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Harry Reid, Mitch McConnell
Harry Reid (on left), Mitch McConnell (Joshua Roberts/Reuters)

While Harry Reid is looking for 60 votes to pass his debt ceiling plan (because, of course, a simple majority is never enough for Democrats), Mitch McConnell managed to get 43 members of the Senate Republican caucus to sign a letter pledging their opposition to what Reid is proposing. Who are the four Republican holdouts? Pretty much the names you'd expect:

• Scott Brown (MA)
• Susan Collins (ME)
• Lisa Murkowski (AK)
• Olympia Snowe (ME)

Assuming these senators are gettable (Brown, for instance, said he'd support either the Reid plan or the Boehner plan), that puts Reid at 57 votes. Yet even if Reid could pass something, could John Boehner get it through the House?

11:08 AM PT (Kaili Joy Gray): Great point from plankbob in the comments:  

Mordor McCain even signed? Sweet.

So much for being a maverick, eh?

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Comment Preferences

  •  answer (12+ / 0-)
    Yet even if Reid could pass something, could John Boehner get it through the House?

    no, of course not.

  •  In a word, No. (15+ / 0-)

    We're headed toward default.

    My country is the world, and my religion is to do good. Thomas Paine

    by irate on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:02:36 AM PDT

    •  or as I said (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Flint, wishingwell

      they'll cobble together the mother of all compromises. Shaheen just said she'd be willing to sacrifice some of her SS...how many people could realistically do that?  

    •  not so fast. Reid will amend his bill to (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ActivistGuy, Red Bean, irmaly, deben

      put in triggers that will put social programs at risk into the foreseeable future, and will forever change the debt ceiling issue into the chance to further screw with the American people.  But this will happen seconds before the deadline, whereby the majority of American people will heave a big sigh of relief that a "crisis" has been averted.  

      "Where free unions and collective bargaining are forbidden, freedom is lost." - Ronald Reagan - 1980

      by livjack on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:08:38 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  That's how the Shock Doctrine works (6+ / 0-)

        We ought to know by now, with the TARP experience of getting steamrolled into massive upward redistribution of wealth by government fiat in our background now.

        "Tu vida es ahora" ~graffiti in Madrid's Puerta del Sol, May, 2011.

        by ActivistGuy on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:18:43 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Hate to tell ya this, livjack (5+ / 0-)

        Regardless WHAT bill comes out of either house of congress now....we're gonna see HUGE cuts to social programs and HUGE cuts in a vast number of government spending programs.  Jobs are gonna be lost no matter which party gets their "program"/bill enacted.  The Teaparty has succeeded where no other conservative entity has....EVER before.  Cuts are gonna happen.  Taxes aren't gonna be raised...not even on the uber-rich.  Dems have folded.  I don't care WHAT rhetoric or spin anyone wants to put on it here...or anywhere...it's just the absolute truth.

        Someone want to argue it?   Love to hear it.  I'm pretty sure this post will get a big "0" recommends.  That's because everyone here reading it knows this is true and just doesn't want to show how true it truly is.

        -- **Nothing sucks more than that moment during an argument when you realize you're wrong.**

        by r2did2 on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:21:43 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  you may have missed that my last sentence was (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          valadon

          snark.  I fully realize what's happening.

          "Where free unions and collective bargaining are forbidden, freedom is lost." - Ronald Reagan - 1980

          by livjack on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:27:25 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  I wonder (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          wytcld

          How about if we get 40 Democrats to filibuster the extention of the Bush/Obama tax cuts.  That's a pretty ripe opportunity for a little political payback I think.

          That extension should prove very interesting.  I expect a very harsh blowback, since right about now, I am guessing there are a lot of Democrats out for blood.

          Intelligent, passionate, perceptive people will always disagree, but we should not let that disagreement, however heartfelt, lead us to become deaf to those better angels of our nature.

          by Mindful Nature on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:33:32 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  weirdly at red state only the 22 repuks who voted (0+ / 0-)

          against boner's bill are heroes.

        •  Well, you've got +3 now (0+ / 0-)

          I might quibble with your use of the word "HUGE," because I think the cuts to SS, Medicare, and Medicaid may not be "HUGE" at first—but over the medium term (6-8 years) I think you're unfortunately right. There are ways out of it; I'm not optimistic at all.

          We should be building the social safety net and putting people to work to get out of this depression. We're going the wrong way and doing the wrong things as a nation.

          The wealthy are all complicit in theft and murderer. There's a class war and 98% of us are losing. If you're not really feeling it yet, just wait.

          Eat the rich.

          •  *banging head on desk* (0+ / 0-)

            So take back the House in 2012 and if you don't like what Obama and Reid are doing, run some Democrats to the left of them.

            According to you, these people should be wildly popular and should win easily. And then they can reverse anything objectionable passed now before it has a chance to come into effect.

            If you don't have the House, all that you can expect is retreats of one kind or another. Too many progressives believe in magic wands. They don't exist. Only majorities get things done.

            I dance to Tom Paine's bones.

            by sagesource on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 12:32:29 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  I Fear This Too (0+ / 0-)

        What a very sad situation.

    •  Oh I am so shocked... (6+ / 0-)

      Too many Tea Baggers want the government to default so should Reids bill fail... feel free to adapt the email below to use as talking points for a phone call or just send or fax it.

      -----------------------------------------------------------------
      Dear Senator:

      The 14th amendment option... it was introduced after the civil war because the southern states tried to use the debt ceiling to prevent the northern states from paying off the costs they incurred in that war.
      ------------------------------------------------------------------
      It was meant to prevent the debt ceiling from ever becoming a political football which is exactly what is going on today.
      -----------------------------------------------------------------
      There have been a lot of talking heads and constitutional scholars debating this with differing opinions, but the only ruling that SCOTUS has ever made on it occurred in 1935:
      ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
              In Perry v. United States (1935), the Supreme Court ruled that under Section 4 voiding a United States government bond "went beyond the congressional power."[49] Legal analyst Jeffrey Rosen has argued that Section 4 gives the president unilateral authority to raise or ignore the national debt ceiling, and that if challenged the Supreme Court would likely rule in favor of expanded executive power or dismiss the case altogether for lack of standing.[50]
      ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      I ask you as my representative to urge the President to exercise his constitutional duties by invoking the 14th Amendment and raise the debt ceiling. This is a national emergency. End the black mail.

      •  If Obama does not use the 14th Amendment (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Flint, deben, wytcld

        I would argue he is in constitutional jeopardy of impeachment for not upholding his duty to section 4. He must act in the benefit of the country in the spirit of the 14 so that no domestic group, in this case tea party republicans to make the deb ceiling a political matter. Obama, invoke the 14th Amendment. You are required too.

        My Country Tis of Thee sweet land of Secrecy of thee I sing

        by hangingchad on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:20:19 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Abolish the "debt ceiling" (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        bwintx, Flint

        then there's no "crisis", no "default".  There is nothing divinely ordained about the existence of the "debt ceiling"  Nothing at all.  Quick, name me another nation anywhere on earth that has a "debt ceiling".  Can't do it, can you?  That's because there aren't any!

        At least that's one true case of "American Exceptionalism", we have a "debt ceiling" that provides an endless annual or more opportunity for the wealthy and powerful to hijack the system for huge chunks of upward redistribution of wealth.  It don't get no more exceptionally American than that!

        "Tu vida es ahora" ~graffiti in Madrid's Puerta del Sol, May, 2011.

        by ActivistGuy on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:21:41 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Or the 14th admendment, which Obama doesn't (0+ / 0-)

      want to do.

      HylasBrook @62 - fiesty, fiery, and fierce

      by HylasBrook on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:09:46 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  we won't default! (0+ / 0-)

      Now - Obama can ride in, do the 14th amendment thingy and - SAVE THE USA and the WORLD ECONOMY!!
      woohoo!

      Obama has done a dang good job of exposing Republicans' dysfunction!
      wow

      "Tax cuts for the wealthy create jobs." -- Republicans, HAHAHA - in China

      by MartyM on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:25:07 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  The problem is... (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        MartyM

        ....the phony impeachment that will inevitably follow the use of the 14th. Another opportunity for the teabaggers to bring government to a grinding halt and throw tantrums on the public's dime.

        I dance to Tom Paine's bones.

        by sagesource on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 12:34:41 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Oh, let 'em! (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          MartyM

          What would the House GOP be doing that would actually be worthwhile, if they aren't busy pointlessly impeaching the president for preventing a default?  I'd rather have them waste their time on impeachment hearings that will make them look even more terrible and boost Obama's approval ratings and re-election prospects than on additional hideous legislation targeting the poor, minorities, etc. and driving the country even farther back into the ditch.  Watch the Democrats ride any GOP impeachment shit right back into regaining a House majority and retaining the Senate and White House.

  •  Mordor McCain even signed? Sweet. n/t (6+ / 0-)

    Dream, that's the thing to do (Johnny Mercer)

    by plankbob on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:03:57 AM PDT

  •  Boehner get it through the House? (0+ / 0-)

    Don't see how without his joining the democrats with a few republicans, ain't gonna happen...imho

    "Lets show the rascals what Citizens United really means."

    by smiley7 on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:05:06 AM PDT

  •  It won't pass (12+ / 0-)

    in time.

     It's a Frankenstein bill so twisted and deformed that it is nearly beyond recognition.

    This leaves the option for a clean vote open.

    With a Presidential announcement that he will appoint by executive order a commission to deal with the debt.

    If the 14th ammendment is invoked the President could still appoint a commission by executive order which would at least prevent the world as we know it  from ending! :)

     

    you just can not pretend like spitting in the face of some progress, because it is 'not enough ' is going to get you more progress

    by missliberties on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:05:23 AM PDT

    •  Yeah...looking at fantastic success of (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      limpidglass, Aspe4, irmaly, deben

      his "fiscal commission".  I ain't holding my breath.

      "I'm not scared of anyone or anything, Angie. Isn't that the way life should be?" Jack Hawksmoor

      by skyounkin on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:07:16 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  reforming the tax code (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        citizen k

        works for me.

         It's about the only opportunity that is serious enough to get it done.

        you just can not pretend like spitting in the face of some progress, because it is 'not enough ' is going to get you more progress

        by missliberties on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:14:29 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Yeah, that really worked out well (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          wytcld, msdrown

          the last time the code was reformed.  I give you the Tax Reform Act of 1986:

          The top tax rate was lowered from 50% to 28% while the bottom rate was raised from 11% to 15%. Many lower level tax brackets were consolidated, and the upper income level of the bottom rate (married filing jointly) was increased from $5,720/year to $29,750/year. This package ultimately consolidated tax brackets from fifteen levels of income to four levels of income.[1] This would be the only time in the history of the U.S. income tax (which dates back to the passage of the Revenue Act of 1862) that the top rate was reduced and the bottom rate increased concomitantly. In addition, capital gains faced the same tax rate as ordinary income. (note: the only good thing to come out of the 1986 Reform, IMO)

          The rate structure also maintained a novel "bubble rate." The rates were not 15%/28%, as widely reported. Rather, the rates were 15%/28%/33%/28%. The "bubble rate" of 33% simply elevated the 15% rate to 28% for higher-income taxpayers. As a result, for taxpayers after a certain income level, TRA86 provided a flat tax of 28%.

          Might work for you, but it doesn't work for me.

          "I believe that ignorance is the root of all evil. And that no one knows the truth." - Molly Ivins

          by Involuntary Exile on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:32:40 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  Excecutive Order for a Debt Commission... (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      missliberties, GOPGO2H3LL

      ...is a very nice PR move.

      It would give a "both sides" for the media to use when giving the "King Obama" winger yelling airspace.

      Like if he's appointing a bi-partisan commission how is he taking it all into his own hands?

      •  I would say that the proposed (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        MazeDancer

        bill is just a little less convoluted than our economic system.

         

        you just can not pretend like spitting in the face of some progress, because it is 'not enough ' is going to get you more progress

        by missliberties on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:10:20 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  You know what's even worse (3+ / 0-)

        Is I have to run to the post office..... and I can't seem to make myself break away from the spectacle. Is that *political-doom porn addiction.

        you just can not pretend like spitting in the face of some progress, because it is 'not enough ' is going to get you more progress

        by missliberties on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:13:20 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Let the baggers howl... like they haven't been (4+ / 0-)

        Invoke the 14th amendment by executive order and it cuts off their leverage.

        The Dems can then put up the balanced approach the polls show the public favors and if the baggers vote it down... 2012 will be a referendum on them.  

        •  Of course I love (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          MazeDancer, Flint, Delilah

          how the international community is shining a light on the obtuse ignorance.

           I think sunshine is the best disinfectant for this strange mutated species of the gop.

           It's amazing to think that the world is watching. I hope our good Senators live up to the dignity of the office.

          you just can not pretend like spitting in the face of some progress, because it is 'not enough ' is going to get you more progress

          by missliberties on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:16:20 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  You raise a good point... (4+ / 0-)

            All the rest of the countries of the world are incredulous over this and think we've snapped our cap!

            They are scared spit-less because a default will trigger a global cascade into a new financial meltdown. As Roubini called is "a perfect storm."

            America... the leading capitalist state in the free world... the one who brought them 30 years of Reaganomics... supply-side voodoo economics... and the Subprime disaster... which they all bought into... going down in flames at the hands of a few "nutters."

            A real... "The Emperor has no clothes" moment!

            •  flipped our lids (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Flint

              snapped our caps and every other appropriate metaphor.

              The full faith and credit of the US is worth taking down..... so the tea party can worship at the alter of 'the job creators'.

               The 'job creators' came down from the mountain, and on a tablet written in stone, were the words:

               You shall not blaspheme the job creators who give you life breath and sustenance on this earth!

              you just can not pretend like spitting in the face of some progress, because it is 'not enough ' is going to get you more progress

              by missliberties on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:31:57 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  We are really, really, really fucking stupid (0+ / 0-)

              This is proof that capitalism doesn't make you smart. Back when we had to compete against the Soviet Empire, one of our weapons was staying (relatively) closer to truth. Since that Empire's collapse, there's been less competitive motivation to avoid taking the easier road in our own media - pretty much a shallow stream of diversions and lies.

              So we've done that. And now we're as stupid as they used to be. Fuck us.

        •  I am watching the Senate (5+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Flint, pamelabrown, wytcld, Delilah, MazeDancer

          debate.

           The Democrats are refusing to accept cuts for the big 3 and they keep pointing out that that IS the goal of the gop.

           Yeah!

          you just can not pretend like spitting in the face of some progress, because it is 'not enough ' is going to get you more progress

          by missliberties on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:26:55 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  I find ML's scenario likely (0+ / 0-)

      even while I find her sig so linguistically twisted and deformed that it is nearly beyond grammatical recognition.

      The House GOP are the political equivalent of suicide bombers.

      by DavidHeart on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:21:57 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Obama needs to ask for a clean bill on Monday (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      msmacgyver, Delilah, msdrown

      if nothing is happening.  

      By Tuesday just before midnight if he doesn't have it Obama absolutely has to invoke the 14th amendment to prevent us from going into default.

      President Obama, May 5, 2011: "When we say we will never forget, we mean what we say".

      by Drdemocrat on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:27:07 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Ye of little faith (0+ / 0-)

        should know that we can not let our economic system revert to a depression to satiate the gop mutants.

        you just can not pretend like spitting in the face of some progress, because it is 'not enough ' is going to get you more progress

        by missliberties on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:35:11 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  A little humor: At least this clusterfuck has (15+ / 0-)

    gotten MSNBC to get off their foolish "Lockup" crap on Saturday afternoon.  Doncha feel sorry for those poor readers having to work?????

  •  The Republicans are going to filibuster? (12+ / 0-)

    Any one remember Jan 2011 when a select few Democratic Senators wanted to Fix the Rules?

    Notice: This Comment © 2011 ROGNM

    by ROGNM on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:05:35 AM PDT

    •  Shit no!! (1+ / 1-)
      Recommended by:
      Jimdotz
      Hidden by:
      PittsburghPete

      We (and by "we" I mean the idiot in the oval office) said that we (he, the idiot) took John Boner at his word that he wouldn't never, ever, ever use the filibuster or hold anything hostage again....

      Or something...

      Sigh...

      NO ONE COULD HAVE PREDICTED!!

      "I'm not scared of anyone or anything, Angie. Isn't that the way life should be?" Jack Hawksmoor

      by skyounkin on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:09:45 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  That was the worst capitulation of all! (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Red Bean, msmacgyver, hyperstation

      The Filibuster assures that the Senate remains conservative even with a generally progressive population because it sits atop a Senate construction that is biased toward rural, conservative states. California's mostly progressive population is larger than the smallest, mostly conservative, 16 states combined. So a large progressive population gets 2 senators while a smaller conservative population gets 32 senators. And yet Democrats chose to preserve the 60 vote filibuster to add to that unfairness.

      And now because of their cowardice, conservatives are about to crash the economy again. I can only hope that this time, Democrats will use the Shock Doctrine to take advantage of it to change course and go full FDR when it happens.

      There are two political aisles: Center-Left and Center-Right. It's impossible to cross them both. Republicans know this and govern accordingly; Democrats don't.

      by Jimdotz on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:19:08 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  but... but.... NOBODY could have forseen this! (0+ / 0-)

      except of course us sanctimonious purist types who did.

      sigh.

      Intelligent, passionate, perceptive people will always disagree, but we should not let that disagreement, however heartfelt, lead us to become deaf to those better angels of our nature.

      by Mindful Nature on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:36:07 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  They might be gone. (4+ / 0-)

    If this isn't just theater--which, frankly is all it might be--looks like the R's endgame could be to (1) refuse to pass a bill and hope that the "both sides do it" meme holds, and (2) goad the Pres into doing something they can respond to by screaming "UNCONSTITUTIONAL1!!!1" and rev up the Impeachment Machine.

    "Nonsense!" said Alice, very loudly and decidedly, and the Queen was silent.

    by RIposte on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:06:13 AM PDT

    •  I agree. The GOP wants the limit raised, but... (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      wishingwell

      they don't want their fingerprints on it, so they can complain.

      Just like they did with the TARP bill.

      Just like they did with their non-action on the Libya vote.

      Art is the handmaid of human good.

      by joe from Lowell on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:09:30 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  It's theatre. But it's (1+ / 0-)

      the kind of theatre where someone yells 'fire' then sets one.

      Still, I think this is all just bullshit to squeeze every last concession from the Dems. And it'll work.

      And we'll raise the debt limit, at the cost of the safety net for millions, and some people on our team will call it a win.

      "Gussie, a glutton for punishment, stared at himself in the mirror."

      by GussieFN on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:11:26 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Someone remind me again why filibuster reform (10+ / 0-)

    didn't happen?

    Remember back at the start of the term, where we were all saying that they needed to change the rules on the filibuster back to what they used to be, i.e. actually needing to be filibustering instead of just not voting for cloture?

    Weren't we concerned over just this sort of thing happening?

    Reality has a liberal bias.

    by Hayate Yagami on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:06:25 AM PDT

  •  Passing the Senate would Strengthen Reid's Hand (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    wishingwell

    he still has the opportunity to tweak his bill to peal off a few Republican Senators, assuming his talks with McConnell go nowhere.

  •  Obama will cave and accept the Boehner bill (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    limpidglass, Aspe4, davidkc, bgold
  •  I'm pretty sure (0+ / 0-)

    we could get more than 43 Kossacks to sign a letter that says 43 letter signing Republican Senators are more interested in destroying the social safety net than they are fixing the economy.

    Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

    by a gilas girl on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:09:52 AM PDT

  •  Mark Kirk (0+ / 0-)

    If Murky is able to stand up to them, I kinda thought he might, too?

    •  I think it should be abundantly clear (0+ / 0-)

      that Republicans who present themselves as moderates, by and large, are not going to deter from the the party line.  There are currently four exceptions in the upper chamber -- Snow, Collins, Brown, and Murkowski -- who are making political decisions because they rely on DEm votes to get re-elected.  They  vote one time out of ten with the Dems in the Senate  to give well-meaning Dem who voter for them hope that moderation exists, and to ensure their re-election chances.   But for the most part, Republicans will choose party over the country every time.  Frankly,  I think they lose their minds when they are out of power our their power is curtailed in some way.  

    •  Maybe he figures he's a one termer (0+ / 0-)

      So why bother pretending to be a moderate.

      "Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the president to explain to us what the exit strategy is." - George W Bush

      by jfern on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 06:10:37 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Teabaggers = Nazis. (0+ / 0-)

    The Germans failed to quash their rightwing extremists.

    We must destroy ours.  Now.

    Hey...it's YOU they are coming after.

    TEABAGGER, TERRORIST...THEY ALL LOOK THE SAME TO ME.

    by GOPGO2H3LL on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:11:48 AM PDT

  •  Make them filibuster this time. (6+ / 0-)

    Fuck this threat and Dems consistently caving to the threats.

    Make Republicans stand on the floor of the Senate 24/7 blocking this bill. And while Republicans are publicly blocking any progress while the market tanks on Monday. Then Obama should invoke the 14th Amendment.

    That would be the most strategically viable option for Dems right now.

    Which is exactly why Dems won't do it. It makes too much sense. Dems set themselves up for this. Republicans are determined to destroy Obama at any cost, yet Obama apparently didn't get the memo.  

    This is a crisis I knew had to come, Destroying the balance I'd kept. Doubting, unsettling and turning around, Wondering what will come next.
    --Ian Curtis

    by jethrock on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:12:10 AM PDT

  •  I've tuned this out. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Timaeus

    It will end with a bill of impeachment from the house in about a month.

    •  Frankly, that the only silver lining. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Phil S 33

      (Er, because it'd go nowhere and it's the kinda thing that people notice, unlike all the 'adult in the room' bullshit about a debt ceiling. Voters will think, 'Really? Impeachment? Isn't that just for blowjobs?' and it'll redound to Obama's benefit.)

      "Gussie, a glutton for punishment, stared at himself in the mirror."

      by GussieFN on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:20:40 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Maybe Reid should offer them ambassadorships.... (0+ / 0-)

    OOPS.....not within his power.

  •  McCain signing isnt surprising (0+ / 0-)

    His anger with the tea party was they werent compromising with Boehner, not that they werent compromising Dems/Obama.

  •  Isackson shows up....Like he's been in a prison (0+ / 0-)

    camp for the last 2.5 years......Kumbaya......yeah right.

  •  Reuters reports there are only 43 R's in Senate (6+ / 0-)

    http://www.reuters.com/...

    All Senate Republicans oppose Democratic debt bill

    iWASHINGTON, July 30 | Sat Jul 30, 2011 1:29pm EDT

    (Reuters) - All 43 Republicans in the U.S. Senate have signed a letter, released on Saturday, saying they will not vote for a Democratic plan to raise the debt limit in a sign that the measure does not have the support it needs to advance in Congress.

    Nice editing work there, Reuters!

  •  Who the fuck is the Soccer Mom? (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    bwintx, PittsburghPete

    Jesus christ how the hell can people vote for someone like that?

  •  What was it we didn't vote for again? (0+ / 0-)

    Oh yeah - Dysfunctional government.

    AAA? I'd settle for Little League over  this "cognitively impaired" T-Ball game.

    An imbalance between rich and poor is the oldest and most fatal ailment of all republics - Plutarch

    by Anthony Page aka SecondComing on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:17:50 AM PDT

  •  If you're going over to CSPAN, have a barf bag (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Ky DEM

    ready.  The keebler elf is speaking!

    Then they came for me - and by that time there was nobody left to speak up.

    by DefendOurConstitution on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:17:56 AM PDT

  •  So that speech by McCain (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    The Gryffin, Ky DEM

    that totally derided the Tea Party was just theater ..go figure, who could of predicted.  Now McCain stands with the Teabaggers. Does he have any dignity anymore?

  •  MEANWHILE, here's something you should know. (13+ / 0-)

    I close my refinance yesterday.  I had been listening to some batshit insane teabagger rep hold forth about the evil debt ceiling in late June and I literally muted the interview, called my lender, and started the process.  I was VERY lucky in many respects - my credit is good, I'm not underwater, and I had all of my paperwork together.

    I called my lender's account executive yesterday to let him know that I had closed and it was DONE.  He told me that was good - because as of this past week, his underwriters will no longer lock rates for refinances or home purchases.

    Take a second and digest that.

    I asked a co-worker who also closed a refi earlier this week if his lender was saying the same thing.  He called and checked: his lender is no longer locking interest rates for refinances or purchases.

    Unreal. Anyone else know of a lender who has that going on?  It makes sense.  If you lock at, say, 4.75% today and don't close your loan for 30-45 days, the bank could wind up having to borrow funds at a much higher rate than your locked rate to honor the agreement.

  •  It depends (0+ / 0-)

    "Yet even if Reid could pass something, could John Boehner get it through the House?"

    Will he get any Democratic votes this time?  He only needs for enough Republicans to spend the day at the beach.

    We can have change for the better.

    by phillies on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:19:24 AM PDT

  •  Jeff Beauregard shows up.....I can go mow the (0+ / 0-)

    lawn.....Lot's of talk....signifying zippo.

  •  This is so damned depressing. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    bgold, Fury, msdrown

    The government is completely broken.

    I've been saying for about two weeks that I thought default was inevitable. That really looks likely now.

    The Republicans think destroying the economy will destroy Obama. That is 100 percent of it.

    It is a calling...to do things about injustice.... It helps to have a goal. I've always tried to have one.--Ted Kennedy, True Compass

    by Timaeus on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:21:41 AM PDT

  •  Jeeezus! (0+ / 0-)

    What IS it with all these f*cking pledges?

    No one ever died from laughing too often

    by googie on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:21:45 AM PDT

  •  These fuckers really are gonna crash the econony. (5+ / 0-)

    Aren't they?

    There are two political aisles: Center-Left and Center-Right. It's impossible to cross them both. Republicans know this and govern accordingly; Democrats don't.

    by Jimdotz on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:22:38 AM PDT

  •  One sentence bill (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Drdemocrat, Fury

    or 14th Amendment.

    Forget these hostage takers.

  •  Whatever happens, we're screwed folks (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    bgold, Fury, PittsburghPete

    The decline of America continues, unabated.

  •  Capitulation (0+ / 0-)

    The Republicans don't just want capitulation policy-wise (they've been offered that for weeks, now); they want it too look like capitulation.  

    I wonder if that is a bridge too far . . . not simply to fail, but to have that failure be manifest.

    I didn't start here, not even close, but I am ready for a default.  

    http://www.amazon.com/s?ie=UTF8&search-type=ss&index=books&field-author=Benjamin%20Gross berg&page=1

    by claytonben on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:25:10 AM PDT

    •  Same here (0+ / 0-)

      or the 14th amendment leading to impeachment push.

      These people must be stopped. Appeasing them only encourages them, and it will get worse.

      With all the calamitous things that would happen, enough is enough.

  •  Pass it with 57. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Fury

    This stupid crap with having to get 60 has got to end.

    •  The problem is (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      GlowNZ, Phil S 33, Fury, Carbon

      that under rules of the Senate, it can't be brought up for a vote. So as much as it would be nice to hold one, it can't be done.

      And yes, I know this needed to be confronted 2.5 years ago. But that is the reality at the moment.

      And the Senate passing it means nothing if the House doesn't go along, which it never will.

      What the game plan now is to say, the House passed something, the Senate didn't (trying to avoid the reality that Reid's bill has a higher % support than Boehner's did), then saying Boehner's needs to be passed and signed.

      There is virtually no way this is going to be resolved in Congress.

  •  Ya'll just don't understand McCain, (0+ / 0-)

    he's a maverick, so anything he does is what a maverick would do. Republicans stopped learning at the transitive property, figured that's all they needed.

    It's like when a Republican lectures about getting our fiscal house in order yet owes more than $100,000 in child support. Owing that much money to your children  is fiscally sound if a Republican does it if said Republican lectures us on fiscal responsibility.

    "We believe that the people are the source of all governmental power; that the authority of the people is to be extended, not restricted."-Barbara Jordan

    by sancerre2001 on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:27:13 AM PDT

  •  This is the old "minority rule"we are so use to it (0+ / 0-)

    .They have been so successful with hostage taking why would they stop now.

    Obama and the democrats are either co conspirators or they are incredibly weak.

    and If Obama thinks weakness and lack of principles is an attractive quality...maybe he should take a look at his Gallup numbers.

    when you have Harry Belafonte and Jessy Jackson calling you weak ass...you might as well admit it to yourself.

    (note they did not actually call him weak ass they use other euphpmisms like curage and stifness)

  •  Getting ugly in the House.....Dreier is a POS.... (0+ / 0-)
  •  They are willing to crash the country (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Phil S 33, Delilah

    to bring Obama down.

    if thats not a definition of treason I don't know what is.  

     and people vote for these fuckers!

    May the road rise up to meet you. May the wind be always at your back.

    by GlowNZ on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:29:34 AM PDT

    •  Obama is going down and he knows it that is (0+ / 0-)

      why he has been paralyzed with fear, ever since his economic advisors told him that unemployment would be around 8-9% on election night, that is why he has been so desperate with the grand barging and the republicans know this and have denied him that, even when he was willing to put SS and Medicare on the table.

      Obama is going down on policy merit that is why he has resorted to winning the election on personality, the shit about seeming reasonable was not about winning the debt argument, it was about independent voters,...come election time Obama would not and could not argue that that is was all GOP's fault because he has not established that as true..remember 2009 when McConnell was saying he wanted Obama to fail ..had Obama accused the GOP of gunning for the economic well being of the country we would have established a hook on peoples mind that would have given him some resonance NOW THAT PEOPLE can see that the country is headed toward default.

      Obama is toast lest the GOP nitwits choose Bachmann and even then it would not be a cakewalk. There is no chance that the GOP will choose B-Mann.

      so he was known for a while that he is toast that is why he has been busy selling off "democratic inheritance" to safe his political behind.

  •  These Republicans are really something (0+ / 0-)

    Their idea of 'compromise' is to take their proposals in full.  Period.

    I've always believed they'd come to some kind of deal, but now I think they're really going to force a default.

    you don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows

    by Dem Beans on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:31:15 AM PDT

  •  Here's part of the backstory (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Fury, mithra, JC from IA

    The Repubs have plenty, but here is a key one:

    They are nearly all burdened with having voted for the Ryan budget and/or the Boehner bill, meaning they have voted to cut Medicare already.

    They want to get as many Dems as possible on record as doing the same, as well as Obama signing it.

    Then of course the anonymous attack ads will start accusing Dem incumbents of cutting Medicare.

    That's a big part of what's behind this.

  •  All this means is that Harry will have to give up (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    mithra, valadon

    more concessions to get it pass.  Harry and the Republicans already know this will bring in more triggers.  They already know this.  Don't be fooled.  This is something they both want included anyway.

    "The only limit to our realization of tomorrow will be our doubts of today." -Franklin D.Roosevelt

    by bmor on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:33:55 AM PDT

    •  I really hate that type of talk (0+ / 0-)
      This is something they both want included anyway.

      I don't really believe this is what DEMs want for this country.  I honestly believe they are shocked at the hostage taking and the complete lack of compromise coming from the other side.  It is stunning really.

  •  Obama is a wimp (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    wytcld

    and will capitulate if they let him.  OTOH, reading about the 43 Republicans in the Senate rejecting Reid's plan leads me to conclude that the Senate won't report out a bill.  That will leave the Boehner bill (all 2 of them) for the Senate to approve (it won't) and Obama to then get all confused about.

    In the end, I expect Obama to be advised to use the 14th or the 'save the Nation' option, but, I don't think he has the nerve (usually I call it courage).  OK, I don't think he has the courage.

    So, he will scurry around looking for a way to cave however he can, and eventually, he will figure out that he is in a double-bind.  I don't know what he'll do then; but I feel certain it won't be pretty.

  •  2.6 years of filibustering...no solution? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    msdrown

    If the roles were reversed...the Republicans would never allow 2.6 years of non-stop filibustering. The Democrats fall prey every time.

  •  Now Mary Landrieu (0+ / 0-)

    Bagging on Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid.  Such a problem!

    I can't believe this entire debate.  Just incredible.

    you don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows

    by Dem Beans on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:40:04 AM PDT

  •  Time for the 14th amendment (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    bmor

    Will Obama has the courage?

    "The real wealth of a nation consists of the contributions of its people and nature." -- Rianne Eisler

    by noofsh on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:41:58 AM PDT

  •  So, the answer to the question (0+ / 0-)

    "Are there 7 sane Republicans in the Senate?" is "No."

  •  Holding out for a 6mos deal and more extortion op. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    JC from IA

    This is how the Republicans get what they want. Four times now, holding legislation hostage until their demands are met. The filibuster rule has been extraordinarily
     harmful to this administration.  

  •  call your senator (0+ / 0-)

    I just called my republican senator to express my outrage that he would filibuster Reid's bill.  I encourage each and every one of you to do the same---assuming that you are represented by one of the 43 evil filibustering republican senators.  And I hope that you will contact your local media with outrage when they report that Reid's bill "failed to pass" the Senate instead of accurately reporting that it was filibustered even though it received bipartisan support.  If enough of us do this it may make a difference.

    To the barricades!

    •  IT WON'T HELP! (0+ / 0-)

      They know they have several years for us to forget their votes, and know that a good campaign commercial will make us forget even if we do remember.  They don't care what we think, period.

      President Barack Obama; I helped make this happen!

      by PittsburghPete on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:56:41 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  98currentGOP Housemembers voted for clean bill B4 (0+ / 0-)
  •  House voting (0+ / 0-)

    Nos made it but now there is  a 15 min vote after request from dems for a recorded vote.

    Be the change you want to see in the world. -Gandhi

    by DRo on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:54:38 AM PDT

  •  Four D's vote Nay on Reid (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    DRo

    That makes it a bipartisan defeat, according to the Republican definition of "bipartisan."

  •  Both parties are looking for one thing (0+ / 0-)

    Both parties are looking for one thing and one thing only.  They're not interested in what's "right" for America...Americans.  Both parties are looking for some kind of KUDOS thingy from the mainstream press and, from the voters...for "doing the right thing"...for "being right"....for "being right".  

    We're not seeing anything that is gonna be BEST for America.  We're seeing the D.C. crowd scrambling for good press and for what will make them look good so as to get re-elected.

    Think not?  hahahaha..........Think again.

    -- **Nothing sucks more than that moment during an argument when you realize you're wrong.**

    by r2did2 on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 11:57:50 AM PDT

  •  Obama and Reid should expose them on TV (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    msdrown

    Obama and Reid need to show the Repub's obstruction and rejection on TV.  Obama should call the press and read out the names of each Repub who signed that letter. He should then explain that if there is a default look at these Senators.

    Harry Reid should call the Senate into session and make each Repub stand up, filibuster and reject the legislation. Don't let them hide.  Then take the footage and play it again and again.

    But will they do something like this? I doubt it.

  •  Does Not Look Good (0+ / 0-)

    I assumed that in the end, cooler heads would eventually prevail to raise the debt ceiling. But after watching a little bit of C-SPAN today and hearing the level of bitterness and animosity coming from the members of the House, I'm convinced that we are headed towards default. There remains too much fight in their voices, and too little time.

  •  Anyone care to wager who crossed over... (0+ / 0-)

    ...to the "dark side?"  I'll lead off with Heath Shuler.

  •  5 dem nay, now eom (0+ / 0-)

    Be the change you want to see in the world. -Gandhi

    by DRo on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 12:01:30 PM PDT

  •  Pecking order for Goverment Non-Payments Aug 3. (0+ / 0-)

    If the Debt ceiling is not raised the following payments will NOT be made

    1. Congress members pay checks
    2. Congress members expenses (office, stationary, etc)
    3. Congress members staff pay (sorry guys and gals, but you need to talk some sense into these jerks)
    4. Congress members healthcare benefits
    5 Congress members Staff healthcare benefits (in case #3 didn't convince you)
    6. Any government subsidies paid to congress members or their families (time for family members to share the pain)
    7. Cessation of any free perks provided to congress members

    Add as you see fit

    "Now watch what you say or they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, a fanatical criminal" -- Logical Song -- Rick Davies & Roger Hodgson

    by Over50Lib on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 12:08:21 PM PDT

  •  As I said here last night, it is readily apparent (0+ / 0-)

    that McConnell figures that running out the clock is his only play.  The question is, what does he expect to accomplish?

    My guess is some variation of his original plan to stick the POTUS with all the blame for raising the debt ceiling, while adding extra unpalatable "conditions".

    Since he will use every extra-constitutional Senate rule in the playbook to meet this end, I expect that labeling him as the obstructionist he is is the only current play for the Dems.  But, I think they will need to adopt the Republican take-no-prisoners philosophy now: Show McConnell that he has fucked his last fuck and that they no longer care about trying to preserve future Senate comity.  You refuse to negotiate with the Majority Leader?  Then, eat shit and die.  Here's your grave, just jump in.

  •  Are we assuming that Bernie Sanders will vote (0+ / 0-)

    for the Reid bill?

    Has he said this?

    It's the fascism, stupid!

    by lastman on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 12:15:31 PM PDT

  •  I AM GETTING SCARED :=( (0+ / 0-)

    All these days I assumed that McConnell, much as I dislike and dispise him, is willing to play ball because in his own way he is a grown-up. I don't know what to believe any more, and I feel like we are beeing beaten to a pulp by carnivorous monsters.

  •  The picture accompanying your diary says it all. (0+ / 0-)

    I listened to Harry Reid's statement last night.   He almost begged McConnell to compromise.  Sorry folks, this AIN'T leadership.  Leadership is showing strength not begging. In his prepared remarks Majority Leader Reid should have DEMANDED that McConnell compromise and back up those demands with facts regarding the consequences of default. Is anyone surprised by the filibuster?  Senator Reid came off as tired, overwhelmed, and desparate.  Surely this will not help him in future negotiations with the wily, unscrupulous McConnell.

  •  CNN refuses to call it a "Filibuster" (0+ / 0-)

    just checked and, at least, we see some news outlets using the precisely accurate term. Even FoxNews!

    I'm an American Liberal. Blogging in between family, work and activism time.

    by AlphaLiberal on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 01:27:55 PM PDT

  •  Dare them to filibuster it!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (0+ / 0-)

    Are you fucking kidding me?? Reid and the Democrats have political gold fall into their goddamn laps and they won't call the Reptiles' bluff?

    Dare them to filibuster the bill while the deadline approaches in front of the American people.

    Of course, what the fuck do I care since I hate Reid's bill anyway.

    I'm just livid at another example of the Democrats' wimpy approach allowing the Reptiles to exercise majority control of the Senate with 43 votes.

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