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So, how is that bi-partisanship going here in California?  Not so much.  Calitics has been following the action with grace and much needed info for us poor citizens who are locked out of these budget negotiations.  We're left out in the cold, literally (Well, except for twitter which is keeping us in the loop).  Cutting like crazy, tax hikes we can't afford, the whole thing is FUBAR on the scale of The Daily Show's, "Clusterfuck to the Poorhouse".  This is the phrase I use and have used for a while to describe California's failing "Democracy".

California lawmakers worked into early Wednesday but couldn't pass a budget to avoid the possibility of laying off 10,000 more state workers.


But it was the headline that got me.  Those we've elected to run our state "Can't solve the budget crisis".  The only reason?  Ideology.  Hard nosed, don't budge an inch ideology that goes before what's doing best for the 8th largest economy in world.  THE WORLD.

I've written about the no tax pledge signed by all Republicans in the legistlature in August of 2008 (except one).  This kind of promise is not possible.  Then you have local radio hosts putting people heads on sticks because why?  Who knows.  They admit at least Democrats didn't sign a pledge.  


Republicans, they can't budge because they painted themselves into this ridiculous corner.

Lawmakers brought blankets and toothbrushes to work Tuesday, planning to stay as long as it took to pass a budget, but as of 2 a.m. PT (5 a.m. ET) Wednesday, it appeared they had taken a step backward.

Late Tuesday, Republicans ousted their leader, Sen. Dave Cogdill of Modesto. The move was likely to complicate debate because Cogdill had headed up negotiations with Democrats on the budget impasse.

Cogdill not only headed up negotiations, he was speaking reasonably and like someone who was able to put their ideology after what is best for the State.  

"My deal, one more time, has always been that I would try my best to get it to a position where I felt it was as good as I could get and I was willing to release my members," Cogdill said in a brief interview in the hallway outside his office. "That's where I am. So I'm not guaranteeing any votes; it's up to them (his members) to make that decision."

"But I've negotiated it to the point where I think it doesn't get any better," Cogdill said.

Sacramento Bee

This is a mess.  I wrote yesterday about how even if we laid off all Government workers, we'd still have a 16 billion dollar hole.  That would mean closing schools, national parks, prisons, the list goes on.  That would mean the end of California as we know and I don't doubt that this makes many Republicans giddy with joy.  

So why do I think this is important at Daily Kos?  Because it's just a symptom of a much bigger issue.  California is where this started with the Howard Jarvis tax revolt of the seventies and the birth of Ronald Reagan as the great conservative thinker of the late twentieth century (eye roll).  California is feeling it now, America is going to feel it worse if we continue to let Republicans push this poison called trickle-down economics.  It has failed and this State is held hostage (Thanks Calitics) by just a handfull of overzealous and very far right politicians because of our State's 2/3's rule.  No new taxes, no budget without 2/3's and as of last night, we were under the impression that this hinged on the vote of one Republican Senator.  ONE.

So, we can listen to them, just has Obama has and hopefully learned from, but we can't let the crazy people run the asylum, it's basically sending California down a spiral it may not come up from.  This doesn't just impact California, this would hurt the whole Country.

So yes, I think it's relevant for Daily Kos and I think it's relevant for the whole Country.  Republicans want to obstruct progress because it proves them wrong.  

I know that California's solution is far from perfect, it's quite fucked up actually as education and every other vital service to our State is being slashed (almost $800 per student in my daughter's school district alone, talk about "Generalional Theft").  But I do think as progressives we have to remember that it's "Progress, not perfection".  We're not perfectionists, we're progressives.

So as Republicans sit on their hands and refuse to budget, the rest of us wait to see if one State Senator can grow a conscience and do the right thing.  And we hope that the rest of the Country realizes that, no, the stimulus package isn't perfect, but it's progress.  Slow and steady wins the race.  We have to keep this in mind always.

Originally posted to Ellinorianne on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 08:56 AM PST.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Headline should read: (17+ / 0-)

    "Republicans block budget solution"  any other headline is dishonest.

  •  they all should be fired. (5+ / 0-)

    its a total disgrace.  The republicans fired their leader becuase he was supporting tax increases.

    What is their genius plan to fix the budget WITHOUT raising ANY taxes?

    by GlowNZ on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 08:59:04 AM PST

  •  So Arnold gers recalled - right? (11+ / 0-)

    Oh, I forgot.  That only happens to unpopular DEMOCRATIC governors...

    The day has come, our time is now...

    by RichM on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 08:59:21 AM PST

    •  He should be recalled (5+ / 0-)

      how the fuck did this happen?

      by GlowNZ on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:00:09 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Well... (10+ / 0-)

        Despite what my liberal Democratic parents say, the seeds were sown a long time ago.  Prop 13 has pretty much tied the state's hands in raising revenue.  Yet, initiative after initiative has forced the state to spend money on various things such as schools and emergency services.

        Arnold didn't solve the problem.  He simply delayed the problem by borrowing money.

        It is a problem that is happening now in many states and at the federal level.  People are demanding more and more from their government, but are unwilling to pay for it.

        The day has come, our time is now...

        by RichM on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:05:22 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Let's be clear; Prop 13 is NOT a problem "that (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          dotsright, Ellinorianne, whaddaya

          is happening now in many states and at the federal level." What's going on in California is a direct result of public referendum.

          Until California has the political will to overturn that idiotic conservative wet-dream---and the whole proposition idea, as well as super-majority requirements for tax increases---the state is going to stew in its own juices.

          Though the results may look similar, it's not factual to suggest that what California is going through right now has any real similarity to the budget issues of other states.

          •  In Colorado... (3+ / 0-)

            We have TABOR - which is essentially the same thing as Prop. 13.  In many other states, they have the same laws - basically stating that the legislature cannot raise taxes unless there is a public referendum and the revenues from those taxes are EXPLICITLY spelled out.

            The day has come, our time is now...

            by RichM on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 10:33:58 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

          •  Right on (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            chrississippi, Ellinorianne

            We Californians have brought this on ourselves.  The idiotic supermajority requirements for raising taxes or passing a budget, the voters' propensity for adopting initiatives that require the legislature to spend money on specific projects, and people's unfathomable willingness to believe the promises of a candidate like Ahnold -- all of these have brought us to where we are today.

            A real solution to California's budget woes can only come from the California electorate.  Under the state constitution, only the voters have the power to amend the constitution to remove the supermajority requirement.  Only the voters can amend the initiative process itself.  Only the voters can stop directing the state to spend money on every little project they think is worthwhile without regard to how such mandated spending affects the overall state budget.  In other words, until the voters here in California grow up and start acting like adults, we're not going to solve this mess.

    •  Kewl! "Total Recalled." n/t (8+ / 0-)

      St. Ronnie was an asshole.

      by manwithnoname on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:03:34 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  It sounds like Arnold has been a lot more ... (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      CA Nana, dotsright, Ellinorianne, whaddaya

      reasonable than the Republican legislators.  It seems that almost every legislative branch Republican in the country, at both the federal and state levels, is convinced that what lost them the last election is that they hadn't been sufficiently intransigent and right-wing.  I think they'll suffer for that miscalculation, but the problem is that they're taking the rest of us down with them.

  •  prop 13 continues to cripple (20+ / 0-)


    That needs to be undone before any progress on the budget can happen.

    Here is what has happened since California passed Proposition 13 in 1978. The obvious direct results have been to cut public services, raise other taxes, and lose credit rating.

    Our school support fell from #5, nationally, to #40 in 1985 when last seen, still falling. County road maintenance is down to where my county (Riverside) is repaving its roads at an annual rate of once every 130 years. Once in 20 years is recommended here, and up north you generally need higher frequency. You can't just build infrastructure and then stop paying for it, it's a perpetual commitment. Thanks to urban scatter, a high fraction of our population now depends on these county roads.

    In 1978 we had a surplus in Sacramento. Since then we have raised business taxes, income taxes, sales taxes and gas taxes, but go broke every June, even as other states are in the black again. Now our State bond rating is last among the states. One of our richest counties (Orange) has gone bankrupt; Los Angeles is on the brink of it, saving itself by closing emergency rooms and hospitals that serve as a last resort for the uninsured poor. We are ill-prepared for Congress' current move (right or wrong) to shift more functions back to the states. The private sector fares no better. Raising income taxes, business taxes, and sales taxes is no way to stimulate an economy; each is a drag on work and enterprise. Our income per capita was down from #7 to #12 among the states by 1992, then fell more: from 1992-94, California was one of three states where median household income fell. Our unemployment rate is 9%, 50% higher than the national mean of 6%. Our poverty rate is 18%, compared to 14.5% nationally. That helps explain why the only government function that grows now is building and operating prisons. One of our few rebounding industries is cinema. Another thriving trade is auctioning off used machinery for export to the east.

    In 1993 there was net outmigration (including international migration) from this state that has symbolized American growth since time immemorial. It is unheard of: 426,000 people were lost, nearly 2% of the population. This is a watershed change: imagine, of all states California, America's trend-setter, our El Dorado, The Golden State, our Horn of Plenty, the safety-valve for job-seekers and retirees and entrepreneurs from everywhere, the end of the rainbow, losing population! It's enough to make a person ask "What are we doing wrong?". The fall of our income per capita is greater than appears from the purely monetary measure. Real pay (in constant $) has fallen more, because of the drastic rise of shelter prices. In San Francisco, shelter takes 50% of the median income, with many other cities, especially coastal ones, not far behind. It is unusual to find livable quarters for less than $600/month. The median home price rose 163% during the 1980s, to $258,000 (that is just the median - the mean is higher). These rises are part of the C.O.L. of all renters and new buyers, a part not fully incorporated in standard CPI measures (for various foolish reasons too technical to open up now).

    •  Think of all of the people prop13 crippled. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      You're exactly right. How do you think overturning Prop 13 will play out?

      Either this sentence is false, or I am a toad.

      by rb137 on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:13:26 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  "Whaa! Undoing Prop 13 would be raising taxes!" (4+ / 0-)

      No new taxes? That leaves zero wiggle room- you can only rebudget so much. Even if they cut some of the policies that cost us so much, they'd still have to have new taxes somewhere. Don't get me wrong- I don't like paying such a high state tax, but saying, "We will absolutely not pass any new taxes" is removing all options from the bargaining table.

      It would help if the districts weren't so partisan that Republicans fear a primary challenge more than the Democrat.

      Someone needs to fix our broken system. Unfortunately, one person can't do it- the problem's entrenched in the legislature and the constitution. And one minority party is holding the whole state hostage.

      Redistrict. Revise the Constitution concerning the 2/3rds majority required to pass a budget (hey, it'll only take 50.01% of the vote!) Make some common-sense changes to our most expensive and broken systems (such as the prison system.) Then revamp taxes. We've got enough commerce, I'm sure we can find a way to both balance the budget and lower taxes, while keeping our infrastructure in good repair. It's just going to take gutting the system to get it done.

      I own half a house- it's a duo.

      by EsnRedshirt on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:16:34 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  I agree .. sort of (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        dotsright, Ellinorianne

        We need to raise taxes -- the 2/3 majority requirement is assinine. Unfortunately, I think it was put in place by an initiative, which means (I think) it can only be repealed by another initiative.

        Re Prop 13: Much as I agree with all the analyses that say it's hurting the state, I have to admit, without prop 13 I would have lost my house years ago -- I would either have to have sold it or been forced out by whatever the state does when you don't pay property taxes.

        We just had a housing bubble -- the assessed value of my house rose sixfold over what I paid for it (over 20 years ago). Without prop 13, I would have been paying well over $10,000 a year in property taxes. I would have had to sell my house -- provided I could even find a seller in a down market -- or declare bankruptcy.

        While I'm not wealthy, I am not poor either. My income is above average, and I pay less than 30% of my income for housing, so it's not true that I can't afford my house, and should not have bought a house in the first place. I just can't afford the kind of increases in property taxes that come with a housing bubble -- something we seem to be prone to here.  (And something we had back in the 70s when prop 13 was passed.)

        I despise Howard Jarvis, but I think just flat-out repealing prop 13 would not be a good idea. Millions of people are in my situation, and would lose their homes -- that would not help the economy. It's better to have people paying small amounts of property tax than not paying anything at all.

        I think prop 13 needs to be revised so that property taxes can once again increase with increases in assessed value -- but with the caveat, perhaps, that if assessed value increases more than a designated amount within a year, the property tax increase would be capped.

        At any rate, I suspect we will never get it repealed or even modified -- it's too politically popular. I think we need to concentrate on other sources of income. Specifically, the income tax at the top level needs to be raised. Which means we have to get rid of the troglodytes who have had "no new taxes" seared into their brains since the Reagan era, crowding out everything else. And that means redistricting so their seats are not too safe. Didn't we just pass an initiative to do that? Please ... do it sooner rather than later.

        Republicans: ten-time gold medalists in synchronized stupidity

        by cedubose on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:43:09 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  i feel you (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          cedubose, dotsright, Ellinorianne

          but repealing prop 13 is only the start.

          have the property tax fall more heavily on intelligently assessed land values and less heavily on building value - that way you arent punished for making improvements.

          and then reduce some of the more onerous and regressive taxes and a tax on land values can take you quite far.

        •  Agreed (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          If Prop. 13 weren't around, I'd end up having to sell my apartment.  Even with the cap, my property taxes are staggeringly high -- they run almost $8,000 per year.  The city raises them every year by the maximum level permitted by Prop. 13, even though my income isn't necessarily keeping pace.  Only the very wealthy could afford to remain in their homes if Prop. 13 did not exist.

          That said, there's no reason that it has to continue to apply to real estate owned by businesses.  You could restrict Prop. 13's applicability to residential properties and recapture a lot of tax revenue without forcing people to sell their houses because they can't pay sky-high property taxes.

          •  again... (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            cedubose, Ellinorianne

            that is because the tax falls heavily on houses, structures etc and not on the value of land.

            taxing land puts idle, underused, and underassessed land into use which takes the speculation bubble out of the equation and stabilizes land values and that land (now out of use) into use which grows jobs, homes etc.

          •  Wow (0+ / 0-)

            That's steep -- I only pay about $2400/year. (The benefits of having bought 22 years ago ...) I could not afford $8000.

            Imagine if there were no prop 13, with the recent bubble. Really ... we do need something like this. (Though we don't need the idiotic right-wingers that seem to come along with it, with their vastly oversimplified view of everything tax-related...)

            stillman, I like your idea of taxing land. It might help the bubble issue, though I don't think speculation was the only cause of the bubble. But it would definitely help.

            Gee, if we could only get rid of the Republicans, we might actually be able to think about putting some of these good ideas into practice ...

            Republicans: ten-time gold medalists in synchronized stupidity

            by cedubose on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 01:39:14 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

  •  Elinorianne... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Ellinorianne, rb137

    that image is horrific.  People's heads impaled on swords, plungers and planks? Maybe I'm being overly sensitive, but it shocked me to comment even before I read your diary.  

    Member of the "Fellows of the Ass Society." Dedicated to reminding people that most knowledge still comes from books. Not Wikipedia.

    by David Kroning on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:00:29 AM PST

  •  HA! I thought California... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    FishBiscuit, Ellinorianne

    was the most liberal state.  

    There's a lot of money in the stimulus to cover state budget shortfalls.  Will Cali get federal money to make up this deficit instead of raising their own taxes?  Complicate that with the fact that Cali is a donor state federally to begin with.  This will definately hurt the whole country.

    Come we go chant down babylon one more time

    by gooners on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:04:19 AM PST

  •  Arnold should threaton to release prisoners (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    CA Nana, Ms Citizen, Ellinorianne

    the other stuff deosn't scare hardcore right wingers.

    After Obama's eighth straight victory, Penn told reporters: "Winning Democratic primaries is not a qualification or a sign of who can win the general election.

    by nevadadem on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:04:51 AM PST

  •  Are the Republicans trying to sink CA? (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Aeolus, Ellinorianne, cocinero, whaddaya

    Are they trying to marginalize the CA Republican Party for another generation?

    I mean, they aren't acting rationally, and it's scary the whole state is being held hostage to them.

    CA's budget rules need a serious overhaul.

    •  Never happen. (4+ / 0-)

      CA's budget rules need a serious overhaul.

      The GOP leader leader got ousted because he agreed with you. There are enough places like Orange County here to keep just enough Republicans in office to stymie any compromise.

      •  I argue downthread that CA's ills (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        tomjones, CA Nana, Ellinorianne

        are the result of ballot initiatives, but I'm going to make a counter-argument here.

        CA voters could change the budget requirements themselves through the initiative process. The economy's current dire outlook should be the catalyst to remove the 2/3 requirement, effectively stripping the OC and Central Valley conservatives of their "veto" power they haev over any budget deal.

        "Just because you do not take an interest in politics doesn't mean politics won't take an interest in you" ~ Pericles

        by Chrispy67 on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:25:38 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  Really? Not Everyone in Cali is Rich (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        tomjones, Ellinorianne

        It gets really messy in the lower depths when services dry up.  Eventually, misery trickles up. It ain't nothin' to joke about.  The prognosis is not good.

  •  I don't get it. CA has the second highest (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    jpmassar, Mother Shipper

    state income rate at 9.3 percent and it kicks in at 45k jointly!  Sales tax in LA county going up to 10 percent!  Why can't they figure out how to balance a budget.  

    You can't cheat an honest man.

    by thestructureguy on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:09:46 AM PST

  •  Why do I get the feeling this is a case of the... (6+ / 0-)

    Shock Doctrine at work?

    The Repubs can't be this stupid or selfish.  They must have a game plan beyond just simple ideology.

    If they let the state fail, are they expecting to be able to pick up the pieces and remake California into something they want?

    All evils are equal when they are extreme. - Pierre Corneille

    by LiberalCanuck on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:16:23 AM PST

  •  The heart of California's failing economy is it's (7+ / 0-)

    over-reliance on the citizen initiative process. The government fails to function because leaders are elected and, rather than making difficult decisions, often choose to "punt" those on to voters in the form of ballot initiatives. A voter information guide in the Golden State can easilly reach over 100 pages.

    Prop 13 places unreasonable restrictions on local and state govt from tapping into legitimate revenue streams to pay for the needs of an exploding population, an aging infrastructure and a declining education system.

    But there have been scores of subsequent ballot initiatives that have continued to enact popularly approved (and expensive!) referenda into law.  The huge prison population is a direct result of Three Strikes policy passed in the mid nineties. Voters have imposed funding requirements on K-12 education that, while well-intentioned, provide little room for flexibility in local and state budgets.

    Voter imposed term limits on state officeholders, rather than making legislators more responsive to voters, have resulted in less-experienced, more partisan ideologues in Sacramento. Many of these legislators spend their terms angling for the next job on the politico career path. If they know they don't have to face their voters next time around, they're more likely to adhere to rigid orthodoxy.

    Legislating from the street (which is what ballot initiatives do) creates an unrealistic mixture of limited revenue, excessive spending requirements and unresponsive leadership. It's a toxic mix for democracy and a healthy economy.

    California is learing this the hard way.

    "Just because you do not take an interest in politics doesn't mean politics won't take an interest in you" ~ Pericles

    by Chrispy67 on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:20:36 AM PST

    •  Exactly (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Ellinorianne, whaddaya

      And in a related vein, way too many ballot initiatives are about finding new groups of people to blame for whatever problems they purport to be addressing.  If the K-12 school systems fall to 49th, blame bilingual education.  If the budget can't be balanced, blame social services for immigrants.  You would think the voters would at some point realize that the common cause of all the problems is proposition 13.

      •  three quarters of the voters (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Ellinorianne, whaddaya

        probably have no idea what prop 13 is (or does).

        people barely understand the measures they're voting on when they step in the voting booth. It's unrealistic to expect they understand 1970s initiatives. That's prehistory to many voters.

        "Just because you do not take an interest in politics doesn't mean politics won't take an interest in you" ~ Pericles

        by Chrispy67 on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:49:42 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  Will there be a ballot initiative... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    CA Nana, Ellinorianne

    to repeal the 2/3 rule?

  •  I was watching the California Channel (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    sfbob, Ellinorianne, gmclaurin

    on public access last night around 12:30. The Reeps were all getting up and patting Codgill on the back for a "job well done" blah blah blah. And all I could think was that they're killing my State. My twitters were not at all polite at that time of the night. ;-)


    by shayera on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:22:18 AM PST

  •  We need an initiative (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Ms Citizen, Ellinorianne

    petition to change the 2/3 rule.  I hate to emulate the repubs, but we need some rich liberals (are you listening down there in Hollywood) to fiance an initiative drive.  I'm sure there are lots of people like me who would volunteer to gather signatures, but we would need paid gatherers, too.  It is ridiculous that the minority can bring a huge state to it's knees.

  •  We have met the enemy (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Aeolus, Ellinorianne

    and it is us!

    We vote for 2/3rds rule so we don't have to pay attention to state budget details - comfortable in the knowledge that the automatic "No" vote of every republican will ensure that ambitious tax and spend democrats don't get too ambitious.

    We reap what we sow.

  •  Main problem: state is too big (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Ellinorianne, cocinero

    The main problem with CA is that it's too big.  With a big state comes a big budget and huge amounts of waste.  My favorite example is the Bay Bridge replacement boondoggle where they are spending billions to put in a new 1/2 bridge instead of just reinforcing the existing bridge.  Some people are making tons of money off that boondoggle, and it's not the people of CA.

    Splitting CA into environmentally-friendly Northern CA and car-obsessed Southern CA is long overdue, IMO.

    Big Joe Helton: "I pay Plenty."
    Chico Marx: "Well, then we're Plenty Tough."

    by Caelian on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:41:28 AM PST

  •  Aren't there laws against gangs? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    CA Republicans are worse than high schoolers who marginalize those who won't conform.  How ridiculous to oust a leader because he dared to {gasp} negotiate.  
      If they're going to act like hoodlums, aren't there anti-gang laws we can use against them?

    My Karma just ran over your Dogma

    by FoundingFatherDAR on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 09:59:55 AM PST

  •  to an outsider, but as one who did live (0+ / 0-)

    in California during the Howard jarvis tax revolt of the seventies, I have viewed as home prices in California escalated out of control, the traffic and congestion grew more and more high density, and conditions deteriorated.

    You say that poor people cannot afford higher taxes   and cannot tolerate more cuts in services, well, that's tough, because California nor the rest of the country can continue to afford to live beyond their means.

    People here are very eager to point the finger of blame, right now at the republicans, that is so incredibly simplistic it is ridiculous.  You can't have your cake and eat it too. If people we call 'poor' are to continue to receive subsidies on education, health and housing, paid for by the hard pressed taxpaying middle and working class, something has got to give.  California has been living high on the hog for years, now it's going to have to re-trench.

    What is your solution? you don't want higher taxes, but who exactly do you expect to pay the costs of keeping all the things you list as losing, national parks, education and i would also presume police and firefighters, and all kinds of social services, what are you proposing if youas a citizen would have access to those closed budget meetings.  Whose going to pony up to cover the great divide between revenues and outgoings.

    If there is a 16 billion dollar gap how do YOU, and all other California citizens propose to bridge it.

    I am interested in knowing,, other than blaming a dead president's trickle down economics.  It's either that or higher taxes and imposed taxpayer subsidies.  That is called 'Socialism' and i personally am not against that governing philosophy, as a Brit I am long accustomed to it. But someone has to pay for it.

    Let's have some SOLUTION diaries instead of all these PROBLEM diaries.  I know you like to write a diary a day but it would be nice if you had some solutions instead of always sounding off.

    •  CA sends more Fed tax revenue than it gets back. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      bubbanomics, Ellinorianne

      So how do you propose others states cut back for what they won't get from CA when it goes down?

      My Karma just ran over your Dogma

      by FoundingFatherDAR on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 10:10:09 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  I want them to pass (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      bubbanomics, sfbob, h bridges, whaddaya

      the budget and I get that people are angry about higher taxes.  But I'm not against them.  Did you read this?  Do you read any of my diaries or just pick out a portion that bothers you.  You've had nothing constructive to add and almost every comment I dread.

      Why don't you write diaries about solutions and I can do what I want with my one diary?  This is from yesterday, I said that I don't mind paying more taxes.

      As a Californian who pays property tax, sales tax and every other tax, I would rather pay more so that future generations are able to have what so many take for granted right now.  All those screaming radio listeners who don't give a damn about Government?  You would care when it started to affect your everyday life.  That's when people seem to care most.

      And I am trying to point to the root of the problem, but I'm one person and this is my rant.  Local papers aren't reporting this, even national ones, saying it's the whole legislatures problem when it hinges on ONE VOTE.  Progressive in California are trying to right the media spin, it's hard but we're trying.

      I don't really care if you don't recognize that.

      •  Sorry To Tell Your Critics (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        bubbanomics, sfbob

        but total taxes are actually higher in other states. In Fl, for example, you pay a 17% tax on your cell phone usage. And property taxes are astronomical. So, whatever else you can say about CA R's,one thing is always true: taxes aren't a problem for ordinary people. R's just want their constituents to have a free ride.

      •  i don't write diaries. I comment (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        only in those I feel have something constructive to add to the public discourse.  

        Different people use DailyKos in different ways.  If my comments bother you don't bother to read them.

    •  the solution is coming (3+ / 0-)

      but i think most people arent going to like it. most of the problems have been outlined here. basically the answer is that unless califorians are willing to sit down and comprimise, this meaning most especially the rethugs, california is going broke. then it will deteriorate badly. finally, perhaps in 15 or 20 years, it will probably split up, new constitutions will be written, and there will be some kind of future for the new states, principalities, etc. btw i dont think its just california thats going to come apart, i fully expect the breakup of the US as well. somethings are just simply to big to function, and are doomed to fail. given the polarized beliefs across the US, the animosity and resentment on both sides, left and right, the bitter hatred of each side for the other, there is simply no way to resolve this, other than balkanization. that is, inevitably, what will come.

      Welcome to the empire. now run away if you can... life is not a dress rehearsal

      by johnfire on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 10:37:24 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  I agree with your diagnosis of the (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        johnfire, Ellinorianne, whaddaya

        problem but as an eternal optimist I hope that all Americans, and those who live here and contribute as well, will realise eventually that we are all in the ame boat and try and create a more equitable world.

        Actually I would broaden my horizons and state that on a global level.  I never have been one who advocated 'the American dream', it is a universal dream and for too long Americans have claimed the sole right to live it.

        •  agreed about the dream. (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          soccergrandmom, sfbob, Ellinorianne

          the idea of american exceptionalism is one of the deep roots of the problem. there are others. the real problem is the propaganda campaign waged for 30 years by rethug libertarians who believe, in a nutshell, that ayn rand was some kind of prophet of a utopian future ( she wasnt, she was a nut case sex deviant at best) and fundie christians who continue to seek a quick coming of the so called end times, and the total destruction of modern science. these are the two interest groups most to blame for the current situation.

          Welcome to the empire. now run away if you can... life is not a dress rehearsal

          by johnfire on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 10:45:48 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  I must confess as a starry eyed idealist in my (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            johnfire, Ellinorianne, whaddaya

            late teens i loved Ayn Rand, she made life so simple.  But then I grew up and went out into the wide world and began to understand the complexities and many facted aspects to every situation I encountered.

            •  well i read (0+ / 0-)

              the fountainhead in college, in architecture school. i thought the book was a total piece of trash when i read the part about the girl being raped and how great she thought it was. at that point i realized ayn rand was a sick puppy....

              Welcome to the empire. now run away if you can... life is not a dress rehearsal

              by johnfire on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 10:54:04 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  I don't remember that bit, but if it is part of (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:

                the story, I imagine that in the social climate in Great Britain in the 50's I probably would have thought being raped was my own fault. That is probably where the well known English saying 'that if rape is inevitable, lay back and enjoy it' comes from. Change what you can and just accept the rest. Life's a bitch and then you die!

                Things have changed, but not that much, which if you were a woman you would know.

                •  well (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:

                  i live in germany. i have heard some english aquiatences say the same thing. i dont hang out with them much, and i have to say, my experiences with english people arent much better than many of the americans i know. im not trying to start a flame war, or put you down or anything, i just dont see much in the way of decency  in either culture alot of the time. personally i like living on the continent better, i really feel people treat each other better here.

                  Welcome to the empire. now run away if you can... life is not a dress rehearsal

                  by johnfire on Wed Feb 18, 2009 at 11:24:30 AM PST

                  [ Parent ]

            •  Well Said (0+ / 0-)

              I had a friend in the Business School who loved Rand's stuff.  So, I read it and didn't get it.  I can't even remember why he liked it so much.

              So much for the literature that launched a political movement. Well, I suspect he became an R, and you see what has become of me.  

        •  You see (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          johnfire, sfbob, whaddaya

          I live in Orange County, where we don't elect Democrats and a lot of us are angry that we aren't heard.  It's a uniquely California thing, we have over 500,000 Democrats in the OC and one Congressional Democrat.  

          We haven't been ranting enough down here and so, that's what I do.  My husband ran for State Senate to get a "D" on the ballot.  I want to be part of the solution but Orange County is broken when it comes to our system.

          Ronald Reagan may be dead but his princpals and values hold true in the OC.  It's around us all the time.  So he's not dead to me.  They won't admit he RAISED taxes in California.  It's almost pathological.

          Our solution would be to change the 2/3's rule, change districting and to also stop putting bonds on the ballot.  Californians want to spend, spend and spend when the vote for ballot bonds but they don't want to actually PAY when it comes to raising taxes.

          And then there is prop 13, where people who have lived in their houses for years pay nothing compared to those who just bought.  Same goes with commercial property, which is a huge drain on revenue.

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