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I just watched, with some horror, the excerpt of Hilary Clinton's interview with Bill Orally and the wholeexchange just made me..., ugh, you read it...

O'Reilly: "Can you believe this Rev. Wright guy? Can you believe this guy?"
Clinton: "Well, I'm going to leave it up to voters to decide."
O'Reilly: "Well, what do you think as an American?"
Clinton: "Well, what I said when I was asked directly is that I would not have stayed in the church.

Ok, so let's stay here for a second and think this through. Somebody who is close to you and your family, who has charitable qualities and also says and does some, well, offensive and some would say horrifyingly awful things. What do you do? Do you abandon them? Hmm, well, even though you think that despite their stupid actions they can still do some great stuff for your community people ask you how can you hang in there? Sound familiar? Well, it should.

When I think of Hilary Clinton I do think of a fighter, but more and more I am thinking, "hypocrisy, thine name is...". What I would like to see, what I hope to see, is Barack decides that enough is enough and notes that Rev. Wright, until his recent self-serving tour, was someone he admired because he had done good in his community and, well, you just don't abandon people who are close to you and they do dumb things. If you did then Hilary should have left Bill. In fact, as private and difficult as that is to bring up, it isn't too far off, especially for those of us who grew up in religious households and understood that our Priests and Pastors were people who we respected and who came to our houses to break bread and give thanks. They are often thought of as part of our family. You just don't get rid of them despite some stupid stuff they said once, and you didn't even hear it. Heck, how many American Catholics stay with the Church and use birth control? How many Non-Denominational Christians remain in their churches even though they may not agree with their pastor's politics?

The point is that a Church is not only a serious commitment, but people who take it seriously know that it is a human institution that, like marriage, attempts to work through our many difficulties to achieve something more forgiving and more loyal than the mere sum of what we sinners, we flawed beings, are.

And now, Barack, I think you need to point it out and do it in a way that stings Sen. Clinton. It will remind her that Church, like marriage, is serious stuff and make you look like the fighter we need you to be.

Originally posted to Loganpoppy on Wed Apr 30, 2008 at 09:02 PM PDT.

Poll

Hilary Clinton's appearance with Bill O'Reilly was

56%106 votes
14%27 votes
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8%16 votes

| 187 votes | Vote | Results

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Comment Preferences

  •  Elitist? EOM (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LordMike, Yerba Buena

    "Come, come, my conservative friend, wipe the dew off your spectacles, and see the world is moving." Elizabeth Cady Stanton

    by txlosthorn on Wed Apr 30, 2008 at 09:08:04 PM PDT

  •  Hillary's new BFF O'Reilly threw her softballs (6+ / 0-)

    No way was he going to ask her questions about her philandering husband.

    Of course, no one else is asking her tough questions either -- which means that, collectively, the corporate-controlled media has no more journalistic integrity than O'Reilly.

    So this is how liberty dies -- with thunderous applause.

    by MJB on Wed Apr 30, 2008 at 09:08:57 PM PDT

  •  Good question (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LordMike, revgerry, princess k, soms

    I think it needs to be answered.  I think Monica Lewinsky should be fair game.  Clinton should have resigned over it.

    The Clintons are corrupt selfish race baiting zero character scumbags. I would rather undergo torture at Gitmo than willfully vote for any Clinton ever again.

    by IhateBush on Wed Apr 30, 2008 at 09:09:14 PM PDT

    •  that is (7+ / 0-)

      absolute crap! as is this diary.

      bill clinton had a goddamn affair.  you have absolutely no leg to stand on re THE CLINTON'S MARRIAGE! were you there? do you know them, personally? their marriage is solely owned & operated by THE CLINTON'S THEMSELVES.  nobody else gets to decide, or really, even offer an educated opinion about other people's personal lives.  they weren't there, they dont live w/ the judged or the partners of the judged.

      resign, my ass.  

      as for the diary? what a facile & specious argument, as if the diarist can read HRC's mind & understand the difference between one's relationship w/ god, religion, what have you, & one's relationship w/ a spouse.

      (obviously, this diarist believes there is NO difference.)

      beneath the paving stones, the beach!

      by oklib77 on Wed Apr 30, 2008 at 09:43:57 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Actually (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        revgerry, bronxcharlie

        Slick Willie lied to a grand jury, lied to the public, and used all sorts of bullshit and illegal means to obstruct the investigation of the Lewinsky matter.  
        His wagged his filthy finger at me and told me that he did not have a relationship with that woman, Monica Lewinsky, which was just another lie by Slick Willie.

        And Hillary, well she told us that this was something that was fabricated by a vast right wing conspiracy, one that she is now using to attack Obama with.

        Read my sig to get a sense of where the Clintons stand with me.  I like people who have some character as my President.  Obama has it and Gore has it.  The Clintons have none.  

        The Clintons are corrupt selfish race baiting zero character scumbags. I would rather undergo torture at Gitmo than willfully vote for any Clinton ever again.

        by IhateBush on Wed Apr 30, 2008 at 09:53:40 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  It's not about comparing church and marriage (0+ / 0-)

        It's about her lack of honesty when she says "I wouldn't.."

        She says she wouldn't stay in the church? Do you believe her? Her record says otherwise. We've heard that line from her before and it was a lie even back then, when she declared she was "no Tammy Winnette".

        Her record shows she has no leg to stand on to be judging others by declaring what she wouldn't do herself. Her record shows that she would publicly declare to the world she wouldn't stay in the church, but 10 years later she would still be in the church and expect people to have completely forgotten her words as she sits in judgement on someone else with the same "well, I wouldn't.." lies.

  •  Consider this your official invitation... (8+ / 0-)

    ...to make Bill Clinton's sex life, before, during, and after his presidency, the new line of attack against Hillary.  I can't think of anything more certain to propel her to victory, not because people like philandering, but because they feel dirty just listening to that crap, and they'll take it out on whoever is making them listen.

    On second thought, you might want to take the advice of Obama's crack political experts, who have done a phenomenal job so far.  They will stop at nothing (call the Clintons racists? No problem!), so if they're stopping at this, it must be because they know it's poison that will just come back at them.

    -5.38/-3.74 I've suffered for my country. Now it's your turn! --John McCain with apologies to Monty Python's "Protest Song"

    by Rich in PA on Wed Apr 30, 2008 at 09:13:19 PM PDT

  •  not at all productive (4+ / 0-)

    really, lets be better than them ok?

  •  Good question (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    revgerry, txlosthorn, planetclaire4

    FYI--Michael Moore on Larry King tonight. He was a good surrogate for Obama--and King included O'Reilly/HRC clips allowing Moore to comment ...I thought Moore was very effective. Measured and thoughtful.

  •  Somehow, I think going after Bill Clinton's (5+ / 0-)

    sexual escapades is even worse than Hillary going after the Wright issue.  Let Obama be Obama. And that doesn't include exploiting the fact that Bill Clinton can't keep his pants zipped up.

  •  Ballsy post. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    planetclaire4, bronxcharlie

    But it's dead-on accurate.  If the whole line of attack on Obama is that he should have had the judgment to leave his church, then obviously Clinton should have had the judgment to leave her philandering husband.  No one will ever ask her that, of course.  But it's just as valid a question.

    "The majority of a single vote [is] as sacred as if unanimous." - Thomas Jefferson

    by cartwrightdale on Wed Apr 30, 2008 at 09:25:04 PM PDT

  •  This diary is pathetic (9+ / 0-)

    Some of you guys need to get out, take some fresh air and think if this level of discussion is good for Democrats and our country.  

  •  Why stay? Because judging from today's photo op, (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    wardlow, planetclaire4

    she can't even pump her own gas, or get herself a cup of coffee at a coffee machine.

    Without servants, she's literally helpless.

    And as we saw from her gabbing away at a radio interview during her "bonding time with a nromal American family," she can't focus her attention on anyone but herself for so much as a half an hour-- so forget her ever finding anyone else to put up with her.

    She'd bloody well better stay, hadn't she?

    So long as men die, Liberty will never perish. -- Charlie Chaplin, "The Great Dictator"

    by khereva on Wed Apr 30, 2008 at 09:30:04 PM PDT

    •  Oops (0+ / 0-)

      Intended to hit "reply" and instead hit "recommend" which didn't intend, sorry.

      She can't even pump her own gas, or get herself a cup of coffee at a coffee machine.

      Without servants, she's literally helpless.

      Are you kidding? Hillary has had Secret Service protection for the last 15 years which means they won't let her hang out in the back of a car pumping gas. Because she's a former First Lady she will have Secret Service protection for the rest of her life, a condition for which she deserves a degree of sympathy for her lack of freedom even if you hate her guts. This doesn't mean she doesn't know how to pump gas.

      As for the now-famous coffee machine, I struggle with a similar gas station coffee machine every day on the way to work and at least 2-3 times a week I have trouble with the coffee machine, fumbling with the cup, the button getting stuck, then all of a sudden coffee flow starts and gushes out and burns my hand. This thing with Hillary and the coffee machine is overplayed by people who don't realize how much trouble average people have with coffee machines.

      Sheesh.

      If you dislike Hillary so much, why not dislike her for some good reason like her cockamamie forced-buy/mandated health insurance scheme using the public Treasury (already in debt) to subsidize commercial premiums.

      •  Did you see the footage? Clearly not. (0+ / 0-)

        She didn't know how, and yes, blamed it on the fact that Secret Service did it for her.

        And no, she gets no sympathy.

        So long as men die, Liberty will never perish. -- Charlie Chaplin, "The Great Dictator"

        by khereva on Thu May 01, 2008 at 04:18:59 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  The Voters You Intend to Reach With This Smear (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LarryInNYC, oklib77

    often believe a women should not leave.

    Remember the Reagan Democrats? Catholics?? They're going to abandon her because she didn't divorce???

    We are called to speak for the weak, for the voiceless, for victims of our nation and for those it calls enemy.... --ML King "Beyond Vietnam"

    by Gooserock on Wed Apr 30, 2008 at 09:36:58 PM PDT

  •  False equivalence.... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    dhonig, oklib77

    ....criticizing someone for touting an out-of-control, meglamanical and weirdly profane "pastor" who curses this country is not the same as attacking someone for refusing to divorce her husband over his infidelities.

    Unlikely America will elect a President who voluntarily associated with a pastor who so blithely takes the name of the lord in vain.

    Unlikely America would refuse to elect a President because her spouse cheated on her and she kept her marriage vows despite it.

    Please don't tell me you feel sorry for Ben. Ben is a well cared for dalmatian and has not been harmed by my political views.

    by Bensdad on Wed Apr 30, 2008 at 09:37:37 PM PDT

    •  Get real (0+ / 0-)

      theologians, pastors, preachers, and minister call down God's damnation, or refer to God's damnation all the time, and not blithely.  It's taking the lord's name in vain if you curse out the guy who cut you off on the highway.  In the church, God's damnation is potentially real and powerful, and any preacher who shies away from talking about it is a milquetoast.

  •  Two wrongs don't make a Wright (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Bob Love

    Enough guilt by association. Vote for the candidate whose policies most match your own and they will take care of their own private lives (and this includes McCain).

    I voted with my feet. Good Bye and Good Luck America!!

    by shann on Wed Apr 30, 2008 at 10:10:58 PM PDT

  •  I'm an Obama supporter ... (4+ / 0-)

    but this is pure crap. I absolutely respect Sen. Clinton for committing to her marriage, even as the vultures circled trying to destroy it. Barack is by far he superior candidate, but in the name of everything that is decent do not attack Sen. Clinton for her commitment to her marriage.  

  •  Does the name Yoko Ono ring a bell? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Katie71

    Someone else posted this before me but this is something I told my boss, a Hillary supporter, when she asked me about Hillary about 6 months ago.  Hillary is the Yoko Ono of politics (with apologies to Yoko who was an artist before she met John Lennon).  She got all the exposure she needed and all the help from a rock star husband.  Could she have been the Senator from New York without Bill?  Would she had the advantage she squandered without Bill?  Would she had won the states she won without Bill?

    That is why I cannot understand the feminist support for her.  Feminism, I thought, was about standing up for yourself, not depending on your man.  If you want to support a self made woman support all the female senators except her, support Nancy Pelosi who made her career away from her Dad-former Baltimore mayor Tom D'Allesandro, there are so many people.

    To paraphrase Anne Richards, she married into third base and thought she hit a triple.

  •  Obama is trying to stay above the fray (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Katie71

    and questions like this do not belong in the primary, but when we talk about electability, is it unfair to point out that all the personal and ethical issues that are "too raw" for the primary would be red meat for the Republicans? Bill's sex life WILL be brought up. Hillary's sexual orientation WILL be brought up. Travelgate WILL be brought up, as will snipergate, cattle futures, Vince Foster, and every other real or imagined skeleton in the Clintons closet. The Republicans have been dreaming of a Hillary nomination. It is what they have planned and schemed for ever since Bill left office. That is why they are working so hard right now to prop her up and bring Obama down. Obama scares them. Hillary merely energizes their base. Hillary only thinks she's been vetted. She has no idea what is coming should she manage to steal the nomination. It will make the Swift Boat crap look like a Sunday picnic.

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