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Tonight is the final debate between our man Larry Grant and the Club for Growth's wholly-owned Bill Sali. So I'm hanging out with best and brightest of Idaho bloggers (fortboise, IdaBlue, The Sniff Test, Red State Rebels, Grassroots for Grant, and New West--our hosts and cookie pushers for the evening).

Today was a banner day for Larry Grant, with Congresswoman Loretta Sanchez appearing for Larry at a press conference and a tea at which the women of Idaho plotted to take over Congress and the world. If there are any women who can do it, it's Idaho's women.

So as we get ready to watch tonight's debate (only those of you in Idaho will be able to really participate--it's on public television) the rest of you can mull over this fantastic news I just got from a source close to the Democratic Brady for Governor campaign. Jerry Brady has closed a 19-point gap since June.  In June, Otter was up 48-29%, in September Otter had a 45-34% lead, today Brady is up 42-40% on the 30-year politician Congressman C.L. "Butch" Otter. The poll surveyed 400 likely Idaho voters and the MoE is 5 points.

So while you all mull over the possibility of a Democratic Congressman and Governor in the great state of Idaho, the rest of us will watch the debate.

Update: Word is it's being livestreamed:

http://idahoptv.org/livehi.asx (hi bandwidth)
http://idahoptv.org/livelo.asx (lo bandwidth)

Update by kos: Let me format the poll in standard Daily Kos style:

Goodwin Simon Victoria Research (D) for Jerry Brady. Dates unknown. MoE 5% (September results)

If the election for Governor of Idaho were held today and the candidates were: (Names rotated), which one would you be inclined to vote for? (IF UNDECIDED ASK): ‘Well, towards whom do you lean?”

Otter (R): 40 (45)
Solid: 32
Lean: 8

Brady (D): 42 (34)
Solid: 35
Lean: 7

Ted Dunlop (L): 2
Solid: 2
Lean: 0

Originally posted to Daily Kos on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:03 PM PDT.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Sali in trouble immediately (6+ / 0-)

    Trying to avoid the first question all together by giving an opening statement. Slapped down.

    "I have a philosophy about elections. I believe issues divide and values unite."--Gov. Brian Schweitzer

    by Joan McCarter on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:03:46 PM PDT

  •  Hit the Naderite (0+ / 0-)

    spoiler with why he's running for the 1st district when he lives in the second. Crummy answer.

    "I have a philosophy about elections. I believe issues divide and values unite."--Gov. Brian Schweitzer

    by Joan McCarter on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:08:28 PM PDT

  •  Whining About Exclusion (0+ / 0-)
    Independent candidate now whining about being left out of debates. Expect same from Hedden-Nicely, the next one.  Spoilers just tick me off.
  •  Very good to hear (0+ / 0-)

    We all knew Sali was an idiot (anyone who reads blogs knows this) but more surprising is Brady's strong challenge for Governor...

  •  Larry (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    N in Seattle

    "The stay the course policy has been a failure."

    "I have a philosophy about elections. I believe issues divide and values unite."--Gov. Brian Schweitzer

    by Joan McCarter on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:11:17 PM PDT

  •  Whoa! When did the Gov's race become competitive? (0+ / 0-)

    That would be awesome if we picked up Idaho. Just more proof that Democrats can win in the reddest of red states.

    -6.00, -4.41 "The foolish and the dead alone never change their opinions" - poet James Russell Lowell

    by Deano963 on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:11:21 PM PDT

  •  Iraq (0+ / 0-)
    "Only way to stop the violence in Iraq is to give local control back to the local leaders. We should be recruiting them to help stop the violence."

    When you have a country that is Muslim, you are not likely to end up with a Christian democratic republic." --Larry Grant

  •  I'm Google BALMing Larry Grant... (5+ / 0-)

    ...and all the other Democrats in the 70-plus races where Chris Bowers is Google BOMBing the Republicans:

    Check it out and copy!  (Or make suggestions!)

  •  I remember Lewiston (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Ckntfld

    as being largely Democratic in feel. I lived there until I left for college at 18, and though I wasn't political as a teen, and didn't pay much attention to the news when I was there, I've always contributed my hard liberal leanings to the positive influence of northern Idaho politics. Conservation, individual rights and privacy, small businesses... these are Idaho values, liberal values -- not conservative values.

    Of course, my growing up there also explains how I, with "hard liberal leanings," am unabashedly and completely pro-gun.

    I love Idaho politics. Go Dems!

    •  I'm in Lewiston now. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      mcjoan, ghostman

      I moved here two years ago thinking I would get my ass kicked for being a liberal democrat.  There are dems here.  My local friends tell me that it's a leftover from Lewiston being a mill town with a lot of union action.  The Lewiston Morning Tribune is definitely left-leaning.  I've been seeing more yard signs for dems than for repubs these days.

      I'm going out Saturday mornig to canvass for Larry Grant.  He's buying lunch for the campaign workers later.

      No matter how cynical I get, I can't keep up these days--Lily Tomlin

      by hoosierspud on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 09:13:55 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Yay hoosierspud! (0+ / 0-)

        Thanks for canvassing with us this Saturday ... you'll enjoy it.

        Seriously, Nez Perce County is key to Larry. If he can win big enough in Nez Perce and Latah and do well in Ada, Canyon, Idaho, Kootenai, and Valley plus a few others, he will nail this thing.

        Help Larry Grant win and turn Idaho blue!! Contribute to Larry Grant now!

        by Red State Rebel on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 09:21:40 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  awesome (0+ / 0-)

        I was back visiting in March, and the only political sign I saw was an anti-Cafta sign. It warmed my heart.

        Yeah, Lewiston definitely has the labor influence because of Potlatch and the history there, and I think too because it's such an outdoor-sy place, that a lot of people are democrat just for environmental reasons. I attended Lewiston High School, and except for the cowboy section of the student body, it was definitely very liberal. Abnormally so, even.

        The Lewiston Morning Tribune... does Bill Hall still write his opinion column? That paper is definitely left-leaning, at least by Idaho standards. My mom still lives there and reads it, and is a very reliable democrat.

        How I miss that town.

        •  I live in the Normal Hill area. (0+ / 0-)

          Bill Hall is retired, but writes a Sunday column.  His column this week was very good, about he was a boy and grew up during WWII and how everyone sacrificed and pulled for the common good.  But with this war, everyone is out for themself or not affected by it, unless they had a family member or friend involved.

          No matter how cynical I get, I can't keep up these days--Lily Tomlin

          by hoosierspud on Wed Oct 25, 2006 at 10:54:49 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  The main thing I remember about Lewiston... (0+ / 0-)

        was the smell of the paper mill.  Yuk.
        My aunt and uncle lived across the river in Clarkston.  We'd drive up there at night, and I'd be sleeping in the back seat of the Buick.  I always knew without looking that we had arrived in Lewiston because of the smell!

        •  Ah, the smell. (0+ / 0-)

          Yeah, pretty disgusting, though I have to admit, it brings me back to some memories I'm rather fond of. However, the smell is mostly gone now. They've been working on the emissions from Potlatch... when I visited in March -- honest to God -- I didn't smell the rotten eggs at all!

          I've heard the pollution from that mill is now 99% steam, and the way it evaporates so quickly, I almost believe it. When I was a kid, the clouds from that factory would hang over the valley like a ceiling.

          •  Your right... (0+ / 0-)

            the smell was bad, but strangely, it brings back happy memories.  For me, it was getting to play with my favorite cousins.

            •  You know, (0+ / 0-)

              I wrote a lot of fiction as a youngster, and when I look back on it now, my writing always comes across as dark and cramped, but filled with hope. It reflects the environment I was in: Lewiston, with the Potlatch cloud and the big hills to the north and south, always made one feel as though one was living in a box... but at the same time, it was a beautiful box of wonders.

            •  sorry, you've got me walking down memory lane (0+ / 0-)

              I have to post a link to my Lewiston photos.

              Check them out. (If you click on them, you can get info about them.)

              And I just realized that it wasn't a CAFTA sign, it was a NAFTA and FTAA sign. Still... and I forgot about the anti-UN bit on the side of the building. There's been quite a row about that, I hear. Ah, Lewiston.

              Enjoy the pics. It's a beautiful place.

          •  smelly idaho (0+ / 0-)

            better than Nampa/Caldwell and the smell of the sugar beet factory. ah, idaho. good times...

            thanks for the awesome post mcjoan! i send them to my parents who still live there and tell them not to give up hope. my next goal is to get them to volunteer.

  •  Sali on Iraq (0+ / 0-)
    People in this room gagging.
  •  Big Doin's (0+ / 0-)

    That phrase alone warmed my heart, McJoan.
    My Dad, may his soul rest in peace, would say that all the time. Is that a southern expression as he was raised in KY? None of my friends or my mother's relatives used that phrase in the Northeast.
    My Dad used to say, " Big Doin's Next Door, Kids, come Look". LOL!

    Carry the battle to them. Don't let them bring it to you. Put them on the defensive and don't ever apologize for anything. - Harry S. Truman

    by wishingwell on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:14:09 PM PDT

  •  I can't believe we are even talking about (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    hoosierspud, offgrid

    turning Idaho blue.

    Holy crap that's amazing.

    If a frog had wings, he wouldn't bump his rear end.

    by InsultComicDog on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:14:42 PM PDT

    •  Some have been saying (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      InsultComicDog

      here that Idaho, the Dakotas and Montana will turn blue before any southern states. I was one who felt Colorado and Nevada were easier to get than any of them but I am feeling states like Montana and Idaho and North Dakota trending at very least, pink.
      Nevada and Colorado remain enigmas to me. As Colorado is just not Fundie Colorado Springs and I am not sure what is the deal with Nevada..seems like that state would be less Red than it is .

      Carry the battle to them. Don't let them bring it to you. Put them on the defensive and don't ever apologize for anything. - Harry S. Truman

      by wishingwell on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:22:17 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  bravo (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        InsultComicDog

        the people of Montana and Idaho and some other states that far too many Presidential candidates take for granted and completely ignore when campaigning. It shows the people of those states are putting down the Kool Aid and being a whole helluva lot more open minded than some of those Kool Aid swillers in well, many other regions.

        Carry the battle to them. Don't let them bring it to you. Put them on the defensive and don't ever apologize for anything. - Harry S. Truman

        by wishingwell on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:25:20 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Montana has a long pro-Dem slant (3+ / 0-)

        The unions in the mine days were stronger than in any other mountain state; it was common from the 40s-70s for many Dems to be governor, senator, and house members. They have not had two GOP Senators at the same time in the last 50+ years.

        Nationally they are still pretty GOP (Presidential elections), but locally far more Dem

    •  If it turns blue (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      InsultComicDog

      I don't have to be embarrassed anymore to tell people I was born in Boise. I am really excited about Grant.

  •  wow, great news for Jerry B (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    mcjoan

    thanks for sharing

    Help Larry Grant win and turn Idaho blue!! Contribute to Larry Grant now!

    by Red State Rebel on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:16:25 PM PDT

  •  My girlfriend sent out her abstentee ballot (6+ / 0-)

    back to Idaho today. Straight ticket blue all the way!!

  •  AP guys question (3+ / 0-)
    John Miller of AP asked Grant what's the first piece of legislation you'd sponsor-  Grant: get back the pay-as-you-go amendment. Second: address corruption, get the ethics committee back on track. Before Tom deLay it was bipartisan with nonpartisan staff. Became corrupt.
    Third vote is accountability. Katrina relief, FEMA.
  •  Cool - debaterama (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    mcjoan, Ckntfld

    I just watched Angie Paccione tear asunder Marilyn Musgrave.

    And now, Larry Grant! Thanks for posting the streaming links - Grant sounds great.

    Let the great world spin for ever down the ringing grooves of change. - Tennyson

    by bumblebums on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:18:56 PM PDT

  •  I'm terrible at this live-blogging thing (0+ / 0-)

    I hope anyone truly interested in what's going on is watching the stream.

    "I have a philosophy about elections. I believe issues divide and values unite."--Gov. Brian Schweitzer

    by Joan McCarter on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:22:25 PM PDT

  •  Independent candidate line (0+ / 0-)
    Andy Hedden-Nicely is pushing the "neither party knows ass from hole in ground haven't you noticed" angle.
  •  quiz question (0+ / 0-)

    how many women have idaho voters elected to congress?

  •  immigration question (0+ / 0-)
    "A wall won't work." -- Grant
    "If we keep electing the same people nothing will change. It's easier to come in illegally than it is legally." -- Hedden-Nicely
    "Build a wall, enforce the wall."  Sali
  •  I've always liked Loretta Sanchez ... (6+ / 0-)

    ...(she could have been Mothra for all I care, given the fact she beat B1 Bob). But the fact she's in Idaho campaigning for a guy who, like she, was a dark horse early on in this contest, impresses me no end.

    •  She was here in January (4+ / 0-)

      (I think January) for the Frank Church Dinner, bucking up the Dem troops at what seemed like a time of incredible darkness. How quickly things change.

      She's wonderful, and I think she really enjoyed being here under these more auspicious circumstances.

      "I have a philosophy about elections. I believe issues divide and values unite."--Gov. Brian Schweitzer

      by Joan McCarter on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:31:14 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Sanchez (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Rolfyboy6, Randall Sherman

        Supposedly, she wants to position herself for a Senate run after Feinstein retires.  If so, it is good to have her going around the country and helping out candidates.  She won "behind the Orange Curtain" back when no one thought a Dem could win in Orange County, California.  Her experience could help them out in the  mountain states as they turn bluer.

        With North Dakota though, the Dems have a lot of work to do.  Dorgan, Conrad, and Pomeroy are really products of a previous time when Dems did well there.  2000 was a devastating year for ND Dems and they are just now starting to recover.  I hope they can turn it around, but right now I see them a couple of steps behind the Montana and Colorado shifting from red to blue.

        •  Dorgan says though ... (3+ / 0-)

          that there is such a history of populism in ND, such a  distrust of bankers and corporations and "big city" types, and such a reverence for labor and unions, that it might be easier to flip the state than you think.

          •  there is that history (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Rolfyboy6

            but the party is in need of a 50 state strategy rebuilding--although I disagree with the notion of it being a supportive state for unions.  

            In 2000 a strong Dem candidate lost to a banker in the gubernatorial race.  There were some tragically odd things about the race, but Hoeven is a popular governor and solidified GOP control over almost every office in state government.  I hope 2000 gubernatorial candidate Heitkamp runs in 08--she'll be 8 years removed from her cancer diagnosis and really would make a great governor.  Outside of her, the pool of potential candidates was so decimated for a while, it will be tough to rebuild.

            Resources and a strong recruiting class of candidates would help.  

        •  A lot of OCers live in Idaho now (0+ / 0-)

          Alhough those people probably voted for Dornan when they lived in California.

          Take the NY-25: Dan Maffei for Congress

          by Progressive Moderate on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 08:21:12 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Sanchez headed to higher office (0+ / 0-)

          Well I had read somewhere that she had her eye on the governorship, in future.

          Personally, I was pushing in 2000 for Al Gore to run with either Ann Richards or Loretta Sanchez as his running mate, but no one would listen to me.

          Personally, I'm assigning the same bonus points and vague future IOU to Sanchez, for stumping for Larry Grant, that I'm recording this cycle on behalf of Maxine Waters and Marcy Kaptur, for campaigning in CT for New Lamont. I don't forget this kind of stuff.

      •  Her "opponent", and I use the term loosely, (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        mcjoan, Rolfyboy6

        is imploding in a race & legal scandal.

        I'm thrilled Loretta is putting her free time to good use for a worthy candidate!  (Not to mention, against HIS toxic opponent.)

        Yes, she worked as a bond trader.  Yes, she is from Orange county.  Yes, she took down that super-freak Bob Dornan (who I personally saw give a rant about chicken-hawks in Venice.  He was at my H.S. waaay back in the day. shuder)  And, she had the mojo that helped boost her worthy sister to Congress too!

        But the day a socal dem gal of any stripe is welcomed as a campaign asset in Idaho 01 is a day to throw confetti!!!

        I bet she has lots of advice on how to beat Dor... erm, Sali. ;-)

  •  Hedden-Nicely questions Grant (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Red State Rebel
    H-N: I wouldn't vote for Nancy Pelosi, she's divisive, would you?
    Grant: You wouldn't be able to anyway, since you're not a member of the Democratic party.
    I don't know what's so scary about a 66-year-old Italian grandmother. We western D's will be a moderating influence on the liberal eastern wing of the party.
    •  Excuse me? (0+ / 0-)

      We western D's will be a moderating influence on the liberal eastern wing of the party.

      Why does the party need to be moderated?

      "No government has the right to tell its citizens whom to love. The only queer people are those who don't love anybody." - Rita Mae Brown (-4.75, -7.13)

      by AUBoy2007 on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:36:02 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Can we get over the Pelosi fright already? (0+ / 0-)

    Let the great world spin for ever down the ringing grooves of change. - Tennyson

    by bumblebums on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:33:58 PM PDT

  •  "larry grant (0+ / 0-)

    is gonna loosen the borders, and immigrants are going to come here and kill your children!"

  •  This is why fringe/indie candidates (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    KLM

    are usually excluded from debates.

    The debate often loses focus. I doubt many peoples' interests are served by seeing a Green or Libertarian candidate asked the last question by Larry in the candidates' question session.

    Really makes no sense. It should be Sali and Grant only.

    "No, I don't want to respond to him. He's at 20 percent in the polls. No one listens to him. He has no credibility. It's ridiculous." - Joe Biden on the VP

    by The Lighthouse Keeper on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:37:25 PM PDT

  •  tote goat? (0+ / 0-)

    McJoan, do you know what that is?!

    Help Larry Grant win and turn Idaho blue!! Contribute to Larry Grant now!

    by Red State Rebel on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:40:34 PM PDT

  •  can anyone confirm that last questioner's (0+ / 0-)

    location? Wasn't it Couer d'Alene?

  •  Words not to use (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    mcjoan

    One of the indie candidates just used the word "lapdance." In a Congressional debate. And this guy looks like a high school principal from 1964.

  •  It can happen (0+ / 0-)

    Remember the great Frank Churh, Senator from Idaho and one of the great environmental advocates of our time, and a bugaboo up the republishits ass.  May we find another Idahoe that thinks Wallace Idaho at its prime was a great place and that wil make the silver mine owners clean things up.  If they do get a few Dems in, the nest time I visit family in Spokaloo, I pledge to go spend some money in far far eastern Washidamont, (that's northern Idaho for you outsiders).  That's saying something cuz years ago I swore off spending any money in Idaho.

    "The worst administration since Caligula" - Rep. Dingell, Democrat - Mich. -9.50, -7.95

    by manoffire on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:45:10 PM PDT

  •  I can't restrain myself. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    hoosierspud, Red State Rebel

      Napoleon Dynamite for Congress!  

  •  I like Larry's demeanor on stage. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Red State Rebel

    He's done well in the first couple of questions. He's made clear he is a Dem, not a Repug masquerading in Dem clothing.

    (Can I find a way to squeeze out another contribution to him? Arrgggg...)

    "No, I don't want to respond to him. He's at 20 percent in the polls. No one listens to him. He has no credibility. It's ridiculous." - Joe Biden on the VP

    by The Lighthouse Keeper on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:47:10 PM PDT

  •  Sali on Social Security (4+ / 0-)

    Sali doesn't like SS or Medicaid. Someone near me just said OMG, you f---in idiot.

  •  trick question, I think (0+ / 0-)

    I'm going with 1

  •  I Believe It! (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    mcjoan, Ckntfld

    Both my grandmothers and my own mother are Idaho women.

    They can do it!

    Baaaa! Baaaa! :::Chomp!::: Beat Doc! www.wright06.com

    by InquisitiveRaven on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:49:27 PM PDT

  •  Sali segues into complete insanity (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Serephin, mcjoan, StephNW4Clark

    Asked what are some things that could happen if the House changes hands, Sali said, "The first thing is being able to get along with people" and he still blathering about this...Than Tan from CBS said "But the Speaker of the House Bruce Newcomb called you an idiot."  CHEERS ALL AROUND for this reporter!

    Sali bragging about how many pens he has from legislation...????  WTF???

  •  Kapow!!! (0+ / 0-)

    Republicans have called you an idiot.  How do you respond?

  •  So, How Do We All Feel (0+ / 0-)

    about blue spuds?

    Okay, saphires, since it's the Gem State.

    They burn our children in their wars and grow rich beyond the dreams of avarice.

    by Limelite on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:52:50 PM PDT

  •  I remember the days of Cecil Andrus (4+ / 0-)

    and Frank Church.  It can happen again, folks!

    Keep up the good work over there in idaho.

    By the way, have you visited red state rebels recently?  All Idaho politics, all the time, baby!

    I've chosen Mike McGavick as my special friend!

    by CJB on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:52:52 PM PDT

  •  Letters to the Editor (Spud Fun) (3+ / 0-)

    Vote for Democrats

    Well it’s that time again, smear and fear, if you should "ever" consider voting for a Democrat, because sure as heck, we’ll be attacked if you do. They say Dems will tax and spend — sure, Dems believe in taxing fairly and will roll back the cuts to the rich but not middle class. They will spend where it does the most good for our hard-working people, not cater to big corporations. The R’s can buy their way into "anything" and it shows, doesn’t it — in our environment and deficit.

    Butch Otter and Bill Sali are a joke. What a pair. Do you really want them for Idaho? I’m impressed with the Dems running this year, especially Larry Grant, Kate Kelly and Jerry Brady. We need some changes and balance in Idaho.

    This country is in big trouble. Bush has driven us to be so partisan, not only in the United States but around the world. He blew it big time, and he blew it in Iraq, making us now "less safe." The real truth is finally coming out. Go Bill Clinton, give ’em hell. Pay attention folks, vote seriously — we have so much at stake for our future.

    Rose Smith, Boise

    Wake up, America

    The biggest threat to America is Dictator Bush and the evil terrorist organization called the Republican Party. It wasn’t bin Laden who stole our freedoms, imprisoned and tortured innocent individuals — remember we are innocent till proven guilty — gave the rich mega tax breaks while raising taxes for us low- and middle-income workers.

    There is something we can do, next month on Election Day: vote these evil Republicans out of office and vote for any pro-liberty and pro-Constitution candidate, and organize a national strike. Let’s take a day — no work and don’t purchase anything — to send a message to our war criminal in the White House.

    If we don’t speak up now, what’s left of our cherished freedoms and liberties will be only for the rich, stealing war criminal elite.

    Wake up, America. I also no longer support our police and soldiers, who are taking away our freedoms.

    Jeff Mortimer, Boise

    Read More - Here

    Bonus Coverage
    Lead Columnist - Idaho Turning Blue !

    After a North Idaho trip in September, I reported my skepticism that Democrats will gain in the most Republican state. Yet the Cleland events — a raucous fundraiser for 1st District Democrat Larry Grant in Eagle and a 500-person dinner at the Idaho Center in Nampa — had so many new faces I’m wondering: Might the forecast for change in other states touch Idaho Nov. 7?

    "The voters aren’t stupid," Cleland told the Nampa crowd in a preacher’s cadence. "It was Tennyson who said the ebb of the flow is the turn of the tide. It’s going to turn on the fact that the American people know — they don’t just think, they know — they know we’re going in the wrong direction. They sense it. They can smell it. They can feel it."

    Bob Blume, a retired surgeon from Nampa, is a Republican who attended the Grant fundraiser. He said that even with party control of the U.S. House of Representatives at stake, he’s for Grant. "Sali’s so extreme, so disruptive in the Legislature. He’d be an embarrassment in Washington."

    Carma Elam of Garden City was attending her first fundraiser. She likes Grant, the former general counsel at Micron Technology. "We’re in a big mess, and he’s a businessman. I like what he stands for."

    "You can feel it," said Jerry Shriner, who came from Coeur d’Alene with his wife, Diane, for the dinner. "There’s an energy to elect Democrats."

    "It finally feels possible," said Diane Shriner.

    "ma ca ca - yo pee pee"

    by Al Rodgers on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 07:54:03 PM PDT

  •  global warming (0+ / 0-)
    Sali, asked if he believes in it - "Waaal, there is debate on both sides of the issue" then quoted a study from a pseudo-institute which "disproves" it.

    Grant: The question isn't whether we have global warming. We should be saying - whatever it is, we shouldn't be making it worse. I believe R & D can help solve. But we need to get off this debate and apply our energies to solving the problem."

  •  only 16% voted in latah county in 2004? (0+ / 0-)

    What the hell is wrong with you people?!

  •  Yay for the Club for Growth! (0+ / 0-)

    Making the world save for free speech and no taxes and no government. What a wonderful world it could be.

    "I have a philosophy about elections. I believe issues divide and values unite."--Gov. Brian Schweitzer

    by Joan McCarter on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 08:16:53 PM PDT

  •  oh boy (0+ / 0-)

    sali just touted club for growth...

  •  Sali asked about his out of state piles o' money (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    BentLiberal

    Hedden-Nicely asked Sali about ALL THAT MONEY from Club for Growth and others.

    H-N said it's "un-American" and some other bad bad words to let out of state people fund campaigns in such massive amounts.

    Yep.

    •  I don't know... (0+ / 0-)

      after all, that's exactly what we do here, on a regular basis: support out of state candidates.

      •  Yeah, but in $20 amounts (0+ / 0-)

        It's a little different when you're talking three-quarters of a million.

        "I have a philosophy about elections. I believe issues divide and values unite."--Gov. Brian Schweitzer

        by Joan McCarter on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 08:21:20 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I still don't know. (0+ / 0-)

          While I'm not defending Club for Growth, and I despise corporate contributions, how can we differentiate between one kind of contribution and another? Wouldn't we pat ourselves on the back if we raised that much money for Larry Grant?

          •  Individual vs. corporate? (0+ / 0-)

            It's a huge difference.

            "I have a philosophy about elections. I believe issues divide and values unite."--Gov. Brian Schweitzer

            by Joan McCarter on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 08:26:50 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  I'm just saying... (0+ / 0-)

              we should be careful about how we fight something like this. After all, if you look at the bottom of this very page, it says "Kos Media, LLC." We press too hard for corporate control, we might find blogs like this regulated to irrelevance. I'm not trying to defend their large contributions, I'm just worried how a debate of this nature might eventually play out.

              •  But the difference is ... (0+ / 0-)

                you look at who funds Club for Growth -- huge chunks of right-wing corporations and interest groups at $10,000 a crack or whatever. If we DID have a PAC, it would be made up of $20 contributions from thousands of people, not a few corporate interests.

                •  ok (0+ / 0-)

                  so are you going to draw the donation line at $20? What if I want to give a $100? $1000? What if they restructure their organization so that donations are coming from "individuals"? Look, I'm not supporting them, I'm just saying that we could end up hurting ourselves by fighting this too adamantly.

                  You know, I can almost hear Kos use this as a fundraising rallying cry: "Club for Growth is putting in $500,000, let's do $501,000!"

                  •  No, I wouldn't recommend limits (0+ / 0-)

                    But again, there's a difference between having 1,000 individuals donate to get to half a million and having the U.S. Chamber of Commerce get you to half a million.

                    If you can't see the difference, I give up.

                    •  oh, I absolutely see the difference. (0+ / 0-)

                      Of course I do. I just don't know how to fix the system so that conglomerates of power can't abuse it. It feels to me that if we limit them, we will also limit individuals.

                      My opinion is that all elections should be funded by taxpayer money, and that each eligible candidate gets exactly the same amount. Sounds fair to me.

                      •  of course, we still haven't addressed (0+ / 0-)

                        the central issue of the initial discussion, which was not who was making the out-of-state donations, but that there were out of state donations. Grant quickly mentioned Club for Growth as a premier contributer, which somewhat obscured his initial point, but we shouldn't forget what his initial point was: he was criticizing Sali for out of state donations. Regardless of who gives them, I think we can all agree that there is nothing wrong with out of state donations. God knows, we here have been pushing for them up and down. And I say, good for us.

  •  sali's closing statement: (3+ / 0-)

    "I support hate, nationalism, close-mindedness, and fear. The liberals are villifying me. The media...vote for me... blah blah blah."

    •  Might work (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ghostman

      Idaho's Rethugs are a special breed of thug. Imagine -  constantly yakking about getting government off people's backs but then whining about abortions and gays. They're all for getting the government off people's backs - rich, white male people.

      Sorry, sometimes these guys just REALLY piss me off.

      I think I have to send another tithe to Grant to take out my anger.

      "No, I don't want to respond to him. He's at 20 percent in the polls. No one listens to him. He has no credibility. It's ridiculous." - Joe Biden on the VP

      by The Lighthouse Keeper on Tue Oct 24, 2006 at 08:31:24 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  yep (0+ / 0-)

        that's what I don't get as well. As libertarian as Idaho is, I don't see how gays and abortions plays well there at all, though it does, strangely. The natural hypocrisy of people, I guess. No, check that: the natural effects of blind religious devotion and fear-mongering.

  •  Final word on Bill Sali (0+ / 0-)

    "That idiot is just an absolute idiot. He doesn't have one ounce of compassion in his whole frickin' body...and you can put that in the paper!" -- Republican Speaker of the House Bruce Newcomb, March 2006, in response to Bill Sali declaring on the floor of the House that "abortion causes breast cancer."

    Republican Congressman Mike Simpson, when he was in the Idaho House, said, "Come on up to my office Bill, and I'll throw you out the window."

    That idiot is just a complete idiot.

  •  Grant's Closing Statement (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    KLM

    Wow, I have to say, that closing statement was amazing. He brilliantly explained why he, and none of the other candidates, unlike Sali who just attacked Grant, should be elected, and using excellent arguments and a good amount of confidence, he would have won my vote if I had never seen him before (and if I won in Idaho, boo hoo).

  •  Yeeeeeeeeeha! (0+ / 0-)

    Dunno, I was a peace-keepin' airborne-trained infantryman in the 70s ... Chile moved me to abandon my career, but this campaign moves me to give up my very last hope.

    Anti-this and anti-that ... you confirm my worst fears about my cohort, those of us who were on the bus in '68 and '69 ... y'all sold out while I got better; y'all got richer while I, well, got poorer.

    I can do MIL-SPEC tech_docs and FMECA ... but I wouldn't do it for you.

    You're suckin' up for votes while folk want democracy.

    I' been there. You haven't.
    You've been getting your careers ... karma ... and it shows.

    Me and my posse oppose Bush.
    I'll die poor, ferr shurr ...
    ... ain't no reason to support you.

    You're yuppies, and yuppies' kidz.
    I'm sorry.
    I can explain it, but I can't change it.

    1. give your head a shake
    1. think what really matters
    1. don't forget 1 and 2

    _{*}_

    (I actually wanna say eat shit and die, but that would benefit nobody.)

  •  polls (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Christopher Walker

    back when larry echohawk ran against phil batt for govenor,larry was ahead of batt by 10 points right up until he lost.but i have been doing some phone and door todoor canvising ive noticed alot of the republicans seem to be leaning towards brady.but iam not getting my hopes up at all.

    2 wrongs dont make it write.

    by idahojim on Wed Oct 25, 2006 at 04:25:38 AM PDT

  •  Is it just me... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Christopher Walker

    ...or is Loretta Sanchez one of the most - if not the most - babealicious women in Congress right now?

    Hubba hubba!

    Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men? Well, come on, doesn't anybody know!?!?

    by Erik the Red on Wed Oct 25, 2006 at 05:31:14 AM PDT

  •  when is the next poll (0+ / 0-)

    How is Grant doing now -- prior to the debate?  And when/where will we know the next poll?

    •  The campaign (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Christopher Walker

      isn't planning another debate. It's not looking like the DCCC is going to pony anything up, so doubtful there will be another.

      "I have a philosophy about elections. I believe issues divide and values unite."--Gov. Brian Schweitzer

      by Joan McCarter on Wed Oct 25, 2006 at 07:08:06 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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