

              So, like the Republicans on this site, you need to go to RS and start out slow. It's not fair, to a point, b/c you won't get away with as much as established Republican posters, but it's more because you're a guest in our home. The same thing is true for Dkos...again, most of us act with respect here.

              Now, unfortunately, they have your IP address and you're a repeat offender..so good luck, sir. You'll prob be banned b/c they don't trust you.

              In case anyone's curious, I'm jadedmara on Redstate.org.

              by jenabelle on Tue May 24, 2005 at 02:51:28 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  Also: (none)
              The whole point of the social laundry list thread was to NOT have debate (you can argue about the validity of that, my personal opinion is that that's the way Mike wanted it, that's the way we'd have it). Anyway, even regulars we know and like were told to knock it off if they started debating on that one.

              In case anyone's curious, I'm jadedmara on Redstate.org.

              by jenabelle on Tue May 24, 2005 at 03:52:42 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Ok (none)
                so tell me what was so bad about Tom Sawyers posts, cause that name is banned now as well.

                I feel like taking to argument to them, so I will continue to drop in occaissionally and voice my opposition and sow some seeds of dissent.

                If there is no opposing voice presented anywhere, then they do not get to hear an opposing argument. Not good enough.

                Apparently they think that RonnieRaygun is Armando btw.

                •  asdf (none)
                  Oh, they hear plenty of opposing arguments. I haven't checked out your new posts, so I can't comment on whether or not they are actually constructive, but the key is to actually come in good faith, not just to stir up trouble. That's all.

                  In case anyone's curious, I'm jadedmara on Redstate.org.

                  by jenabelle on Wed May 25, 2005 at 12:34:10 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                •  Don't flatter yourself (none)
                  We're under no impression that RonnieRayGun (or his four alter egos) are Armando. Trust me. We actually appreciate the 'real' Armando on RedState.org - and by the way, he used his real email address to sign up, not .Mac aliases.

                  The reason RonnieRayGun was banned was because you had four other accounts that had clearly violated the posting rules. Having a fifth account and pretending that everything's OK because that particular psuedonym is clean doesn't cut it.

                  If you really want to engage people in debate, do it without being deceitful and you'll go a lot farther.

    •  You were banned not for tone, (none)
      but for adding no substance to the conversation.  Snipe and snark and tired old boilerplate is a violation of the posting rules if done so on a consistent basis.
  •  You know what would be cool? (none)
    If there was a concerted effort by about 100 - 200 Kossacks.

    Over the course of a week or two, everyone signs up with a chosen right wing blog and develops an alter ego.

    Then, on a chosen day, everyone starts posting as moderate republicans who are unhappy with the NeoCons running the country.

    Just to try and create a divide amongst them. It would be effective if there were a significant number of people echoing those ideas. Since they tend to have a herd mentality.

    Either that or just swamp the site with dissent for as long as we can and drive them nuts with factual information.

    •  I like it (none)
      "Facts are stubborn things."

      -A famous (R) president

      The beautiful thing is when people talk about how Saddam was a bad man, you can point them to Rummy and Saddam's video.

      I always hate arguing verbally.  Nothing can be proven until you've got the "Internets"....;)

      Keep up the good work!

      "You can't awaken a man who pretends to be asleep."-Navajo saying.

      by quartzite on Tue May 24, 2005 at 01:20:06 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  well (none)
        Let's test the water with a couple of recruitment Diaries, or work on a plan of attack before doing those. Basically just outline what we are going to do, present it and take some suggestions in. Hopefully gather some support and see if makes a difference.

        If peoples alter egos are kept alive than they could drop a comment or two a day in the same manner that they may do here.

        It would be nice to do a couple of all out attacks though, put them on their toes a little.

      •  Eh (none)
        except that it would be a very public plan, which may scuttle it in the end. But if it sounds like a good idea to you, let me know.
        •  Yes, I like the idea (none)
          Devil's in the details, but I'll look for you next week and try to post if you do a diary.

          "You can't awaken a man who pretends to be asleep."-Navajo saying.

          by quartzite on Fri May 27, 2005 at 03:06:41 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

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