Skip to main content

I'm tired of these through-the-looking-glass argument from the Clintons. It's the second time on a national stage that I've been told the equivalent of "who are you going to believe, me or your lyin' eyes?" and I don't like it one bit. Rather than rant and throw shoes at the TV I'm just going to ask...

If caucuses don't matter why on earth did the Senator from New York spend 74 days in Iowa since the 2004 election and never once make this argument in front of Iowans?

All of Hillary Clinton's Iowa visits are chronicled by the excellent GWU Democracy in Action project. 74 days in Iowa and never does Hillary Clinton argue that caucuses shouldn't count and now she can't say it enough. What does that record say about Sen. Clinton's character? 74 days, not a peep.

[credit, the George Washington University / Democracy in Action project]

2007 plus Jan. 1-3, 2008 (35 visits, 74 days)1

Here is the first quarter of 2007 as an example
[edited from the entire year -- see entire list at Democracy in Action]

April (2 visits, 4 days)
>Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton visited Iowa on April 21-22, 2007 including the second corner of her "Four Corners of Iowa" tour.  On April 21 she participated in a town hall-style "Conversation with Iowans" at Miller Middle School in Marshalltown; visited Uncle Nancy’s Coffee House and Eatery in Newton; appeared at a Rally For America with Congressman Leonard Boswell at McAninch Maintenance Facility in Des Moines; and delivered the keynote speech at the Buchanan County Democrats Annual Sustaining Food Banquet in Oelwein.  On April 22 she participated in a town hall-style "Conversation with Iowans" at Luther College (Regent’s Center, Main Gym) in Decorah;and hosted a press conference with Finley Hospital nurses at Dubuque Airport in Dubuque.

>Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton visited in Iowa on April 2-3, 2007.  On April 2 she attended a barbeque at the home of state Senator Eugene Fraise in Fort Madison; and participated in a Conversation with Iowans at Burlington Memorial Auditorium in Burlington.  On April 3 she attended an open house breakfast at the home of former Gov. Tom and Christie Vilsack in Mount Pleasant; toured Riksch BioFuels and discussed bringing new jobs to rural America in Crawfordsville; participated in a Conversation with Iowans at Quality Inn and Suites in Iowa City; and participated in a Conversation with Iowans at East High School in Waterloo.

March (2 visits, 3 days)
>In Des Moines, Iowa on March 26, 2007 Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton participated in a "Good Morning America" town hall focused on health care at Des Moines Science Center, broadcast live on ABC >; announced the endorsement of former Iowa Gov. Tom Vilsack and First Lady Christie Vilsack at a press conference at Greenwood Elementary School; and then greeted students at the school.

>Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton visited Iowa on March 4-5, 2007.  On the evening of March 4 she held a rally at the University of Dubuque in Dubuque.  On March 5 she met with members of the Iowa Senate at the Capitol in Des Moines; toured Pioneer Hi-Bred International research greenhouses, then spoke to Pioneer Hi-Bred International employees in the Carver Center, in Johnston; and met with members of the Iowa House at the Capitol in Des Moines.


January (1 visit, 3 days)
>Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton visited Iowa on January 26-28, 2007.
On the evening of January 26 she did an interview with Des Moines Register columnist David Yepsen at the Drake Diner in Des Moines.
On January 27 she met privately with labor leaders at the Hotel Fort Des Moines in Des Moines; attended an Iowa Democratic Party Central Committee meeting at Iowa Democratic Party headquarters in Des Moines; conducted a town hall-style "Conversation with Iowans" in the Dale and Lois Bright Community Center at East High School Community Center in Des Moines; stopped by the I'll Make Me A World in Iowa" annual festival (celebrates the contributions of African Americans) at the Polk County Convention Complex in Des Moines; and conducted a house party-style "Conversation with Iowans" at the home of home of Dan and Marcia Rogers in Cedar Rapids.
On January 28 in Davenport she conducted a "Conversation with Iowans" at Mississippi Valley Fairgrounds' Keppy Hall (note this was originally planned to be a house party-style "Conversation with Iowans" at Hickory Garden Family Restaurant); and held a press availability in the library-media center at Central High School.

NOW she says there is a problem with caucuses? Pathetic.

Originally posted to joejoejoe on Wed May 28, 2008 at 11:10 PM PDT.

Your Email has been sent.
You must add at least one tag to this diary before publishing it.

Add keywords that describe this diary. Separate multiple keywords with commas.
Tagging tips - Search For Tags - Browse For Tags


More Tagging tips:

A tag is a way to search for this diary. If someone is searching for "Barack Obama," is this a diary they'd be trying to find?

Use a person's full name, without any title. Senator Obama may become President Obama, and Michelle Obama might run for office.

If your diary covers an election or elected official, use election tags, which are generally the state abbreviation followed by the office. CA-01 is the first district House seat. CA-Sen covers both senate races. NY-GOV covers the New York governor's race.

Tags do not compound: that is, "education reform" is a completely different tag from "education". A tag like "reform" alone is probably not meaningful.

Consider if one or more of these tags fits your diary: Civil Rights, Community, Congress, Culture, Economy, Education, Elections, Energy, Environment, Health Care, International, Labor, Law, Media, Meta, National Security, Science, Transportation, or White House. If your diary is specific to a state, consider adding the state (California, Texas, etc). Keep in mind, though, that there are many wonderful and important diaries that don't fit in any of these tags. Don't worry if yours doesn't.

You can add a private note to this diary when hotlisting it:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from your hotlist?
Are you sure you want to remove your recommendation? You can only recommend a diary once, so you will not be able to re-recommend it afterwards.
Rescue this diary, and add a note:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from Rescue?
Choose where to republish this diary. The diary will be added to the queue for that group. Publish it from the queue to make it appear.

You must be a member of a group to use this feature.

Add a quick update to your diary without changing the diary itself:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary?
(The diary will be removed from the site and returned to your drafts for further editing.)
(The diary will be removed.)
Are you sure you want to save these changes to the published diary?

Comment Preferences

  •  Sen. Clinton visited 60 of Iowa's 99 counties (14+ / 0-)

    Many Iowa counties she visited 4 or 5 times! New York state has 57 counties and I'd bet Sen. Clinton has visited more Iowa counties 4 times in the last 4 years then she has New York counties.

    It's just ridiculous to suggest that caucuses don't matter when the record of Sen. Clinton's time disproportionately says caucuses DO matter. If she truly believes caucuses don't matter then she's a fool for spending so much time there and her judgement is so poor that she should be disqualified from any job that requires she manage her own time.

    "Nothing seems to embarrass the political class today." - Bill Moyers

    by joejoejoe on Wed May 28, 2008 at 11:15:30 PM PDT

  •  another Mark Penn moment (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Sharon Jumper, luckylizard, skyfox

    its been reported that she was told Iowa wouldn't favor her, to spend minimal time and Penn won the fight that she should make an all out effort.  She wasted a lot of time and money that could have been spent elsewhere.  But there were a lot of caucus states early, I'm not sure what would have really helped.

    But, yes, her arguments change as her circumstances change.  She doesn't believe in anything.

    •  BS woulda coulda shoulda. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      If she had focused less on Iowa and more on New Hampshire, she probably would have won NH by a bit more -- and it wouldn't have been a big deal.

      She still would have lost SC.

      She would have lost IA by even more, of course.  And, had she not build a caucus infrastructure in IA, she likely would have done even worse in NV and lost the local level delegate contest.

      As a matter of fact, if she had ignored Iowa, then NH wouldn't have saved her campaign because she would have been seen as winning a more or less uncontested primary when the other two major candidates were duking it out in Iowa.

      WARNING: There is a high probability that the preceding comment is snark. Use your best judgment (hopefully better than Sen. Clinton's or Sen. McCain's).

      by Anarchofascist on Wed May 28, 2008 at 11:46:50 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Change (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      joejoejoe, skyfox

      Obama - the "change" candidate

      Clinton - the "change my story every time I'm caught lying or when I think I can gain some kind of advantage" candidate

  •  Good question! (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Terri, Uncle Moji, luckylizard

    Possible answers:

    -She really, really, really likes corn.

    -Nothing better to do with her time.

    -She was looking for a new place to carpetbag.

    -She had a crush on Tom Vilsack.

  •  You are quite mistaken, (9+ / 0-)

    Senator Clinton was never in Iowa, she has no recollection of Iowa, she never intended anything toward Iowa, and any claim about her being in Iowa is a falsehood manufactured and promoted by the Obama campaign and the MSM. She regrets if you mistakenly believed she was in Iowa campaigning as if she cared, but you are simply wrong.

    •  She didn't have electoral relations... (7+ / 0-)

      ...with that state, Iowa.

      •  Heh (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Sharon Jumper, Uncle Moji

        I originally hyperlinked to a YouTube of Bill Clinton's famous denial in the "who are you going to believe, me or your lyin' eyes" quote but I figured that was too inflamatory.

        And yet I still enjoyed your snark!

        HRC is like the person in your office who suggests anchovies as a topping for a pizza party, gets voted down, proceeds to eat the pizza with no anchovies without complaint, then months later complains she wasn't consulted in the process and accuses the people against anchovies of hating hard working fisherman and supporting "weird toppings", without mentioning that "weird" means the toppings more people enjoy.

        "Nothing seems to embarrass the political class today." - Bill Moyers

        by joejoejoe on Wed May 28, 2008 at 11:59:24 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Bubba says (0+ / 0-)

      Hillary mis-spoke about being in Iowa because she was sleep-deprived due to being up at 3am dodging sniper fire, and she's 60 years old and was hung-over from drinking beer shots with hard working white Americans, and besides "they" are just sayin' this 'cause they're trying to force her out of the race 'cause they hate her and the're all gangin' up on her due to her being a girl and if y'all put on yer white robes and git out and vote for her we can still win this thing.

  •  Hey (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    barath, humphrey, Sharon Jumper, Ambboogie

    It's unfair and misogynist of you to demand intellectual integrity from Hillary Clinton.

  •  The tag team of Bill and Hillary keeps on. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    Bill in PR:

    Bill Clinton has taken another step in the Hillary campaign's arguments about the Democratic popular vote, bluntly telling a crowd in Puerto Rico that super-delegates and the party as a whole will have to judge just how much caucuses should matter.

    "And the party will have to decide whether they believe the caucuses -- where you get about one delegate for 2000 votes -- are more important than the primaries where you get one for 12,000," Bill told the crowd.


    I am significant to Obama. I am insignificant to Clinton.

    by hyper on Wed May 28, 2008 at 11:49:27 PM PDT

    •  I think this is good. (0+ / 0-)

      It shows that Hillary is not playing for 2012.  They're not going to get the caucus system removed.  And this strategy is basically a big caucus state write-off.  They'll do even worse in them next time around with all of these quotes floating around.

      WARNING: There is a high probability that the preceding comment is snark. Use your best judgment (hopefully better than Sen. Clinton's or Sen. McCain's).

      by Anarchofascist on Wed May 28, 2008 at 11:53:34 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Oh, she loved us Iowans (7+ / 0-)

    until the day she set foot in New Hampshire.  

    The Iowa caucus should be for real Iowans she told us in an effort to stir up divisions in my city between college students and us 'locals.'  Of course she did this only after campaigning to those college kids for months and then realizing that they were going overwhelmingly against her.  Then they weren't 'real Iowans' any more.  

    She showed glimpses of the divisive piece of shit she is way back when.  

    By the way Senator Clinton, we all still live here and we're all still trying to get along in spite of the tensions between college students and locals that you tried to agitate for your own gain.  And yes, our votes count too.  Maybe even as much as those of people in MI and FL where you told them their votes wouldn't count before they decided whether or not to go to the polls.  

    Do I sound angry?

    I just wish she'd come back here and try to campaign in front of us again.  I'd talk right over her stupid planted questions this time.  

    It's like realizing that Richard Nixon has been reincarnated and he's in my party.  

    Fear is the mind killer

    by Sun dog on Wed May 28, 2008 at 11:52:04 PM PDT

    •  Nevada too (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Uncle Moji, Sun dog

      The Clintons were happy to win Nevada after trying to poison the process there with misrepresentations (Bill being the chief offender) and lawsuits. I know it upsets people to accuse "the Clintons" as a unit but at this point I really don't know any other way to portray it. Bill is out saying outrageous things about the process that are false and he's acting as Hillary's chief surrogate. I'm just tired of the lies.

      If caucuses are wrong in 2008, they were wrong in 2005-2007.   The Clintons are smart people with access to a soap box, why not bring up this issue when you have a chance to lead?

      "Nothing seems to embarrass the political class today." - Bill Moyers

      by joejoejoe on Thu May 29, 2008 at 12:10:47 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  They aren't leaders, that's why (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        The hunger for power doesn't necessarily equate to leadership.  

        There is a reason why we took the White House away from the Reaganites and wound up handing it right back to them after eight years.  It's not because George W Bush is a genius.  

        Fear is the mind killer

        by Sun dog on Thu May 29, 2008 at 12:18:39 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  I don't think this diary is right (0+ / 0-)

    This diary just reprints the Web site it is pointing to. This is plagiarism even though credit is given. Excerpts and commentary by the diarist would be a more honest approach. Why link to something if you're just going to reprint it?

    (Bush) believes the same thing Wednesday that he believed on Monday, no matter what happened Tuesday. -- Colbert

    by makemefree on Thu May 29, 2008 at 12:30:53 AM PDT

    •  It's a chronology (0+ / 0-)

      I wasn't sure about copying the entire timeline of visits but I wanted to show the overwhelming number of opportunities Sen. Clinton had to voice concerns about a prominent caucus before results started coming back that made those criticisms convenient at best.

      If others think it's too much to quote from the Democracy in Action project I'll edit it down to three paragraphs.

      "Nothing seems to embarrass the political class today." - Bill Moyers

      by joejoejoe on Thu May 29, 2008 at 12:37:25 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  title of this blog is a good question (0+ / 0-)

    I have another one... I hear the charge laid against obama that he was pandering to IA/NH when he took his name off michigan's ballot... if he's guilty as charged then why didn't Hillary campaign in michigan & florida?  

    Shouldn't she have ignored the DNC rules and went about her own way by advertising and holding rallies in those states?

    Then they act all indignant that one of Obama's nationally televised ads was seen in florida, lol.

    "Be realistic, demand the impossible"

    by soros on Thu May 29, 2008 at 03:00:23 AM PDT

  •  Caucuses mattered until Hillary ... (0+ / 0-)

    discovered that she'd lost most of them.

    "Those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither liberty nor security." -Ben Franklin

    by leevank on Thu May 29, 2008 at 03:46:00 AM PDT

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site