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Some of us, anyway.

You do what works.
Whatever gets Obama elected.
Anything. Period.

Because it is just that important.
No crying about the moral high ground, and no whining about how that makes us no better than them.

They have too much of a head start... we could sacrifice bunnies to Cthulu, tell kids there is no Santa, and preemptively invade the Vatican...

We would still be way better than the Republican Party. Because they are just that bad.

Facts, schmacts.

Whatever it takes.

The alternative is too dire to take the chance.

Suffice it to say I was stunned when I read that comment just moments ago. I'd expect this type of talk from Steve Schmitt and Nancy Pfotenhauer, because if you change Obama to McCain and Republican to Democratic it's a variation on the Republicans' message through and through:

You do what works.
Whatever gets McCain elected.
Anything. Period.

Because it is just that important.
No crying about the moral high ground, and no whining about how that makes us no better than them.

They have too much of a head start... we could sacrifice bunnies to Cthulu, tell kids there is no Santa, and preemptively invade the Vatican...

We would still be way better than the Democratic Party. Because they are just that bad.

Facts, schmacts.

Whatever it takes.

The alternative is too dire to take the chance.

I just never thought I'd read it only DailyKos. The truth of matter is that regardless of how you spin it, we wouldn't be better than the Republican Party if we did that.

No. We would be the Republican Party. Before this election cycle heated up, before the Convention, Palin and McCain's bounce we were all too happy with the way things were going. This is an election about change and we were the guys who were for it always, not just the guys who were against it before we were for it. Now by all rights I'm a young guy in college trying to survive on Ramen. I don't have all the life experience some people on DKos have. But I grew up with George W. Bush. I've seen how bad it's gotten even where I live.

I know we need change.

But needing change doesn't mean you try to kill your opponent by innuendo and lying, as many on this board - even those amongst us whom up until recently I held in the highest respect - suggest we ought to do. I don't give a damn how dire the scenario is: when you give up your ideals and your morality to win against those who have done the same, you give up your right to do better for this country.

This country needs a character debate. We need it now and we need it bad. Our leaders should be better than this filth. We should hold them to a higher standard, not hold the bar so low that they could trip over it and still win the expectations game. The big, bad world is out there, and it's our guy's platform that we can make something better of it. Anything less is the type of cowardice that's defined the last eight years of lawlessness in the White House and the last twenty years of the Republican Party. Stop acting like we can play morality games while destroying the reputation of someone by innuendo. That's just disgraceful to this site and to the Democratic Party. We owe it to ourselves to be better than our opponents, because the situation truly is too dire to take that chance.

Originally posted to Dreamscribe on Fri Sep 12, 2008 at 09:15 AM PDT.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Change jar n/t (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Vicky, kck
    •  BTW, I don't agree with Paul Hackett's advice... (0+ / 0-)

      ...and he did lose his own election after all.

      "This is a fight for the future. And it's a fight we must win...Obama is my candidate. And he must be our President." Hillary Clinton, DNC, August 26, 2008

      by kck on Fri Sep 12, 2008 at 10:24:27 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  A few thoughts... (0+ / 0-)

    Politics is not the ministry, or social work...Who the President is will determine lives, how many lost, methods of loss, collateral loss...Elections are matters of life and death...

    In the Revolutionary War, it is said that the British soldiers cried foul that the colonialists hid behind trees firing shots rather than the accepted mano a mano methodology the Brits used. If you were in charge, wouldn't you lead the troops into trenches and behind rocks, sneak up on the armed enemies?

    Part of why we call public service "service" is because those we elect do not rise up onto an altar but down into the snake pit of thieving, selfish, parochial war...This is why I caution that Obama's art of oratory will be one of his least important talents as a President, until re-election.

    Warriors (and Presidents) win with organization and discipline but also trickery, subterfuge, leverage, and strength, or they die. Once the war is over, we get to live out our ideals...because they won. Successful governing triumphs over the forces of unlawfulness and disorder allowing us to live out our ideals...That's not to say he needs to become a dirty pol, but neither can he rely on your smile...to win, he must know in his bones how to overcome his opponent with an overwhelming force power.  

    Getting to the finish line may not be a phase of election politics you are ideally suited for yet...   ;-)      

    "This is a fight for the future. And it's a fight we must win...Obama is my candidate. And he must be our President." Hillary Clinton, DNC, August 26, 2008

    by kck on Fri Sep 12, 2008 at 09:58:38 AM PDT

    •  That's not what I'm saying (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      kck

      I'm all for attacking John McCain on the issues and pointing out his flaws. I will never be more of an outspoken supporter of that line of attack. But the insinuations by some on this site that to beat the Republicans in the fall requires the Obama campaign or any Democrat to mortgage his or her values and partake in Rovian tactics is one I detest. We can stand up strong against McCain and the Republicans by pointing out forcefully that they have wronged this country and shouldn't be allowed to rule.

      What we cannot do is smear them with the same swiftboat tactics that killed us in 2000 and 2004. What will our slogan be in 2012 if Obama gets elected that way? "We were for change before we were against it"? We are a community that prides ourselves on being thoughtful and decent without being spineless. If we lose our decency and our thoughtfulness while winning an election, we won't have defeated the Republican party.

      We'll have become them.

      •  OK, then, I agree. (0+ / 0-)

        I can speak as a corporate leader, and in that sector, life is wonderful, productive, ideal in the absence of adversaries or competitors. In other words, big fish, little pond. When in a large corporate enterprise, smears are rare and seldom tolerated, your friends need to feel as if they need you and your enemies need to feel either as if they wish they were your friends or afraid of you. You know how they say the best defense is an offense, well, slimy smear campaigns are defenses, focus is on your opponent...in an election, when who's on top (the outcome) is uncertain, it is a constant state of offense...owning the message.

        I recall a time in the primaries when Obama was out with something new and strengthening every day...Hillary barely had time to respond when something new came up. Everytime he spoke he was making news. Obama was driving full speed ahead on HIS message...overwhelming power.

        "This is a fight for the future. And it's a fight we must win...Obama is my candidate. And he must be our President." Hillary Clinton, DNC, August 26, 2008

        by kck on Fri Sep 12, 2008 at 11:33:46 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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