US won't let Canada help Katrina victims

"Things that make you want to scream" for $500, Alex...

Okay, first this article:

A specialized urban search and rescue team from Vancouver will be joining the rescue efforts in Louisiana in the wake of hurricane Katrina.

B.C. Solicitor General John Les said the province decided to send Vancouver Urban Search and Rescue (USAR) after officials in Louisiana asked for help.

"We're the first non-U.S.-based team to be requested," said Les. "They're going to be helping as many people as they can."

CTV Vancouver has learned that the team will board a plane Wednesday night heading to Lafayette, Louisiana, where local authorities will direct them to devastated areas.

Sounds great! Except for one problem -- this team wasn't allowed to fly into the US, blocked by Homeland Security from entering. A Canadian reader sends this report:

On tonight's news, CTV (Canadian TV) said that support was offered from Canada. Planes are ready to load with food and medical supplies and a system called "DART" which can provide fresh water and medical supplies is standing by. Department of Homeland Security as well as other U.S. agencies were contacted by the Canadian government requesting permission to provide help. Despite this contact, Canada has not been allowed to fly supplies and personnel to the areas hit by Katrina. So, everything here is grounded. Prime Minister Paul Martin is reportedly trying to speak to President Bush tonight or tomorrow to ask him why the U.S. federal government will not allow aid from Canada into Louisiana and Mississippi. That said, the Canadian Red Cross is reportedly allowed into the area.

Canadian agencies are saying that foreign aid is probably not being permitted into Louisiana and Mississippi because of "mass confusion" at the U.S. federal level in the wake of the storm.

Once the hard-hit region is back on its feet, there better be a full accounting of the preparation and response to this catastrophe.

•  AAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!

  Have you ever seen someone literally spitting mad?

  by Tomato Observer on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 08:57:28 PM PDT

  •  Horrible

    This makes me lend even more credence to yesterday's Diary with an offensive title.  I'm beginning to think they want people to die.

    by xeju on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:07:35 PM PDT

    •  They don't want the truth to come out

      This editorial in Biloxi  mentions reporters unable to get good information on the distruction
      http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001052870

      The GOP has crap all over their faces over this one.  They know it, so just hide the facts as always.  With the Canadians there a body count gets out.  

      This is almost as sick as cancelling search and rescue to stop looting.  Where's Rumsfeld when you need him with his "redistribution of wealth" theory.

      by Yankee in exile on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:13:07 PM PDT

      •  Bush has also refused help from Venezuela

        I diaried about Hugo Chavez's offer of help here.

        According to this comment thread in another diary, the help has been rejected.

        Unbelievable.

        by MaximusNYC on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:42:15 PM PDT

        •  I AM PISSED......

          I almost dropped my glass of water when I saw this. The administration is INCREDIBLY INCOMPETENT! There is NO EXCUSE for denying Canadian assistance!

          BUSH IS BY FAR THE WORST PRESIDENT EVER! EVER!

          Pacific NW Portal - Regional Politics At Your Fingertips

          by MountOlympus on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:04:53 PM PDT

          •  Especially this team

             The Vancouver Urban Search and Rescue team is one of the best trained and qualified rescue teams in the world for land or water. They were at 9/11, and the earthquakes in both Iran and Turkey.

             The team was originally modeled after the US FEMA 62 member model (under the Clinton adm. & James Lee Witt)

            The officials in Louisiana requested their help  and Bush's Homeland Security won't allow them into the US  --- WTF!!

            I just don't understand this administration!

            by Best in Show on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:57:05 PM PDT

            •  What's not to understand?

              This admininstration is

              1. Incompetent. (They know this, so they use extreme secrecey to hide their incompetence.)
              2. Does not understand or believe in government.
              3. Believes that a person's only function is to get rich (and expects the government it doesn't believe in to be a major source of funds.)
              4. and finally is filled with angry ignorant people who don't give a shit about anyone else.

              They are once again demonstrating that they could not successfully organize and manage a dog fight with willing and angry dogs. That is, they are demonstrating that they learned nothing from their haplessness that permitted 9/11.

              Expect them to attack the people who are pointing out their incompetency. That is something that can be done by an angry, ignorant, anti-social incompetent of the type who today runs the Republican Party.

              by Rick B on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 11:50:38 PM PDT

              •  Did anyone else see...

                ...Haley Barbour on CNN this morning?  Yelping hysterically about the fine, FINE response of the Federal Government to the crisis.

                The thing about Republicans is that they have no shame.  They don't stop.  There could be - hell, THERE ARE - a pile of bodies at Barbour's feet, and his agenda remains the same.  

                by escapee on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 05:50:19 AM PDT

            •  This is NOT

              ..going to go over well in an increasingly pissed off Canada. The DART team also met difficulties in responding to the tsunami - those difficulties made sense - the regions affected where as culturally, socially and  linguistically foreign to their skills and training as any place on earth. There was public outrage none-the-less - this country wanted them in the air, on the way immediately!!! There were many patient on-air explanations by officials - 'we're trying, but without being specifically requested, we would just be in the way, we've insured that officials in each country are away of our availability', etc...

              The current situation however - exactly matches their skills, language, training, etc. This will make for an interesting dilemma here - the earnest desire to help the PEOPLE we know and love as our neighbors, while being spit on by an administration that is increasingly belligerent and hostile to our country.

              Excuse my language people, but fuck!

              by wabegg on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:02:10 AM PDT

              •  agree

                Canada pays alot to keep this team ready to go and this is perfectly suited to their skills.

                by sommervr on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:14:53 AM PDT

          •  NOT INCOMPETENT BUT CRIMINAL! n/t

            by Maine Atticus on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 08:45:14 AM PDT

        •  Well, in JoJo's defense,

          Chavez did call him an asshole, and one simply doesn't do that to G.W. Bush, no matter how many plebes suffer when he pouts.  Besides, most of the White (i.e., Rethug) people got out in time.  I'm sure Onkel Karl is tallying Dem votes lost to drowning.

          by moltar on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 01:17:02 AM PDT

          •  Speaking of Chavez

            Chavez blasts Bush for vacationing while Katrina slammed the Gulf coast.

            I'm new here, and not sure how to format the gray quote box, so Chavez' quote is in bold.

            "For four days there were warnings that (Katrina) was going to make a direct hit, and the king of vacations at his ranch only said 'you must flee.' He did not say how," Chavez said, charging that the United States had no evacuation plans. "It's the rancher mentality."

            by MHoward on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:46:10 AM PDT

            •  How to blockquote

              [blockquote] to start [/blockquote] to finish - (replace [ and ] with angle quotes - the ones that look like greater than or less than signs.

              DFooK

              by deepfish on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 05:05:17 AM PDT

            •  It's no wonder...

              ...that Pat Robertson and the U.S. Government want Chavez dead. He's not afraid to tell the truth about the boobs we have in office.

              The Democrats could learn a thing or two from him.

              by edicius on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 05:11:47 AM PDT

            •  Reminds me of Jon Stewart's Report

              on the Homeland Security response to that airplane flying too close to the White House some time ago:

              "Run Like Hell!"

              So much for the billions poured into civil defence and emergency preparedness. The Bush administration is Kafka-esque in its bureaucracy and denial of basic logic and humanity.

              God Save the USA (from Bush).

              You all have my deepest sympathies (for the effects of Katrina and for the hell you are undergoing under Bush).

              Best Wishes, Andy (a Canadian).

              by Hrothgar on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 08:49:21 AM PDT

        •  BBC lead story Thursday...

          ... is that a "number of European governments" have offered assistance for Katrina and it has been turned down.  "We have made no requests for assistance" is the response from the White House the BBC is reporting.

          Will post link as soon as they put up the story on their web site.  Nothing other than the lead on BBC world radio at this point.

          by Hector Solon on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 06:43:28 AM PDT

      •  I'll tell you where Rummy is...

        He's sitting in his office trying to figure out how to pin Katrina on Iran so he can justify bombing them.

        by democracy inaction on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:02:31 AM PDT

        •  it weren't no hurricane

          it was a terrorist attack using wmd disguised as a hurricane. and the terrorists were all from iran and they're gettin smarter and smarter. we gotta get em

          by titotitotito on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 04:32:27 AM PDT

    •  Out of sight, out of mind...

      ....why else would they want the refugees in the Astrodome?  There's no showers except for the locker rooms and no cooking facility except the concession stands.

      A much better idea would be to use the state university dorms to house the refugees, with food available at the cafeterias - the students can be sent to a school out of state or just start their school year second semester.

      If there's not enough room there, then they can always house people at Mississippi's seg academies...

      The Superdome served its purpose, protecting thousands of people from the storm and the floodwaters.  But it, and any other non-residential building, is unsuitable to house people for any prolonged length of time.
      

      by varro on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:50:30 PM PDT

      •  asdf

        If you're going to do that then you'd have to federalize all university dorming within the applicable area. State universities are attended disproportionately by poorer and minority students, and it would be patently absurd to let the rich kids go to their rich colleges while simultaneously putting the screw to everyone else.

        by loyalson on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 01:31:08 AM PDT

      •  Work with what you can

        I'm sorry but in this case the complaint isn't valid.  Where in the world do you put in excess of 20000 people and have all the facilities necessary to care for them?  Nowhere is the answer.  You find a big place with a roof and airconditioning and you build the rest as you go.  So it seems like a good decision to me.  Anywhere you put them there will be problems.

        The schools are in session as well and I suspect Astrodome life will be much better than dorm life.  They would have to clean up all the puke first.

        by jrflorida on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 07:23:51 AM PDT

  •  I always think

    ... they've hit bottom, and they always find a new bottom.

    by hyperbolic pants explosion on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:47:35 PM PDT

  •  Coming soon:

    Video KOS!®

    

    by subtropolis on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 12:09:32 AM PDT

  •  Your government is making it hard...

    ...for us to even help you.

    We like Americans very much, but you really need to do something about the guy supposedly in charge.

    Maybe this should be brought up at the next Hannity or O'Reilly pity-part about how the US doesn't get respect any more.

    by bartkid on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 10:20:00 AM PDT

•  UNbelievable!!!

  But it really doesn't surprise me considering the incompetence of Bush and his cohorts.

  by humphrey on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 08:58:45 PM PDT

  •  I continue to be shocked by ...

    ...this Administration. But I am NEVER surprised.

    by Meteor Blades on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:10:05 PM PDT

    •  Know exactly what you mean.

      Whenever I think that something is the stupidest thing that could have been done, bushco turns around and does something even more stupid!

      rrrrrrrrrrr

      by Street Kid on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:43:44 PM PDT

•  "mass confusion"

  I have no doubt about that.  Hopefully this information is shared far and wide before anyone starts screaming about a perceived lack of foreign aid.

  by Nancy in LA on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 08:59:08 PM PDT

  •  Then let's share it far and wide! :)

    Check these tips to Write Letters to the Editors that have more chances of getting published (the tips include a link to the Media Database to find local papers to target), and fire away!

    Don't just complain, Take Action.

    by cyrilb on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:46:49 PM PDT

    •  Thanks...

      for linking to this.  

      by Street Kid on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 11:31:58 PM PDT

  •  This is the most disconnected

    White House since Hoover, and at the same time more criminal and less competent.  The few thinking and courageous Republicans remaining need to draw up impeachment charges post haste to save the country and their party.  Come '08, the Democrats will need a principled opposition for the next sixty years.

    by Mogolori on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:56:58 PM PDT

    •  How will the Democratic Leadership deal with this?

      This is as incompetent as the occupation of Iraq. Is the Democratic Leadership going to continue to be timid and quiet?

      This isn't a war. Maybe they can be convinced to get on the angry-at-incompetence bandwagon without being afraid of sounding too strident or looking unpatriotic.

      I can't wait for the DLC to let us know what the Republican talking points are.

      I'd like to see the Democrats bring this up. I just don't expect it. They are going to let the Republicans skate on this like they have on the disaster in Iraq.

      by Rick B on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 11:58:57 PM PDT

      •  Apparently *we* are the Dem leadership...

        ...til they grow some spine take matters into your own hands.

        • Write LTEs
          
        • Phone call-in radio and TV shows
          
        • Post on non-political boards
          
        • Chat with folks over the water cooler/ in line at the coffee shop
          
        • Write your elected officials -- from village hall to county and state to DC

        Stop looking for someone else to do what needs doing. Just do it.

        by thesill on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 06:50:16 AM PDT

        •  Someone needs to coordinate action

          Stop looking for someone else to do what needs doing. Just do it.

          Yeah, right.

          An uncoordinated mob will always be defeated by a smaller disciplined army. The Republicans are in office because they are highly disciplined and have no organized opposition.

          My LTEs are already sent, with more to come. Same for my money. I am a Democratic Precinct Chair. I'm just damned tired of trying to do it alone, especially here in Texas where admitting you are a Democrat has become some form of social disease. I think I have earned the right to be disgusted at the Democratic Party failure.

          What have YOU done? Voted for Nadar?

          by Rick B on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 09:17:28 AM PDT

          •  asdf

            I don't have any money to spare, but I've been waging a campaign in the Denton Record-Chronicle for the past few years on the letter page. I ran for school board just to see what it was like to run for office (and because I hate unopposed elections), and am thinking about running for State Congress here in Texas. If I do, though, I won't run as a Democrat unless the party gets some real leadership. Just because I despise the Republicans doesn't mean I'm going to sign on with a bunch of dudes who can't figure out how to say "Bush sucks."

            by walkingshark on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 10:11:53 AM PDT

            •  You can't beat something with nothing

              And in a two-party system, third parties and independents are nothing. I'm from Denton, live in Fort Worth, and was represented previously by Martin Frost. Now there is this ignorant MD from Lewisville. [God save us from overtrainned and undereducated technicians who attempt politics when they have some spare money to waste! Frist and Ron Paul, anyone?]

              If you can work hard enough to run for office, you can work hard enough to help turn the Democratic Party in Texas back into a political party from whatever gutter it currently resides in. You have no other vehicle with which to effectively make a difference. It takes people working in groups to change politics.

              That is why Libertarians are self-defeating fools. People aren't just individuals. They are as much social or pack animals as dogs are, and politics is a group activity. If you can't work with others, you a politically useless.

              by Rick B on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 11:27:36 AM PDT

          •  I've done and am doing plenty...

            No need to pee on fire hydrants but I am doing all that you've listed and more. And I'll keep working my ass off doing it until either the Democratic Party rights its ship, folds under the weight of its own crap or people like you and I take it over and fix it. The difference here is I realize I'm not alone even if much of the time it seems like it.

            Do you have any elected Democrats near you? If so make sure they know you want them to step up. If not -- write Reid and Pelosi and Dean.

            by thesill on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 10:21:43 AM PDT

      •  Cricket...cricket...

        There will be no intelligent or purposeful response from the Democratic "leadership."  I'm not even sure who they are at this point anyway.

        by Island Expat on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 09:53:10 AM PDT

  •  Lack of foreign aid

    I think thats it.  From the get go they've been calling this our tsunami and wondering whether the world would respond.  They want Americans to not care what the world thinks because in fact the world hates what America is doing right now.  So what better way of difusing that perception than to make the world look bad.  I can't see any other reason to refuse aid.  

    by jrflorida on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 07:31:39 AM PDT

    •  Exactly

      Bush said it himself this morning on GMA - effectively, "thanks, but no thanks - we can take care of ourselves".  Dumbass.

      by Nancy in LA on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 10:16:32 AM PDT

•  c'mon, they can hardly be trusted....

  if they weren't part of the "coalition of the willing."

  i don't mean to joke.  i'm at my wits end over all of this.  the carnage, the misery, and the idea that i'm a thousand miles away with little i can do to help.

  i'd at least like to see my government helping---really helping---on my behalf.

  by William S Martin on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:00:09 PM PDT

  •  Don't forget...

    ...to ask Poland for aid.

    by varro on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:52:12 PM PDT

•  Mass confusion?

  I would have thought they'd get used to that after 5 years?

  I bet the real reason is they don't want to shown up for the blundering idiots they are.

  by brenda on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:00:17 PM PDT

  •  i'm not gloating

    Salut from Montréal,

    i have to agree that it seems possible that there might be some truth to that. Perhaps they don't want CNN swanning over the cool tech that our socialist system can provide. You beat us to the moon but...

    But seriously – there might be something there. And that would suck. The state & parish authorities are at (past?) the breaking point. I heard so many interviews today from police, nurses, everyone, all pleading for help. No matter the cause, this is just sick.

    You'all might hear a lot of shit from up here over this, and yes, a lot of us do think the Conneticut Cowboy is a weasel. But a lot of us won't be gloating. Canada has a long connection to the Southern United States. A lot of the French Acadians we threw out ended up in Louisiana. My grandpa had a brother in Mississippi somewhere. And the South to Canada, first the revolution, the Civil War (Montreal – city of intrigue), the Underground Railroad, Jazz...

    So however this might blow up in the US's face (because the egg tossed by Junior lands on the rest of you) i urge you to keep this in the media's faces. This is just stupid. And we want to help.

    And anyway hell, i'd feel this way if i was Swiss. Or Swedish.

    by subtropolis on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:18:38 PM PDT

    •  Hallibuton wants an exclusive contract

      to clean up and serve MRE's. The company does not want any foreigners interferring with their monopoly.

      Seriously I cannot fathom why expert help would be refused. What good reason can they possibly have?

      by Agathena on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 12:37:37 AM PDT

    •  other explanation?

      CTV Vancouver has learned that the team will board a plane Wednesday night heading to Lafayette, Louisiana, where local authorities will direct them to devastated areas.

      Warning - total speculation on my part.

      If they weren't taking their own planes (Homeland security risk - unacceptable) - then they would have been going through American customs in Vancouver airport.

      I live in Vancouver. I used to travel a lot - at least 7, 8, 9 trips a year to the states. Visiting family, visiting friends, passing through in transit to somewhere else, etc....

      Since 9/11 I've watched Customs and Immigration (American) in Vancouver airport get more and more disturbing. It's become some scary shit people - and I don't have the nerve to do it anymore. I haven't crossed that border in 6 months - those family and friends... well, I miss them, and really want to see them, I miss your country, but...

      It's very easy for me to imagine a couple of ill-informed, terrorist-hunting agents - agents who've becomed very accustomed to denying people entry to the US - get freaked out about a large group of men with gear, perhaps a guy in a turban (Actual photo of team) - they're unable, based on total lack of information flow to confirm or deny anything.....

      I've been denied entry people... it's random, it has a momentum all its own, they err on the side of caution without any rhyme or reason, and have become pretty fucking flippant about it. Who ya' gonna' call? If you appear to be stressed or upset about the total disruption of your travel plans... you know, like maybe trying to insist that your purpose in entering the US is to save lives god-damn-it!!! Well - emotion... it's not a stretch for me to imagine these guys getting throw out by security.

      Again - I know nothing about what actually happened, have no idea whether something like this could or could not have happened... but wanted to offer this anyway...

      God - help us all....

      by wabegg on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:37:54 AM PDT

    •  Bonjour Montreal

      You needn't apologize, I'm from Minnesota .... hey, can we join up with you guys?

      Seriously, I listen to As It Happens most evenings. "Hello, I'm Barbara Budd" is music to my ears. You folks got that thing going in Canada there...what's it called? Umm...oh yeah!...it's called "culture". We should try that sometime.

      by brenda on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 05:57:11 AM PDT

      •  As It Happens

        Absolutely top notch! (CBC radio for those of you who don't know. Excellent show.)

        by subtropolis on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 08:25:26 AM PDT

•  More blood

  On Shrubco's hands.

  by hazzcon on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:00:50 PM PDT

  •  It's not just about the Bush admin

    Once the hard-hit region is back on its feet, there better be a full accounting of the preparation and response to this catastrophe.

    I think the project is bigger than this: it's nothing less than a complete revamp of the American psyche, an update to the twentieth century (sic).

    We in Europe are watching this in horror, and some of us are making donations as we would to a third world country.  And some of us who have talked to Americans for years are only just realising that we got it wrong all those years.  We used to hotly deny we were particularly communist, and say "look, we're just like you mostly, modern western democracies".  

    But I see now we are more communist than you, and that's a good thing.  We can use the weasel word 'communitarian', but it amounts to the same thing.  
    

    by Del C on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 12:17:09 AM PDT

•  I expected that.

  From when I heard Canada had offered help I expected that the Bush administration would turn it down. They want to be able to say that the international community didn't help, so it's damned inconvenient if they do. How can you destroy the U.N. if the international community steps up to the plate to help your own devastated cities? And we all know where rebuilding devastated cities stands in status vs. destroying the U.N.

  by Magenta on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:00:51 PM PDT

  •  "It's OUR natural disaster..."

    "We don't need your help.  We don't WANT your help."

    Insane.  Simply insane.  Will there ever be an accounting for this incompetence?

    by Titian on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 05:05:05 AM PDT

•  Talk about incompetent.

  Has our Federal Government gotten so lame that they can't even answer the phone and say "Umm, OK?"

  by Mike S on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:00:51 PM PDT

•  Trifecta

  Bush will spin this to his advantage, of course.  He will claim the disastrous economy (just wait) is not his fault - the hurricane.  The price of gas is not his fault - the hurricane.  The war is not his fault - the hurricane.  

  Impeachment, people.  The time has come.

  by stlawrence on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:01:00 PM PDT

•  With Friends Like This....

  Sorry Louisiana.  A legitimate offer of aid has been declined because of "mass confusion" on the part of your own federal government.

  See, Louisiana...there's just no end to the ways your federal government's incompetence is screwing you.

  by happiness cat on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:01:19 PM PDT

  •  Not incompetent

    It's intentional, IMO

    by Magenta on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:02:47 PM PDT

    •  Offshore

      In the meantime jerkoffs on FoxNews say things like "The US is always first to bring aid to furriners. I bet those furriners won't be sending us any aid".

      by Albatross2147 on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:27:26 PM PDT

      •  Right.

        The Bush administration loses all credibility if they take foreign aid. We're the "pull yourselves up by your bootstraps" nation. And if people can't do that on their own, we're not going to let foreignors help them out.

        Now, I hope it backfires and we take all comers, but I'm not optimistic.

        by Magenta on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:33:59 PM PDT

  •  random katrina question

    we've all seen the "looters vs. finders" pics.

    is the charge of racism at all mitigated by the fact that different news agencies supplied the pictures?

    the "find" picture is AFP, whereas both "looting" pics are AP.  conversely, has anybody seen an AFP pic of "looting" or an AP pic of "finding"?

    by Cedwyn on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:05:14 PM PDT

    •  weird

      didn't mean to reply to you.  sorry for the confusion.

      by Cedwyn on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:06:04 PM PDT

      •  weirder still

        You were just replying to yourself.

        by subtropolis on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:19:46 PM PDT

    •  CNN has one of the previous AP looter pics...

      ...on a slideshow, but have neutralized the language. The kid is now merely "carrying groceries".

      http://www.cnn.com/interactive/weather/0508/gallery.katrina.tues.pm/frameset.exclude.html

      by Young Freud on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:08:36 PM PDT

    •  AFP picture of "looting" right 'ere

      Take a look at
      
      this AFP picture:

      

      Caption:
      

      Looters hit a drug store in the French Quarter district of New Orleans in New Orleans, Louisiana, following Hurricane Katrina. Fresh floods, fires and looting rode in the destructive wake of Hurricane Katrina, deepening a humanitarian crisis that left hundreds feared dead and sections of New Orleans submerged to the rooftops.(AFP/James Nielsen)

      As someone pointed out earlier, note that the store says "Now open", and the supposed "looter" has items in grocery bags!

      This picture above, coupled with the AFP one of white folks "finding" supplies in a store, should be used in the racism charge. Both of these are now from the same agency.

      by MilongaMan on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:21:02 PM PDT

      •  ok except

        the store does look closed to me. Only saying i wouldn't rely on that as the pillar of your arguement.

        by subtropolis on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:21:41 PM PDT

        •  The 'NOW OPEN' signs and

          automatic doors opening for customers are a dead giveaway that the store is, in fact, open. It does not look closed AT ALL.

          by Xeno of Elia on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 12:04:13 AM PDT

          •  signs shmigns

            And doors can be forced. All i'm saying is that, aside from th signs, it doesn't really look as if the store is, in fact, open for business. Whether those people are taking things without paying is none of my concern (aside for the general concern for their safety, that is).

            If you want to argue about this that's fine with me. I think you have a good point. But i recommend you don't shout 'conspiracy' and that that store is open. To me, it looks dark.

            by subtropolis on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 08:30:29 AM PDT

            •  Ummm...

              Maybe it 'looks dark' because there is no power?

              by By The Root on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 08:40:35 AM PDT

              •  smacks forehead (twice)

                ok, my rational thought has failed me. I stand by my original statement, though. I don't care if people are grabbing shit from stores. It saddens me that some are carrying off electronics and whatnot but food, water, diapers, shoes: fuck, take it!

                by subtropolis on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 01:17:44 PM PDT

        •  does not matter

          This was just a tangential comment. It does not matter if the store is in fact open or not.

          Let's say the black woman is in fact taking stuff without paying. OK. So, in this picture, she is "looting", and in the other picture, the white folks are "finding". Both pictures from the same agency, AFP.

          That's all one needs for the argument.

          by MilongaMan on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 10:15:20 AM PDT

      •  Sigh...

        You know, you guys have pretty much discredited yourselves completely by claiming there is no looting going on in New Orleans.

        I can't tell my looking at every photograph what is happening.  Yeah this picture looks like a rush on a store that happens to be open.

        But CNN had a street interview with some kids who had stolen about a dozen pairs of nikes, and they were pretty much admitting they stole 'em.  But, yeah, yeah... I know... They weren't stealing the nikes, they were Liberating them from the occupying forces of the shoe store.

        Whatever.  This whole debate is crap.

        by Steve4Clark on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:45:46 PM PDT

        •  Looting or surviving?

          A lot of what is being called looting is really surviving based on what I have seen.  

          And who has claimed that there is no looting going on?

          by Shockwave on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:58:35 PM PDT

          •  Let's see a little balance...

            Instead of claiming every picture isn't looting... Let's see a bit of balance, and condemn the kids stealing the nikes and blue jeans.

            That's how you frame an issue.  When you only complain about one side, you just end up looking discredited and foolish.

            by Steve4Clark on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 11:07:46 PM PDT

            •  If I was a kid in NO today...

              ...I might want to get me and my friends some sneakers if I could. I may not have more than one pair of very wet shoes. Kids may not have a clue of whats going on. And furthermore, as minors they have a much more difficult time of telling right from wrong, according to the law.

              Of course there is looting. What does that change?
              

              by Shockwave on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 11:31:44 PM PDT

            •  Yes

              Let's all condemn children who've are surviving one of the greatest disasters in American history for their supposed moral failures.  We'll look real good, then.

              Feh.  I'd rather look bad.

              by Drew on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 11:51:05 PM PDT

            •  I do not deny there is looting

              but I question the importance of it. Right now in New Orleans people can literally get away with murder. Murder someone, throw their body in the flood water, no one would ever know. Yes law and order is needed to protect people's lives. However, the flood makes accumulation and protection of material goods a minor concern.

              by Agathena on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 01:00:14 AM PDT

            •  If I owned that store

              I would be trying to get a message to the people there to take all the sneakers they can get a hold of and pass them out to everyone to protect their feet from rusty nails and bacteria filled water.
              Short of getting that message out I would be praying they looted me.
              

              by TeresaInPa on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 07:56:42 AM PDT

              •  Yeah, because

                sneakers offer real protection to rusty nails and bacteria.

                by Steve4Clark on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 09:22:27 AM PDT

        •  first of all...who are "you guys?

          and why is "looting" even important?

          by TeresaInPa on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 07:46:22 AM PDT

          •  Then why keep talkinga bout it?

            You guys refer to the idiots who keep talking about it.

            by Steve4Clark on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 09:24:39 AM PDT

        •  "Looting" vs. "Finding"

          "Looting" vs. "Finding", both from AFP agency for seemingly identical situations.

          That is all, this is the whole charge and the whole argument. Try to focus for a moment, without going away on a tangent.

          Get it now?

          by MilongaMan on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 10:18:44 AM PDT

          •  You folks claiming the AFP captions

            are "racist"... you do know, don't you, that AFP stands for Agence France-Presse?

            Get some perspective. The whole world isn't organized around the American brand of race politics. For foreigners -- and that even includes Canadians -- American race sensitivities are a minefield of weird, hidden hazards. Americans will take offense at the strangest, seemingly most trivial, things. I've been castigated for saying a person I admired was "articulate" -- because his skin was brown. Everywhere else in the world, "articulate" is high praise; it means the person is surpassingly good at putting their thoughts into words. In the US, it turns out, it is still permissible to compliment white people thus... but not blacks.

            That's a "rule" that makes no sense whatsoever to anyone outside the United States. There's a whole network of peculiarities like this. In this case, the French captioned those photos, most likely, without even thinking about the skin color of the people portrayed.

            by Canadian Reader on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 12:10:05 PM PDT

            •  and your point is?

              You folks claiming the AFP captions are "racist"... you do know, don't you, that AFP stands for Agence France-Presse?

              .. and so on..

              I am a European who currently lives in Canada. What is your point? You think these are actual French people who wrote the captions in French that later got translated? Or do you think it is more likely that these are American employees of AFP who did that? And even if they are French, what exactly is your evidence that the French do not harbour racist tendencies and don't you think it is rather obvious that it is exactly the opposite (provided you know anything about France's more visible struggles with that in their own country over the last couple of decades at least)?

              By the way, what is it with the epidemic of recent "you folks"/"you people"? I don't know personally any of the people on this site. I am not even an American, as most of them are. I do not speak for anyone but myself. Please stop projecting.

              by MilongaMan on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 01:32:53 PM PDT

              •  Good point about American employees

                maybe writing those captions. And I'll be more careful about using "you folks" -- I actually know it's objectionable, but in this case I specifically wanted to address the few people in this thread who were, I thought, reading too much into a phrase.

                Is France racist? I'm sure it is; so is Canada. People everywhere divide the world into "them" and "us". You would probably know better than I where the French social fracture points are. But neither France nor Canada is racist in the American categories.

                I am a Canadian who currently lives in the US. Until you actually live here, you can have no concept of how much black-white subtext there is to everything, even in New Jersey. The scars of the civil war warped American thought in ways that Canada and France have never experienced.

                by Canadian Reader on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 08:04:25 PM PDT

        •  strawman

          You know, you guys have pretty much discredited yourselves completely by claiming there is no looting going on in New Orleans.

          Aaah, a strawman argument, coupled with an apparent lack of reading comprehension (or is it just a simple intentional non-sequitur?). Nice job, Steve.
          

          by MilongaMan on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 11:03:10 AM PDT

•  unFUCKINGbelievable-- how will the

  corporate media spin this one?  

  What the HELL is wrong with this administration?  What the HELL is wrong with the Republicans who think Bush, and Bushco, are doing a great job for this country?  And what the HELL is wrong with the border officials who sent the Canadians back?  What the FUCK?  Do they not have an OUNCE OF COMPASSION in their FUCKING BODIES for their fellow Americans?  And they probably think they're being "patriotic" to obey Bushco's fucked up "homeland security" regulations.  HOW THE HELL ARE THE PEOPLE OF LOUISIANA MORE SECURE WITH THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION TURNING AID AND RESCUERS AWAY FROM THEM?

  by concernedamerican on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:01:48 PM PDT

  •  Corporate Media Spin

    They don't have to spin it.  They just won't support it.  They'll just let the Freeper side of the world continue to scream about how no other countries are willing to help us after all they've done for us.

    by TracieLynn on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:20:21 PM PDT

    •  They're ignoring it...

      They run letters to the editor like this instead... (and combined with the fact that the Trib did not report anything about any aid offers this LTE "appears" on the mark even though it's totally baseless).

       

      by thesill on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 06:59:38 AM PDT

•  Bush Admin == Incompetence

  Boy, if these morons can't get their shit together when a hurricane hits, how can we expect them to have their shit together if there's a terrible terrorist attack?

  Bush and his allies control everything in government right now, and they can't seem to do anything right.

  Unless you count those fabulous tax cuts. Hoo. Ray.

  by CleverNickName on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:02:04 PM PDT

  •  Yup

    The Bush admin's lack of preparedness, lack of action, lack of planning . . . lack of anything that resembles a constructive quality or characteristic boarders on criminal.

    Their reaction to this disaster makes me more afraid to think about there ability to deal with a dirty bomb or other type of terrorist attack.  

    We are all fucked.
    

    by lostian1 on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:14:33 PM PDT

    •  Three Strikes Bush is OUT

      The missing component is to PLAN for the worst and be prepared, not get caught with your pants down then trying to make the best of a situation that never should have happen.

      This is 9/11 and the post Iraq after Mission Accomplished. Bush ignored the warnings ant then claims it wasn't his fault no one warned him. Three strikes thousands of Americans dead. Let get the Bum OUT!
      

      by VirtualTruth on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:24:02 PM PDT

    •  Boarders on criminal

      Disagree....leave "boarders" out.

      by martik on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:13:20 PM PDT

  •  You can't. It's FUBAR.

    Didn't you know, no new training, no new equipment, no new disaster and evacuation plans, no nada. This, while the new Chief here gets a billion dollar new office, hand made furniture, whilst the Heliocopter Rescue guys are sweltering in leased from San Diego for shit buildings, A/C's running all day long and just blowing out the clapboard structures. No new or improved security around the nuclear subs in San Diego Bay, no new or improved security around San Onofre Nuclear Plant, nothing, nothing, nothin.

    I've said this before on other sites, people think I'm "angry". That I'm just some flipped out surfer chick living in Baja that dislikes the Japanese for being such assholes down here and their whole fucking history.  Fuck yes, I'm angry.

    Today, DHS sent out a memo to the employees that if they wanted, they could volunteer to help out in the disaster area.  I'll get a copy of it and post it.  Mike said everyone just looked at each other and shook their heads.  It's a Chinese Fire drill people !!!  I know there are good law enforcement and others that want to help, but noone is in command.  It's like a cut loose patrol on the Mekong Delta.

    Not only that, and it's probably been said before, everyone knew this thing was coming. WTF, there should have been on ground support ready to roll, water, medical, food, and now the son of a bitch wants to put these poor people in buses, BUSES, let them travel to another spot for 12 hours. What are they, illegal immigrants ???  Fuck that, fly their asses there in Military Cargo planes. And one, ONE naval hospital ship.  Oh wow, how generous can you get?

    Take a lesson everyone, this happened to these folks, you bet it could happen to any of us the next time around. This is NOT alarmism :  We need to live in a state of constant alert and prepardedness as long as this quack is in charge, do not, I repeat, do not count on this lousy government for any help.  Pull out your old Civil Defense booklets and get your own stuff together.

    by Pargie on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:30:54 PM PDT

    •  On that DHS memo...

      Here's an article about it:

      http://www.govexec.com/dailyfed/0805/083105p2.htm

      Key sentence - these volunteers, who already work for DHS, will need to be TRAINED before they can actually go in and do anything:

      "The employees will be trained at Emmitsburg, Md., Atlanta or Orlando, Fla. Workers who are bilingual or have commercial driver's licenses are especially needed."

      by fpc on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:37:18 PM PDT

      •  Yep

        What a bunch of BS, that is why the guys rolled their eyes and shook their heads.  Truthfully, I think they are afraid to leave the Border and their families.  They're REAL nervous most of the time.  REAL nervous.

        Thanks for the link.

        by Pargie on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:12:35 PM PDT

    •  well said

      I've felt this for years, that they're not just malevolent, they're incompetent to boot. Hell, there's all sorts of other malevolent bastards living it high off these chumps because they're such fuckups. Well, and because they're malevolent.

      But you just nailed it there. You seem like an ok sort to share a bunker with.

      grab yer gun! (er, surfer-chick reference)

      by subtropolis on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:32:03 PM PDT

    •  Navy Hospital Ships

      There's only 2.  The USNS Mercy is in the Indian Ocean providing medical support for the ongoing Tsunami relief effort (yes, sadly, they are still sorting it out), the USNS Comfort is tasked to the hurricane relief effort.

      You don't just fire up one of these hospital ships and go.  It takes days of intense around the clock work to prepare these units even though they are in a stand by state of readiness.  

      I take extreme exception to your comments about the Japanese.  Your racist attitude is unacceptable, and I find your comments repugnent and offensive.

      by markt on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 07:16:57 AM PDT

•  Wow! Just like the USSR

  They never allowed "foreign help" either.

  I'm hoping it's just a huge mix-up, but it doesn't speak well for the Department of Homeland Security either way.

  by Dont Just Stand There on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:02:34 PM PDT

  •  Even the Iranians...

    ...were more open than this following the earthquake in Bam in Dec. 2003.  

    And btw, the Russians have opened up a bit, as evidenced by the way they reacted to the submarine incident last month, in contrast with the Kursk.

    by fpc on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:09:05 PM PDT

  •  sounds like the russian sub in 2000

    A small number of the crew survived the initial explosion of an unstable torpedo - only to die hours later, slowly suffocating in freezing conditions and pitch darkness.
    

    A rescue mission of sorts had been launched but Russia refused foreign assistance, even though its navy lacked modern search-and-rescue equipment.
    

    Many believe that 23 sailors who survived the blast might have been saved, had the Russian navy reacted in time.
    

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4144194.stm

    by William S Martin on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:12:31 PM PDT

    •  Kremlin East, Kremlin West n/t

      by Gooserock on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 11:03:53 PM PDT

•  Possibly,

  the reason could be the coverage of DART and Katrina will be detailed on CBC?

  by Street Kid on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:03:22 PM PDT

  •  Despite the CBC employee lockout

    David Kyle's 15 minute edition still did a piece at 10 that mentioned the Canadian Red Cross was getting workers ready to go south and were basically waiting to be asked to come.

    I don't recall the exact reference, but he did mention something about BushCo not officially asking yet.

    by Cordelia Lear on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:29:45 PM PDT

  •  Oooh, You're Good

    Yah, this makes sense.  Having that Canadian team in there could result in uncensored footage being shown on CBC.

    Bu$hCo probably does not want this to happen.

    by bincbom on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:38:39 PM PDT

    •  asdf

      CBC coverage limited.

      by Street Kid on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:56:33 PM PDT

•  Inexcusable

  Sheer incompetence that will cost people their lives.  Everything since 2000 has the result of sheer incompetence.  I assumed that there was an ulterior motive behind most of it.  Power, money, fame, legacy... you know, the usual.  I assumed gas prices going up 10% overnight was just the oil companies learning from Enron tricks.  

  Rejecting aid from Canada (CANADA!!!) is nothing less than proof that these people have no idea what they are doing.  There should be a congressional hearing by Monday investigating this.  

  Not for partisan reasons.  Just so that this never happens again.  This buffoonery cannot stand. This risk has been talked about for years.  Where are the contingency plans?  Inexcusable.  

  by Guancous on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:03:41 PM PDT

•  This is insane.

  Now Dubya, there are a lot of good ways in which to try to emulate Teddy Roosevelt, but this isn't one of them:

  From a timeline on the history of the 1906 SF Earthquake -

  "Imperial decree on the 30th Day of the Third Moon from Empress Dowager of China to send 100,000 taels as a personal contribution to the relief of the San Francisco sufferers. President Theodore Roosevelt declined the offer, as well as donations from other foreign governments."

  by fpc on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:03:59 PM PDT

  •  Thanks for that timeline link...

    union protests, political corruption, army history... fascinating.  And now I know that the "Ham & Eggs" fire started just down the street.

    by AnthonySF on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:22:46 PM PDT

•  So far...

  ...I haven't seen any evidence of pre-planning for this disaster.  It's been three damn days and there are still people on roofs and in attics?  There are now three failed levees and I have yet to hear an explanation of why there was no post-storm inspections.  Crime is rampant.  I was looking for information on a Times Picayune (New Orleans main newspaper) message board and came across this:

  THERE HAS BEEN A REPORT JUST FILED ON WWLTV THAT THE RESCUERS AS WELL AS EVACUEES THAT THEY ARE NOT DOING WELL. PEOPLE ARE IN HIGH NEED OF FOOD AND WATER. NO ONE HAS BEEN BY ALL DAY TO HELP THEM. PLEASE, URGENTLY CALL WHOMEVER YOU KNOW TO GET THE RESCUE WORKING.

  Three days and the situation continues to deteriorate.   A full accounting indeed!
  

  by BarbinMD on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:04:14 PM PDT

  •  well now that

    king george has sauntered back in to the castle they can have a few more meetings and oh, several more days of thumb twittlin and then maybe we can go in and help the few that are left living.

    by titotitotito on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 04:35:16 AM PDT

•  Don't piss off the Canadians, eh?

  Especially since they're your main source of oil right now...

  by BerkeleyCanuck on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:04:31 PM PDT

  •  didja know

    that Cheney's coming up here in September to check out the oil sands project? Creepy, eh? Well, it was planned awhile ago. But make no mistake – he's comin' up to make deals to get our own wingers in power (yes, our own right wing is smack dab in the middle of our oil).

    How's the sun down there, eh?

    by subtropolis on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:37:18 PM PDT

    •  Yeah

      I used to live in Calgary.

      To tell you the truth though, even though they listen to country music and drive pickup trucks, Albertans are idealogically to the left of even the people down here in Berkeley.

      Maybe they might share some of the same views on moral issues as the right wing in the U.S, they're actually pretty socialistic.  The Alberta government spends that oil money very liberally on social programs.  Schools, health care, recreation, etc.

      Specifically, I'm most familiar with the benefits my grandmother had when she was still alive.  They treat the seniors pretty well there:

      http://www.seniors.gov.ab.ca/

      Most other provinces in Canada don't come close to the social spending in Alberta -- it's really a great place to live because of it.

      Ralph Klein would be committing political suicide if he tried to drive the same idealogical line that the right wing in the U.S. subscribes to.

      by BerkeleyCanuck on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 11:29:25 PM PDT

      •  yeah i was stretching things

        and yeah, Klein's been good to Albertans, for sure. All the same, i'm creeped out about Cheney coming up to visit.

        by subtropolis on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 12:12:43 AM PDT

        •  wanna bet

          that he adds refineries to the tour plan??? Let's just hope he doesn't show up with troops...

          by wabegg on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:57:41 AM PDT

          •  i can see it now

            "Bush diverts troops from crisis in the South to invade Canada. Most Americans polled feel he should have waited a bit longer."

            by subtropolis on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 08:32:28 AM PDT

•  Oh Jesus

  On CNN. A busload of people in the bus outside the Astrodome are not being let in by security.

  by RandyMI on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:05:43 PM PDT

  •  Another screw-up!

    They knew the buses were coming, so why weren't they ready??? Oh, no matter, it's just "those folks" from the Superdome. These poor people-screwed again!!

    by Phil S 33 on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:21:40 PM PDT

  •  That's not how I understood the situation

    It was my understanding that evacuees who escaped in private vehicles (SUVs and minivans, from the look of it) were directed to head for the Astrodome by FEMA.

    Said evacuees, upon arriving at the Astrodome, were then informed that only those unfortunate enough to have taken refuge at the Superdome would be allowed into the Astrodome.

    This represents yet another logistical failure affecting thousands.  It appears that the FEMA/state-of-TX effort to fit out the Astrodome for refugees was planned to handle exactly the number of people who had checked into the Superdome.

    Welcome to Bush-league America, folks -- where anyone who's self-sufficient enough to get their own ass out of NOLA in one piece is presumed able to fend for themselves, and turned away at the gate.

    I'm not a Christian, but most of BushCo professes to be -- and after days like today, I find myself wishing for somebody to show up and smite these motherfuckers Old Testament style.

    -AG
    

    by AlphaGeek on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:20:17 PM PDT

    •  Convert NOW!

      and smite the motherfuckers!

      Bring another soul to Jeeeeessusssss and get the super discount package, including plague pestilence and locusts.

      Best reason I've heard yet.

      Thanks for the laugh amid the fucking disaster that is Bush League America.

      by Deep Dark on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:48:51 PM PDT

•  the CBC

  also said that teams from Hydro Quebec and Ontario Hydro (or whatever it's called now) are just waiting  for the okay to cross the border with their trucks and help to restore power.

  They are still waiting.

  The premiers of Ontario and Quebec called the US ambassador, they also said, and offered any type of aid that was required.  The ambassador thanked them but didn't take them up on their offer.  

  by non cest non on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:06:58 PM PDT

  •  In a just world

    Ambassador Fuckhead (I can't remember his real name, but I don't have enough respect for him to Google it) would be immediately recalled and assigned to the passport office in New Orleans.

    by Olds88 on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:12:55 PM PDT

    •  Yeah, it was the guy who didn't

      know where Canada was. Replaced Celucci.

      by lecsmith on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:17:46 PM PDT

    •  Celluci

      Paul Celluci.  Our very own ex-governor of Massachusetts.  He deserted mid-term to take the Canada job, after some of the most disgusting and transparent sucking up to Bush you've ever seen. Kinda like what Mitt's doing now to cuddle up to the GOP right wing.

      by lahke on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:21:12 PM PDT

      •  My bad

        It's now David Wilkins.  The one who's telling the Canadians that we aren't going to honor our NAFTA obligations, even after we've been ruled against 3 times.

        Urgh.  That means Celluci's back.

        by lahke on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 09:56:23 PM PDT

        •  revolving door

          Everyone – everyone – was glad to see Celluci's back. What a jerk. And now Wlikins is suggesting we're too sensitive (really) and that we should just come to an (US) agreement about trade. After however long it was with the other prick, he really started off in Ottawa on the right foot.

          by subtropolis on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:42:29 PM PDT

        •  That's what is nice about my system,

          "Ambassador Fuckhead" just keeps on working.

          by Olds88 on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:24:09 AM PDT

      •  David Wilkins

        A Texan buddy of W's. Admitted that he really didn't know anything about Canada but was ready to learn.

        Seemed to be at least a bit less of a dick than Celucci, then had the gall to chide us to not get "emotional" about the U.S. decision not to respect the NAFTA softwood lumber ruling. I mean, it's only the Rule of Law--nothing to get emotional about or anything..

        by tameszu on Wed Aug 31, 2005 at 10:04:04 PM PDT

        •  Right

          After all, what's $5 billion in illegally collected tariffs between friends?

          by Alien Abductee on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 01:51:42 AM PDT

        •  I was speculating yesterday

          on why Canadians weren't doing more and wondering if the ambassador had refused help. This suggests to me that perhaps they are turning Canada down because it makes the Bush administration look bad.

          I think this is spot on. How frustrating that they will not let us pitch in.  It is a tragedy brought on by Bush's ego.

          This needs to get out to the MSM.  I'll bet Martin is pissed.

          by quickiemart on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 05:00:37 AM PDT

        <