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Wasn't Palin chosen to usher Hillary voters into the fold?

Isn't she supposed to be a dynamite choice for women, mothers, and those cherished "family values"?

Here's a great article about how Palin is viewed by the very demographic she is supposed to appeal to: disaffected Hillary voters and small town women.

It might surprise you.

UPDATE: Wow! My first rec list!

I'd like to thank the academy...

and all the folks who are finding my diary helpful and inspirational.

Remember: we can't trust those talking heads on television. The "open mike" moment was the first real truth to come out in a long time.

To the Flipmobile:

This September 7th article from the LA Times was written by a reporter visiting Uniontown, Pennsylvania, a former coal-mining town in the foothills of the Appalachians. Exactly the kind of town that is supposedly "trouble for Obama."

But this is also the kind of area that is particularly hard hit by the economic policies beloved of the Republicans.

So what are these ladies saying?

Trish Heckman, 49, restaurant cook and disappointed Hillary supporter:

"I wanted Hillary to win so bad, but I saw Sarah, and it just didn't work for me," said Heckman, taking a break in the empty courtyard of J. Paul's restaurant in a downtown struggling to revive. "I have no retirement. Obama understands it's the economy. He knows how we live."

Gosh! An African American man from an big urban city knows how she lives.  

What does a 46 year old waitress at the local diner say?

She had already declared Palin "the perfect candidate" after watching her Wednesday speech. Artice had already decided that her vote would go to the first candidate who mentioned gasoline prices.

"And -- I'll be danged -- it was Obama," Artice said, between servings of liver and onions during the lunch rush.

I love that "I'll be danged." It's exactly how my own female relatives talk.

Sandy Ryan, 59. How did she view Palin belittling Obama's history as a community organizer on Chicago's South Side?

[She...] clicked the remote.

"That's enough of that. I switched over to 'House Hunters,' " she said with some disgust over dessert with a group of women from the senior housing complex she manages.

I think it was a mistake to make fun of community organizers. It sure played well with a bunch of party faithful who already are reluctant to give up any of "their money" to the poor and needy. But those who actually live in small towns know how much the people in these places depend on community effort and community support.

It's heartbreaking to see how many pancake breakfasts and spaghetti suppers are held in my area to help a sick child or a family breadwinner facing a serious illness. A tip jar on the counter of my local store is not even going to touch the needs of that six year old who needs a kidney transplant, or the local volunteer coach with Lou Gehrig's disease, to just name the two most recent residents with their pictures on those coffee cans.

Patty Tobal, 63 year old retired nurse and lifelong feminist says:

"We don't need any more fighting in Washington," Tobal said while having her hair done at a little shop on Route 40, where the customers go longer between appointments in these hard times. "Women are not for women just because they are women. We are intelligent enough to make a conscious decision."

Exactly my take on the Palin pick. I was insulted by this brazen appeal to what the Daily Show's Samantha Bee calls "Vagina-Americans."

Jennifer Glisan, 23, an EMT, says:

"I think Palin is a fake. She will run the economy into the ground," Glisan said after catching glimpses of the vice presidential nominee's speech between emergency calls.

"I have to kill myself every day at work to earn enough to pay for gas to get there. I think Obama is sincere. I think we need a change."

This is powerful stuff, right from the people Palin was supposed to appeal to.

But I'm not surprised. This was a classic head fake from the Karl Rove playbook. Palin wasn't chosen to scoop up women and the small town crowd: unless those very people are also right wing evangelicals.

Palin is there to shore up their previously indifferent Base. Those folks who care more about preventing abortion than they do about caring for all the babies their policies are designed to create.

Those "Christians" who skip over the part where Jesus himself says we should take care of the neediest among us.

Those people who love George Bush.

The Base was indifferent to McCain. The non-Base weren't buying his "centrist, not-Bush" compaigning. So to keep this election from being a total blowout, they had to, once again, pull in the Base as the only GOTV effort they still had.

So, in conclusion:

--Step away from the despair. Karl Rove turns out to be a one-dirty-trick pony. This is all they have. In a year where Bush is breaking records in disapproval ratings, that's not an endorsement of Rove's talent assessment. It's an indictment of their governing policy, which has had time to settle into even the most clueless voter's mind.

--Palin is a flawed choice. Sure, they would have preferred a wingnut woman politician without the stew of scandals that haven't even come to a full boil yet. They would have preferred an abstinence advocate without a pregnant teenage daughter. They would done better to have gotten a woman who was an actual feminist to pick up disaffected Hillary voters, who were so passionate in large part because of their strong feminist values.

But I guess they run with the whacky woman wingnut they have, not the one they wish they had. Demographically, Palin looked perfect, as mother, governor, and darling of the religious right. But despite all their carrying on, it's not working.

Palin is going to lock up their Crazy Base World vote. Because McCain, despite all his pandering, could not.

But that's not enough to win.

And they know it.

Originally posted to WereBear on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 08:36 AM PDT.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Palin hates polar bears (photoshop) (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    kitebro, vacuumslayer, myelinate


  •  Can we stop referring to them as Christians? (7+ / 0-)

    It's obvious these people aren't. Maybe we can call them false prophets or jesus posers....
    Other than that, excellent diary. Thank you for putting this together.

    Here you are with a handful of holes, a thumb up your ass and a big grin to pass the time of day with. - The Wild Bunch

    by jazzence on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 09:11:18 AM PDT

  •  Palin's biggest downfall (7+ / 0-)

    might turn out to be hiding out in Alaska. For whatever reason, people are interested in learning more about her. But the only interview she's granted has been with People magazine. At some point she will have to say something. At some point she will have to answer Americans' questions. If she doesn't, it will speak volumes - and it won't be flattering.

  •  It's disgusting that... (8+ / 0-)

    The press won't compare Sarah's and Obama's actual "experience" for fear of being "elitist." Here's the actual record. Palin spent her first college semester at Hawaii Pacific College, transferring in 1983 to North Idaho College and then to the University of Idaho. She attended Matanuska-Susitna College in Alaska for one term, returning to the University of Idaho to complete her Bachelor of Science degree in communications-journalism, graduating in 1987. She then went on to be a sports reporter and a mom. During all of this time, she could care less about American political issues (only caring about gun issues at best).

    Of course (as you know), meanwhile Obama was making history as the first black Harvard Law Review President (a post that usually leads one to the Supreme Court), graduating Magna Cum Laude from Harvard Law and teaching Consitutional Law at Chicago U.

  •  Palin was for Talibangelicals, not Hillary voters (5+ / 0-)

    This was about putting another George W. Bush Jr. on the ticket, just with more direct fundamentalism.

    And it worked.  It was about energizing the crazy right wing hardliners, who although would never vote for Obama, were awfully tepid about McCain.

    Now that McCain has chosen a lunatic Apocalypse-freak, they think they have their first straight line to the White House.

  •  Palin is for ground game and money!! (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    BirderWitch, mel70

    She's energized the churchy base; they'll be out in full force for McCain now.  And money from fundies is pouring in as well.

    Hillary voters were never a target.

    "No way, no how, no McCain." Hillary Clinton

    by keeplaughing on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 09:14:36 AM PDT

  •  I am petrified (10+ / 0-)

    I feel like we are in the twilight zone with this election. How can anyone including republicans, democrats and the media continue to let this woman pass without being interviewed on her positions, her policies, what she is going to do as VP. The mere thought of her being a heartbeat away from the presidency scares me to death. Are people really this gulliable? Do people really hate the fact that barack is a black man and they would risk not only our lives but their childrens lives putting this woman in office? The american people should be OUTRAGED that she has not been vetted enough on her positions. I hope women whom she is supposedly targeting wake up from this fantasy. She is against everything that would help women. Its is scary how people are idolizing her when she is just dick cheney in a skirt. I hope that in the coming weeks, barack and joe biden start hitting back even HARDER because this is not the time to play games with the american people lives. Forget the fact that she is woman, she wants to be treated equally so she should be vetted just like the other candidates. Our lives are at stake right now and I don't want this woman anywhere near the white house.

  •  Palin is a terrible choice. (4+ / 0-)

    The people who are voting for her would never have voted for Obama or Hillary anyway.  

    However, she is turning off the women who voted for Hillary and may have voted for a Moderate Republican like Jodi Rell of CT.  Now those women who are upset about not having Hillary as a presidential or VP candidate are being forced to make a choice between holding a grudge and voting against everything they stand for or voting for Barack Obama.  Overwhelmingly, I think they'll get over their anger and vote for Obama.  The a large majority of the women who are voting for Sarah would NEVER vote for Hillary.  

  •  Republican ground game! (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    billlaurelMD, degreesofgray

    Before McCain picked Palin, his ground game was non-existent. When Bush won in 2000 & 2004 he had a good ground game based upon the evangelicals. The pick of Palin was to re-activate these people.

    What that means is we will need to re-focus and work harder to get Obama elected.

  •  Bimbo power (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    to roll out the republican bimbo`s! Bimbo power!

  •  Good diary... (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    billlaurelMD, BirderWitch, mel70

    ...seems to me Palin was picked so she could re-confirm the Republican party's embrace of Bush's right wing extremism.

    Ironic they didn't want Bush to speak at the convention, yet, via the Palin pick, they turned the party back over to Bush.

    This is seldom mentioned outside of liberal blogs,  but Palin was a pick meant to engergize the pro-Bush sector of the Republican party.

    Which means Palin lead the Republican party right back to Bush instead of away from him. (Which makes McCain appear even more of a hypocritcal Bush-lover).

    And as long as the Republican party is willing to re-confirm their commitment to Bush, that's nothing but good news for Obama/Biden.

    Bottom line is that Karl Rove still loves Bush, and he was determined to give the party back to Bush during this election.  Palin was the perfcet Rovian stooge  to accomplish this.

    "The thought of [McCain] being president sends a cold chill down my spine."-Senator Thad Cochran, Mississippi Republican.

    by wyvern on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 09:20:18 AM PDT

  •  Kinda early to see how the McMILF ticket pans out (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Bulldawg, BirderWitch

    At the moment they're enjoying a post-convention bounce.

    If, by the end of this week, they flatline at 45%-46% or even remain tied to Obama/Biden I'll be a happy camper.

    I expect them to temporarily reach 50% in one of the Gallup/Rasmussen trackers today or tomorrow and I hope it doesn't bring out a horde of concern trolls.

    Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of liberty ::Thomas Jefferson::

    by Jeremy10036 on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 09:21:20 AM PDT

  •  where is Sarah Palin? (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    sagesource, lrhoke, Cedwyn

    that should be the only question asked about her until she agrees to be interviewed by ligit press and real reporters. If that mantra is drilled on by dems she'll be forced out of hidinh, if not she'll scam the election as a "womans candidate".

  •  Any Hillary voter who would go for Palin is... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Buffalo Nickel

    probably just gravy.  The McCain campaign seems to be really bummed by the lack of excitement surrounding the McCain campaign and realized if all they had to depend on to excite the convention was Gulianni, Romney and McCain they were done for.  Sooo they went for a flash in the pan that has helped them get interest in the convention and now on the campaign trail.  It was a way to continue the fraud.  The trick will be maintaining that as it has been with the Bush Administration.  We only have two months for people to wake up.

    We'll see.

  •  My friend who is a disappointed HRC supporter... (13+ / 0-)

    She is livid at Palin's glass ceiling remarks. She cannot allow her to rise through the glass ceiling that Hillary cracked, only to buck every issue that Hillary champions. She feels like it's theft -- she's stealing from Hillary, as well as women generally.

    My friend was going to quitely vote for Obama, but with resignation. She's fired up and ready to go, now.

    I'll bet she's not the only one...

    John McCain and George W. Bush: Let them eat cake. August 29, 2005.

    by rb137 on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 09:24:47 AM PDT

  •  When Barack said "they think your stupid" (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Cedwyn, esquimaux, BachFan, mel70

    He said it all.

  •  I miss slamming John Bush. So, I am following (0+ / 0-)

    BO's lead and refocusing my diaries and recommends on John Bush, period.

  •  I see Obama signs everywhere (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Isara, Hope Monger

    but when I see an occasional McCain sign, it's more like a display... flags and handwritten rants on poster board.

  •  A BIG mistake to slam community organizers... (9+ / 0-)

    I noticed that McCain was trying to push back on that remark (by The Mute One) on Face the Nation).  But he sounded insincere.  Clearly, they realize there's been some backlash over it.  That's a shame.

    Of course, since The Mute One isn't allowed to talk to the Press, we don't know when or if she will "be allowed to" push back.

    asking "Why not?" Lisa in CT on First Read and Obama website

    by JellyBearDemMom on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 09:29:15 AM PDT

  •  Is Rove once again trying to get the result (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Kestrel228, bluebrain, DanK Is Back

    close enough so that he can steal the election? He attributed his last win to the wingers - because they turned out.

    It's hard to know - but getting it close enough to steal is likely the plan.

    We have to make sure that doesn't happen - we have to work harder.

  •  Community Organizers (6+ / 0-)

    I do have to agree with you that in the end it was a Republican/Rove type mistake to hammer against Community organizers. They threw it to the convention as "red meat" because its a phrase that was code for them. Personally I believe though that we should come back with this and hit them hard with the idea that they now despise the "1000 points of light" concept, that they despise that fact that people give their time and energy to make the world better in their community, because its so bizarre and mean.  But the fact is they likely meant something else. Unveiling some of these code words reveal some pretty ugly values -  disdain for the poor, racism, selfishness.  My god though, the community organizer line sure did energize me!

  •  Obama should use "community organizer" (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    vacuumslayer, mel70

    in his closing statement and why he did it and who he fought for side by side. He should use the word "us" and how "we" are going to change Washington.

    It could be the most powerful moment of the debate.

  •  recc'd for (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    Karl Rove turns out to be a one-dirty-trick pony.

  •  We have an excellent chance to take it this time, (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    jamfan, luvmovies2000, vacuumslayer

    but the people on the other side, the ones who are far more concerned about "values" than they are issues, have a powerfully destructive voice. They can't be argued with or "debated." They can only be OVERWHELMED WITH NUMBERS. If in spite of our best efforts this bunch wins again, it will take a TOTAL ECONOMIC COLLAPSE of this nation to finally get it through to this nation that Republicans can't govern, they can only frighten, bamboozle, and smear.  

  •  McCain picked Palin for the base (6+ / 0-)

    In part, McCain was seduced by the media hype during the Dem convention that there was still a rift between Hillary's supporters and the campaign, and thought picking Palin would exploit that rift.


    But the main reason he picked her, I believe, is because the Republican base, or that part of it that is fundamentalist Christian, still did not (and probably still does not) trust McCain. That means that, on the eve of his convention, McCain count not count on his base of support - not good.

    Had he thought his base was secure, McCain would have gone with the person he really wanted - Lieberman. Obama, on the other hand, felt comfortable enough with his base to be able to sit down and decide whom he really wanted and could work with best.

    Biden represents the heart of the country. Palin represents the extreme. So it should come as no surprise that only the extreme likes her.

    American foreign policy is NOT a Viagra substitute.

    by DanK Is Back on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 09:42:54 AM PDT

  •  No, wrong on all counts. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    luvmovies2000, misreal

    The target audience is the people who dine at McDonald's and aspire to acquire a McMansion.  
    These people are not realistic.

    How do you tell a predator from a protector? The predator will eat you sooner rather than later.

    by hannah on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 09:45:34 AM PDT

  •  Best Quote -- Make an Ad from it: (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    luvmovies2000, spyguy999, mel70

    "Women are not for women just because they are women. We are intelligent enough to make a conscious decision."

    Dulce bellum inexpertis [War is sweet only to those who have no experience of it].

    by Fatherflot on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 09:46:23 AM PDT

  •  I loved Samantha Bee's answer (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    greenomanic, skrekk, mel70

    ...when John said (paraphrasing), "Yeah, but Sam, Palin is Hillary's ideological opposite."

    Bee's reply, "Yes, John, but she's her gynecological twin."

    LOL! Yes, women are dumb enough to vote on the va-jay-jay. Evidently Karl Rove thinks so. Snort.

    Republicans: Fluffy. White. Happy. -- The Daily Show

    by romwriter on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 09:47:39 AM PDT

  •  Enthusiastic base changes the game (5+ / 0-)

    This diary is ok as far as it goes with McCain's lame attempt to pull in the imagined PUMA vote.

    However, don't underestimate the potential value to him of solidifying and firing up his base.

    Palin is going to lock up their Crazy Base World vote.

    But that's not enough to win.

    It's probably true that it's not enough to win, but it does change the game somewhat.

    See "Rival Tickets Are Redrawing Battlegrounds", today's NYT, by Patrick Healy and Michael Cooper.

    Fresh from the Republican convention, Senator John McCain’s campaign sees evidence that his choice of Gov. Sarah Palin as his running mate is energizing conservatives in the battleground of Ohio while improving its chances in Pennsylvania and some Western states that Senator Barack Obama has been counting on.

    ...[Obama's campaign]is banking on holding all the states Senator John Kerry won in 2004 and picking up the additional electoral votes it needs by flipping some combination of Colorado, Indiana, Iowa, Nevada, New Mexico, Ohio or Virginia into the Democratic column.
    Strategists say that Mr. McCain can now count on a more motivated social conservative base to help him in areas like southern Ohio, where the 2004 race was settled.

    While fortified turnout from this base is probably not enough to assure victory for Mr. McCain, strategists said, it would be very difficult for him to win without it. In that sense, Ms. Palin’s presence on the ticket — depending on how her candidacy fares under the scrutiny it is receiving — could be vital.

  •  Their politics are finished! (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

        All they ever had going for them was that, "Pull yourself up by your boot straps," thing. When people have lost their jobs, lost their homes, and are dying from lack of medical care, the Pull yourself up by your bootstraps" crowd needs to shut the hell up.
    In this floundering, failing  economy-republicans should have nothing to say. Their legislation and their governance has brought this country to its knees. If anything, they just need to shut the hell up! The other team is going to clean-up their mess. As always.

    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from a religious conviction." --Blaise Pascal

    by lyvwyr101 on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 09:51:37 AM PDT

  •  Anecdotes aren't statistics (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
  •  Even low information voters (10+ / 0-)

    have bullsh*t detectors and Peggy Noonan pegged it right this week when she called this political bullsh*t. Obama nailed it yesterday too when he said "They must think you're stupid." It captures what most independent voters don't like about this pick. It is an obvious pander and the type that assumes the vast majority of people out there are stupid. It's insulting and a lot of people, especially women, I've talked to about Palin literally feel insulted. So whatever morass of scandals Palin has brewing back home, however thin her resume, however weak her ability to talk about foreign or domestic issues before audiences not primed to adore her, it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter whether each and every one of these points is drilled into the public consciousness or not. People see her for what she is. What Obama supporters need to do is stay on message. It's the economy, jobs, energy, health care...all those things that weren't covered by Palin's OR McCain's speeches and likely won't be talked about by Republicans in the coming weeks. And these are the issues that this election will turn on, not mooseburgers.

  •  Although I'm told (11+ / 0-)

    by the TV how her appeal to the American woman is strong how working class real Americans love her 'values' and other bs. Every woman I have talked to no matter where they stand on the demographic breakdowns age, political spectrum, career, single married all are freaked out by this woman. So who likes her?

    I hear She's insulting to me as a woman, She's scary, She's a dimwit and on and on. Realize this is not a poll just anecdotal but even my suburban right leaning daughter in law thinks she's 'disgusting'. My grandaughter is autistic so the special needs Mom thing isn't working with a mom of four, who knows what it is like to have a child with special needs.    

    "And if my thought-dreams could be seen They'd probably put my head in a guillotine" Bob Dylan

    by shaharazade on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 09:56:19 AM PDT

  •  I'm hearing lots of negative remarks (12+ / 0-)

    from my hometown in Iowa. My stepmom, who is 67 is majorly pissed at this woman. She knows tons of people and does an amazing amount of volunteer work on behalf of those less fortunate. Now her age group there is might conservative and not very pc when it comes to women and she told me the comments are that Sarah is nasty, rude and bitchy (their word, not mine) and they hate that she slammed community organizers (these women are huge in working with local churches running food banks and clothing stores), they're also very disgusted with the whole unwed pg teen thing being trotted out on a national stage as though it's now somehow a wonderful thing.(some of these women remember either a friend or when they themselves got pg and were humiliated by the very society that now claims it's ok as long as a wedding follows). Now, we here, may be loathe to discuss that but it IS being talked about by many older women. She also said that while she and the other women might not have chosen abortion they want it available for their daughter and granddaughter because they remember clearly how it was before it was legal. She also said they told her they're not stupid and they see that the economy is number one.

    I think McCain seriously misjudged some of these older women. It's good to hear these things from real older women instead of the TM BS spin.

    A nation of sheep begets a government of wolves. War does not determine who wins. War determines who's left.

    by Its any one guess on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 09:57:20 AM PDT

  •  despair? (6+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Fury, Isara, 99 Percent Pure, misreal, rsmpdx, mel70

    I've switched my thinking from "we will pull this out" to "we will give Obama a mandate"

    Go volunteer!

    They don't need only canvassers and phoners.

    Give the campaign office a call and tell them your talents.

    Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room! - President Merkin Muffley

    by AlyoshaKaramazov on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 09:59:08 AM PDT

  •  This diary (8+ / 0-)

    is part of what is wrong with DKOS.  It's become a god damned cheerleader website with a bunch of people sticking their thumbs in their ears screaming "I can't hear you!"  

    Her targeted audience is evangelicals not former HRC supporters.  Sure they'll try to pry away a few female swing voters from HRC, but that was just hype for the media and helped stir up the pundits during the Dem convention..  The reality is she galvanizes the GOP base in important regions like SOUTHERN OHIO which along with blatant cheating helped deliver OH to the GOP in 04.  If you read the NYT today, there is an excellent article that breaks down the the frontline of the battleground states.
    Rival Tickets Are Redrawing Battlegrounds  

    We are in a dogfight and Palin is connecting with the voters.  Far from a blowout this election is going to swing based on a select number of precincts in select districts in a handful of states like Nevada, New Mexico, Colorado, Virginia and then the big three of PA, FL, and OH.  Palin will help get out the vote in the rural evangelical regions which is precisely what she is supposed to accomplish and not what this bullshit this diary proposes.    

    Oh and fire away with the silly accusations of "concern troll" and make sure you reread the first line of this posting after doing so...

    I take political action every day. I teach.

    by jbfunk on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 10:02:19 AM PDT

  •  But the Palin story does work as a wedge issue (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    billlaurelMD, Tanya

    It's the usual Karl Rove divide and conquer strategy. When they got us at odds with each other over distractive issues then America looses focus and is ripe for manipulation by propaganda. Many people are now starting to think that Iraq is a success because they're just not able to process all that stuff about there not being a political solution yet and the underlying problems still festering. Sure they'll feel stupid and used in a few months if John McCain is elected and Iraq starts flying out of control again, but these guys are excellent at short term manipulation and memory loss. We need to do a better job of reminding people of how they've been used before preceding an election.

  •  Screw Palin!! (3+ / 0-)

    We need to out organize, out register, out GOTV in every precinct. We need to ensure victory from the ground up.

    The cable news networks are doing everything they can to play up the R'Thug game of focusing on personalities over principles, spin over facts, truthiness over integrity for low information voters. It's to the advantage of the talking heads to continue the charade for their advertisers' and employers' business interests. Nothing more, nothing less--just doin' bidness.

    "In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act," George Orwell.

    by not4bushwa on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 10:21:42 AM PDT

  •  Thanks! You've made me feel better. (0+ / 0-)

    Even though my acquaintances who weren't sure they could support Obama have now decided they can, thanks to Palin, I've still been scared.  Because I've been hearing non-stop Palin-mania stories for the past week, even on NPR.  It's made me wonder if my friends are just anomolies.

    Thanks for the reality check!

  •  Every woman I talk to (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Fury, esquimaux, BirderWitch, taiping1

    in red Orange County, CA comes up with the "b" word within 30 seconds of talking about Palin.

    McCain is clearly out of touch with women (after all, they seem to serve at his 'pleasure' as he dumped his first wife as 'repulsive.')

    Let me illustrate how flawed their thinking is.  The rethugs are assuming that "hockey mom, PTA mom" will resonate positively with women.  I don't think so.  I've raised four kids and I think my association in kids' sports and PTA is fairly typical.  We've all come across the parent that thinks that they are the boss of the organization and it's their way or the highway.  Seriously, you meet some pretty obnoxious, self-serving parents and her self-described "pit bull with lipstick" pretty much sums it up.

    When McCain's ailing . . .you'll get PALIN.

    by Shappy on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 10:32:40 AM PDT

  •  As a person who occasionally attends (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    luvmovies2000, BachFan, BirderWitch
    an evangelical church (I'm atheist btw), I can tell you that Palin shores up the fundies in ways McCain never could.  As for independents, I can't tell you because they don't exist around here :P.

    But in the unlikely story that is America, there has never been anything false about hope. -- Barack Obama

    by ZacJamieson on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 10:38:35 AM PDT

  •  One thing I know about Hillary supporters (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    They are the kind of women who do not shy away from having frank discussions with their sexually active teen-age daughters about contraception.

    If, in Palin's case, you are against allowing public schools to give young women good information about how their bodies work, then this talk must come from the parents.

    What does Palin's failure to take on this duty say about her ability to take on the difficult tasks expected of parents, or political leaders in our modern world?

    "Be yourself; everyone else is already taken." - Oscar Wilde

    by greendem on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 10:38:38 AM PDT

  •  Total Wishful Thinking (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    luvmovies2000, fALk, db27

    Your argument is based entirely on anecdotal interviews conducted by the LA Times. California is NOT in play.

    The target audience for Palin is in Ohio and Michigan and a few other states, and we don't see any articles like that from south Ohio, for example.

    Let's see what the next Ohio and Michigan polls say, but the projections are not good. Most analysts think she found her mark here, precisely because of the pervasive attacks on rural people coming from "progressive" circles.

    The ultimate effect will depend on whether the low-information voters on the coasts smarten up fast about the rural voters in the heartland and stop dissing us before the election.

    If you push Palin to become a small-town hero, she'll adapt well to the role.

  •  Not all "born-again"s want to be "fooled-again"s (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    luvmovies2000, taiping1

    Use me once, shame on you.
    Use me twice, shame on you.
    Try again, you've lost my vote.

    Some Christians noticed Obama's vociferous defense of Sarah Palin when she was attacked on personal family matters.   That's what Christians are supposed to do:  stand up for what's right.

    Some Christians saw the hypocrisy when the right wingers complained about the personal attacks after having engaged in much worse attacks (and less true)on Obama....for nearly two years!!!

    Some Christians viewed Palin's acceptance speech as
    an inappropriate way to repay kindness from Obama.

    We will always have fundamentalists in every religion who carry things to dangerous extremes.   But many Christians are seeing through this latest attempt to woo them.

    --It's a feverish world, Inman said, for lack of better comment. (Charles Frazier)

    by Taya Lawrence on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 10:43:51 AM PDT

  •  I had an interesting conversation Friday (5+ / 0-)

    I work at a kennel, where I happen to be one of the few male employees (and I work in the office, ironically), and had a brief exchange with one of my colleagues. She's a woman in her mid-20s, married, no kids. Like me, like many of us, struggling to make ends meet. Also not particularly political that I've noticed.

    Her description of Palin's speech? "Catty."

    "Nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight. You've got to kick at the darkness until it bleeds daylight." --Bruce Cockburn, "Lovers In A Dangerous

    by AustinCynic on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 10:46:29 AM PDT

  •  Diary is a bit confused (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Ohiobama, Taya Lawrence

    Palin was targetted to attract some of Hillary voters, yes, but the main target is independent white females. Gallup had a story about how this group was the most likely to shift, since it's split half and half between McCain and Obama.

  •  true (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    there are a lot people who feel if you attack her your attacking me, if she can be VP so can I.

  •  I don't know why anyone with half a mind (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    jamfan, luvmovies2000, Buffalo Nickel

    would see Palin as "change"... except that she doesn't have a penis.  Let's compare her record:

    She fires people that don't share her politics (check)

    She racked up millions of dollars of debt for the city she was elected to lead (check)

    She plays fast and loose with the truth (check)

    She uses the power of her office to advance a personal agenda (check)

    She stalls efforts to investigate alleged misdeeds within her administration (check)

    Her politics are as far right of center as one can get (check)

    Hmmm... yeah, that's change I can believe in... NOT!

  •  Does it bother anyone else that McCain's VP has (3+ / 0-)

    to be coached/tutored on foreign relations (and who know what else)??  And that they feel they have to "shield" her from the media.  I've hear a few commentators say this now, in a matter-of-fact way... like it's no big deal.  Gee... to me, this is a VERY BIG DEAL!  Why do I get the feeling that no Republicans are bothered by this?  This is not college where you cram the night before the final.  Everyone knows how much you retain when you do this.  And if you don't... take a few minutes and watch Father Guido explain how it works.

  •  Okay, if Palin is tanking w/targeted voters (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    slinkerwink, Fury, Ohiobama

    then someone explain today's Gallup results?  McCain must be advancing himself then despite his VP choice.

    I don't know, the article is good, but this strikes me as anecdotal evidence, not anything to get excited about.

  •  I thought Palin was supposed to shore up (0+ / 0-)

    the crazoid wingnut base of the GOP so that McCain's landslide loss in November will not be quite such an utterly humiliating avalanche of defeat.

    Restore constitutional government in America. Impeach Bush and Cheney.

    by revbludge on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 11:23:50 AM PDT

  •  Today's Tracking Polls have McCain +3 or Tied (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    which pretty much refutes the entire basis of this diary. These are the first traking polls that are entirely post-Palin's speech.

    It wasn't McCain that turned so many people around, it was Palin.

    So we need to end the wishful thinking now folks, and understand what is happening. And STOP the backfiring personal attacks.

  •  Well I had to put some facts before a Palindrone (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    luvmovies2000, skrekk

    ...they seemed to think that everything she claimed in her speech was true.  

    She didn't like Rachel Maddow simply labelling Palin's claims as lies -- it would have been better had Rachel said what was lying about those lies. I did that part for her.  

    Plus I brought up Biden's points about the fact they never mentioned the middle class (much less the working class or working poor, which a lot of people are palpably sliding into, and need to be told, glittering generalities from Caribou Barbie AIN'T gonna help 'em) OR Health Care OR Social Security (which McCain tried to privatize).

    It's a long row to hoe, and we gotta keep at it!  

  •  She is the most qualified candidate (0+ / 0-)

    to change McCain's Depends.

    McCain's 3AM ad is really a Flomax commercial.

    by jhecht on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 11:43:17 AM PDT

  •  I keep thinking I'm going to wake up (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    jamfan, Bronx59, Buffalo Nickel

    This whole election seems like some bizarre joke or a movie or something. The Democrats are doing so perfectly, in every measurable way, and the Republicans are lousing up so horrendously, every minute, and then McCain picks this...I don't even know what to call her yet. It's like an SNL sketch or something. But it's real, and it's actually happening. And I used to have so much respect for McCain, too. It's just...confusing.

    I don't know who the Republicans really wanted to target with Palin--I'm not even sure about women since she's really not a good pick for that--but I know someone who's Republican who told me he "likes" Palin, and I mean that in all the wrong ways. I think he'd be voting for McCain no matter who he'd picked (although I don't know about Clinton, heh, as he's no fan, but McCain never would have picked her), and now the campaign has the added benefit of being more visually appealing to him.

    But as I was looking at the comments, I thought, "Wait, isn't there a Vice-Presidential debate?" Holy cats, she won't last 2 seconds against Biden. It has the potential to be far more interesting than even the Obama/McCain debate. My God, I must watch this.

    "With a keen eye for details, one truth prevails." - Detective Conan

    by onetruthprevails on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 11:45:54 AM PDT

  •  We'll see where this goes though (0+ / 0-)

    Obama and Biden need to continue to keep the gloves off and hit the fakes where they need to.

    Conservatives are close-minded, shallow, superficial people that live in a fantasy world where everything is black and white and there are NO shades of gray.

    by Brad007 on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 11:47:43 AM PDT

  •  I Loved This in Your Diary - (0+ / 0-)

    Step away from the despair.

    The media are having quite a binge on the brief view they had at the convention of Sarah Palin, where she delivered a speech written by somebody else.

    Palin is a walking talking wedge issue, nothing more nor less, meant to distract and divide the American people along the fault lines of their fear.

    By picking Palin, the Republicans are inviting the American media and their audience to binge, yes binge, on the politics of personality, while keeping their VP candidate away from direct examination through interview by the press.

    They are creating a narrative where their audience can say that they know Palin, not by her stand on the issues, or her political practice of policies, but by the glasses she wears, the speeches she mouths, the fit of her skirt, her diet, and her private family matters.

    In the debut of WSJ Magazine, Palin chides herself not on her lack of foreign policy opinion or experience but on breakfast.  This moose-hunting, caribou eating mother of five cheats on what she eats, just like your average working gal or guy in Chicago, or Walla Walla, or Tuscaloosa:

    "My family and I eat a healthy diet heavy in wild Alaskan seafood, moose, caribou and fresh fruit," she says. "I guess my biggest pitfall is breakfast. I know it's the most important meal of the day but I still haven't bought into it. I hate to admit it, but a skinny white-chocolate mocha is my staple in the morning."

    American non-line press people are gorging on Sarah Palin right now.  Her candidacy is a chance for them to play out their oppositional narrative for two more months.  Rather than be forced to cover the issues and the real concerns facing us all they can natter on about what Sarah's wearing, her family foibles, and how she makes them feel.

    They are diabetics and Palin is a fat white-chocolate mocha.

  •  Encouraging story (0+ / 0-)

    McCain is clearly getting a convention bounce, as you'd expect. But the longterm question is what Sarah Palin will do. I knew she'd repel feminist Clinton supporters. I knew she'd attract Christian conservative women. And I knew that suburban Independent women would give her some time but were a bit skeptical. What I didn't know was how blue collar women would respond.

    My neighbor, who is a blue collar white Democrat from Appalachia admired Palin's grit but doesn't think she knows much to be VP. She's unimpressed by Palin's refusal to take questions.

    She is much like the women in this article.

    If they are unswayed by Palin, then Obama will do fine.

    Note also that Uniontown, PA went about 85% for Clinton in the primary. Obama had ZERO support there in April. If these women are repelled by Palin, then Obama will be in good shape.

  •  But really, isn't it fair to say evangelicals are (0+ / 0-)

    less likely to vote for a woman, overall, than non-evangelicals? Aren't these the same voters who really don't approve of the idea that a woman should be the "head", but rather the "heart" of the family? Sure, maybe hire a woman to be HHS secretary, or Treasury, but not CIC. I mean, isn't this one of their basic tenets?

    And if so, how is Palin supposed to help shore up support from the so called base, the regular church going crowd? I just don't see this kind of wave of support carrying her and McCain over the finish line...

  •  Hillary voters aren't the ones they want (0+ / 0-)

    They are using Palin to get white men, particularly blue collar, union, gun-pwners, hunters - the same folks that voted Hillary not because they were feminists but because they did not like Obama.

  •  huh? (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Paul Goodman, Alec82

    I don't follow.  You say

    Wasn't Palin chosen to usher Hillary voters into the fold?

    Isn't she supposed to be a dynamite choice for women, mothers, and those cherished "family values"?

    Here's a great article about how Palin is viewed by the very demographic she is supposed to appeal to: disaffected Hillary voters and small town women.

    But I ask, who has been saying that?

    Palin is for conservative men, not liberal women. We can make fun of her all we want on here; it doesn't matter.  She's not aimed at us.

    Obama will win women huge. The whole Obama-is-in-trouble-with-women is an invented story pushed by GOP operatives and corporate media establishments.  It's not based in any empirical evidence.

  •  Aren't we forgetting someone? n/t (0+ / 0-)

    It's John McCain, not whatshername.

    by ticket punch on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 01:27:41 PM PDT

  •  crash course (6+ / 0-)


    Barry Blitt, NYT

    I support Barack America and his trusted sidekick Joe Delaware! -Socratic

    by valadon on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 01:46:02 PM PDT

  •  Sarah Palin the way I see it, is an insult to (0+ / 0-)

    Hillary voters.  Women that voted for Hillary, whom I supported in the beginning are much smarter than Sarah Palin could ever dream of being.

    I am sure Hillary supporters are very well aware of this.

  •  Any woman should be turned off by (0+ / 0-)

    the way she is treating her daughter.  Palin knew her daughter was pregnant when she agreed to be McCain's VP and seriously doubt she told the one person who supposedly vetted her on that one day.  She's exposing her daughter to the spotlight in a very vulnerable state.  Unless the daughter is a true republican dense, not too bright and insensitive she can't be happy about this.  It also appears that the boy doesn't really want to get married.He posted on his my space site that he doesn't want kids.  If this way Obama's daughter he would have been out before you could say the word.  These family values people are hypocrites who, if Palin is any example, put themselves and their ambitions before their children.

  •  I hope this is true (0+ / 0-)

    but apparently it's not being picked up in the polls.

  •  Obama mentions gas prices in every speech n/t (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    Politics is like driving. To go backward, put it in R. To go forward, put it in D.
    58 days until the '08 elections. Let's paint the country BLUE!

    by TrueBlueMajority on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 02:12:32 PM PDT

  •  The Washington Snowbillies (0+ / 0-)

    It could play in the "heartland" as a tragi-comedy.

    Considering how messed up their own lives usually are, why do the so-called "family values" voters want someone just like them running things?

  •  What's more telling (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    is that this is a city in PA-12, the very kind of district McCain HAS to win in order to carry Pennsylvania.

    "No way, no how, no McCain." Hillary Clinton, 8-27-08

    by Christian Dem in NC on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 02:55:00 PM PDT

  •  You said "female relatives"... (0+ / 0-)

    I've never used that phrase. I'm going to this Thanksgiving, though.

    We said we want change, and they gave us a handful.

    by MouseOfSuburbia on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 03:26:57 PM PDT

  •  Fundamentally hypocritical (0+ / 0-)

    CSPAN is replaying the 2006 Alaska gubernatorial debate, and she clearly says in reference to assisted suicide, "I don't think the government should be involved in ending someone's life." BUT SHE'S WHOLEHEARTEDLY IN SUPPORT OF THE DEATH PENALTY? The death penalty, where the government is involved in ending someone's life..

    I don't think there are any Russians, and there ain't no Yanks. Just corporate criminals playing with tanks. The Call, 'The Walls Came Down' (83)

    by Uosdwis on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 04:03:06 PM PDT

  •  The "bounce" (0+ / 0-)

    Only bounce I fear is a dud nukular weapon, when the desperate republiKKKlan neocons pull out their last card, an attack on Iran. Maybe their puppetmasters in
    Tel Aviv will do the deed, but it'll be the Cheney regime who say "Okay." One can only hope and pray, if that's your preference, that sane minds in the Pentagon will put the USA ahead of their cushy pensions and tell Richard Bruce Cheney to go mate with himself.

  •  Always thought them putting Palin in attack mode (0+ / 0-)

    was a mistake.   They'd have gone farther with her as 'just a PTA mom'.   Most people are tired of attack dogs, and that was the first time many saw her and I know it was a turn off for most outside the Republican base.    Obama does get respect for not 'going there' like everyone typically does.    His joking tone a couple of days ago was perfect.

  •  she may be tanking w/disaffected Hillary supprtrs (0+ / 0-)

    but probably will be successful with alot of the the 'bitter' small towners who have been looking for a reason to get excited about voting against Obama.   Biden was a great pick to combat that, but she will peel away some of those votes.  Odd that McCain wasn't enough by himself.

  •  Here's what we do....... (0+ / 0-)

    Please get out into your neighborhood and make personal contact.  Reach out to the people you avoid talking politics with, and take a chance.  I infuriated a co-worker by responding to one of her right-wing forwards with the facts on Palin.  I don't give a shit.  She has a huge contact list, and it was worth a try.  I'm going to keep at her, too.  She was mad because she knew I was telling the truth. Maybe I made her think.

  •  Palin has locked up the fundie vote for McSame (0+ / 0-)

    which allows him to tack to the center now. His challenge was always to satisfy the base and appeal to independents at the same time. I hate to say this, but picking her has put that to bed for him.

    The fundies aren't even listening to Gramps anymore, they're so fired up for Palin. His entire message since the convention has been aimed at independents.

    My sense is that with the vast majority of voters, opinions on McSame are pretty much set. Yes, we should keep trying to tie him to Bush, but I think it's as important to get across how dangerous and extremist and unprepared Palin is.

    We have to make her completely unviable.

  •  Has she actually shot a moose? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    Or is the moosehunting just another lie or exaggeration? Would she even know the difference between, say, a moose and a caribou, given that her vindictive policy towards wolves suggests an abysmal ignorance of basic ecology?

  •  It was sexist to select her (0+ / 0-)

    And then she proved women can be every single great or disgusting type of person there is.

    Thus, for thinking persons being a positive sum outcome for our sisters and my Party.

    Who quotes the AP these days anyway?

    by eroded47095 on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 05:33:57 PM PDT

  •  Fibber McPalin: (0+ / 0-)

    "So I said 'listen here Congress 'thanks but no thanks' on that bridge to nowhere.'"

    "I took the money of course, but no way was I going to spend it on that bridge to nowhere as soon as Congress said I couldn't.  It was then I decided to say 'thanks but no thanks.'"


    Republican National Convention, Sept. 2008

  •  Canvasiing today indicated women ain't buying it (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    XOVER, robertacker13

    Really good news.  My canvassing today proved to me that Palin hasn't moved women to vote for her at all.  Most are insulted that the GOP thinks women will vote for them just because they put a woman on the ticket.  Any woman won't do.  Hillary was a good woman ... in line with their valies ... Palin is NOT!

  •  Great diary and I too believe picking (0+ / 0-)

    Palin is all karl rove.  He is looking to keep it close for another theft.  Beware of this immoral man who could never win anything fair and square!

    When power leads man toward arrogance, poetry reminds him of his limitations. JFK

    by yowsta on Sun Sep 07, 2008 at 06:23:41 PM PDT

  •  She is truly dangerous! (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Paul Goodman

    I was flamed for posting a brief diary on this topic yesterday so I'll comment here.

    This woman scares me from more than one perspective but the biggest is her being a heartbeat away from the presidency and the implications of her strings being pulled by the neocon cabal.  Can you imagine her as president with someone like David Addington as VP?

    If McSame is transported to the promise land, someone will have to replace her as VP and we've seen what a strong VP has done for us in the recent past. Can you imagine someone like Addington who doesn't even think that the office of VP is part of the executive but somewhere, constitutionally, between the executive and legislative having control over Palin.  The unitary executive on steroids.

    This scares me folks!!!

  •  asdf (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Paul Goodman

    Wasn't Palin chosen to usher Hillary voters into the fold?

    Nope, that was the shiny object the GOP used to distract the media and many here.

  •   The day after Palin's big speech (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    My girlfriend was telling me about a discussion she had with some older ladies she works with in our small, conservative Gulf Coast Florida county which always goes Republican in the Presidential elections.  They were telling her about how great Palin was and how she had really cleaned up Alaska politics.  I'm wondering what they'll be saying as more and more dirt comes out on her.  We truly need to get back to the issues.  I've had no one at work (I'm a teacher) say anything positive to me about McCain.  I've had a few tell me that Obama scares them, but most seem to love Obama or at least think he's the best choice we have this November.

  •  Palin didn't target Hillary voters (0+ / 0-)

    The Hillary voters arn't going to fall for cheap trick and even if McCain is too dumb to know this, his handlers arn't.

    Palin is there to unite the base. The uneducated white males and the red neck Republicans who make 25k per year. She is doing great here. This demographic hated McCain and probably would have stayed home on election day. But Palin, with her big boobs, hunting, fishing and snowmobiling brings this demographic in. She's sort of a new Ann Coulter to them. A pin up girl that they can identify with.

    Her large family and pregnant teen gives her appeal to the female sector of this group as well.

  • Close


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