Skip to main content

This from the Congressional Black Caucus Jobs Tour in Detroit, Michigan:

The above clip and below clip is FRUSTRATION.

One thing is for sure, in my family I know several who are unemployed.  Two of my family members unemployed for over 2 years.

The unemployment rate in the African American community is 16%.  Not 8% or 12% but 16%.  That is a fact.  For African American men it is 17.5% and African American teens a whopping 41%.

I see in Chicago, grown men walking around unemployed.  Many African American teens or young adults, no jobs, nothing to do.  Grown men going from house to house with lawnmowers knocking on doors for any work.

This is real.  Not a game.  But real.

The foreclosure rate in the African American community is astronomical.  Most losing homes because they have lost their jobs.  Not a myth but a reality.

While about 4.5 percent of white borrowers lost their homes to foreclosure during that period, black and Latino borrowers had 7.9 and 7.7 percent foreclosure rates, respectively. That means that blacks and Latinos were more than 70 percent more likely to lose their homes to foreclosure during that period, the study found.

The jobs proposal by President Obama is unclear.  But one thing I know that must be faced is IMMEDIATE JOBS.  Not fantasy jobs.  But clear cut jobs that the public can visualize and see.  

We don't want to hear nothing about trade agreements.  Trade agreements have already taken over this country, just look around everything is imported but little of our goods are outsourced.  The imbalanced is overtly unfair and has been one of the problems with joblessness here in this country.

We don't want to hear about patents.  The American public don't get that nor care about that.  Will the result of it be up and ready to hire folk immediately?  NO.  We all know this.

I like the idea of the infrastructure bank, but that will not have any immediate impact.

In other words, the public want to see JOBS.  Real jobs.  Not talking about jobs, but acting on jobs.

Lastly, we see BUS FORCE ONE everywhere but the inner city where many minorities live and struggle.  And it is hard to go to these communities because they are in despair.  But BUS FORCE ONE need to go into these communities and listen to these people.  These are the many faceless unemployed Americans who voted for Barack Obama and they need to know what he is going to do for them.  These folks are hanging by a sheer thread and there is no help out there.  So, when BUS FORCE ONE goes on another listening tour, stop on by Crenshaw, Inglewood, Detroit, Southside and Westside of Chicago, projects of Brooklyn, Oakland, St. Louis, etc. because these folks have something to say, too.

From MSNBC, Jansing and Co.:


YouTube Video

And how bad is it?  Obama reaches RECORD LOW APPROVAL on the economy.  It is that bad out here.

7:13 PM PT: And on the listening tour, people have ONE THING ON THEIR MIND:  J.O.B.S.  Like one man said, "I don't want to hear about another commission..."  AMEN, on that one.



Originally posted to icebergslim on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 12:19 PM PDT.

Also republished by ClassWarfare Newsletter: WallStreet VS Working Class Global Occupy movement.

EMAIL TO A FRIEND X
Your Email has been sent.
You must add at least one tag to this diary before publishing it.

Add keywords that describe this diary. Separate multiple keywords with commas.
Tagging tips - Search For Tags - Browse For Tags

?

More Tagging tips:

A tag is a way to search for this diary. If someone is searching for "Barack Obama," is this a diary they'd be trying to find?

Use a person's full name, without any title. Senator Obama may become President Obama, and Michelle Obama might run for office.

If your diary covers an election or elected official, use election tags, which are generally the state abbreviation followed by the office. CA-01 is the first district House seat. CA-Sen covers both senate races. NY-GOV covers the New York governor's race.

Tags do not compound: that is, "education reform" is a completely different tag from "education". A tag like "reform" alone is probably not meaningful.

Consider if one or more of these tags fits your diary: Civil Rights, Community, Congress, Culture, Economy, Education, Elections, Energy, Environment, Health Care, International, Labor, Law, Media, Meta, National Security, Science, Transportation, or White House. If your diary is specific to a state, consider adding the state (California, Texas, etc). Keep in mind, though, that there are many wonderful and important diaries that don't fit in any of these tags. Don't worry if yours doesn't.

You can add a private note to this diary when hotlisting it:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from your hotlist?
Are you sure you want to remove your recommendation? You can only recommend a diary once, so you will not be able to re-recommend it afterwards.
Rescue this diary, and add a note:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from Rescue?
Choose where to republish this diary. The diary will be added to the queue for that group. Publish it from the queue to make it appear.

You must be a member of a group to use this feature.

Add a quick update to your diary without changing the diary itself:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary?
(The diary will be removed from the site and returned to your drafts for further editing.)
(The diary will be removed.)
Are you sure you want to save these changes to the published diary?

Comment Preferences

    •  I'd love to hear (9+ / 0-)

      what you would propose that would work immediately.

      Thanks.

        •  Can you be any more specific? (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          princss6, wader, vixenflem, scribe

          One of the problems they ran into with the Recovery Act was the dearth of "shovel ready" projects.

          For example, we're getting a new light rail built in my city. The planning for that has been going on for over 10 years.

          •  i don't know about your city (26+ / 0-)

            but in mine the plans are in place. so is the money. but the money for a new bridge may not be there.

            the most shovel-ready tend to be the most obvious and necessary- rebuilding schools and bridges.

            The cold passion for truth hunts in no pack. -Robinson Jeffers

            by Laurence Lewis on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:46:10 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Ahhh, (11+ / 0-)

              I can see that you haven't had much experience working in city planning.

              I'm not discounting that there are some possibilities. But its a documented fact that one of the things that slowed down the spending of Recovery Act $'s was the lack of shove-ready projects for immediate implementation.

              This is history we are aware of. So it needs to be taken into consideration.

              I think an infrastructure bank and other kinds of similar investments are sorely needed. President Obama has been saying so since the SOTU.

              But we shouldn't fool ourselves into thinking that - even if they can get legislative approval - that they'll have an immediate impact. Lets tell voters the truth this time so  we don't set them up for being disillusioned.

              •  I heard this last week... (13+ / 0-)

                from an engineer in my city.  Plans are in place - shovel-ready is another level and many projects as valuable as they are - did not go through the final planning stages, approvals, yada yada yada thus making them shovel-ready.  

                I for one am tired of pandering to perpetrators --- many of whom are opposed to any discussion however it comes. -- soothsayer99 DPK Caucus

                by princss6 on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:56:21 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  and at the very moment that they are (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  princss6

                  confirmed as shovel-ready, some professor at a state u somewhere requires a 2nd enviro study.

                  Yep, pardner was an engineer in city planning.

                  At one point in time it was almost amusing. Now it's just plain tragic.

                  "Show up. Pay attention. Tell the truth. And don't be attached to the results." -- Angeles Arrien

                  by Sybil Liberty on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:24:21 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

              •  another cheap personality attack (24+ / 0-)

                how unsurprising.

                and i know plenty about city planning. the city in which i live was transformed largely through the efforts of people i have known since childhood. and there are still plenty of shovel-ready projects around the country. even if some will be slower, some are ready.

                The cold passion for truth hunts in no pack. -Robinson Jeffers

                by Laurence Lewis on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:05:50 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

              •  I write for a national construction magazine (29+ / 0-)

                and have YEARS of experience with the construction industry...

                I watched the President of Vulcan Materials on CSPAN yesterday begging Congress to keep the gas tax in place and to allocate more money for highway repair and construction...

                New Mexico has already started to let secondary roads go back to gravel... no money to keep paving..

                Seattle is trying to avoid cutting bus routes (and laying off drivers) by implementing a $20/car plate fee...

                There are literally THOUSANDS of bridges across the US that are close to failure because the funds are not there to repair and replace..

                There are THOUSANDS of miles of US Interstate highways that need repair and upgrading to handle the increased loads

                State highway departments have plenty of projects on hold that could go to bid tomorrow if the funds are there... anyone who says shovel-ready is a myth soes not know what they are talking about.

                •  I'm really sorry (3+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  princss6, skohayes, dizzydean

                  if I didn't make myself clear.

                  I totally agree with your entire comment. Funds for infrastructure are desperately needed and HAVE to be approved...soon.

                  My comments have been more about the immediacy this diarist was talking about. I don't think its realistic to suggest to voters that money can be allocated for infrastructure and jobs will immediately appear. We should have learned that from our experience with the Recovery Act investments in infrastructure.

                  If we want immediate stimulus - we should be talking about other avenues.

                  That was the point I was putting up for discussion.

                  •  The Recovery Act resulted in jobs within MONTHS (16+ / 0-)

                    of passage...  

                    I personally spoke with highway department officials in WA, TX, AZ, FLA, NM and other states who told me those funds had allowed them to go forward with projects that had all the planning done but were on hold...

                    The FLA people sent me data showing that the stimulus money produced a temporary upward spike in ut construction employment... but it was like a band-aid on a cut artery...

                    •  I'm not suggesting (2+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      malharden, princss6

                      there were NO shovel-ready projects when the RA was implemented. But I do worry if we think an infrastructure bill will immediately create enough jobs that people will notice.

                      Its a piece of the puzzle that's clearly needed. But I also know that when the economy was tanking in 2009, one of the reasons there was not as much infrastructure spending is that it wouldn't have worked fast enough in the midst of the crisis.

                      Other stimulus measures are what is needed for that.

                      •  Cryp, the idea that shovel-ready did not exist... (8+ / 0-)

                        ...is a RW talking point.

                        They LOVE it.

                        The fact of the matter is that shovel-ready is not a literal term. It simply means projects that could go forward if funded. No, not all the jobs would be hard-hat/blue-collar, but so what?

                        If the ARRA funds went to the architect who could start planning to replace the bridge, that's still white collar jobs that would eventually be blue collar jobs, which should be fine.

                        The RW distorts this reality into a failure simply because shovel ready was not always literally "shovel ready".

                        " 'You Rock?!?' (But been through less gravel.) My mystique suggests battle. And, what have You?" -Common

                        by malharden on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 03:11:34 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  That's why (1+ / 0-)
                          Recommended by:
                          Christin

                          my original point has been to talk about immediacy.

                          I think its a mistake to go to voters saying that money for infrastructure will have an immediate affect on jobs.

                          That's what contributed to the RW talking point. There are actually some great infrastructure projects funded by the RA. But that impact has been spread out over time whereas other kinds of stimulus can have more immediate impact.

                          •  Urban planning jobs ARE immediate jobs. (6+ / 0-)

                            Yes, the immediate step is not to grab a shovel, but still there is a job that happens immediately.

                            Where there is lag, it often has to do with the fact that Federal Acquisition Regulations require fair competition for these Federal contracts. Nobody wants a bunch of no-bid contracts going to Haliburton to do all this recovery act work.

                            So, the $$ becomes available but most of the jobs can't possibly hit for 4-6 months, and the shovels cant possibly hit for 12 or more months.

                            THAT's one of the core challenges. That's the grain of truth to the non-shovel ready argument that the RW puts forth.

                            " 'You Rock?!?' (But been through less gravel.) My mystique suggests battle. And, what have You?" -Common

                            by malharden on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 03:38:01 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  There are jobs ready to BID today (8+ / 0-)

                            planning and engineering all done, permits issued..ready to go, but can't go to bid because the money is not there... do you have nay idea how many tens of thousands of miles of city streets and state and federal highways are in need of repair and upgrade NOW?

                            These projects, along with bridge repairs do NOT require the whole planning, design, engineering process to start from scratch.. they are ready to go as soon as a contractor can be awarded the job... and these projects pour money into small and medium size communities all over the country... and give jobs to true blue collar construction workers as well as project managers and engineers, support staff, equipment sales and repair people, etc etc... and all that money gets spent in local communities

                          •  Correct. I just made this point as well. (3+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            miguelmas1, hardart, triv33

                            As you, I work in this area and I know this for a fact.

                            "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

                            by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:37:17 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  I can't say that's incorrect. (0+ / 0-)

                            I have no idea what's bid-ready at the state level. I do have very direct knowledge of how hard it is to get a bid out at the Federal level.

                            One person's definition of bid-ready often is at odds with the legal department, the IG and the contract officer.

                            YMMV.

                            " 'You Rock?!?' (But been through less gravel.) My mystique suggests battle. And, what have You?" -Common

                            by malharden on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 07:47:17 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  State Highway Departments Can Move Quickly (0+ / 0-)

                            when they want to, especially if it is for repairs and upgrades to existing highways and bridges... most, if not all, have in house engineering departments that constantly work on planning for repairs and upgrades... if funds are available, they can and will move quickly to get projects out for bid and awarded...

                        •  As well as projects (4+ / 0-)
                          Recommended by:
                          miguelmas1, hardart, triv33, malharden

                          already started, and backlogged procurements.

                          "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

                          by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:36:30 PM PDT

                          [ Parent ]

                      •  Yes Cryptodira, they will notice (5+ / 0-)

                        because they will be employed.  Migualmas is correct because part of the Recovery Act had tough reporting requirements that demanded progress.  Also, projects that claimed to be 'shovel ready' and wasn't risked losing their grants to another project that was.

                        There are TONS of projects that have been designed that have been shelved because there is no money -- specifically on the highway side.  There are tons of transit projects that can't START design because there is no state local match.  

                        This affects the construction worker to the engineering firms and all of the periperial workers that supports intrastructure building.

                        It may be good for the auto repair industry though.

                        "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

                        by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:35:31 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                  •  Rebuilding infrastructure (8+ / 0-)

                    uses a lot of jobs before it gets to 'shovel-ready'.  Engineers, surveyors, appraisers, for example.

                •  Yes... (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Catesby, wader

                  agreed to all you say but recognizing the need does not meet the burden of classifying a project as shovel ready.  The way the engineer explained it is that even if they have plans, even if they went through approval, etc, the entire process has to start again.  He said he had plans in his desk but none were shovel-ready.  

                  A project is considered shovel ready if it has advanced to the stage that laborers may immediately be employed to start work. The term is used in reference to projects which are candidates for economic stimulus spending: money put into a shovel ready project will have a more immediate impact on the economy than money spent on a project on which a great deal of time must elapse for architecture, zoning, legal considerations or other such factors before labor can be deployed on it.
                  President Barack Obama used the term to describe projects for his stimulus plan on a Meet the Press interview [1] on December 6, 2008.[1]

                  I doubt all of the projects you mentioned for roads and bridges can employ laborers immediately.  The person that employed the term should have supplied this detail but...

                  I for one am tired of pandering to perpetrators --- many of whom are opposed to any discussion however it comes. -- soothsayer99 DPK Caucus

                  by princss6 on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:32:06 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  I don't what universe he lives in (8+ / 0-)

                    I have personally spoken to state highways directors across the country who have projects they have everything in place for except the money

                    He may be referring to NEW MAJOR projects... which can and do take years...

                    but there are plenty of repair and refurbish projects that are sitting and waiting for funds and can be up and running in MONTHS... put out for bid and awarded.. if the money is there

                    •  This is where (2+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      princss6, Odysseus

                      the city planning, not just the engineering,  comes in.

                      Listen to a story Jared Bernstein told Ezra Klein about it:

                      Very early on in the Recovery Act, the VP went to visit this bridge in Pennsylvania that was a good candidate for repair. He asked “how shovel-ready is it?” It happened that the engineer was there and said, “hold on, I’ve got the blueprints right over here in my car.” He actually got them and showed them to the VP.

                      They quickly got a transportation grant to fix the bridge but didn’t start construction for a few months because the local government didn’t want to have to divert traffic patterns until the summer.

                    •  In MONTHS... (2+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      wader, dizzydean

                      ISN'T shovel-ready.

                      I for one am tired of pandering to perpetrators --- many of whom are opposed to any discussion however it comes. -- soothsayer99 DPK Caucus

                      by princss6 on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 03:11:30 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  Better than years (8+ / 0-)

                        and months IS shovel ready when you consider that there is still a bid process to go through... it took about two to three months for the ARA funds to result in projects breaking ground... or pouring cement or laying asphalt..

                        There are a LOT of projects that could be going between three to six months from the time funds are available...

                        What else do you suggest that could literally tens of thousands of people to work with the resulting ripple effects on local and state economies?

                      •  For highway projects princss, yes (3+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        miguelmas1, hardart, triv33

                        it is.  Maybe shovel ready is a term not to use because many people simply don't understand the process.

                        I do.  It's what I do for a living.

                        "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

                        by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:45:04 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  This is the point... (0+ / 0-)

                          shovel-ready does not equal immediate - which is the question I had asked the diarist about that started all of this.

                          She goes to great lengths in this diary to talk about how we need jobs immediately. I asked what ideas she had about that.

                          To be honest - I'm not sure the government can create jobs immediately, but I was open to the possibility of ideas. I don't think infrastructure development fits that bill. It is certainly crucially important for the government to invest in infrastructure - both from a jobs development and needs perspective. But we need to be clear with the public that any of these things will take some time - some a few months and most will be years.

                          •  And my point to you is that (2+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            miguelmas1, triv33

                            'shovel ready' for the industry that I work in -- is measured as immediate, given the typical time it takes to get projects from the planning stage to a stage of construction.

                            I don't expect for you to understand this if you don't understand how the industry I work in works.

                            However as a layman's term 'shovel ready' may not be a good one because the layman takes it literally as meaning tomorrow and NO construction project -- even privately funded ones can move that fast.

                            However you are as wrong as you can be about intrastructure jobs because you don't look at the sustainability over the long term with such jobs in this industry, given how long it takes for them to move from the planning stage to construction completion.

                            The GOP used to understand this as well, given that they have usually been at the forefront of pushing intrastructure projects because for a politican, it's the one thing that a voter can see as something that government has paid for that directly impacts them.

                            "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

                            by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:27:38 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  I'm afraid (0+ / 0-)

                            you're finding disagreement where there is none.

                            I agree totally that the word means different things inside the industry than it does outside. I'm simply saying that we can't promise what voters think of as immediate jobs through implementation in infrastructure projects.

                          •  Actually we do disagree. (1+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            triv33

                            Because the voters who work in this industry understands this, and so does the politicans.  Also voters who don't can see their money at work, so they do get it as well.

                            We totally disagree about the effects of intrastructure building.

                            "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

                            by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 08:14:48 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  I never disagreed (1+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            princss6

                            about the importance of infrastructure building. That's what you're missing. I think its critical and I recognize that most of it is very visible to the voters.

                            The entire discussion started about what would create jobs immediately - from the voters perspective. We need to be clear with the public that when it comes to infrastructure - the jobs they will see will take from months to years to develop.

                    •  I see the figures from my state. (4+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      miguelmas1, hardart, Dallasdoc, triv33

                      The plans are bid ready.  The backlog is ridiculous now.

                      "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

                      by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:43:29 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  My understanding... (0+ / 0-)

                        is that bid ready is not shovel-ready.  I'm sure there is something at whitehouse.gov that outlines exactly the particulars.

                        I for one am tired of pandering to perpetrators --- many of whom are opposed to any discussion however it comes. -- soothsayer99 DPK Caucus

                        by princss6 on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:05:28 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  We have considered bid ready (3+ / 0-)
                          Recommended by:
                          miguelmas1, triv33, princss6

                          as shovel ready princss.

                          Contractors in construction for the most part hires out of the union halls.  When there is plenty of work, it doesn't matter who gets the bid -- these workers are gonna get picked to work on a job.  Construction workers understand how the process works.  When their chances of landing a long term construction gig increases, they are in a better place.

                          Trust me, they get what shovel ready means to them.

                          "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

                          by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:33:52 PM PDT

                          [ Parent ]

                  •  I know from my experience (6+ / 0-)

                    on the bridge they are rebuilding with stimulus money outside my farm.  I've learned a lot about the whole process.

                    One aspect is they have to move the bridge slightly.  So they have to purchase land from me, and my neighbor.  They also have to negotiate to rent land for a emporary easement.

                    They're not going to do this and fork out money to property owners (they rent for 3 years standard), unless they know they have the funding to continue the rest of the project.

                    And it takes time to negotiate a price.  In my case it's pretty simple - they have to move fences, my sign and give me temporary access.  In a lot of other cases, it gets more complicated when people actually have to move out.  But even in my case, it's taken 3 months since they decided how much land they wanted, and they haven't made me an offer yet.

                    So yes, you are correct.  It makes no sense to have projects sitting around "shovel-ready"

                    •  There are a LOT of bridges that need REPAIRS (8+ / 0-)

                      and upgrades...

                      others are like your case

                      There are a LOT of projects that would go to bid tomorrow and be awarded within a month or two (I know how it works because I also consult on projects going to bid)...

                      That would put money into communities within a period of months... meanwhile the longer term projects could go forward, allowing contractors to know there will be future work, meaning they can make permanent rehires of project managers, engineers, and other staff as well as commit to equipment purchases...

                  •  It depends. (3+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    miguelmas1, TiaRachel, triv33

                    On how the local governments are set up.  I don't view 'shovel ready' as just projects ready to bid.  It puts designers back to work.  

                    Also they don't just 'start again'.  They revise the plans based on current conditions and revise the cost estimates.  Then they put the projects on the street to bid.

                    But more procurements means more people at the local level that can be hired to handle the contracts.  It's not just the construction worker.

                    But specific to those workers and HIGHWAY projects -- hell yes.  They are ready to be let right now.

                    "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

                    by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:42:22 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                •  I have a patient (5+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  miguelmas1, TiaRachel, Uberbah, JesseCW, triv33

                  ... a civil engineer who has supervised two of the biggest public transportation projects in NM over the past 7 years.  He has a multi-million dollar project ready to go,  to fix the biggest transportation bottleneck in the state's biggest city.  The city has already told him he would be waved through if he could only get the money together.  He didn't get it from the stimulus, and now has no idea where it will come from.  

                  Excuses don't get things done.

                  Don't tell me what you believe. Tell me what you do and I'll tell you what you believe. --Meteor Blades

                  by Dallasdoc on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 05:20:46 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Projects Like This All Around the Country (3+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Dallasdoc, Uberbah, triv33

                    They put LOTS of people to work... and keep lots of small business afloat...

                    and help families make house payments, buy homes, buy cars, etcetcetc

                    Lots of them are Union... if the contractor is AGC, the project is Union... and a lot of highway and bridge projects are done by AGC contractors....

              •  I was told by a bureaucrat that the stimulus act (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                princss6

                had a lot of new reporting requirements and restrictions in it, apparently because the then-new Obama administration was making extra sure the money went where it was supposed to go.  That slowed down the start of a number of projects that had already been approved (under earlier requirements/ restrictions).  That aspect of the situation could be handled with more assurance if there were a second stimulus.

                •  Well, I can tell you this (0+ / 0-)

                  Yes the reporting requirements are more onus because there was an emphasis placed on transparency.  

                  However the reporting requirements would not hold up projects that are ready to go.  The grantees receiving the grants who aren't moving their projects is usually because their projects weren't ready to go at the local level.

                  In our agency, about 80% of the funds have been expended already.

                  A second stimulus or just the reauthorization of the Transportation Bill would provide a non-stop flow of funding for projects.  This piecemealing stuff that we are forced to deal with because Congress is using continuing resolutions is the real problem.

                  "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

                  by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:45:56 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

              •  If federal $$ was offered w/an expiration date... (0+ / 0-)

                that might "cut through some red tape", or prod the process along.

                Feds to State:  We'll pay 60% of this project.  You have (fill in the blank) months to make it happen.  After that date, the offer is rescinded.

                "In a nation ruled by swine, all pigs are upwardly mobile." Hunter S. Thompson

                by Keith930 on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:00:09 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  Actually the stimulus funding (0+ / 0-)

                  for the transportation sector has a sunset provision of 2015.

                  "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

                  by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:47:10 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

            •  water mains and gas lies are wreaking havoc (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Laurence Lewis, TiaRachel, cameoanne

              all over the country those are things that could also be done fairly quickly

              To sin by silence when they should protest makes cowards of men~~ Abraham Lincoln

              by Tanya on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:27:14 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  I have a new bridge being redone (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              billlaurelMD

              with stimulus money right outside the front of my farm.

              It's taken months already with surveyors and engineers, then having to buy land from residents (me), including appraisals etc.

              They are not going to get started on it until next summer.  None of these things move quickly.  But although it will be a while until an actual shovel hits dirt, it has provided employment for a few people in my area so far.

            •  Thank you Laurence, shovel ready is something (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Laurence Lewis

              the right wing promotes as bringing the "bacon" home.

              However, they have this quirk.  They take the money while  claiming that they oppose federal projects.  Hypocrites are a dime a dozen in Washington.

          •  the other big problem with the recovery act (5+ / 0-)

            was that it was mostly tax cuts which helped corporations run up huge cash accounts to the point that Apple now has more cash than the US govt

            To sin by silence when they should protest makes cowards of men~~ Abraham Lincoln

            by Tanya on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:21:05 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Does your understanding (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              malharden

              of math indicate that 1/3 equals "mostly?" Because roughly 1/3 of the RA was tax cuts.

              I also think that if you look into specifics, the majority of the tax cuts went to individuals, small businesses, and companies developing green energy projects.

          •  one thing i can is they are not monolithic (0+ / 0-)

            if so someone whould have asked the ? if the pres. is supposed to do everything what are they getting paid for

          •  don't worry about it if any of the baggers get in (0+ / 0-)

            office you can kiss all that goodby and i don't know where you live at but perhaps all the history books could be changed like in texas to rewrite them without anything black in them

          •  Shovel-ready infrastructure jobs (0+ / 0-)

            ...financing the $1T in deferred maintenance of existing infrastructure.  There are oodles of shovel ready projects there; send the money directly to the municipalities, counties, and infrastructure agencies.  Don't get it hung up in the politics of state governments.  Except for those projects that the states does themselves.

            Another way of quickly putting people back to work---backfilling state government budget deficits to allow them to rehire laid off workers.

            50 states, 210 media market, 435 Congressional Districts, 3080 counties, 192,480 precincts

            by TarheelDem on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:53:33 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  That's what my neighborhood needs-more than (17+ / 0-)

          patent reform or trade deals. We need to hear on the street "so & so is hiring"-even if "so & so" is the govt.

          Meteor Blades seems to do an outstanding job of community moderation despite the abject failure to be perfect.

          by catilinus on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:36:21 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  You institute "revenue sharing" immediately (0+ / 0-)

          sending money to hard-pressed states, counties and cities so that they do not have to fire teachers, firefighters, police officers, librarians, social workers, etc. and maybe they can hire some back who have been laid off.

      •  a WPA type program would put people to work (7+ / 0-)

        immediately but that means govt rather than private sector job creation. this is what worked through the carter administration but has been abandoned ever since. Now dems don't even talk about such things even though these programs were historically implemented in both dem and repub administrations during recessions. it was the accepted practice since FDR through carter

        To sin by silence when they should protest makes cowards of men~~ Abraham Lincoln

        by Tanya on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:26:01 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  For every dollar that goes into (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Tanya, triv33

          direct government jobs, six dollars of private sector job growth are created.  Governments need materials from the private sector, equipment and maintenance (or maintenance supplies) from the private sector.   The whole idea of government jobs was to prime the pump (that's FDR's term) for private sector job growth.

          The Carter administration was hampered by Nixon's CETA program that used scads of middlemen contractors for training, placement, and supervision.  And in many cases, these private sector services were beset by fraud.

          50 states, 210 media market, 435 Congressional Districts, 3080 counties, 192,480 precincts

          by TarheelDem on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:00:08 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  How about a plan to stop the lay-offs of (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        lineatus, TiaRachel, cameoanne

        desperately needed personnel, such as teachers, firefighters, public health nurses, cops, mental health professionals, librarians, janitors, social workers, etc. etc.?
           

        "We the People of the United States...." -U.S. Constitution

        by elwior on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:26:40 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  The best way to do that (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          elwior

          ...would be for the Fed to borrow the money and either grant it directly  to school districts, municipalities, counties, and states. or loan it at low interest and generous terms.  This would allow those entities to backfill their budgets that are out of balance.  That could very well be $1T well spent that would come back as income tax revenue.

          50 states, 210 media market, 435 Congressional Districts, 3080 counties, 192,480 precincts

          by TarheelDem on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:03:06 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  CCC type work (0+ / 0-)

        Something like the CCC durning the FDR recovery.  I asked my mother what the CCC did and she joked that they sent men into the forest to rake up the leaves.  Something like this that starts paying for work today.

        •  The CCC (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          JesseCW

          ...built the Blue Ridge Parkway
          ...built significant sections of the Appalachian Trail
          ...built state parks
          ...built national park buildings

          Most of the work was felling trees, turning them into logs for building, laying rock walls, building roads in areas that had not yet been cleared.  Building tunnels.

          To call it raking leaves really is insulting the incredible national and state assets that these guys built and folks use now without knowing how they got there.

          50 states, 210 media market, 435 Congressional Districts, 3080 counties, 192,480 precincts

          by TarheelDem on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:07:14 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  passive aggressive, much? (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Razorblade, cameoanne

        Obama's proposals for jobs is more bad trade deals, more tax cuts for jobs off-shored jobs,  tax cuts for billionaires job creators,  another war or two, Haliburton is hiring in Afghanistan I hear, and maybe if we finally get rid of Medicare, Social Security and other middle class programs and services, we can drive up the demand for cat food.   Those would be good solid factory jobs.  

        With Democrats like Obama, who needs Republicans.

        by dkmich on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 05:14:44 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  I would love to hear any propositions, including (0+ / 0-)

        your own cryptodira.

        •  I said up above (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          foucaultspendulum

          that I don't think the government can create jobs immediately, but I was open to ideas folks have.

          I actually agree with some folks that giving/lending money to the states would be the fastest way to actually create/sustain jobs. The problem is that I think that is probably the least politically feasible thing to get through this Congress.

          And one more time, just to be clear, I think federal investment in infrastructure is critical. Its just that it won't create jobs immediately and requires a long-term commitment if we're really going to get it done.

    •  We are not monolithic (12+ / 0-)

      and we don't all agree with this diary... we do not all wait for some sage to come along to say the one thing our conclusions have been set to and go spout it along as gospel.

      We don't want to hear about trade agreements, but said trade agreement might be what's helping with American exports at the very moment when our economy and dollar is falling.

      We don't want to hear about patents, but said patents will be responsible for the development of manufacturing or green jobs that will come down the line.  I mean, the new batteries being built here in the U.S., in Michigan nonetheless are from those same patents which are now being used to help bring Back Detroit.  But yeah, the president doesn't care about Detroit, even though he single handedly saved the industry that kept Detroit Alive in the first place.  

      No, We don't care about that.  We want the president to march here and see the devastation caused by previous administrations including Bill clinton who ushered in those initial trade agreements.  But oh no, We were so in love with bill clinton the saying goes.  Bill clinton could go into harlem, detroit and so on because he was the first "black president".  We gave him a pass, we gave the Bush's a pass when they didn't come to our neighborhoods.  But now that President Obama is here and he happens to be black, he has the obligation to come right?  Just like Tavis and Cornell feel the need for a poverty tour when they made no such request under the previous admin.  I wonder why?  Why is it that everyone is coming out at this moment huh?  

      So let's please stop acting like the President doesn't understand the plight of what's happening in the black community, or the Latino community.  The man was a community organizer in those exact neighborhoods and i'm sure understands the workings of those communities better than most on this site.  

      Frankly, I'm not one that's gonna ask the president to focus on a bill that effects only the AA community, that's not what I elected him for.  

      But if all we want is for the president to come and take a meaningless condescending tour for the sake of our feelings, without the likelihood that Congress will actually do it's job, then I have no more to say.  We direct our anger at the President and allow legislators to scream and yell about things not getting done when a) THAT'S THEIR DAMN JOB to pass such laws and b) they voted against measures that would have helped with jobs and other issues in the first place.  But no...we don't hold them accountable, because afterall..the President has Law making authority under Article 1 of the constitution...

      I'm curious to see how vocal these same legislatures were at criticizing the economic policies of Bush, or Clinton...I'm curious to see if they were so opposed those same policies that brought us this mess as they are to the President today.  I highly doubt it.

      •  Hear. Hear. (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        hardart, princss6

        And I couldn't add to this if I tried.

        "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

        by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:49:12 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Rec 10000 times. (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        princss6, seanwright, smoothnmellow

        My sentiment exactly. If not for my own possibilities, I would wish the president forgo a second term, take his family back to normal life and go fight a cause in some other country that would appreciate his efforts.

        This country doesn't deserve him. I do and many others who feel like I do, but the rest?

        Let the Republicans rule all branches again.  Only then will people who are hammering him would see all the good things he has done and are trying to do, but it will be too late.

        •  I feel like this (5+ / 0-)

          During my angry phases when I read shit on this site that drive me beyond the crazy cliff..but then reality slaps me in the face and I realize how fucked up this country already is under just 1 year of republican control of ONE chamber...imagine if they had all THREE?!  This is what astounds me...how quickly so called liberals and progressives have been quick to dismiss the administration from the very beginning for problems that had been brewing for more than just the 8 years under Bush.  

          Alas, these are the same people who claim to be political geniuses, yet have no fucking sense of reality of politics.  Krugman for instance, the supposed political genius asks for proposals that have no chance of passing congress, yet bitches and groans that the president is wasting time not effecting policies.  Hello dumbfuck!  You want him to waste time proposing bullshit measures that will waste time, but then attack him when he actually presents measures that will actually see the congressional floor.  

          Its so sad that some on this site claiming to be progressive have forgotten that citizen participation is the ultimate responsibility required for our republic to work...that's the difference between today and the movements of the early to mid 20th centuries...if people cared about something, they walked, marched, attacked the source of the angst, but through non violence.  Today, they bitch and moan behind keyboards, sign meaningless petitions, take the words of paid columnists and hacks as gospel without doing research and demand change when they themselves refuse to do the work required of a citizen.  Citizens fight for their rights, they don't wait on others to lead them or tell them what to fight for...

          •  Let me correct that for you.... (0+ / 0-)
            Krugman for instance, the supposed political economic genius asks for proposals that have no chance of passing congress, yet bitches and groans that the president is wasting time not effecting policies.  Hello dumbfuck silly man!

            Other than that, tipped and rec'd.

            One million times.

            "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

            by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:05:46 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  Word. (0+ / 0-)

          Sometimes I'd rather have him as Senator than the one we got in his place...

          I often wondered why in the world would he want to subject himself and his family to this mess.

          "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

          by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:50:34 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  One Question (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        edwardssl, navajo
        We don't want to hear about patents, but said patents will be responsible for the development of manufacturing or green jobs that will come down the line.

        For you and everyone else that has said this since the President included the patent reform bill in his speech the other day:

        Have you actually read this bill? I have (stuck at home will do that to you.)  If you have not, before repeating this statement I URGE you to read the actual bill.  Please.

        If you don't stand for something, you will go for anything. Visit Maat's Feather

        by shanikka on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 05:15:43 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  I'd like to share a portion of FDR's SOTU address (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      triv33

      from 1944, often referred to as the Economic Bill of Rights:  

      We have come to a clear realization of the fact that true individual freedom cannot exist without economic security and independence. "Necessitous men are not free men." People who are hungry and out of a job are the stuff of which dictatorships are made.

         In our day these economic truths have become accepted as self-evident. We have accepted, so to speak, a second Bill of Rights under which a new basis of security and prosperity can be established for all regardless of station, race, or creed.

         Among these are:

         The right to a useful and remunerative job in the industries or shops or farms or mines of the Nation;

         The right to earn enough to provide adequate food and clothing and recreation;

         The right of every farmer to raise and sell his products at a return which will give him and his family a decent living;

         The right of every businessman, large and small, to trade in an atmosphere of freedom from unfair competition and domination by monopolies at home or abroad;

         The right of every family to a decent home;

         The right to adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health;

         The right to adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness, accident, and unemployment;

         The right to a good education.

         All of these rights spell security.
         And after this war is won we must be prepared to move forward, in the implementation of these rights, to new goals of human happiness and well-being.

      "We the People of the United States...." -U.S. Constitution

      by elwior on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:23:13 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Seeing African American's as a"monolith" has value (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Agathena

      It obscures economic policies.

      You aren't really saying anything that I did not say repeatedly before I just stopped saying it to the bad faith actors who want to use race as a shield to protect the party rather than address economic issues.

      Is the point to convince them to care? On some level, they do care about these issues. But, it is not their top priority.

      How will telling them something as obvious as African-Americans aren't a monolith change their tactics?

      I mean those who are using race to deflect from economic policies are not going to stop doing so.

      You know that, right?

  •  Frankly (71+ / 0-)

    I'd just like to be able to see us as Black people once again be able to publicly articulate all of our concerns without running the risk that we, our mama, our daddy and every public Black person who has ever bothered to criticize President Obama to date will get dismissed and personally dissed (and at times of giving aid and comfort to the enemy) for doing so by folks who 90% of the time make nary an statement about the specific policy being discussed to accompany it.  There is another diary up on this tour and sure enough it took someone 45 seconds to throw Maxine Waters under the bus.  No discussion about whether Waters is right, wrong, and definitely no discussion about WHY.  Just "she don't speak for me."

    This is a pattern at this point, and it hurts my heart.

    If you don't stand for something, you will go for anything. Visit Maat's Feather

    by shanikka on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 12:26:51 PM PDT

    •  Well, the clips are profound. (33+ / 0-)

      There is anger out there and for anyone of color who decides there is not, do it at your peril.  Keep ignoring these folks and they just won't SHOW UP TO THE POLLS.

      •  I've Already Seen It (50+ / 0-)

        I started trying to raise the alarm in mid-2010 about what I was hearing here in the 'Hood, and from relatives in the 'Hood, and the likely impact it would have in November 2010 in terms of folks showing up -- folks who LOVE President Obama.  Lord knows, I tried.  So did others who are even more out there, like Meteor Blades.

        Given the reactions to those who did try and raise this alarm, you'd have thought we'd called someone's mama a stank ho, or been previously diagnosed with a psychotic disorder because of an inability to reality check.

        Well, we weren't wrong.  Folks are still trying to pretend differently, with the oft-told lie that progressives were the reason we got rolled, instead of the disappearance of the level of voter engagement in the youth and African Americans that was absolutely necessary to send President Obama to the White House in 2008.

        Given current conditions, I suspect it will be same old same old between now and 2012, that's how pessimistic I am about folks actually realizing that those who are raising concerns are coming at this with just as much love and concern for our people right now as those who have their reasons for staying shut, such that folks need to stop trying to "shove out" and make "other" ANY of us.  Whether they like hearing what they have to say or not.  Because it's not just about talk talking, it's about trying to find a way to re-elect the President.  And right now, we're on a serious trajectory in the opposite direction if what I see happening keeps happening.  Folks are NOT planning to show up.  We can lecture them all we want, but the real issue is:  can we make the case why they should?

        I don't believe the answer to that question is yes if we keep trying to squash uncomfortable voices in our own community as if they are the enemy.

        Sorry.  That's a vent.  I shouldn't even be on here right now; my stress levels have been creeping up around here the last couple of days.

        If you don't stand for something, you will go for anything. Visit Maat's Feather

        by shanikka on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 12:38:35 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I have been told that one reason why people don't. (19+ / 0-)

          ...want to "strut around for white folks", is because they don't "want to give some fool the green light".

          Y'all having been giving folks the full view.  It's just "poor me, I can't diss President Obama without any pushback". Well there is a good reason for that that isn't even on the radar of this site's dominant demographic.

          I know I was surprised to encounter this feeling as heavily as I have. I hear it in homes that I have visited a few times.

          I was asked a good question once, "why can't Obama be mediocre?" The gentleman, who was very active withe NAACP, said, "son, we just want him to make it through this alive and not embarrass us".

          Now that is not a perspective I've seen here at DK, but I think when complaining about getting pushback from criticism, one should be completely honest and expand the possibilities as why that might be the case, even if that means you don't get applause.

          "There is nothing more dreadful than the habit of doubt. Doubt separates people. It is a poison that disintegrates friendships and breaks up pleasant relations. It is a thorn that irritates and hurts; it is a sword that kills.".. Buddha

          by sebastianguy99 on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:37:12 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  The same message is being sent by the (9+ / 0-)

          Latino community:

          Latinos To Obama: Change On Immigration Or Else

          http://www.huffingtonpost.com/...

          And many of the unions are sending the same message.

          Union Enthusiasm for Obama Re-Election Fades, AFL-CIO’s Chief Trumka Says

          http://www.bloomberg.com/...

          And so are the baby boomers.

          http://www.commondreams.org/...

          You were spot on with this statement:

          Because it's not just about talk talking, it's about trying to find a way to re-elect the President.  And right now, we're on a serious trajectory in the opposite direction if what I see happening keeps happening.  Folks are NOT planning to show up.  We can lecture them all we want, but the real issue is:  can we make the case why they should?

          The lectures and vindictiveness being spewed by his followers on this site is really hurting Obama.

          And I really agree with this:

          ...those who are raising concerns are coming at this with just as much love and concern for our people right now as those who have their reasons for staying shut

          Obama's reelection chances are not looking good at the moment, and the Democratic Party is in jeopardy of splitting.  I can almost guarantee that the 2012 Democratic Convention will be contentious and that is not good for Democrats...period.

        •  Is this how you see it, Shanikka? (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          vcmvo2, soothsayer99, CaliSista
          I don't believe the answer to that question is yes if we keep trying to squash uncomfortable voices in our own community as if they are the enemy.

          Btw, aren't you at least a teeny bit uncomfortable by your new found friends? You know that a lot of them are no friends of black people.

          Obama/Biden 2012!

          by JoanMar on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:48:21 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Exactly what I've been seing (5+ / 0-)
          the disappearance of the level of voter engagement in the youth and African Americans that was absolutely necessary to send President Obama to the White House in 2008.

          A lot of older people are upset, to be sure. But many of them are still engaged enough that they might show up for the next election. On the other hand, pretty much every young person I know (both black and white), who last time were super excited about Obama, are now... "Whatever."  The same ones who 3 years ago were excitedly rounding up their friends and going out to see Obama speak (sometimes driving for hours), now wouldn't even bother to go see him if he came to town here.

          Whether you're a big Obama supporter or not, seeing kids lose their passion SO QUICKLY is very, very sad.

          "Any dictator would admire the uniformity and obedience of the U.S. media." -- Noam Chomsky

          by ratmach on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 05:38:08 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  What's new about that? (0+ / 0-)

            Youth generally don't stay focused on one thing for too long anyway. Always been this way.  That is why pols concentrate on those they know can be counted upon to vote.

            Having said that, the campaign season has yet to kick off and I suspect that we will see a build up to regarner their attention over time.

            "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

            by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:11:42 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  Multiple times I have posted here (24+ / 0-)

        that when people do not think neither side cares about their plight, they are less likely to vote period .  I believe there will be a drop off in voter participation in 2012 with the biggest drop off in voters will be among the youth of all races and secondly among minority voters.

        It is sad because those groups were among the President's biggest supporters in the last election and are also the ones suffering the most in this jobs crisis.  No, not just sad, but unconscionable that we all allowing so many people, particularly those hardest hit to suffer even more by not doing anything.

        For the Administration to suddenly think they  can pivot TO jobs after negotiating away any increases in revenues for the next decade in the non-crisis deficit reduction is unrealistic.  The Administration has painted itself  into a corner.  

        To develop a job programs that actually works and gets people in to decent living wage jobs is going to take a massive investment on the part of the federal government.  Nothing else will begin to create the numbers of jobs so desperately needed in this country.  But the Administration has left itself without a means to garner adequate funding for such a program.

        Meanwhile huge swaths of our population are suffering and still there is no real jobs program.  

        BTW, tipped and recommended.

        The United States is not just losing its capacity to do great things. It's losing its soul.--Bob Herbert. gulfgal98's corollary- Our soul is gone.

        by gulfgal98 on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:14:42 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Well, Slim.. the people of (0+ / 0-)

        color has a candidate in Herman Cain.  Perhaps they should be out there supporting him.

    •  What is the point of having even partial freedom (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      MikePhoenix

      and equality if the condition on it is that one may never use it when it counts?

    •  You and Tavis have a ball n/t (8+ / 0-)

      "I honor the place in you where Spirit lives I honor the place in you which is of Love, of Truth, of Light, of Peace, when you are in that place in you, and I am in that place in me, then we are One." Namaste friends!

      by Adept2u on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 12:58:06 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  its also a pattern that diaries like this are (10+ / 0-)

      tossed up in folks faces like "SEE!?" just to prove a point.

      which hurts my head.

      YMMV.

      besides which, black folk criticizing the president has never been verboten on this site.  witness the diarist.

      I love you like cooked food, shanikka but this whole "we can't even criticize obama without being thrown under the bus" is overwrought.  straight up.

      "I'm Black and I'm proud, I'm ready, I'm hype, plus I'm amped/ most of my heroes don't appear on no stamp!" ~Carlton Ridenhour

      by mallyroyal on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:32:02 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Sorry to not satisfy you. (17+ / 0-)

        But this has been all over TELEVISION.  Facts be DAMNED, when it come to President Obama.  Anything critical, shove it under the rug immediately, must not harm any image.   Geez, wake up folks.  People are mad, angry and they have every right to be.

        •  first of all miss "get over it" you act like (9+ / 0-)

          you're telling me something I don't know.

          but seriously, the folks in MY hood who talk like you talk like that about ALL politicians.  and cops.  anyone in 'authority'.

          the POLITICAL minded folks I know, even the ones who only follow politics a little, aren't on some "the prez is fuckin up" stuff.

          and maxine waters don't move nothin over this way.  chaka fattah does.

          "I'm Black and I'm proud, I'm ready, I'm hype, plus I'm amped/ most of my heroes don't appear on no stamp!" ~Carlton Ridenhour

          by mallyroyal on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:44:36 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  I can't speak for your neighborhood (4+ / 0-)

            But I know a lot of those same kinds of folks, I am one sometimes.  Those were some of the most important people for Obama's election in 08.  They believed, and that's how the GOTV was so good.  I don't know that there's anything to be done to reverse that at this point, but denying that there is disappointment certainly doesn't help.

            I refuse to represent my political beliefs using numbers. It isn't accurate, nor is it helpful. But I'm around a -10 on both scales.

            by AoT on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 03:30:31 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  how am I denying there's disappointment when I (6+ / 0-)

              comment here everyday lol?  

              this is what I don't get:  I relay MY anecdotal experience and what... it weighs less that slim's or something?  I could characterize your statement as 'denying' whatever I wanted to, wouldn't make it true, necessarily?

              as to another thing you said:  

              They believed, and that's how the GOTV was so good.

              so what are we saying here?  he 'conned' folks or what?  we're blaming him for what, exactly?  the tendency of the American public to not read or listen and to impute whatever they want on whatever anyone says?  I was active in the campaign too.  I didn't vote for him for the primary or the general while wearing blinders or under some misapprehension.

              for God's sake the first thing I ever saw from him was a speech about... wait for it... BIPARTISANSHIP.  the frickin '04 convention ring a bell?  come ON with the "he fooled people" stuff (if thats what you were implying.  I've seen it said enough that I've given the matter some thought).

              "I'm Black and I'm proud, I'm ready, I'm hype, plus I'm amped/ most of my heroes don't appear on no stamp!" ~Carlton Ridenhour

              by mallyroyal on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:10:33 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Maybe deny was too strong (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                mallyroyal

                I was specifically responding to when you said this:

                but seriously, the folks in MY hood who talk like you talk like that about ALL politicians.  and cops.  anyone in 'authority'.

                It sounded to me like you were saying that these were people who would never be satisfied, and maybe some of them wouldn't, but a lot of them didn't start like they, the ended up there for reasons.

                Also you are, unfortunately, right when you say that "the tendency of the American public to not read or listen and to impute whatever they want on whatever anyone says" was responsible and not Obama.  It's hard to admit that sometimes because I was one of the people who did exactly that.  People were fooled alright, but more by themselves than by the campaign.

                I tend to reserve most of my bile for congress, Dem and GOP, as they've had a lot more to do with the problem than did Obama.  Actually, given the circumstances he's doing a decent job.

                I refuse to represent my political beliefs using numbers. It isn't accurate, nor is it helpful. But I'm around a -10 on both scales.

                by AoT on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 05:43:18 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  Not to go all Bill Cosby up in here, but (3+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  mallyroyal, soothsayer99, princss6

                  there are some folk in the hood who aren't satisfied with anything for the reasons that Dr. Cosby has pointed out in the past and yeah, it wasn't received very well either.

                  But Mal is right.  The Black Nationalist sector, for example, is never satisfied with anything and it's generally because they only are concerned with the needs of Black folk, so yeah.

                  I can see them being pretty fed up.

                  But then they always are.  Understandably so in some cases...

                  "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

                  by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:32:26 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

        •  This is true... (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          AoT, MikePhoenix

          Anything critical, shove it under the rug immediately, must not harm any image.

          The question is...why?

          I ran across something today that says it better than I ever could:

          One way of thinking about Black suffering under the Obama Presidency is to view it as revolving around the axis of craving, harmful speech, and pride. First, we crave middle class visibility and acceptance from whites. This is because a paradoxical form of invisibility has burdened black people since their arrival in North America: they are radically unseen and their full humanity is ignored yet, the same time, their bodies are hyper-policed and deeply feared.

          [...]

          It is important to remember that the craving for acceptance, like any addiction, is a form of suffering. It is simply an intense desire to be embraced by others. Fastening our need for acceptance on external sources diminishes our capacity to be free. Obama, and the worldwide attention he gets, cannot heal the suffering produced by the long-standing conditions of black invisibility. This suffering is attended to by the mindful embrace of self and the fundamental recognition that Jesse Jackson employed as his mantra in the 1970’s: “I am, somebody.”

          http://www.urbancusp.com/...

          I have a few quibbles- I would call that description in the first paragraph one of black blind faith toward Obama, rather than "black suffering", and I don't think it's as widespread as he seems to think it is. I think it's a good description of Obama's most avid black followers, which isn't synonymous with "black Obama supporters"

          •  Interesting Quotes (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            navajo

            I'll read the whole thing and see what I think, but thanks for the link.

            If you don't stand for something, you will go for anything. Visit Maat's Feather

            by shanikka on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 03:06:09 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  let me ask you something: (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              princss6, soothsayer99, Robinswing

              would you understand if I was as absolutely offended at those "interesting quotes" as you seem to have been by some things that have been said to you in the past couple days?

              like... it staggers me that you'd not comment on the meme that someone like myself (for instance... I'll let others speak for THEMselves) behaves the way I do because of some need for acceptance from whites.

              SERIOUSLY?  do I have to spell out how toxic that BS is?  I can, if I must.

              (and I don't want to hear this wasn't meant to apply to me.  parent up twice from that comment.)

              "I'm Black and I'm proud, I'm ready, I'm hype, plus I'm amped/ most of my heroes don't appear on no stamp!" ~Carlton Ridenhour

              by mallyroyal on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:16:08 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  I Haven't Read It Yet (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                navajo, Plantsmantx

                Honestly, Mally, I haven't read the linked article yet.  That's why I said that I appreciated the link - because now I can.  

                How I feel about the quotes is dependent upon putting them back in their original context, if I'm making any sense.  When I said "interesting" I really did mean "interesting" - but that's because I got my undergrad degree in psych with an emphasis on Black Psych and therefore all this type of analysis is "interesting" to me.  That doesn't mean I agree with what the linked author might have to say once these snippets are put back in context or believe their is an sufficient foundation for them in the context they appeared.  I will say that at least one of the ideas underlying in the quotes the poster used was first articulated by Black psychologists from one of the several schools of thought more than 50 years ago.

                But I always try and understand why people feel why they do - you and everyone else.

                If you don't stand for something, you will go for anything. Visit Maat's Feather

                by shanikka on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:53:26 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

          •  Oh yeah (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            mallyroyal, soothsayer99

            I just crave for attention and respect so I don't say anything if I feel it's being threatened.

            If that was written on a piece of paper that I had in front of me now, it would be balled up in my circular file.

            "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

            by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:36:34 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  No. What is damnable is (0+ / 0-)

          the idea that you can convince someone else to agree to your interpretation of the facts.  There is no need to shove anything under the rug.

          But be straight on what folk are mad about.  They are mad because the economy sucks and is not getting better.

          "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

          by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:26:29 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Its funny in a diary where a black person (8+ / 0-)

        criticizes Obama we have someone claiming black people can't criticize Obama.   I mean, since when have black people been muzzled?  Did Obama do this?  If anything, the views of black people, especially those that disagree with Obama, are elevated.   I think its certain that black people on this site, and in my neighborhood, won't accept insults of Obama.  And black people certainly don't want to hear talk of primarying Obama (or Clinton in 96 or Gore in 2000).  But if I say, we need some more fucking jobs in this neighborhood, no one is rushing to run me out of town.  The idea that black voters are somehow stiffling criticism of Obama from other black people is frankly ludicrous.  

        If you talk issues people (including black people) will listen.  

        •  (gives you a bullhorn) say this one more time! (7+ / 0-)

          'cause they don't hear you though:

          Its funny in a diary where a black person criticizes Obama we have someone claiming black people can't criticize Obama.

          "I'm Black and I'm proud, I'm ready, I'm hype, plus I'm amped/ most of my heroes don't appear on no stamp!" ~Carlton Ridenhour

          by mallyroyal on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:50:06 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Actually (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          billlaurelMD, 4kedtongue, navajo

          That wasn't my claim.  My claim was that they can't publicly criticize President Obama without getting tore down and rhetorically pushed out of the Family by their own people at the same time that 90% of those tear-downers say not a single word about the actual policies at issue and why the person tearing them down is wrong.  Please include my entire idea before you go about discussing why you think it is wrong, in the interests of accuracy, at least?  I appreciate it.  

          If you don't stand for something, you will go for anything. Visit Maat's Feather

          by shanikka on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 03:09:26 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  I didn't comment in BK 'cause I was thinking hard (4+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            vcmvo2, princss6, soothsayer99, burlydee

            about what you were saying.  and this is what I have to say about this:

            My claim was that they can't publicly criticize President Obama without getting tore down and rhetorically pushed out of the Family by their own people[...]

            who can push you out of the Family, shanikka?  I'm pretty sure you've been black a couple years longer than me so that can't be it.  you're a lifetime member in that vein.  hmmm, you're an integral part of the Porch, and even if folks don't like everything everyone says, you're a lifetime member there, in EXCELLENT standing...

            so... what are you talking about?  I'm asking you this in all sincerity.  who can kick you out of the Family?  and even more pertinent, who's trying to?  again, a serious and sincere question.

            ('cause as mr roboto as I may be in dkos' sight, every time you say this sort of thing it TOTALLY mystifies me.  we can't even kick Clarence Thomas out of the family, and you think YOU'RE on shaky ground?  come on.)

            "I'm Black and I'm proud, I'm ready, I'm hype, plus I'm amped/ most of my heroes don't appear on no stamp!" ~Carlton Ridenhour

            by mallyroyal on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:22:20 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  That's Why I Said "Rhetorically" (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              4kedtongue, navajo, catilinus

              Because you're right, nobody can push any of us out.  That doesn't mean that in their rhetoric though, they don't often end up sending the unstated message that they wish they could.  Which is one of the reasons I try, even when I fail, to be very careful to criticize people's ideas, and not the people themselves unless I am sure that I can back up the personal aspersions I ascribe to them.  

              That was sort of the point of my diary the other day.

              If you don't stand for something, you will go for anything. Visit Maat's Feather

              by shanikka on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:30:52 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  you sure about this? (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                vcmvo2, soothsayer99
                That doesn't mean that in their rhetoric though, they don't often end up sending the unstated message that they wish they could.

                'cause I don't see it. especially not against you.  maybe slim lol (j/k)

                "I'm Black and I'm proud, I'm ready, I'm hype, plus I'm amped/ most of my heroes don't appear on no stamp!" ~Carlton Ridenhour

                by mallyroyal on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:33:15 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  I'm Sorry You Don't See It (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  navajo

                  I do.  And not just as it relates to me.  Or I wouldn't have said it because "me" is not my primary concern.

                  If you don't stand for something, you will go for anything. Visit Maat's Feather

                  by shanikka on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:54:29 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  hm. well even as I note that there are a few (4+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    vcmvo2, princss6, soothsayer99, burlydee

                    Af-Am commenters whose views fall well outside of the mainstream of thought in my sphere, I still wouldn't consider anything anyone said to anyone on here tantamount to rhetorically kicking someone out of the tribe.  the frame makes no sense to me.  I used Clarence Thomas in a comment for a reason.  nobody can tell that man he's not Black.  he just IS.  it's a fact like which way is north.  same goes for everyone, as regards whatever group to which they inherently belong.  I don't see how it even comes up, personally.

                    also, I think you're missing out on some pointed commentary by those who DO fall out of my mainstream.  bruh1 used to call me some doozys lol.  slim keeps telling me to get over being black lmao.

                    anyway, musing now... "rainbows" don't usually cast shadows but I think maybe one did around here.

                    "I'm Black and I'm proud, I'm ready, I'm hype, plus I'm amped/ most of my heroes don't appear on no stamp!" ~Carlton Ridenhour

                    by mallyroyal on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 05:05:47 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

              •  Unstated messages? (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                princss6

                Oh sweetheart, you know black people better than this, I'm sure.  You know  black folk don't send unstated messages.  

                We all tend to rather blunt.

                Like all of the time.  

                Are you serious?  You really think folk on BK is sending such messages???

                Wow.  Just wow.  I don't even know what to say to this.

                If anything, the dialouge among those who don't agree is rather superior to anything I find on most other diaries....

                Maybe I read this whole line of discussion wrong.

                "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

                by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:47:15 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  I Do Know Black People (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  navajo, Plantsmantx

                  Better than this, having both been born Black and living with them all my life (including in my college dorm.)  While most of us do tend to be blunt and direct  not all of us do.  Some of us play the same games as other folk do.  As someone else said for different reasons, we are not all monolithic.

                  If you don't stand for something, you will go for anything. Visit Maat's Feather

                  by shanikka on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 08:25:20 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

          •  There's not much difference here to me.... (0+ / 0-)

            I'm just sayin....

            "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

            by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:40:32 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  Post of this diary so far. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          burlydee

          Ironic, indeed.  It's nuts and it decreases any credbility that some of them may have garnered from me by repeating that meme.  And they are smart enough to know way better than this.

          "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

          by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:39:30 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  People of unknown skin colors are attacked, (0+ / 0-)

          in widely various ways, and distractions and excuses are raised, all the time for criticizing the President. This site is one good example. In fact the phenomenon all but endemic here.

          H'mm. I'm not terribly into this, anymore.

          by Knarfc on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 09:57:38 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  A good speech won't help? (18+ / 0-)

    Not even a bipartisan good speech? More tax breaks for "job creators" on wall street maybe? There are investment bankers and hedge fund managers starving on wall street, you know. How about another new war liberating some country to death perhaps? No? Jeeze, some people are never satisfied are they? Would slashing the deficit help? More ear to ear grinning, maybe?

    </snark, and disgust>

    Antemedius | Liberally Critical Thinking

    by Edger on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 12:30:29 PM PDT

  •  The CBC is in an impossible position; squeezed (9+ / 0-)

    between an exterminationist rightwing and a President who needs to give inordinate amounts of attention to the white power structure to even have a chance.

    There's no answer to  Maxine Waters' appeal to her fellow AAs, I'm afraid.

    From Neocon to sane- thanks to Obama- and Kos.

    by satrap on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 12:34:54 PM PDT

    •  I completely agree (6+ / 0-)

      I'd love this President to man up and get tough, but it's not going to happen.  And if by some miracle it did, it would affect nothing more than my morale.  

      This Congress is not going to permit Obama to do squat.  Period.  We could have every Dem in Congress magically grow a spine and we still wouldn't get anywhere - the GOP will not permit it.  And they have the numbers to stop it.

      So, while my heart would love to see Obama become a hell of a lot less conciliatory, it won't do a thing other than make me smile.  

      Your flag decal won't get you into heaven anymore. John Prine -8.00,-5.79

      by Miss Blue on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 12:40:37 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Actually that is important - smiling. (7+ / 0-)

        If people have something to go to the wall for (see the state my birth, Wisconsin) folks will go to the wall even in the face of overwhelming odds.  That would make a miracle election.  Let him go to Congress and not get what the people want.  Those are odds I would take because you would be smiling and knocking on every door you could find...just sayin' a good fight for the People is a great story.  

        Every time history repeats itself, the price goes up...East Wing Rules

        by Pithy Cherub on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:17:04 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Hmm (10+ / 0-)

        I'll take this opportunity to say, for the record, I think Obama is tough as nails. He faced some of the toughest politicians one can face in the primaries and general election, not to mention the crazy American media.

        The problem is, in my view, he really has bought into the doctrine of bipartisanship completely. He has a deep philosophical commitment to it.

        And that makes him much more centrist than many want to believe. It is who he is. He's much more conservative and solidly centrist in ideology than most of us knew. It isn't weakness.

        If it were weakness, then all the pleas to him to "buck up" would make sense. Unfortunately, he's following what he believes.

        I wanted to say this, for the record.

      •  as the nytimes today editorialized (16+ / 0-)

        if he offered a real jobs program, and fought for it, it would draw a sharp contrast with the republicans. define the differences. highlight them. make the republicans vote against jobs. over and over and over.

        The cold passion for truth hunts in no pack. -Robinson Jeffers

        by Laurence Lewis on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:38:15 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Who decides what gets voted on in the House? nt (0+ / 0-)

          " 'You Rock?!?' (But been through less gravel.) My mystique suggests battle. And, what have You?" -Common

          by malharden on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 03:23:07 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  then talk about the Boehner (5+ / 0-)

            not allowing jobs bills to be voted on in the house.  Or is that too esoteric for the American people to understand?

            "Without viable unions to serve as a counterweight to corporate power, America's working people and their families are at the mercy of the largest and most powerful economic organizations on the planet."

            by billlaurelMD on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:03:01 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  the Executive writes the Federal Budget. (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            triv33

            So take advantage of that process and dramatically expand infrastructure funding and other government agencies that could directly hire hundreds of thousands to millions of Americans, like the Park Service, National Guard, Coast Guard, AmeriCorps, Peace Corps, etc.

            He's got a (D) next to his name. How many Ds and how many Rs next to his policies? - Jim P

            by Uberbah on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:35:09 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Your ignorance is showing as usual. (0+ / 0-)

              This kind of thing is exactly why you are ignore-on-sight.

              So take advantage of that process and dramatically expand infrastructure funding and other government agencies that could directly hire hundreds of thousands to millions of Americans, like the Park Service, National Guard, Coast Guard, AmeriCorps, Peace Corps, etc.

              This is exactly what the f@ck was done.

              full budget - http://www.whitehouse.gov/...

              Textual overview: http://www.whitehouse.gov/...

              -As part of a six-year, comprehensive surface transportation bill at $35 billion per year, the Budget creates hundreds of thousands of jobs in the short term with a $50 billon up-front investment; establishes a National Infrastructure Bank to support projects of national importance; and brings access to high-speed rail to 80 percent of Americans within 25 years.

              -Consolidates 60 duplicative, often earmarked programs into five. Investment will only be made if bipartisan financing is found to ensure that it does not increase the deficit.

              -Builds a next-generation, wireless broadband network to bring high-speed Internet access to 98 percent of Americans, and establish an interoperable network for public safety.

              -Plan is fully paid for, and the sale of spectrum provides nearly $10 billion for deficit reduction.

              Please stop shooting from the hip, pull your head out of your a$$, and do some research.

              " 'You Rock?!?' (But been through less gravel.) My mystique suggests battle. And, what have You?" -Common

              by malharden on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 07:52:45 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Ready! Fire! Aim! (0+ / 0-)

                You're pointing to routine infrastructure bills while completely ignoring the word dramatically I used in my post.

                The question was: how does the president get a jobs bill into the House.  I answered it.

                As part of a six-year, comprehensive surface transportation bill at $35 billion per year

                And I'm talking a sum ten times that size.  Then doubled again.  For starters.  And that's just for highway and bridge repair.

                Because we have $2 trillion in backlogged repairs to our existing infrastructure.  Not even including new construction of high speed rail or mass transit.

                And that's just for roads, rails and bridges.  There were also the aforementioned Park Service, National Guard, Coast Guard, AmeriCorps, Peace Corps.

                I'm talking millions of new jobs in 2009 alone.  Republicans say "no way"?  Obama says "Thanks!  We'll pass the bill anyway via reconciliation and then take all your seats in the next election for opposing jobs."

                So, by running around half-cocked with assumptions, you come up short while getting egg all over your face.

                Your ignorance is showing as usual.

                There's the first egg.

                This kind of thing is exactly why you are ignore-on-sight.

                Second egg.

                Please stop shooting from the hip, pull your head out of your a$$, and do some research.

                Third egg.  Fourth egg for pointing to routine spending and pretending it's anything like first year New Deal employment numbers.

                A couple more and you'll have a an even half-dozen!

                He's got a (D) next to his name. How many Ds and how many Rs next to his policies? - Jim P

                by Uberbah on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 10:15:56 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

      •  It would make a difference (4+ / 0-)

        Obama needs to make the case that we need more Democrats so that he can pass the legislation people are hungry for. The way to do that is to tireless push the legislation and loudly point at the Republicans every time it doesn't pass. That Obama chooses not to forcefully make the case,is leads me to believe that he isn't terrible interested in passing Progressive legislation, especially since it would be a winning message. Poll after poll shows that overwhelmingly Americans want the taxes raised on the rich, entitlements protected and a real Jobs Program.

        Obama's current test campaign is just terrible. Shared sacrifice instead of forcing the rich to sacrifice some of their ill gotten gains? Free trade that already decimated American manufacturing instead of a rally call for made in America? Unions are the problem instead of the corporations who are hording their money? Does he really think this is going to be the way to hold onto his job?

    •  Barbara Lee & Nancy Pelosi last night re: jobs (9+ / 0-)

      At an African-American church in East Oakland, CA

      The event, headlined "Speak Out for Good Jobs Now," aimed to take testimony from Americans on their concerns regarding the economy from an audience overwhelmingly made up of African Americans and labor union loyalists - the heart of the party base and among those hit hardest by the recession.
      'Tax the rich'

      Dozens filed up to mikes to tell their stories of unemployment. The session, organized by the Congressional Progressive Caucus, was at times raucous, with some heckling or angrily chanting that it is time to "tax the rich."

      Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/...

      "A city for sale and doomed to speedy destruction if it finds a purchaser!" -King Jugurtha of Numidia

      by LucyandByron on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:45:28 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  LOL If you think CBC talks for all AA. See (5+ / 0-)

    just because we share the same ethnic background doesn't mean that we don't have our free will.

    "Rick Perry talks a lot and he's not very bright. And that's a combination I like in Republicans." --- James Carville

    by LaurenMonica on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 12:40:56 PM PDT

  •  The Turnout Crash Last Fall Highlights This. (19+ / 0-)

    Even if Black support for President and party remain in the 90's, like everyone else if they don't feel they'll get anything for voting they'll stay home.

    Turnout is going to be a huge problem for Democrats in 2012, even aside from the Republican disenfranchisement programs.

    We are called to speak for the weak, for the voiceless, for victims of our nation and for those it calls enemy.... --ML King "Beyond Vietnam"

    by Gooserock on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 12:41:04 PM PDT

  •  No, it's not monolithic. (14+ / 0-)

    Nor should it be.  

    Many African Americans have suffered greatly in this recession.  

    I don't think most blame Barack Obama, but I understand why some might feel left out.

    The American people must wise up and rise up!

    by TomP on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 12:42:01 PM PDT

  •  I think the issue of class (12+ / 0-)

    in the black community is a very under-played variable in this debate. If you are unemployed, under threat and in an emergency you've got bigger things to worry about than criticism of the president.

    The cave, the Matrix, America.

    by Grassee on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 12:50:07 PM PDT

  •  The impossible thing is that the USA needs a (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    lcj98, a gilas girl, princss6

    leader like Obama to get the great majority on the same page.  But huge numbers of whites want to move in a completely opposite direction i.e. "freedom" "liberty" "I rely on myself!".  

    A freedom agenda like the Rs are promoting will lead to the absolute annihilation of anyone dumb enough to go it alone in the 21st century of massive technological advancement and state power.

    We need unity- but Obama can't give us that if around half the nation despises it.

    From Neocon to sane- thanks to Obama- and Kos.

    by satrap on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 12:54:55 PM PDT

    •  we need "unity" maybe, (0+ / 0-)

      but not if its called "unity" I think.  

      what we really need is solidarity and a recognition that the "I"s in that society of individuals are much better off when they focus on the society part and not the individual part.

      my fear is that folks will simply fall back into their older patterns and stay away from the polls, not because of any feeling about the POTUS per se, but because of the very real and old malaise that what goes on in DC and the government doesn't really have much to do with the feel and contour of their daily lives.  

      Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

      by a gilas girl on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:42:26 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Obama is the POTUS not the President of AA (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    cwholcomb, ScottDog

    He shldn't focus on a particular segment of the population just because he shares the same ethnic background.

    He shld focus on jobs, jobs and jobs for every American citizens regardless their race.

    "Rick Perry talks a lot and he's not very bright. And that's a combination I like in Republicans." --- James Carville

    by LaurenMonica on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:01:14 PM PDT

    •  He shouldn't focus on a particular (6+ / 0-)

      segment of the population just because he shares the same ethnic background. Very true.

      But he should focus on those segments of the population that are hardest hit by economic forces beyond their control. Haven't we expected this of all Democrats for decades?

      We decided to move the center farther to the right by starting the whole debate from a far-right position to begin with. - Former House Majority Leader Tom DeLay

      by denise b on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:21:11 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  depends on (0+ / 0-)
        Haven't we expected this of all Democrats for decades?

        which "we" you are referring to...

        Fear doesn't just breed incomprehension. It also breeds a spiteful, resentful hate of anyone and everyone who is in any way different from you.

        by awesumtenor on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:53:55 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I am sorry (0+ / 0-)

          if you don't wish to be included in the "we". I believe that the vast majority of Kossites would agree with the statement. Of course, there are always exceptions.

          We decided to move the center farther to the right by starting the whole debate from a far-right position to begin with. - Former House Majority Leader Tom DeLay

          by denise b on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:01:04 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  no; you arent sorry (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            princss6

            be honest; you dont give a big rat's ass what I may or may not wish.

            Seeing that you and the vast majority of Kossacks ( not Kossites, BTW ) are not black it does not surprise that you'd be dismissive and would presume said majority to be similarly inclined. the fact remains despite the consistent support of the black community for democratic incumbents and candidates, that support has been taken for granted to the point of exclusion on many occasions by many candidates for office running under the democratic party banner once they have achieved the office sought.

            As such, the "we democrats" aegis tends to expand and contract PRN based on political expediency... and sometimes we fall under it... and other times we do not...

            Fear doesn't just breed incomprehension. It also breeds a spiteful, resentful hate of anyone and everyone who is in any way different from you.

            by awesumtenor on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 08:28:36 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

    •  People get that, (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      shanikka, ohmyheck

      but he has had a very tin ear for almost 3 years about the struggles of the joblessness out here.  Folks are tired of him talking and want action.  The reason for a jobs program is one thing re-election.  Period.  Why?  Look at the drop in the poll numbers.  That should be shocking to everyone.  POTUS is becoming out of touch and when you are like that, the public becomes out of touch to you.

    •  Nor should he leave the impression (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      icebergslim

      that he is focusing on a different segment (independents).

      We know AAs are overwhelmingly Democratic, so the contrast can create an unintended impression of leaving out a group...

      As Waters said, why is the President not visiting any more diverse communities on a jobs tour when those are the hardest communities hit by the jobs crisis.  At a minimum, it has to make you wonder.

      "But once John Boehner is sworn in as Speaker, then he’s going to have responsibilities to govern. You can’t just stand on the sidelines and be a bomb thrower." - President Obama, 12-07-2010

      by justmy2 on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:42:26 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  In Los Angeles, (20+ / 0-)

    angst, fear and angry mumbles about the Obama Administration are spilling over and no longer just confined to the salon or barber's chair or the front steps of church. The Congressional Black Caucus(especially the ones in LA) are aware of the great disconnect and are becoming more vocal.   It is repressive when some black folks seek to shut down debate here because of a perception that criticism of public policy somehow diminishes the man, Barack Obama.  It is important to not make the forefront of every argument that he is the first black man, but treat him as an equal worthy of honest critiques, comedic satire and approbation when earned.

    Chicago, Los Angeles, Detroit< Miami are as important to visit as are the Sundown towns interspersed throughout the Midwest.  The need for Obama Stimulus II (bigger, badder and BOLDER) than before needs to be the top of his list everyday and every night.  How do I get people jobs to stimulate the economy.  There are parks that are in horrid disrepair or unsafe, there are police officers needed, fund after-school programs that mirror Headstart, but most important start fixing the water systems, the roads & bridges, retrofitting homes (kind of a clash for clunkers for housing systems) but do something and be seen as leading the charge Mr. President.  Being last to the party in a big honkin' armored bus ain't doin' it.

    As a black person, one of my concerns is largely unspoken.  His tepid public policy approach and technocratic governing style give me pause to fear he will be remembered as the first black president first and foremost and that is a singular distinction owing to circumstances of birth.  I want him to use politics as a platform to compete on ideas and brave vision coupled with empathy for those trapped in an urban hellhole or those separated in rural zones because of distance.  His actions must match his rhetoric.  He can no longer afford to just discuss the issue.  Action speaks louder than words.

    Every time history repeats itself, the price goes up...East Wing Rules

    by Pithy Cherub on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:04:18 PM PDT

    •  I wish he would reach out (6+ / 0-)

      to those in inner cities, but I fear he will not because of what Rs would say.

      I hope folks will cut him as much slack as they can.  I have been really frustrated with a lot of decisions, but I think he is a good and decent person and I do think he cares about the plight of the poor.   He sure is not perfect, but he is the first AA president and that does mean a lot.

      In the end, most in the CBC understand that.

      The American people must wise up and rise up!

      by TomP on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:08:46 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  That's the problem, (9+ / 0-)

        is a pol boxes themselves in because of fear, then getting out of the box is impossible and the world becomes much smaller.  Yes, he is the first; and with that comes an obligation to pave the way for others.  If you do Good Works for the Common Good a natural elevation of governance would be to make it about Big Ideas & Goals not patents.

        Every time history repeats itself, the price goes up...East Wing Rules

        by Pithy Cherub on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:20:57 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Those are nice words (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          CaliSista

          but the calculation on Obama's mind is will going to inner city Detroit, NY, Chicago, LA, along with all the criticism and sound bites that will surely arise out of that, gain him votes or lose him votes?   Maybe Obama is over estimating white resentment/backlash if he were specifically address inner city communities but I'm sure that is the calculation his election team is trying to make.   How do I turnout the African-American vote without pissing off the rural white voters who I also need?

          •  Since it is apparent (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            icebergslim, catilinus

            by President Obama's own words and confirmation from his political shoppe, that being reelected is not his biggest concern; how about he does the best policy for both constituencies (J.O.B.S.) and base it on doing the right thing rather than the getting the most votes.  That is how he gets votes not straddling some mythical fence....

            Every time history repeats itself, the price goes up...East Wing Rules

            by Pithy Cherub on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:42:21 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Well, I think being reelected is always a (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              CaliSista

              politicians biggest goal.   But I really don't understand how your comment addressed mine.  I agree, we need better jobs policy from this administration.    

            •  Getting reelected is the biggest concern (0+ / 0-)

              of nearly every politician up for election no matter what they say.

              "Someone just turned the lights on in the bar and the sexiest state doesn't look so pretty anymore" CA Treasurer Bill Lockyer on Texas budget mess

              by CaliSista on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 08:45:18 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

        •  He doesn't need to focus... (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          burlydee

          on issues specific to people of color, imo.
          He needs to pursue policies that benefit the poor and working class. That, alone, will inure to the benefit of our communities.

          That's why I'm so hard on the WH when they stray from those policies(tax-cut extension, austerity, giving up on jobs initiatives).
          Fox News is laying in wait to howl about perceived favoritism, even when their cries are based on lies(Pigford settlement, etc.) so I'm sympathetic to their plight.

          “Sometimes, the most reasonable thing in the legislative process is to be unreasonable.” Mike Pence, R-Ind., on negotiating with the democrats.

          by dclawyer06 on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:48:50 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  He is putting HIMSELF in that box, (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        ohmyheck, Williston Barrett

        one of FEAR.  Is that what we want from a leader?

        •  We have the leader we elected. (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          doroma, a gilas girl, burlydee

          They try to avoid race as much as possible.  

          He's in farm country in Iowa now.  

          maybe one day it will be different.  

          The American people must wise up and rise up!

          by TomP on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:37:01 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  not sure I understand your meaning here: (0+ / 0-)
            They try to avoid race as much as possible.

            hesitate to respond (though I nearly did) until I'm more clear.  

            Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

            by a gilas girl on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:45:13 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Can't speak for TomP but a focus on race (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              princss6, conlakappa

              is the last thing Obama and his advisers want. The Rethugs are trying to dog whistle his race at every conceivable opportunity so the Neanderthal constituency will be frothing at the mouth and stampede their way to the polls in 2012.

              "Someone just turned the lights on in the bar and the sexiest state doesn't look so pretty anymore" CA Treasurer Bill Lockyer on Texas budget mess

              by CaliSista on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 08:51:39 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

        •  You assume there was a time when he was (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          blindyone

          not in said box... even though our melanin-challenged brethren across the political aisle have been praying for one of two things to happen... either the POTUS have an "angry black man" meltdown or he focus on issues that the southern strategy of the GOP has been painting as dangerous to "hard working americans, white americans" since the Goldwater campaign in 1964 and which a large number of white folk have swallowed hook, line and sinker..,. enough that they could paint him as being Robert Mugabe and telling white america to "be afraid... be very afraid".

          It's not a fear issue, IMO... but because he cannot win without a sizeable number of votes from white america, he cannot be in a position to give the crazy accusations that Beck and Limbaugh and Colter et al have been making since the morning after the 2008 presidential election any credence...

          Fear doesn't just breed incomprehension. It also breeds a spiteful, resentful hate of anyone and everyone who is in any way different from you.

          by awesumtenor on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 03:02:54 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  This board is like... 97% white (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      princss6, CaliSista

      So tell me again how in the world these "some blacks" as you say, is trying to shut down discussion?

      Have you seen what's on the rec list lately?

      Please.  No one is shutting you down.  

      But I will tell you that your experience is as antedotal as the next black person.

      Congresswoman Water's district has changed dramatically and like all members of Congress who have probably been in their seats for too long, they are fighting to keep it.

      She is no exception.

      "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

      by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:26:49 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Seek to shut down is present (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        icebergslim

        tense with an eye towards what some strive towards.  My anecdotal evidence is mine not yours, that doesn't make its value less real, it just is...  Your experience can be drastically different.  There always have been people of color prominently featured at this site.  The owner is a person of color.  Early on many people of color chose not to identify in any polls.  I have never participated in them.  Some have some awesome low UIDs.  It only means that is the site 12-15% AA?  No, but those voices of color have been clearly elevated to the front page consistently since inception.  

        What is empirical evidence is that many of the 2008 first time voters (many of whom were folks of color or the young) did not show up in 2010.  GOTV efforts require a large turnout.  When people are not seeing results for working people, said groups will just plain not show up.  The issue is whether the disappointed will turn up to volunteer in the numbers needed/required for an incumbent running for office.  There is nowhere near the level of enthusiasm needed that was apparent in 2007 & 2008...and that includes in the black community.  Brother Barack has to make a case for a second term.

        Latinos are not throwing a lot of love the president's way or perhaps you missed his lukewarm reception at La Raza.  Maxine has many issues, good points and failings, but one thing is clear, she knows her political landscape and works within that framework.  

        Every time history repeats itself, the price goes up...East Wing Rules

        by Pithy Cherub on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 05:45:18 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I didn't say it was less valuable. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          princss6

          I'm saying that it's one story and someone else has a different one.

          As for this site Pithy, the fact still remains that its membership is overwhelming white.  Secondly the most vocal viewpoint of this site regarding criticizing the President is very well represented, so the small percentage of black folk here who may not share those criticisms can hardly stop the small percentage of black folk on here who espouse such criticisms every day.

          Lastly as for both Ms. Waters and Mr. Obama, they will do what politicans do when they are up for re-election.  

          They will make their case known.

          "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

          by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 08:01:15 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Unlikely, commenters don't reflect that (0+ / 0-)

        Do your really believe that out of 1000 recs in a popular well liked diary that only 30 (actually less than that since Native Americans, Asians, etc. would also be deducted) are AA?

        I challenge the assumption.

        If you ask "what color is the poster" when someone criticizes the President's policy or track record, you are probably a racist. If you assume white progressives don't like the President's policies because of his skin color, you are definitely a racist.

        by Celtic Pugilist on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:35:10 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  YES. challenge away. (0+ / 0-)

          and how about naming me more than 30 active black commenters?  can you even name ten?  we're not hiding, so it should be easy.

          "I'm Black and I'm proud, I'm ready, I'm hype, plus I'm amped/ most of my heroes don't appear on no stamp!" ~Carlton Ridenhour

          by mallyroyal on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 02:38:55 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Not easy because I haven't kept track (0+ / 0-)

            ...whenever someone claimed their ethnicity and it's not something I can just look up.  However, I have a list 10 already.  With 20 more that I believe are based on several other things.  Took me about half an hour to do that last night.  

            And that doesn't include any of the other non-white posters that I removed from the list.  So I'm pretty well convinced that the oft quoted stat is bullshit.

            If you ask "what color is the poster" when someone criticizes the President's policy or track record, you are probably a racist. If you assume white progressives don't like the President's policies because of his skin color, you are definitely a racist.

            by Celtic Pugilist on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 04:29:23 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

  •  So for AAs, it IS a depression (11+ / 0-)

    I wonder what the history books will say about this period 50 years from now.

    Things are bad, much worse than the "data" seem to suggest, it seems.

    Hows this going to end? Scary.

  •  A recent poll says that 86% of Blacks support... (19+ / 0-)

    the President, nevertheless, when you scratch beneath the surface of the overall number, only 56% support his handling of the economy---this is down from 77% in May.

    •  Excellent comment. (6+ / 0-)

      That seems to reflect reality.  Many folks may be disappointed or unhappy, but they still support Obama.  

      That's pretty normal it seems.  While many AAs may feel a special bond with the first AA president, it does not mean they stop seeing the world as it is and being critical when they see fit.

      The American people must wise up and rise up!

      by TomP on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:18:28 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  And this is the point right here. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      amk for obama, sethtriggs

      This parsing of data points in order to support the point of why Obama should not be supported is totally apparent and transparent here.

      "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

      by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:22:02 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  I work in a predominantly black community (7+ / 0-)

    and I see the same thing...we have almost 20% unemployment here. That seems to be the magic number- that's what they had in Greece, Egypt, Spain, etc.

    The great riots of the 60's- Chicago, Detroit, Milwaukee, etc- were thought to have been spurred in large part by a black youth unemployment rate of around 15%...It's only a matter of time.

    Will work for food
    Will die for oil
    Will kill for power and to us the spoils
    The billionaires get to pay less tax
    The working poor get to fall through the cracks
    -James McMurtry

    -9.75/-8.26

    by SwedishJewfish on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:19:13 PM PDT

    •  I wonder if you have any data (0+ / 0-)

      about when the unemployment rate for AA youth was less than 15%.

      •  I was mistaken (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        ohmyheck, greenbird

        15% was the overall black unemployment rate, not just the youth rate. 15.9% to be exact. I don't know the exact figures but it was significantly less during the WWII era. In Detroit I know the black unemployment rate was quite low until they started doing the post-WWII layoffs and most of the auto plants relocated to the predominantly white (and institutionally segregated) suburbs.

        Will work for food
        Will die for oil
        Will kill for power and to us the spoils
        The billionaires get to pay less tax
        The working poor get to fall through the cracks
        -James McMurtry

        -9.75/-8.26

        by SwedishJewfish on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:00:25 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  SwedishJewfish. That is an hilarious sig name:) (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      SwedishJewfish

      Rec'd for that alone! Are you Swedish? I only ask becasue I was born and raised there for many years. Parents both American, but I consider myself half. Some days even more Swedish. You know socialist et all. ;)

      "And he goes through life, his mouth open, and his mind closed." Shakespeare

      by vixenflem on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:23:29 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  lol (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        vixenflem

        I am of Swedish and Lithuanian descent- and I always loved the Swedish Fish candy, so that got me nicknamed "Swedish Fish" when I was in middle school. I became Swedish Jewfish, or just "Jewfish", when they found out I was Jewish (I went to Catholic School so that was kind of a big deal!) I used to hate it but its grown on me ;)

        Will work for food
        Will die for oil
        Will kill for power and to us the spoils
        The billionaires get to pay less tax
        The working poor get to fall through the cracks
        -James McMurtry

        -9.75/-8.26

        by SwedishJewfish on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 05:25:53 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  The AA comunity isn't stupid or defeatist either (27+ / 0-)

    You can always spot those don't fully understand the history of the African-American struggle in this country. It is one of persistence in the face of horrible setbacks, sellouts, and disappointment. It is not at all like the easy deflated modern Progressive, or at least, a certain vocal, and mostly comfortable segment of them. The African-American struggle keep taking an inch an doing whatever it could to get the next inch, and it kept going and allies came and went, but it kept going, and it continues today.

    The African-American community knows that the issues it faces did not start when President Obama took office.

    I took a friend to the dentist today, and the tv was on. At some point, they showed the clip of Representative Maxine Waters acting out. I kid you not when I say that each of the African-Americans in the office at that time, along with the Latina receptionist, all were visibly  open-mouthed upset at Waters.

    Most thought she was covering her behind because she has some issues of her own she doesn't want to get into. All thought that she and the CBC were crooks. Some Tea Party types tried to state some nonsense, but the multicultural waiting room wasn't having it. It was beautiful sight to behold deep in a supposedly hopelessly red state.

    One thing I have learned while on the ground is that the CBC is not relevant to the lives of most in the AA community, and is not well regarded. I have been surprised by this, as I thought it would be the opposite. This is why it's good to talk to people and learn something by challenging your own assumptions. This is important in every community, not just the African-American community.

    Of one thing I am sure, the folks here getting applause and adulation trying to sell the idea that African-Americans are anything but not solidly behind President Obama, are selling something far out of the mainstream.

    I wonder why we haven't seen any diaries of Tavis Smiley and Dr. West getting a surprise rude reception when they tried to sell the same nonsense we see from a few folks around here?

    "There is nothing more dreadful than the habit of doubt. Doubt separates people. It is a poison that disintegrates friendships and breaks up pleasant relations. It is a thorn that irritates and hurts; it is a sword that kills.".. Buddha

    by sebastianguy99 on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:20:59 PM PDT

  •  You as SO right... (4+ / 0-)

    the African American community is not monolithic.

    As an example, along with the things you've talked about in your diary, there's this:

    Earlier this year, when a Washington Post -Kaiser--Harvard poll asked respondents whether they expected their children's standard of living to be better or worse than their own, 60 percent of blacks chose "better," compared with only 36 percent of whites.

    Numerous previous polls found the same cheerful confidence. On the eve of President Barack Obama's inauguration, 69 percent of black respondents told CNN pollsters that Martin Luther King's vision had been "fulfilled." Nearly two years later, as America prepared for the 2010 midterm elections, blacks shared little of the disenchantment that had overtaken many whites. African-Americans were more likely than whites to say that the economy was sound, found CBS News. And nearly half (compared with 16 percent of whites) thought America's next generation would be better off.

    Over the past few years, pollsters repeatedly have corroborated the phenomenon. Whereas whites are glum, blacks are upbeat-which is remarkable since the economic crisis has hit African-Americans with particularly brutal force. Employment among black men, for instance, has dropped to an all-time low. When I asked Harvard Business School professor David Thomas about the CNN poll, he laughed. "It's irrational exuberance," he said.

  •  what does MY congressman, a member of the CBC (7+ / 0-)

    and a member of the progressive caucus, say?

    (rhetorical question.  PA-02, for anyone who would like to check for themselves.)

    "I'm Black and I'm proud, I'm ready, I'm hype, plus I'm amped/ most of my heroes don't appear on no stamp!" ~Carlton Ridenhour

    by mallyroyal on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 01:38:13 PM PDT

    •  Our Congressman usually doesn't (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      mallyroyal, Celtic Pugilist, princss6

      say a whole lot about the president, but he's been busy getting some grants for the area, though.  He did have this to say about the latest hunger report, which showed Bob Brady's PA-01 as the second most food insecure district:

      "The report issued by the respected Food Research and Action Center (FRAC) about the disturbing level of hunger in Philadelphia and other cities serves as a serious reminder of the very real stakes of the recent and upcoming debates about federal spending.

      "Far too many families -- and a disproportionate share of them live in our nation's great cities -- are struggling at the very lowest end of the economic spectrum. I am concerned that recent conversations in Washington DC have proposed curtailing the social safety net which is already insufficient.

      "We are not a beggar nation and must not act like one. Surely a nation as great as ours can afford the compassion to ensure that our neighbors, especially children, can meet their basic human needs. I urge my colleagues to consider this report and its implications as we continue a great debate about shared responsibilities and government priorities."

      The mediator between head and hands must be the heart. Epigram from Metropolis

      by dizzydean on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:26:58 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  our congressman lauded the debt deal, as I'm sure (3+ / 0-)

        you know, dizzy.

        "I'm Black and I'm proud, I'm ready, I'm hype, plus I'm amped/ most of my heroes don't appear on no stamp!" ~Carlton Ridenhour

        by mallyroyal on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:43:42 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Yeah, I know. I think he did so as a Pelosi (0+ / 0-)

          loyalist.

          The mediator between head and hands must be the heart. Epigram from Metropolis

          by dizzydean on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 08:18:11 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  you think fattah has been muzzled? (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            dizzydean

            LOL you've met him, right?

            "I'm Black and I'm proud, I'm ready, I'm hype, plus I'm amped/ most of my heroes don't appear on no stamp!" ~Carlton Ridenhour

            by mallyroyal on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 10:42:26 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Sadly, he doesn't make it my way too often (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              mallyroyal

              and I do like him, most of the time.  Have never met him, though I wish I could.

              And, no, I don't think he's necessarily muzzled, but he seems to disappear an awful lot.  You don't see him in the Inqy very often (last time was a criticism of the CAMERA program) and, jaysus, did you see the last newsletter?  Not a whole lot there to get excited about.

              He's on the Appropriations Committee, and you need to make some friends in high places to do that.  

              The mediator between head and hands must be the heart. Epigram from Metropolis

              by dizzydean on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 11:57:44 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  well here's the thing. (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                dizzydean

                it's kind of a joke in my family that while chaka says the right things all the time, he says them badly lmao.  I wince whenever I see him on MSNBC.  he hasn't embarrassed me yet though during this administration, thank God.  there's a reason I wasn't on his staff during the mayoral run.  I did NOT want him to be high-profile mayor of Philly.  he's a gaffe machine waiting to happen.  I want him right where he is.

                but yeah I have a lot of respect for his policy and his politics.  always have.  not so much for his comportment in the past.  he's gotten better.

                "I'm Black and I'm proud, I'm ready, I'm hype, plus I'm amped/ most of my heroes don't appear on no stamp!" ~Carlton Ridenhour

                by mallyroyal on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 02:23:25 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

              •  jeez, I'm smoking and forgot why I was saying all (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                dizzydean

                that:  my point was that nobody muzzles chaka fattah.  he really believes in this president, which means a lot to me, actually.  makes me know I'm not crazy lol.

                "I'm Black and I'm proud, I'm ready, I'm hype, plus I'm amped/ most of my heroes don't appear on no stamp!" ~Carlton Ridenhour

                by mallyroyal on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 02:24:40 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

  •  Seriously... (4+ / 0-)

    You're linking to an article about the bus that likens Obama to Beyonce?

    Never mind the fact that the Secret Service designed/bought the bus.

    Never mind the fact that they also bought a bus for the GOP nominee.

    Nope... just keeping parroting right-wing memes.

  •  I'm going to Crowdsource a Jobs Bill. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    greenbird, sethtriggs, Chi

    I think we should start writing our own Jobs Bill and lobby our congresspeople with it. It should be a crowdsourced effort. We will go to a website I shall setup, and input what shovel-ready projects or immediate work we can see that can be done in our communities. Then we enter that in the database, along with our estimate of how much it might cost to hire the workers and buy the supplies, and then that becomes part of the bill. We will vote on individual pieces of it and then put it together in a shiny package that's too good to ignore. You might think this is a crazy idea but I actually think it might work, and I'm going to get started on it. I'll let you know when I have something up and running, and post about it here and elsewhere.

    •  what have we got to lose? (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      aigeanta

      it's better to find out if someone is already working on one, to make a coalition of good workers/groups/sites to help publicize/pay for growing it, especially the ALA [american library association, might support free internet access for all communities, with or without libraries per se], but not alone and based on what workers know.

      the old ACT-UP base of focus on the recipients, put them in the main chairs, let their voices be first.

      probably a lot of experience in the FarmAid stuff too but i'm not staying on topic here.

      there's a people's budget...go from there.

      Addington's perpwalk is the trailhead of accountability for this wound to our national psyche.

      by greenbird on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:55:52 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  yes. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    icebergslim, Paddy999
    ...it is hard to go to these communities because they are in despair.  But BUS FORCE ONE need to go into these communities and listen to these people.  These are the many faceless unemployed Americans who voted for Barack Obama and they need to know what he is going to do for them.  These folks are hanging by a sheer thread and there is no help out there.  So, when BUS FORCE ONE goes on another listening tour, stop on by Crenshaw, Inglewood, Detroit, Southside and Westside of Chicago, projects of Brooklyn, Oakland, St. Louis, etc. because these folks have something to say...
    it is hard to hear. it is hard to see. it is hard to live. it is hard to be left out. it is hard to brave another day of another day. what does it mean to be invisible? if the least are chosen first, and their problems addressed, don't we all benefit?

    Addington's perpwalk is the trailhead of accountability for this wound to our national psyche.

    by greenbird on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:30:33 PM PDT

  •  Not sure how this framing... (7+ / 0-)

    helps anything.
    Does anyone really think all AAs in this country share the same beliefs or approach to politics?

    “Sometimes, the most reasonable thing in the legislative process is to be unreasonable.” Mike Pence, R-Ind., on negotiating with the democrats.

    by dclawyer06 on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:36:09 PM PDT

  •  So tired (6+ / 0-)

    and tacky.

    There were 20 people in that room, they panned out and you could see it, come on with this lazy bullshit.

    Who shot ya? Seperate the weak from the ob-solete Hard to creep them Brooklyn streets It's on ____, f**k all that bickering beef I can hear sweat trickling down your cheek

    by mim5677 on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:36:26 PM PDT

  •  I so agree. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    icebergslim, Plantsmantx, jinx303

    The president needs to come to cities like Detroit and see what even a little "shared sacrifice" means to those on the very edge of survival. A few dollars in food or heating can make the difference in making it or not.

    I hope he doesn't take urban and African American voters for granted - that would be a big mistake. And I think he would be surprised and humbled by what he saw in these struggling cities. People are losing hope.

    "The answer to violence is even more democracy. Even more humanity." Norwegian Prime Minister Jens Stoltenberg

    by poe on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 02:54:39 PM PDT

  •  To see a model of a productive (8+ / 0-)

    diary which provides information and also the space for people to respectfully disagree, please see DemFromCt's Sunday diary on Medicare and Medicaid, or DeOliver's Sundat diary on class.  Some people have made good comments in this diary, but mostly it is a waste of time.  What has anyone learned from reading this?  On second thought, I'll just speak for myself -- I've learned almost nothing from reading this.

  •  And you felt the need to diary on this? (0+ / 0-)

    Although your diary title and what is said in it is a bit disingenous because everyone is frustrated in a bad economy.

    Not just African Americans.

    Duh.

    "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

    by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:10:59 PM PDT

  •  It was a mistake for Obama not to tour the cities (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    The Dead Man, Razorblade

    he f**ked up royally.

  •  Ain't no corporate donors in the hood (0+ / 0-)

    Obama is "a good man" to many democrats like Bush was "a good man" to republicans.

    by The Dead Man on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 04:28:06 PM PDT

  •  Anger with Obama in the Black community is real (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    icebergslim, Razorblade, priceman

    ...it's very real, and the president better acknowledge it. He cannot take any group for granted; these are real people with real lives, who have played by the rules - but see a system of corporate greed and political gamesmanship destroying their lives.

    •  Yeah, really and you know because...? (0+ / 0-)

      "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

      by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 08:04:18 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  not monolithic but 95% + or - for Obama (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    princss6, blindyone

    We in the minority community are not monolithic but we still support this president against the GOPers. But even though your title is somewhat misleading I agree with most of it. We need jobs and the President needs to also visit our communities which I'm sure he'll do.

    We also need to work hard to force the Congress to support the things you mention because we know full well that Obama can't do it alone.

    America could have chosen to be the worlds doctor, or grocer. We choose instead to be her policeman. pity

    by cacamp on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 05:55:04 PM PDT

  •  Black approval of Obama is at its lowest point (0+ / 0-)

    Gallup had him at 95% early in 2009.. and above 90% into this year (February 2011).

    Since then, his job approval among blacks has fallen more than 10%.. to a low of 81% in the latest polling.

    "To pass these defendants a poisoned chalice is to put it to our own lips as well." Justice Robert Jackson, Chief Prosecutor, Nuremberg.

    by Wayward Son on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:12:36 PM PDT

    •  Somehow I kinda think that it's (0+ / 0-)

      still, like, WAY higher than white approval.

      "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

      by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 08:05:29 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Intelligent analysis looks for changes. (0+ / 0-)

        Why has Obama lost 15% of a group that has no real reason to challenge him on any Democratic issue?  Have they changed their political views, or are they realizing that he is not what they once thought?

        If you don't care.. and are just looking to justify everything Obama might do.. then by all means, look around for some comparison to act as a life preserver.

        Here's one you can use until the end of his Presidency.. it could drop to 4%, and still be higher than 'approval from KKK members'.  That'll really show em.

        "To pass these defendants a poisoned chalice is to put it to our own lips as well." Justice Robert Jackson, Chief Prosecutor, Nuremberg.

        by Wayward Son on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 03:57:09 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  A young person's job that has come to our (0+ / 0-)

    neighborhood.  Young College kids come door to door with a set of number stencils and paint.  Charging $6-$8 bucks to put your house number at the curb in front of your house in front of your mail box.   There are 36 houses on our street and many people paid them to do that.   A couple hours work.

    "When the powerless are shut out of the media, we will make the media irrelevant" ~Anonymous~

    by Paddy999 on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:36:14 PM PDT

  •  Nice to see so many folks worried about.. (7+ / 0-)

    Black unemployment. Seriously?? We have always been LAST HIRED, FIRST FIRED!!! From those who are working fast food to the bruh/sis in the corner office -- our employment figures has never been on par or better than white employment.  And yes, even with 'Affirmative Action' -- which benefited white women more than any other impacted class -- I have yet to see black folks working more, and MAKING MORE $$$, than whites in my 50+ life time.  

    Yet, somehow this topic is on every one's lips. I can't turn on the news or cruise the internet without hearing about it. And even its even on this site, where it has been proven that there are alot of white, middle class  men -and very few of us.

    I didn't know so many non black folks cared about my employment.

    Why? No one has ever cared about this before outside of the community.  When I was looking for work, I never heard -- you are so important, I have to hire you because educated black women are on the top of my wish list. Thank you for being here.

    Alot of this screaming, talk, and crying about black unemployment has alot of hidden agendas behind it. If folks were that concerned about me having a job back in the day, I'd be some company's CEO by now.

    Superman's black in the building - Public Enemy

    by blackinthebuilding on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:47:43 PM PDT

  •  strange (3+ / 0-)

    that I have seen neither the Bus, nor Maxine Waters, D-CA out in here in California's Central Valley where average unemployment is 17%. In Imperial County it's up to 29.2%. Steinbeck would have otherwise had another masterpiece to create all over again. Central Valley was his homeplace.

    Hopefully either/or will show up soon - Bus or Waters.

    "Show up. Pay attention. Tell the truth. And don't be attached to the results." -- Angeles Arrien

    by Sybil Liberty on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:52:22 PM PDT

  •  Tonight I am getting the sense that the (0+ / 0-)

    tide is turning.  The Wisconsin Recall elections in the heavily Republican areas is just a snap shot of the anger of the Union's, teacher's, firefighters, and the middle and working class.  Just imagine if it was ALL of Wisconsin!  Walker Recall will come in January I hope.  Ohio's SB 5 has gained strong support to repeal Kasich's anti-union over grab.  Kasich is running scared now because he wants to talk to Teachers instead of making fun of them.  He wants them to drop their ballot issue.  The Supporters of the ballot issue bit back hard.  He signed his stupid law in the dark of night.  He can just repeal it!  Otherwise, see you at the ballot box.  Yay!!  That is some good yummy Spine!!

    Now they have dialed back and are ignoring Ron Paul on the Main Scream Media.  The polls are showing people are fed up with the Teaparty.  With Perry coming onto the stage, they need to clean up their act to make him appeal to other Conservatives.  The Teaparty has done the bases bidding.  They will fade away a bit just like Palin for awhile.

    KKKarl Rove is afraid they created a monster that is out of control.  He does not like Perry.   He wants more "regular" Conservatives on the scene to ace out Perry.  

    I have not been happy with Obama.  I feel he should fight harder for the Liberals and Progressives.   I do understand they have fillibustered everything to make him fail.  The downgrade rating was on purpose for the Teaparty so they can use it against him in the run up to the Presidential Election.   I do not like this Super Congress either.

    I feel for the AA community because in this climate with the Teaparty, the bills do hurt minorities and the poor harder.  Truthfully, I would like more parties in our Government.  More representative of the people.  

    The fun part of all of this is, they keep throwing out nutball white men and none of them can outshine President Barack Obama.

    Hang in there, if we can get the house back, Barack Obama re-elected, I think a lot of things will turn around during his second term.  The "people" are demanding it.

    Fire Boehner!  Fire McConnell!  And remember, Teaparties are for little girls with imaginary friends.  

    "When the powerless are shut out of the media, we will make the media irrelevant" ~Anonymous~

    by Paddy999 on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:34:11 PM PDT

    •  I have a similar feeling. (0+ / 0-)

      Some sort of a tide is turning.

      However, the future is far from certain, and in this environment very bad things could happen. Don't kid yourself. Significant sections of this country, in white, black, and mixed neighborhoods, urban, suburban, and rural resemble a tinderbox.

      H'mm. I'm not terribly into this, anymore.

      by Knarfc on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 10:14:37 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Great diary, icebergslim (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    icebergslim, Plantsmantx

    Obama is shocking the AA community by not living up to the promises in his campaign like Milton Friedman shocked Latin America with austerity. Why does Obama think austerity is the answer?

    Maxine Waters is right, and so are you. The black community has never been monolithic.

    Pro Life??? Conservatives want live babies so they can raise them to be dead soldiers!- George Carlin

    by priceman on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 07:44:15 PM PDT

    •  Oh yeah? He's shocking the AA community... (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      princss6

      Um, okay.  Glad you are here to tell me these things or I wouldn't have noticed.

      "The bottom line is, we've got to wake up. We can't allow our disappointment in Obama to lull us into allowing a truly dangerous strain of conservative philosophy to gain any more traction than it already has." --ObamOcala 4/5/11

      by smoothnmellow on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 08:34:16 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  OK. I'm going to guess that (0+ / 0-)

    many of these Congressional Black Congressmembers are looking at perhaps some severe criticism from their constituents, which until now they have kept under wraps. For whatever reason, they can't anymore. The pressure is too great. They see a failure to be seen as putting some sort of pressure on the president on jobs is detrimental to their re-election chances.

    Barack Obama as well is looking at his re-election chances. I see now from the 2nd "Frustration" clip that the reason Obama is in the midwest is these are "battleground" states. And unfortunately for the Congressional Black caucus most of their constituents reside in blue states, certainly not in Iowa, Minnesota, and rural Illinois (?)... But if Illinois is a battleground state, Pennsylvania, Ohio, and even Michigan are as well. The president needs to take a trip to black communities in these states, very soon. If he doesn't, he risks the Black Caucus losing members, and even more importantly for the President, he losing them them personally in 2012.

    When was the last time the President met with the Black Caucus on the topics of jobs and shared sacrifice?

    And what is the President's plan, compared to the Republicans (as Chris Mathews asked)? Is it for Americans to lose their homes and to lose their livelihoods at a slower rate than with a Republican in power?

    If so, how does he sell that plan? Can he?

    H'mm. I'm not terribly into this, anymore.

    by Knarfc on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 09:40:14 PM PDT

  •  What is the point of this diary? (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    princss6, soothsayer99

    God...if I have to hear that "The American people don't want to hear about patents!!"...line one more time...Yes..the economy sucks...and the economy sucks more in the AA community...but this whole "if you just talk about Jobs it's gonna suddenly change the numbers or the desire of Congress to pass bold legislation" is the biggest pipe dream since well...let's the "lets just pass Single Payer" movement.

    There is no government program to get 8 million people back to work in the span of 2.5 years...unless of course that threat of invading aliens is true.  So, you accept the new shitty reality and try to chip away at it...but this pipe dream that an intransigent opposition, in a period of divided government, is going to relent at this point is just pure fantasy.  

    Of course....you can win the political argument (like some of these ppl mention) but there again...that does nothing to change the numbers.

    So wtf then is your point??

    1964 Cassius Clay vs Sonny Liston, 1997 Masters Tiger Woods vs Field, 2008 Barack Obama vs Field

    by ZenMaster Coltrane on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 02:12:25 AM PDT

    •  poisoning the well... (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      soothsayer99, Robinswing

      the views represented by the diarist among the AA community are outliers and they and everyone else knows it.  So this is one more attempt to point out what is wrong with black people who don't share the diarists views.  This is an attempt to discredit mainstream blacks vis-a-vis the outliers.  Throw in some personal even of scores, a few crosses for the martyrs and viola.  Navel-gazing and more black people are mean to us or too stupid to know what is good for them, like we elevated black people do.

      I for one am tired of pandering to perpetrators --- many of whom are opposed to any discussion however it comes. -- soothsayer99 DPK Caucus

      by princss6 on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 07:14:24 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Keep your blinders on.... (0+ / 0-)

        you will wake up and Barack Obama will be ex President Barack Obama.  People are fed up but you don't want to address that.  Obama's approval rating is 26 fucking percent for the economy.  If you don't understand what next year's election is about, think again.  Pretty pictured, floral rhetoric will not change what is happening now.  Folks are tuning this POTUS out and that is gravely dangerous, for folk who are in denial about what is going on do so at your peril.  Outliers my ass.  Walk through these major cities where AA and Hispanic unemployment is sky high and folks are truly fed up.

        •  I know... (3+ / 0-)

          I used to hate when my mom told me she was punishing me for my own good and it hurt her more than it hurt me.  You obviously don't know what we are up against but hey, you are welcome to continue the charade that black people are pissed off at Obama.  Your own video is showing that elected officials say (so they say) that there constituents don't want them to ATTACK the President.  So which is it?  Are we so pissed off they we are defecting or are we supporting him to the point where Congresspeople say they can't ATTACK him?  

          Just got finished signing up for Team 2012 and getting my t-shirt.  I live in a major city.  I live in one of the poorest areas of my city BY CHOICE.  I was just canvassing my area two weeks ago.  

          Wanna know what i heard the folks talking about?  Oh, they were registering to vote or already voting.  Not a one said anything about the President or being pissed off at them.  No, they were pissed off because they see because he is black, the tendency to not treat him fairly and not respect him.  That's what I heard.  People being pissed off by the way he was treated!  

          At a house party for his birthday, the host, decked out in an Obama Family t-shirt (also my neighbor), with all types of Obama memorabilia around her house and twenty other supporters...the host had this to say, she wished he would be tougher with the Republicans.  A few others agreed.  

          But guess what, pissed off is not what those twenty folks were nor are any other people I've encountered in my big city.  In fact, I just two days ago, heard a group of women walking down the street pissed off about the way he is being treated.

          BTW - how was the family reunion?  I bet everybody was pissed off there, too, eh?  I'm surprised you didn't diary about it.  

          Oh the folks that showed up in Detroit to tell Tavis and Cornel to knock off their personal grudge.  Yeah they were pissed but not at the President.

          So yes, keep on poisoning the well with your what's wrong with black people and poor picked on me because other black people disagree and haven't been cowed into silence and submission by year long campaigns to paint us as unreasonable and/or emotional and/or playing the race card to silence criticism.  I anxiously await what door you leave open and trust me it isn't missed who supports you.  

          Pissed off at Obama?  Haha - the same people who supported Clinton until he went Southern Strategy, right?  But do you and I'm gonna do me because pissed off at Obama isn't what I'm seeing and you know it.  

          I for one am tired of pandering to perpetrators --- many of whom are opposed to any discussion however it comes. -- soothsayer99 DPK Caucus

          by princss6 on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 09:23:05 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  And you think that number would be different (0+ / 0-)

          if the unemployment rate was 8.5%...Child, please.  The issue is housing.  You need to get household formation going again but that takes time.

          And you are yet to explain how anything can be done legislatively to transform this situation overnight.  And no...jettisoning Tim Geithner doesn't change the numbers.

          Keep pumping out these "The American people want Jobs (No Shit!)" diaries.  

          1964 Cassius Clay vs Sonny Liston, 1997 Masters Tiger Woods vs Field, 2008 Barack Obama vs Field

          by ZenMaster Coltrane on Thu Aug 18, 2011 at 01:10:52 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site