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Hove I ever told you no one likes Republicans? Actually, I think I have. These are data that poll after poll shows us, and on Sunday, Chris Cillizza rounds up some recent ones. Cillizza:

There is no great affection for the Republican Party in this country, a senior Obama administration official said last week. That creates the opportunity for competitive races district by district.

The official noted that the GOP's unpopularity marks a critical difference between the election this November and 1994, when the party's sweep of more than 50 seats won it the majority in the House for the first time in 40 years. Then, the official argued, Republicans had been out of power for more than four decades and voters were ready to try something different. This time, voters know what they would be getting with Republicans in charge and don't like it, the source said.

AP Congressional approval/disapproval
Dems 38/60
Reps 31/68

CBS/NY Times, 9/15

Dems 30/58
Reps 20/68

ABC/WaPo, deserve reelection

Dems 34
Reps 31

Brendan Nyhan posted a terrific graphic at, while arguing the end result is still a GOP generic ballot lead:

What does it mean? Hard to know in terms of November, though the experts will tell you it means Democrats are likely to lose the House. The Senate, with O'Donnell running in DE, seems a safer bet to stay D, with or without Harry Reid (who, thanks to Sharron Angle, is the luckiest politician in America.)

But what it also clearly means is that Americans are frustrated with the lack of progress on the economy, even as they still rightly blame Bush for getting us in this hole (see Bush Still Takes Brunt of Blame for Economy vs. Obama.) As the party in power, Dems will take the brunt of that.

And it means GOTV matters more than ever.

But what it doesn't mean is that Republicans and their (lack of) ideas are popular.

Originally posted to Daily Kos on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 07:46 AM PDT.

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Comment Preferences

  •  They're popular enough (6+ / 0-)

    to win the majority of votes. I still haven't seen a cogent explanation for this seeming paradox.  Yeah, times are tough, but if people blame the Republicans for it more than the Democrats, why does that mean they just have to vote Republican anyway?

    Just doesn't add up, there's something missing here.

    •  We should blame the media (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Gowrie Gal, coffejoe, jan4insight

      for treating them like they matter.

      •  It'd be sweet if the media cared.... (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        cybersaur, Mr MadAsHell, JL, OHknighty

        Spray tons of carcinogens into the ocean to hide petroleum spewed from a hastily-drilled hole from a greedy corporation, but don't smoke pot.

        by xxdr zombiexx on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 07:57:51 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  The state of our politics (8+ / 0-)

        It is truly depressing that one of the two major parties in the U.S. — one that happens to be poised to gain control of the legislative power, or at least total ability to block any and all legislation — bases its political appeal on an unalloyed tissue of lies and bigoted fear mongering. Republicans’ true mission, of course, is to protect the privileges of the wealthy, but as that would not likely attract a majority of voters, they invent an alternate reality: global warming is a hoax, federal deficits are caused by giveaways to lazy shiftless dark people, Islamic terrorists are taking over the country, slight increases on marginal tax rates for extremely wealthy people will cost you your job, same sex marriage will make God send earthquakes, etc. They have sufficient money and media infrastructure to persuade a large segment of the population that we are not living in the universe in which we actually live. And it’s working.


    •  no they're not (12+ / 0-)

      The Repugs don't WIN votes--it's us who LOSE them.

      That's a very huge difference.

      •  Right--you can't beat nuthin' with nuthin' (4+ / 0-)

        The Dems are singularly bad at communicating what they have done and why they deserve to stay in power.  Sure the econpomy didn't recover as fast as people want, but more tax cuts isn't going to correct that--if tax cuts were all it took, we would have had paradise after the Bush tax cuts instead of a financial meltdown.

        Too many Dems run away from their own party instead of explaininag and defending it as the party of the people.

        Why does Meg Whitman want China to win the race for green tech dominance?

        by Mimikatz on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:01:58 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  and on the other hand, too many Dems have (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          MikePhoenix, James Kresnik

          forgotten what their party is supposed to stand for, and have sold us out and screwed us over on everything from the public option to ending the PATRIOT Act.

          That is why the words most commonly associated with "Democrats" are "spineless" and "capitulated".

          There's no reason for anyone to vote Dem if the Dems don't even act like Dems. If we wanted counterfeit Repugs, we'd be voting for the real thing.

        •  That's not the only communication deficit... (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          bronxdem, MikePhoenix, James Kresnik

          There is the whole "tin ear" thing --

          How did the administration and Congress fail to grasp the message that voters would receive as they spent the better part of a year on a highly compromised and watered down Health Insurance bill, most of whose benefits don't even hit til 2014, at a time when unemployment went through the roof and millions of people were suffering in the here and now?

          Vision is great, but people want to believe that their leaders are aware of and care about the problems afflicting them.

          As bad a problem as the economy is, worse is the sense that it didn't really seem to catch our leaders' attention -- except when bailing out rich folks.

          LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

          by dinotrac on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:29:45 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Yep - look how long the Republicans hung on (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          MikePhoenix, jan4insight

          Bush and the Republican controlled legislature began control as a joke and proceeded to drag this country into a ditch and yet look how many times the electorate kept giving them one more chance to screw up things even worse

          Most people still blame them for our woes, and yet because the Democrats haven't made everything all better in one election cycle they want to turn everything back over to the guys who wrecked things. It makes no sense what so ever.

          Either people are just expressing their disappointment with the Democrats but will not choose to cut out their eye to spite their face on election day or they really are that pissed. If Republicans manage to take back one of the Houses, people will quickly be reminded just how little they like the Republicans and Democrats will take full control in landslide victories in 2010. Unfortunately for the nation, we will be in an even bigger hole by then. On top of that the Democrats will have once again learned the wrong lesson and will be even more timid then before, afraid to be anything other then good little Corporate Renfields setting the stage for even greater losses.

      •  100% correct. I am so sick of this whining (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Superribbie, dinotrac

        and blame the media. There will be noone to blame if you lose because who cares if repubs are popular, they vote no matter what.

        If you lose it is YOU who are to blame, Simple.

        •  "blaming the media" is something that EVERY loser (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          does.  The Repugs cried the very same sob story back when they were losing.  And now that we are losing, we sob it too.

          In both cases, it provides a convenient excuse for the losers to blame their loss on something other than themselves.

          •  yes, but, they are sooo wrong and we (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Superribbie, De Re Rustica

            are sooo right, no fair. Boo hoo, life a bitch and then you die.

            Fight or surrender. Your choice. I've had it with this attitude.

            If you fight and vote you WIN. If you bitch and moan, and don't vote, you LOSE.

            YOUR CHOICE.  Many here seem to think that losing is better than winning because that will teach them a lesson!!! right. The only lesson that teaches is tnat winning is better and losing is nothing!  Snoopy's creed, even dumbo Americans should understand Snoopy!!!!

            If you want to change the world you do it one election at a time and losing even ONE sets you back ten!!!

            Those who want singlepayer health care, do you truly believe that when the Repubs repeal the whole kit and caboodle you will get it all back at the next election?  Right, dream on!!!! Your kids will be grandparents the next time any US President dares stick his/her toe in that swamp!!! and Medicare and Social security will have gone the way of the dinosaurs.

            •  well, I don't think civilization will collapse if (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:

              the Dems ever lose an election.

              And since I seriously doubt that the Dems will win every single election from now till the foreseeable future, I think we'd better get used to the idea that we won't win every time.

              I doubt the sky will fall.

              •  I totally agree, however I do not think it is (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Superribbie, MikePhoenix

                good policy to keep switching horses every two years. This president and this Democratic majority both require, need and deserve at least one FULL TERM to implement their ideas.

                If they don't' work by 2012 then by all means vote them out. Do not do it in 2010.

                Even many perennial plants require three years to attain maturity before they bloom. Be a little patient, then kick the bums out. I guarantee you will be even unhappier in 2012 if you  give power back to the repubs in this election cycle.

    •  Well they're talking a lot about Democrats (4+ / 0-)

      And unlike in 1994, the GOP is not running a national, issues campaign (however dishonest the Contract on America was).

      This year it's anti-Dem plus local issues (plus pseudo-Constitutional red meat thrown at the Teabaggers).

      I think there's an enormous opportunity for the Democrats to have a national conversation about the Republicans.

      "I trust that you will continue to let me and other Democrats know when you believe we are screwing up." - Barack Obama

      by GreenSooner on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:13:22 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  see, this is my point . . . (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        MikePhoenix, Anne Elk

        I think there's an enormous opportunity for the Democrats to have a national conversation about the Republicans.

        Why bother?  People already hate the Repugs, so what's the point in telling everyone why they should hate Republicans? It may make our partisan panties feel all warm and fuzzy and give us an opportunity to wave our blue pennants and cheer, but it doesn't help us. People are NOT not-voting for us because they LIKE Republicans---they are not-voting for us because we don't impress them.

        So ranting and railing about how bad the Repugs are, simply doesn't help us.

        We need to become what we SAID we were---a transformational party of change.  Instead, we are Repug-lites who can't even pass our own party platform when we held the biggest majority in half a century.

        The thrashing we are about to get is OUR fault, and no one else's.

    •  I'm not sure I'd go that far. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Geotpf, MikePhoenix

      A couple of things come into play, one of which is that the Democrats have, as Pete Seeger sang about LBJ back in the Vietnam days, stuffed beans in their ears.

      They've let their vision interfere with their hearing to the detriment of all. The end result is a highly compromised vision and millions of people watching our lives go down the toilet while our leaders don't seem to give a damn.  

      Kind of like the old medical saw that the operation was a success but the patient died.

      The other thing is that votes are yea or nay instruments.  I don't get to add specific instructions to my vote.  I get to say this guy or that guy.  Period. Voting for the folks who are there now will be read as an endorsement of them. Voting for the other guys might be read as an endorsement, but will certainly be read as a rejection of the way things are now.

      Republicans will benefit because they are the most likely "other" vote, not because they are beloved. They haven't earned it. It's one of those cases where you benefit simply by being there.

      LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

      by dinotrac on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:21:14 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  exactly (0+ / 0-)

        Republicans will benefit because they are the most likely "other" vote, not because they are beloved. They haven't earned it. It's one of those cases where you benefit simply by being there.

        People are not voting Repug because they love the Repugs.  They are voting for the Repugs because they don't want to vote for us and they have no other alternative but to vote Repug or stay home.

        And that is why ranting and railing about how bad the Repugs are, simply doesn't help us.  People already KNOW the Repugs are awful. They want an alternative to the Repugs--and we are not giving it to them. When we roll over and capitulate and surrender and act like Repug-Lites on every major issue, then people will rightly conclude that we simply are not an alternative, and voting for one or the other simply doesn't change anything.

        That is OUR fault, and nobody else's.

        If Dems grew some balls and started acting like Dems, then maybe people would have a reason to vote for Dems.

    •  Here's the thinking (0+ / 0-)

      It's a "throw the bums out" election, because the economy still sucks.  Of course, the only way you can throw the Democrats out is by voting for Republicans.

  •  I still say "generic republican" misleads when (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Mr MadAsHell, jan4insight, MRobDC

    there's a huge division...several huge the GOP itself.  Any answering person presumes that THEY are the normal republican.  

    So the teabagger likes the generic republican because he assumes the generic republican will be like him.  So does the country club big business guy.  So does the moderate.  So does the neocon.  

    But the actual nominee isn't going to be a little of all four, he's going to be one group only.  Three or more are going to be disappointed between the ideal and the reality.

    Some feel more comfortable with the certainty that comes from losing power and letting republicans stab them in the front. It's a failure of nerve.

    by Inland on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 07:50:09 AM PDT

  •  I like Nyhan's graph ... (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Brainwrap, Geotpf, cybersaur, MikePhoenix

    ... but I think he got his colors mixed up.

    "It does not require many words to speak the truth." -- Chief Joseph, native American leader (1840-1904)

    by highfive on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 07:51:18 AM PDT

  •  Why in God's name are the Republican bars blue (8+ / 0-)

    ...and the Democratic bars red?

    Yes, I know it shouldn't be a simple red/blue dynamic, but that's how it is, and portraying them reversed like that makes no sense. For whatever reason, Dem = blue, GOP = red in everyone's mind.

  •  "Likely to lose the House" (5+ / 0-)

    I can't read anything beyond that.

    I. Do. NOT. want to lose the everlovin' House.

  •  that is why we waste our time when we (6+ / 0-)
    harp on constantly to everyone about how bad the Repugs are (including one front page story after another about how awful the GOP is).

    We are preaching to the converted, and that never helps. The Repugs already have an approval rating lower than Charlie Manson's.

    Despite the fact that the GOP is toxic and everyone hates it, we will still take a thrashing in November. The important point is that it's OUR fault, and no one else's.  Nobody will be voting FOR the Repugs--they will be voting AGAINST US, or they won't be voting at all because they can't bring themselves to vote FOR US.

    And if we want to fix that, then we have to focus on the actions of OUR OWN PARTY, not the Repugs. When the words most commonly associated with "Democrats" are "spineless" and "capitulates", then WE are the source of our own troubles, not the Repugs.

    "Yeah, maybe we suck, but the Repugs suck EVEN WORSE!!!!", is not a winning campaign slogan.  But it's the only one we seem to have.

  •  hate GOP but love teabaggers? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    likely more an "anything but" current Congress climate

  •  This is where enthusiasm comes in... (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Mimikatz, Khun David, cybersaur, coffejoe

    Teabaggers will be more motivated, and with low turnout from the rest, they can make the difference.  

    Sen. Reid on GOP threat of filibuster on tax cuts - "by Republican logic, until rich CEOs get what they want, middle-class families can't get what they need."

    by Jonze on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 07:54:52 AM PDT

  •  It would (4+ / 0-)

    royally suck to have Pelosi replaced with oompah loompa.

  •  Your conclusion is vital. (3+ / 0-)

    GOTV matters more than ever.

    GOP/TP understand this is their chance to avoid extinction and will work Nov 2010 like mad to gain a majority.

    Our own GOTV will determine whether the 'Pub brand is "resurgent" or "so 20th Century."

    I'd like my life back, too, Tony ____ Video and more songs at da web site

    by Crashing Vor on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 07:55:50 AM PDT

    •  It also matters (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      cybersaur, Crashing Vor

      Because you know that a GOP majority in the House will be used to attempt to win the 2012 Presidential election by bringing Obama down.

      Even if you hate Obama, that's going to be two years that are not good for the country.

      In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice; but in practice, there always is a difference. - Yogi Berra

      by blue aardvark on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:02:45 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  People don't like republicans? (4+ / 0-)

    I keep hearing this but I wonder if Democratic Leadership is aware of it.

    I think we should be beating republicans over the head with attack ads sufficient to SCARE Americans about any further republican influence in their lives.

    Spray tons of carcinogens into the ocean to hide petroleum spewed from a hastily-drilled hole from a greedy corporation, but don't smoke pot.

    by xxdr zombiexx on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 07:56:16 AM PDT

    •  that would require a spine (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      Dems don't have any.

      That's why we can't win elections even though our opponent has an approval rating lower than Charlie Manson's.

      Our difficulties are not the GOP's fault--they are our OWN fault.  When the terms most often associated with Demsw are "spineless" and "capitulates", it should be no wonder at all that nobody wants to vote for us.

  •  That's Why You See Wingnuts Who Regurgitate (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    lilkymbo, coffejoe, OHknighty

    right wing talking points say that they are independent or libertarian. Could be it be that as far as demonization goes Republican is the new Liberal?

  •  I can't stand them (4+ / 0-)

    Even when I am completely unenthusiastic about the Democratic candidates, I vote the straight "anti-Republican" ticket.

    In the Democratic primaries, I vote for the smartest person on the debate stage, regardless of their chances of victory. Thus, I voted for Howard Dean post-scream, and for Jesse Jackson... twice.

    However, in the general election, I vote straight Democratic, and I always will. The worst Democrat is better than the "best" Republican.

    "She's petite, extremely beautiful, and heavily armed." -1995 Michael Moore documentary Canadian Bacon

    by Tom Seaview on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 07:56:22 AM PDT

  •  well then we're not completely insane? (0+ / 0-)

    So then all these predictions that Republicans will win big in November are hogwash? I hope you are right and we're not completely insane as a country.

    by Lynnehs on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 07:57:05 AM PDT

    •  they still win (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      peiople are upset at the economy.

      "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

      by Greg Dworkin on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:15:25 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  spend a few days here (0+ / 0-)

        The economy is not the only thing they are upset about.

        •  you're wrong, actually (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          it's the economy and not much else. What we complain about is immaterial.

          For example from ABC:

          Also, very few, 9 percent, identify "the way Washington works" as one of the single most important issues in their vote preference. Other options – local issues, taxes, Afghanistan, immigration, the deficit and health care – are called one of the single top issues by anywhere from 8 to 19 percent. Many more call the economy one of the single most important issues, 31 percent.

          Adding in the next tier, "very important," the economy swells to 93 percent, followed by health care, called very important or more by 82 percent, and the deficit, by 76 percent.

          "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

          by Greg Dworkin on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 09:23:31 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  Good, I can't stand them either now we (0+ / 0-)

    have to plaster them with Tea = GOP = teh crazze and teh stoopid and teh crooked and teh dum....oh yeah right they like all of that stuff since that is the base.

  •  Let's see. We can't stand the Republicans and (6+ / 0-)

    we think their policies stink. There's only one thing to do.

    Vote for Republicans.

    •  Bingo. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Wildthumb, Greasy Grant

      Spray tons of carcinogens into the ocean to hide petroleum spewed from a hastily-drilled hole from a greedy corporation, but don't smoke pot.

      by xxdr zombiexx on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:03:14 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  We expect better from Democrats, (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Geotpf, Wildthumb

      so when Democrats are disappointing us, they suffer more at the ballot box.  We expect Republicans to screw up, so when we put them into office and they screw up, they are meeting our expectations.  It's funny/peculiar how that works; we have better feelings about someone who's meeting expectations than about someone who always disappoints us.

      Barack Obama in the Oval Office: There's a black man who knows his place.

      by Greasy Grant on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:23:42 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  not any more . . . (0+ / 0-)

        I've gotten to the point where anytime the Dems breathlessly announce the latest new and wonderful thing they are going to pass, I just assume as a matter of course that they'll capitulate and chop it down to nothing. When they promise us ponies, I just assume we'll get pony-shit again.  (shrug)

        •  60 votes (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          60 votes, 60 votes, 60 VOTES!!!!

          •  how many votes did we have before (0+ / 0-)


            You know, back when we gutted the public option and gave a pony to the insurance companies?

            Heck, if I really wanted to be mean, I'd ask when the Dems have had 60 votes EVER, at ANY time--and they still managed to pass things.

            And if I even wanted to be MORE mean, I'd ask when DUBYA ever had 60 votes (without Dems caving in to him, I mean).

            When the Dems have their biggest majority in half a century and STILL can't pass anything decent, I don't think it will impress people for you to declare that you jsut need an EVEN BIGGER majority.

            Just a guess.

            But hey, we'll find out in November if you're right. After all, if everyone loves what we're doing, then we'll get our 60 votes.  (shrug)

  •  I think we keep the house (0+ / 0-)

    But by a hair. I wonder who is in charge of running the DNC. We have a ton of cash thay is just yearning to be used in states and I have not yet seen one damn AD in any of the states. Seriously. We can do this!

    •  To be honest (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Brainwrap, Geotpf, Jerry056

      Even if we are only holding on by a few Blue Dogs, its  better than having Boehner as speaker and the rest of the loony bin as committee chairs. A 1 vote majority is better than having Congress come to a standstill while Bachmann Turner Overdrive and The Mangerine send subpoena after subpoena at the White House hoping to find anything at all to embarrass him with. They don't care about governing, they care about politics. That is the only reason they even want to win. We have to fight back to hold onto as many seats as we can, even if it means working to re-elect someone who voted against some of our issues. The majority is more important at this point.

    •  Tim Kaine, who's managed to fuck up (0+ / 0-)

      ...just about every positive thing Howard Dean did.

  •  Sounds like people don't like Dems either. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Eric Blair, squarewheel, peregrinus

    But when there's no alternate option, you're stuck with either one or the other.

  •  What this means is GOTV (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    And after you GOTV, GOMV (Get Out More Votes).

    Because you know the Tea Brained Republicans will claim a mandate if 3% of those elected bear their endorsement, nevermind the 97% that didn't.

    It's the same math as they use for tax increases.

    In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice; but in practice, there always is a difference. - Yogi Berra

    by blue aardvark on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:01:02 AM PDT

  •  On the graph it seems like Dems were still (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    cybersaur, coffejoe, jan4insight

    popular when Bush got elected to office in 2000.

    Oh...yeah, I remember now.

    Dems DID win the popular vote, but that doesn't mean anything.....

    Spray tons of carcinogens into the ocean to hide petroleum spewed from a hastily-drilled hole from a greedy corporation, but don't smoke pot.

    by xxdr zombiexx on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:01:43 AM PDT

    •  I have a fantasy movie script I wrote... (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Geotpf, xxdr zombiexx

      in which the losing presidential candidate was also the President of the Senate, which had to certify the results of the obviously corrupted election results.  Wouldn't that have been awesome?

      The pain....

      Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room!

      by bigtimecynic on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:08:38 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  People don't like Republicans?! (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
  •  DKosPPP poll... (0+ / 0-)

    Shows MASSIVE enthusiasm gap and Feingold down double digits in Wisconsin.  Poll will be released later, so this was just a teaser...

    Sen. Reid on GOP threat of filibuster on tax cuts - "by Republican logic, until rich CEOs get what they want, middle-class families can't get what they need."

    by Jonze on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:03:28 AM PDT

  •  WRONG! The GOP has plenty of ideas. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    cybersaur, ezdidit, jan4insight

    It's just that their ideas have nothing to do with improving the country. They want to maximize the redistribution of wealth from the middle class to the rich, they want to give corporations complete power and immunity, they want to privatize the military, and they want to tell you who you can fuck and what god you can worship.

    We shouldn't be selling the notion that they have no ideas. We should be selling the fact that they have LOTS OF DANGEROUS ONES.

    Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room!

    by bigtimecynic on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:05:06 AM PDT

  •  NBC (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    is out with a polls this morning as well.  Obama's approval is 47-49, they find the generic ballot of +4 GOP, and think neither party has clear ideas about the economy.

    By 24-69, people do not believe the GOP has a clear vision on the economy.  The Democrat numbers are 30-65.

    NBC also finds support for extending all of the tax Bush tax cuts.

    The bitter truth of deep inequality has been disguised by an era of cheap imported goods and the anyone-can-make-it celebrity myth - Polly Toynbee

    by fladem on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:05:14 AM PDT

    •  I like the NBC poll (0+ / 0-)

      very solid,for a media poll.

      "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

      by Greg Dworkin on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:16:55 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I look (0+ / 0-)

        at the major news organizations' polling: NBC, CNN, CBS and even FOX. Fox tends to find higher undecideds, but doesn't really noticably lean one way or another.  Pew is also good, though they lean a little to the Demcocrats.  

        You know what I think of Gallup.  I am suspicious of Rasmussen (though I wouldn't dismiss them).  

        I am also very suspicious of the Battleground poll, which hasn't been great in the last few cycles.

        The bitter truth of deep inequality has been disguised by an era of cheap imported goods and the anyone-can-make-it celebrity myth - Polly Toynbee

        by fladem on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:25:57 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I rank ABC/WaPo slightly ahead of CBS/NYT (0+ / 0-)

          and NBC slightly ahead of them. I love Pew because of the data they publish, in addition to topline.

          Gallup is only useful in October. I don't trust CNN or Gallup as much as the others.

          But as you know, come November, all the polls converge.

          "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

          by Greg Dworkin on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:55:23 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  They got nothin' (0+ / 0-)

    Where is the Republican agenda? What are they running on?

    So our folks should be saying to the undecideds, "Look, they got nothin'. I know things are bad, but do you really want to vote for someone who has no plan to fix things? We have both a plan for and a record of fixing things. They got nothin'."

    Republicans are Unpatriotic, and they have no ideas.

    by cultjake on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:05:48 AM PDT

  •  This might be valuable information... (0+ / 0-)

    when the Democrats actually stop fearing the media narrative and begin dominating it.

    Why are Democrats so complacent? Why do they let the media do this to them every single time? Why are the president's advisors only now thinking about linking the Tea Party to the GOP?

    Why, why, why?

    Go Tea Partiers! Keep pushing the Repubs even further to the batshit crazy right

    by ThanxAl on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:06:04 AM PDT

    •  When pigs fly (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Eric Blair

      when the Democrats actually stop fearing the media narrative and begin dominating it

      Seriously, I'd love to see it.  But the Democrats had a once in a generation opportunity to take over the narrative in January 2009 and they very deliberately threw it away.  What did they get for doing so?  Not one damn thing.

      And this isn't just about Obama.  There are Democrats who do not appear to care whether they stay in the majority.

    •  Because the Democrats are elitists too... (0+ / 0-)

      Why, why, why? Because the Democrats are no different than the establishment Republicans. They are all elitists who basically buy into and support so-called "free-market (state backed) capitalism", and are looking for ways to essentially preserve the domination of .1% of the population over the rest.

      There are only a handful of Democrats who are actually pro-working class.

      This is the problem, progressives in America keep trying to put their support into this stupid party which is never going to do any of us any good.

      What progressives need is a Tea Party type movement of our own, but this will never happen, because the only reason that the "Tea Party" is successful at all is because it serves the interests of those same wealthiest .1%. The "Tea Party" is a sham "revolution" hat is basically a matter of a few rich folks driving a heard of bulls through a crowd of people. Yeah, the bulls are the wild a crazy ones getting all the attention and carving the path of destruction, but its really the guys who are driving them from behind that are responsible.

      The Tea Party folks don't even understand themselves how they are being used. But you see, the Left will never have a Tea Party movement, because there are no corporate backers for such a movement.

      The only meaningful movement worth having in America is one that goes against the interests of the wealthy elite who are sucking the blood from the population like giant bloated ticks.

      Yes the Tea Party folks are genuine people and there is a real grass roots movement, but that movement is only successful in-so-far as it serves the interests of the wealthy, intentionally or unintentionally.

      The Democrats aren't going to save us, they are just as much a part of the problem as the Republicans, figure it out...

  •  This is like the difference (0+ / 0-)

    between a turd that stinks and one that doesn't.   They are all  politicians,  but the incumbent ones are particularly stinky and will be flushed in November.

  •  People hate politicians (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    GreenPA, peregrinus

    they just hate Republican politicians slightly more than they hate Democratic politicians.

    It's really not good news for anyone.

    If I wanted to shut up, do what I'm told, and like it, I'd be a Republican!

    by MadLibrarian on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:08:45 AM PDT

  •  Who likes who is not important (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Eric Blair, coffejoe

    Who likes who is not important.  What matters is who votes for which party.  And on that score, we are looking at a lot more people who want to vote for Republicans than want to vote for Democrats.

    The really puzzling disconnect is found when one compares the American public's perception of Republicans with the apparent perceptions of the White House and Democratic leadership.

    Today I read that White House aides are mulling over strategy for the election that is a little over a month away.  How about running against the Republicans and their disastrous policies that put the country in the tank?  How about point out that they have not only done nothing to help the situation, but have stalled or delayed everything the administration has tried to do to help the situation?

    •  Pretty impressive achievement (0+ / 0-)

      If you think of it, the Rethugs should be on the edge of extinction as a political party.  Their policies have consistently failed.  They have been corrupt, dishonest and inept at governing.  They have led us into disastrous wars and wrecked the economy.  It is a pretty impressive achievement for the Democratic leadership to have put itself the position of losing the House and/or Senate.  I don't think I could have screwed up so badly.  I think it takes real talent.

  •  the Republicans have thrown up barriers (0+ / 0-)

    since President Obama was elected.  They have practiced the worse kinds of politics.  These polls show that Americans have been paying attention enough to know how unlikable they are but still may reward them cutting off their noses to spite their faces.

    When Americans complain about the system being broken they surely need to include themselves.  They say they hate the negativity and games playing but if they put the party of no back in the majority it proves they aren't telling the truth.

    The whole thing is discouraging in a way beyond political ideology - that terrible public behavior is simply ignored and rewarded even as many of the same people mouth talk of "values."  What about the value of actually putting America first rather than party and power?  

    •  what did you all expect them to do? (0+ / 0-)

      lie down and surrender to despair?  that is what Democrats do, Republicans hold their noses and go out and vote the party line.

      You folks are playing on different playing fields and by different rules.

      •  indeed, the Repugs are an OPPOSITION PARTY (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Geotpf, soccergrandmom, Anne Elk

        Stopping the other party from doing things, is what an OPPOSITION PARTY is supposed to do.

        The Dems might have kept that in mind back when THEY were the opposition party---and rolled over and capitulated to Dubya on virtually everything.

        I find it hysterically funny that so many DKos-ers fall victim to the same "bipartisanship" bullshit that Obama has. "The Repugs are blocking everything we do  boo hoo hoo! Why can't they work with us boo hoo hoo !"

        What the fuck did you EXPECT them to do? WE don't support any of THEIR program, so why in hell would you seriously think THEY would support any of OURS?

        You think they should support us "for the good of the country"? Just how goddamn naive ARE we?

  •  make 'teabagger" and Republican synonymous (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Marinesquire, coffejoe

    Voters dislike Repubs more than they do Democrats but they dont all equate teabaggers AS republicans...some think teabaggers are the alternative to repubs so it behooves Democrats to keep hammering home that teabaggers ARE the most extreme wing of the GOP.  THEN gotDv

    "can you please continue the petty bickering...I find it most intriguing" DATA

    by KnotIookin on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:11:49 AM PDT

  •  Stop saying "Tea Party candidates"!!! (0+ / 0-)

    They are "Republicans" or "Republicans endorsed by Tea Party supporters" - until and unless they start running as a third party.

    I worry enough that low-information voters don't know that GOP = Republican. Now they've got a whole new mask to hide behind.

    I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. - Major General Smedley D. Butler, USMC

    by Marinesquire on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:15:15 AM PDT

  •  Dems ALSO hold an 8% generic margin over Repukes (0+ / 0-)

    in "has a coherent plan."

    Repukes are the problem, and we can only decimate their illicit creed of Gang Rule with our majority electoral voice!

    •  Barack spent the first year of his presidency (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      insisting that all solutions to all of America's problems had to be bipartisan solutions, with input from Republicans and Democrats.

      I'm still glad I didn't vote for McCain/Palin, but if you took all of Obama's positive attributes, and added a killer instinct that would have hammered the final nails into the GOP's coffin, we'd be looking at a much better political landscape for Dems during these midterms.

      Barack Obama in the Oval Office: There's a black man who knows his place.

      by Greasy Grant on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:28:01 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Amen Greasy (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        ezdidit, Greasy Grant

        Like investigating the crimes of the Bush Administration instead of "Looking ahead."  Maybe being honest with the American people about how screwed up Wall Street really is.

        •  Plans should be coherent. (0+ / 0-)

          Republicans haven't even begun to advance anything that is coherent, except a desperate appeal to racists, xenophobes, homophobes and cowards. The MSM just loves the bullshit of their controversy.

          Their stoke up as much militancy, inspire as many lone wolves and foment disorder and violence. It's a very dangerous strategy, because if they lose, there will be hell to pay...for them and for us.

          They are too extreme in their pursuit of the headline, the sound bite and the spotlight.

          But the more irascibly and outrageously they feature their immoral, subversive and anti-American plans, the more easily they will be defeated.

  •  Looks like people here have already (0+ / 0-)


    What Is The Matter with America?

  •  People don't like the Republicans (0+ / 0-)

    The fact that the GOP is even in play this election should serve as a wake-up call to the Democrats.  People aren't voting for the GOP.  If November turns out to follow the "conventional wisdom" the voter will be voting against Democrats.  

    Although the GOP turn into nut country may save the Democrats.  

    The only thing that will save the sorry asses of the Democrats is the Republicans.

    by ThAnswr on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:21:57 AM PDT

  •  They may not like Republicans (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    but it doesn't necessarily follow they will go to the effort to vote for Democrats.

    Take nothing for granted.

    Before you win, you have to fight. Come fight along with us at TexasKaos.

    by boadicea on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:25:17 AM PDT

  •  meaningless without likely voter analysis (0+ / 0-)

    its all about what voting patterns it translates into. people either act on those dislikes or they don't. we know the motivation on the other side is high. but what of the people who are dissatisfied with both? or hate GOPers positions when you ask them about it but otherwise don't spend a lot of time thinking about it?

    that is where this election will be decided. everything else is fluff and nutter.

  •  Well, that's really unfortunate. (0+ / 0-)

    Because I've decided that what Republicans really want is to be admired and admirable.  That's why their operatives keep trying to degrade Obama.  God forbid he should become a celebrity.  

    The politics of personal destruction is balanced by the politics of personal adulation.  

    Narcissus staring at himself and basking in the glow without realizing he was admiring his own image.

    President Obama's skin color is the only thing that stands between him and many people identifying with him.

    The Constitution is not a menu for an exclusive diner.

    by hannah on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:27:52 AM PDT

  •  "And it means GOTV matters more than ever." (0+ / 0-)

    That line by you says it all.  We know how endangered our candidates are and how unenthusiastic we are.  We know that Republicans are threatening a takeover of the House. But what we don't so well know is what we need to do to stop them.

    If we organized tens of thousands of us from non-contested districts to phone bank for our vulnerable candidates, how much of a difference would that make?  If a a lot, how do we get this national phone bank up and running?

    If President Obama unleashed our Big Money to run special interests ads that counter the Koch and other Republican Big Money, would that level the playing field?

    What do Independents need to hear to swing their vote toward us?

    Dem, WE NEED KOS TO TAKE THE LEAD IN THIS.  If you and the other Kos featured writers would start writing about EXACTLY WHAT WE NEED TO DO TO WIN SEATS IN NOVEMBER and to do this 24/7 without taking time to cover interesting and informative, but not vital-to-November stories, YOU COULD ENERGIZE US AND GET US WORKING TO WIN!

    I hope you'll take the lead and give us a fighting chance this November.


  •  On issues its even worse (for conservatives) (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    For the past 30 years its remained true that if you simply poll on individual issue, and leave labels aside, that most people in America favor progressive policies. However, as soon as you say "Democrat" or "Republican" somehow the Republicans come of better.

  •  It's the failures of the Dems (0+ / 0-)

    and the "pragmatism" delusion over the past 2 years, that has led to the current situation.

    Voters are punishing Dems for siding with the banks and the insurance/pharma co's that are ripping everybody off.  And for continuing open-ended wars of occupation.  And for continuing and expanding upon Bush-era abuses of power.

    Democrats were elected under a clearly left-progressive, protect-constitional-principles banner.  During a time of unprecendeted chicanery by Wall Street that demanded a strong regulatory response (along with a few "sharp fellow" CEOs publicly scrubbing floors and toilets in their new jobs as prison janitors).  The Dems abandoned this banner completely (while protecting the CEOs) to advance a mushy, self-delusional, "centrist" pseudo-pragmatism.  And voters are punishing them for it.

    Voters don't like what Republicans are selling.  Voters dislike even more though when Democrats abandon their reasons for even existing.

    We know now that Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob. -FDR

    by gila on Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 08:36:31 AM PDT

  •  WHO TURNS OUT Nov is key, not general opinion (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    DemFromCT, dsmmom

    The underlying reason the GOP is expected to do well in the November mid-term elections is NOT that the GOP has gained significantly greater approval or popularity since 2008 among the general electorate.  Rather, it's because GOP voters and GOP-leaning independents are proportionately more likely to turn out in November, whereas Dem voters and Dem-leaning independents are proportionately less likely to turn out.

    In short, GOP-leaning voters are inclined to express their dissatisfaction by turning out.  Dem-leaning voters are inclined to express their dissatisfaction by NOT turning out.  So it doesn't matter that if you include the latter (plus genuinely undecided independents) in your sample of who approves whom and what, the Rethugs are disliked/disapproved of by a significantly greater margin than are the Dems, if the Rethugs are disproportionately inclined to vote in November in sufficient numbers.

    What's particularly dangerous (and potentially painful) is that the difference between a rather tepid ordinary off-year election gain by the GOP (as the party out of the White House) and a huge off-year gain whereby they take control of the house and leave the Dems in control of the Senate by a mere sliver will be...literally a sliver of one to four percentage points difference in turnout.

  •  I don't see how you come out with Repukes leading (0+ / 0-)

    I know in the summer there were polls and that one way out in left field from Gallup.  Latest polls show them tied.

    Latest race by race shows everything tightening up.  This is before Oct when the majority of Americans actually start to evaluate the parties and candidates.

    So how the hell you still manage to adopt this BS media framing that Dems are still doomed is beyond me!

    PS: I know Nate is still spewing on about it but he has invested too much in Dems failure to want to see it turn around.  And it will turn around and Nate will deservedly lose a lot of credibility.

  •  Hostage Taking Is Their Cup of Tea Bagging But (0+ / 0-)
  •  The difference is... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    ...The Republicans are unfavorable because of what they've done, and what they represent.  The Democrats are unfavored because (a.) They've failed to dominate the Republicans as much as they should have when pushing policies that the American People need. And (b.) A constant barrage of negative, and absurd, misinformation being put out by rightwing media

    Reason (a.) could be fixed, if the Democrats would unite, and just decide to use the power they have, end the filibuster, ignore the lobbyists and pass the full "wishlist."

    For 8 years the GOP transformed America into its current state, and the people have suffered for it. (except for the richest 2%). Obama's election was the American People saying: "Well that was a failure. Now let's see if this Progressive vision will work." But instead of fulfilling that vision, the Democrats have wavered, and wilted.

    The Democrats favorability isn't suffering from the quality of ideas, but the unwillingness to follow through and get the job done.

  •  Something to add to making Repubs even more (0+ / 0-)


    Late in arrival to these threads but I would like to have folks printout these mini Democratic vs Republican "fliers"

    This is a tool for people to use to simply draw a comparison between Democrats and Republicans. Easy to hand out to others or post or leave behind- very small footprint but straghtforward.

    I have created a website so that you can printout business card size, simple message, political fliers. It only comes with a few political statements at this time but you might find it pretty comprehensive. The front side can read " Vote for People-  - Vote Democratic".  The backside can say " A Vote Republican is a Vote for Fear". There are lots of what a "Vote Republican" means to chose from-27 of them to choose from and they ain't positive for Republicans- that's for sure.

    I haven't included any images in this comment( you can see those on the website) but you will be able to printout 10 business card size handouts on a single 8.5x10inch page(frontside and backside) and then cut them apart

    All are free for you to use.

    Website to get these pdf files: /

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