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Boehner and Obama
(Yuri Gripas/Reuters)
 

President Obama's approval rating is now at its lowest point ever in a pair of new polls, with Congress ranked even lower.

NBC/Wall Steet Journal (data):

After the bruising debt-ceiling fight — as well as Standard & Poor's subsequent downgrade of the nation's credit rating — Obama's job approval rating has sunk to a low of 44 percent, a 3-point drop since July. His handling of the economy stands at a low of 37 percent. And only 19 percent believe the country is headed in the right direction, the lowest mark for this president. [...] Obama wasn't the only party damaged by the debt ceiling debacle. A whopping 82 percent now disapprove of the job Congress is doing. In the history of this poll, it's an all-time high level of dissatisfaction with Capitol Hill.

ABC/Washington Post (data):

More than 60 percent of those surveyed say they disapprove of the way the president is handling the economy and, what has become issue No. 1, the stagnant jobs situation. Just 43 percent now approve of the job he is doing overall, a new career low; 53 percent disapprove, a new high. [...] Obama does, however, rate better than do congressional Republicans, his adversaries in recent, fierce confrontations on federal spending. Just 28 percent approve of the way Republicans in Congress are doing their job, and 68 percent disapprove, the worst spread for the GOP since summer 2008.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Well, of course I wish his poll numbers (8+ / 0-)

    were higher, but considering the state of the economy, they're not as bad as I thought they'd be.  I'm not at all worried about him yet.

    If he can draw a credible contrast with Republicans, then I still like his chances.

    No need to squabble girls. There's plenty of me to go around. - Pam from True Blood

    by fou on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:03:36 AM PDT

    •  I'm worried. (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      fou, Flint, dinotrac, rcnewton

      This shit could go either way.

      This comment may not be reproduced or excerpted on other sites without my express written permission.

      by psilocynic on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:05:30 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I'm not worried at this point. (5+ / 0-)

        Obama's poll numbers have been in the 40-50% range for like the last year and a half.  It's somewhat remarkable actually.  Reagan's and Clinton's ratings were some 5-10 points lower during milder recessions.

        Of course state-by-state numbers are those that would give us a better picture of his re-election prospects.  But if he's in the low-to-mid forties now, and his D approvals are in the high-70s, let's say; then simply bringing home a larger chunk of his base will put his numbers in a more competitive position.

        I read somewhere recently that he needs to be at 45% or higher to be re-electable.  He's basically there already.

        Mind you, I'm not saying he's a lock.  At this point, his chances are still iffy.  But they're far from being in the toilet.

        No need to squabble girls. There's plenty of me to go around. - Pam from True Blood

        by fou on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:13:07 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  The problem is (8+ / 0-)

          the economy is most likely not going to get better before election day.  This is almost a given.  So the voters have yet another year to stew and get angry and with no hope in sight of major relief.  

          So the serious issue here is that his poll numbers are dropping now and that the main reason they are falling is the economy and with most experts are telling us that there is simply not much hope it will do anything but stagnate or get worse.  So the likelihood of his poll numbers leveling off or climbing is almost zero....unless something extremely bold and productive happens very soon.  

          •  Clinton's "come back" was made against (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            blueoasis, rcnewton, Bailey2001

            the background of an economic recovery/boom.  That's important to consider when trying to draw any parallels between past President's polling data and what's happening now.  Reagan's polling data might be a more apt comparison although as I remember that era everyone loved Reagan and even though people were losing ground, it didn't seem like they really realized it at the time.  It wasn't until GHWB's first term that people seemed to finally get tired of the economic state of affairs.

            Anyhow, the economy won't change unless the government steps in and does something fairly significant to change it - like spend money.

            The Obama Administration should be looking closely at what levers they could pull within the realm of Executive Power to at least ease the pain, imo.

      •  The economic stall is a global phenomena (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        psilocynic, drmah, Hear Our Voices

        Not that it will do Obama any good because he'll still get blamed in this political year.

        A few short months ago Germany, Europe's main economic engine, revised their GDP projections for this year up from 2.5pp to 3.2pp... look at it now... its gone flat.

        indicator historical data chart    
        Germany GDP Growth Rate
        http://www.tradingeconomics.com/...

        PS. Last time I looked China's GDP was still estimated at 9.6pp

    •  But to draw a contrast with the GOP.... (21+ / 0-)

      ...President Obama has to embrace entitlements.

      The moment he goes on recored asking for ANY entitlement cuts, even the Chained-CPI for social security, it becomes GOP vs GOP-Lite.

      Learn about Centrist Economics, learn about Robert Rubin's Hamilton Project. http://www1.hamiltonproject.org/es/hamilton/hamilton_hp.htm

      by PatriciaVa on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:09:43 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I tend to agree. (5+ / 0-)

        I think at this point that there's little upside in Obama embracing any kind of entitlement cuts.  The chances of Republicans going along with any sort of compromise are small at best.  I also think he knows this, and that he'll retool his message accordingly.

        No need to squabble girls. There's plenty of me to go around. - Pam from True Blood

        by fou on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:15:53 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  I bet the 53% contains a lot of Progressives (7+ / 0-)

        Is there a breakdown of the numbers of those who are pissed off at Obama for not standing his ground and being more progressive. Methinks there are others like me.

        If I had gotten a call for this poll in the last two weeks I would have registered a big F.U. to the President.  This is killing me.  I truly believed he was our "Warrior."

        I keep waiting fo the pushback, but I am almost done.  Like I have said before, I'll vote for him (assuming Bernie Sanders doesn't primary him) but not another red cent until he starts fighting back. I'm tired of the "red meat" rhetoric in front of progressive crowds, followed by complete capitualation in Washington. Never thought I would say this but I'm starting to feel "flim flammed" by this man.

        He can turn us around, but he needs to make a strong, grand gesture to his progressive "supporters."

        Meet the New Boss, Same as the Old Boss - P.Townsend

        by Chilipalmer on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 09:12:25 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Yes, this actually already happened... (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Geekesque, fou, TexasTom

      Last year. Republicans nominated teabagger extremists in Delaware, Colorado, and here in Nevada, and we ended up serving as the firewall that kept The US Senate Democratic. Harry Reid and Michael Bennet have already shown how to survive in a tough "anti-incumbent" environment. I bet President Obama has been taking notes since then.

    •  It's that credible contrast that's the problem. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      farbuska

      It's not so much that things aren't better than they are, it's that so much time has passed with so little being done or even tried.  Obama doesn't seem to care about the dire straits in which so many Americans find themselves.

      I'm my heart of hearts, I know that can't be true, but...

      when it comes to getting people on the job, there's not a lot of good material for that credible contrast and we are nearly 3 years into an administration that started out with a huge Congressional majority.

      Not really what you want to take into 2012.

      LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

      by dinotrac on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:40:44 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  I'm more than worried. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      rcnewton
    •  contrasts are nice...results are better (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      rcnewton, fou

      "But once John Boehner is sworn in as Speaker, then he’s going to have responsibilities to govern. You can’t just stand on the sidelines and be a bomb thrower." - President Obama, 12-07-2010

      by justmy2 on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 10:05:46 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  The debt ceiling debacle really was one (12+ / 0-)

    Especially for Obama.  Bill Daley strikes again.  Midas in reverse.

    Rick Perry is a monstrous lie.

    by Paleo on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:04:44 AM PDT

  •  And the Republicans succeeded (10+ / 0-)

    They know their electoral chances are more tied to Obama's disapproval than to their own approval.

    This is why their strategy is so hard to combat.

    August 16, 2011: Rick Perry will win the Presidency in 2012.

    by NoFortunateSon on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:05:08 AM PDT

    •  Not hard to combat (12+ / 0-)

      As long as you combat it.  By calling them out and pointing out exactly what they are doing and why.  Would be nice if that would be tried by this administration.  Even once.

      Rick Perry is a monstrous lie.

      by Paleo on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:11:11 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  It isn't hard to combat (0+ / 0-)

      it was outline from day one...they were straight forward...they said they wouldn't vote for him and said they wanted him to fail.  The response is not to give them everything they want hoping they will change...the response is to immediately draw a contrast and make it crystal clear what you want to do and if you have to compromise don't celebrate....hang it on their heads.

      Celebrating the stimulus was the first issue, and it has continued from there....we can argue over whether the compromise was required, but to no get any concessions or ownership from Republicans and then take full ownership of essentially "bipartisan" plan is and always will be a recipe for disaster...

      "But once John Boehner is sworn in as Speaker, then he’s going to have responsibilities to govern. You can’t just stand on the sidelines and be a bomb thrower." - President Obama, 12-07-2010

      by justmy2 on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 10:11:15 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  This poll is instructive as to why the President (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    atdnext

    addresses the issue of deficits.  Like it or not, the American voter has been conditioned to positively receive the GOP message (cut taxes and reduce spending).

    "Because I am a river to my people."

    by lordcopper on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:05:22 AM PDT

    •  ? (18+ / 0-)

      Where do you get that?  Far more people are concerned about jobs and unemployment than the deficit.

      Rick Perry is a monstrous lie.

      by Paleo on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:08:40 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  but they say this, too: (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        lordcopper

        Similarly, there has been little change in the widespread public perception that Obama favors a bigger federal government that offers more services.

        That highlights a major disconnect between Obama and the public. Only 38 percent of those polled say they favor a larger government with more services, while 56 percent say they favor a smaller government with fewer services.

        "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

        by Greg Dworkin on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:25:00 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  that's from the WaPo link (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          lordcopper

          "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

          by Greg Dworkin on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:25:19 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  That's a loaded question (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Palafox, farbuska

          And used, or more appropriately misused, constantly.

          In any event, people generally approval of conservative platitudes in theory, but when you get into specificity, the results change dramatically.

          Rick Perry is a monstrous lie.

          by Paleo on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:31:57 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  In the abstract that's completely (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          blueoasis, justmy2, farbuska

          plausible, but the reactions from even my most anti-tax and anti-government friends to the possibility of entitlement cuts and the debt ceiling deficit episode was highly negative.  If you bring it down to specific issues and outcomes, I think those numbers change.

        •  Two different truths. The deficit should not have (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          blueoasis, farbuska

          been a major Obama problem.  It rises up only because there is precious little body of "He's fighting for us and doing things that we need" on Obama's CV.

          His biggest achievement -- the Health Insurance reform bill -- hasn't yet kicked in fully and most people see little or no benefit as health insurance rates continue to rise.

          Meanwhile, long-term unemployment gets longer and longer.
          Even there -- his biggest accomplishment in the last two years was to get unemployment extended. That's not a bad thing in and of itself, but, in the absence of some visible job-creation fervor, risks sending the message that he's ok with joblessness and sees no problem with people continuing to scrape by on the scraps unemployment tosses, or, for that matter, the plight of those with no jobless benefits.

          LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

          by dinotrac on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:48:30 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Is that the same public which believes this: (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          blueoasis, lordcopper, farbuska

          (published November 2010)

          Asked to estimate how much of the federal budget goes to foreign aid the median estimate is 25 percent. Asked how much they thought would be an "appropriate" percentage the median response is 10 percent.

          In fact just 1 percent of the federal budget goes to foreign aid.

          American Public Vastly Overestimates Amount of U.S. Foreign Aid

        •  that is what the President has said (0+ / 0-)

          over and over again...it would be odd if they didn't say that...but that still doesn't mean they think deficit reduction is their number one goal...I don't think we can make the assumption that people equate the two, even though the result would be that.  I am just not sure people put all of it together.

          I just see people wanting to support the President, and willing to follow his lead.  It is just that his lead has been towards Republican policies, so we see that showing up in polls...

          "But once John Boehner is sworn in as Speaker, then he’s going to have responsibilities to govern. You can’t just stand on the sidelines and be a bomb thrower." - President Obama, 12-07-2010

          by justmy2 on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 10:15:34 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  I call it "California Budget Syndrome". (7+ / 0-)

      I'm originally from SoCal, so I'm familiar with people there actually believing Ahhnuld when he told them, "We cahn hav it OHLL!" For some reason, Americans have a hard time understanding that budget cuts WILL mean less money for public education, less money for heating assistance, and less money for JOB CREATION. We really need to educate voters more on what's actually in federal and state budgets.

    •  Treasuries are trading at yield of 1.92% (13+ / 0-)

      The bond market isn't worried about the deficit, and neither should President Obama.

      There is no polling data that supports Obama's infatuation with the deficit.

      Learn about Centrist Economics, learn about Robert Rubin's Hamilton Project. http://www1.hamiltonproject.org/es/hamilton/hamilton_hp.htm

      by PatriciaVa on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:15:54 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  a difference between message and policy: (4+ / 0-)
      Like it or not, the American voter has been conditioned to positively receive the GOP message (cut taxes and reduce spending).

      The same American voter, by and large, did not positively receive or respond to that message in 2008, and the GOP ran on exactly those things.

      Yes, it's true that voters may like the idea of certain things in the abstract ("lower taxes," "less government spending"), but when the actual policies are implemented from those principles -- like the Bush tax cuts and draconian spending cuts to public programs -- the voters generally don't like what they see.

      And besides, if you're correct that the Obama Administration is addressing the issue of deficits because they think voters will more positively respond to the GOP message of cutting taxes and reducing spending -- during a severe economic recession -- then that's an indictment of the Obama Administration for following the path of failed policy that should have been confined to the dustbin of history.

      This is why I don't agree with the notion that the President and his PR team have a "messaging" problem.  I think they have a policy problem.  The debt ceiling episode made that crystal clear.

      •  But they responded to it in 2010. Why is that? (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Beetwasher, rcnewton

        This is politics.  Sometimes "the public" is irrational.  A leader has to do the right thing, but he/she has to stay in office to do it.

        "Because I am a river to my people."

        by lordcopper on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:35:36 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  as I see it, a leader.... (6+ / 0-)

          also has to be the one who leads with his or her own vision and principles -- who leads and changes the narrative in a better direction -- and not merely follows the narrative of his opponents because he thinks its electorally convenient.  Adopting deficit cuts during a time of severe economic turmoil is not only bad messaging, it's bad policy.  That's not doing the right thing.

          •  That's a pretty weak argument. Your analysis (0+ / 0-)

            doesn't address the level of complexity in the American electorate.   But if that works for you, fine.

            "Because I am a river to my people."

            by lordcopper on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:59:36 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  right, and this: (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              blueoasis, rcnewton, Palafox
              This is politics.  Sometimes "the public" is irrational.

              is the hallmark of addressing the complexity of the American electorate.

              But hey, if you have an argument for why the President's proposals on the debt ceiling deal represent good policy, go for it.

              •  Recognize two facts. (0+ / 0-)

                1. The POTUS had two options in the debt ceiling deal.  Sign it or veto it.

                2. The Republicans control the House of Representatives.

                Given those two facts, the President had very little choice.  Now if you have facts that dispute that basic understanding, I'd be happy to hear it.

                "Because I am a river to my people."

                by lordcopper on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 09:08:47 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  those were not the options in April (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Palafox, farbuska

                  they were a direct result of piss poor policy and political decisions.

                  And even at the end, those were not the only options.  Another option was calling their bluff.  We can argue over whether it was viable, but it most certainly was a third option.

                  "But once John Boehner is sworn in as Speaker, then he’s going to have responsibilities to govern. You can’t just stand on the sidelines and be a bomb thrower." - President Obama, 12-07-2010

                  by justmy2 on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 10:23:34 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  And the subsequent downgrade would have been laid (0+ / 0-)

                    at the President's feet, and appropriately so.  There is no way around giving Republicans a voice in policy after giving them control of the House of Representatives.

                    "Because I am a river to my people."

                    by lordcopper on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 10:37:21 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

      •  It's both (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        rcnewton, blueoasis, farbuska

        a messaging problem and a policy problem.  I feel Obama's team doesn't use the bully pulpit enough to get out their own message and when the baggers do it and they see any positive reaction from it.....Obama's team says "Well let's move in that direction and see how that play out!"  (hence the bipartisan bs)

        Instead of taking their own policies to the voters and really trying to make it happen and see if low info voter will finally get it.    

        •  The problem is (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Palafox, farbuska

          the voters aren't listening to him anymore. It's all about what they see day-to-day in their own lives, and currently they are feeling under the couch cushions for quarters.

          "Whenever a fellow tells me he's bipartisan, I know he's going to vote against me."-- Harry S. Truman

          by irmaly on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 10:24:22 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  As a matter of fact (0+ / 0-)

        they did an incredible job in messaging around the debt ceiling debate...the flipped should the debt ceiling be raised  completely and a balanced approach became part of the lexicon...

        they just don't realize the power they have, or they are uninterested in pushing policies with a modicum of a chance to be successful...

        "But once John Boehner is sworn in as Speaker, then he’s going to have responsibilities to govern. You can’t just stand on the sidelines and be a bomb thrower." - President Obama, 12-07-2010

        by justmy2 on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 10:21:43 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  That's why you uncondition them. (13+ / 0-)

      You know...by telling them the truth and repeating it often.

      •  Not saying it's a totally bad idea... (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        lordcopper, Beetwasher
        You know...by telling them the truth and repeating it often.

        But didn't Jimmy Carter try that in 1979-80? And Walter Mondale in 1984? Again, I'm not saying it can't be done... But it's not easy to do, and it will take more than just one election cycle to undo 40 years of radical right conditioning.

        •  there are not enough Democrats making the case (6+ / 0-)

          for stimulus. All people hear is the GOP message and nothing else, over and over.

          "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

          by Greg Dworkin on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:27:06 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  They're all pointing to the President. (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            atdnext, Beetwasher, rcnewton

            "Because I am a river to my people."

            by lordcopper on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:37:09 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  GOP messages are simple. (0+ / 0-)

            Ours haven't been. What are we doing to make our message relatable to most Americans who don't pay as close attention to DC politics as we do?

          •  Obama/GOP Message The Same (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            blueoasis, Palafox

            Obama has been touting austerity since before the 2010 election. The Catfood Commission and the underlying philosophy behind it has been promoted since the Democrats had majorities in both houses of Congress.

          •  Should they be contradicting the President (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            farbuska

            Bernie Sanders does, but what if it were the majority of Democrats.  Wouldn't that have the same type of impact as a primary?

            I actually think they should push for what is right.  But I understand that when they break from the WH there better be a good reason. And wouldn't it be better in the WH led instead of looking for an opportunity to create separation from the house.  Think about if they would have embraced Pelosi success in November and started the process of laying the foundation for Republican obstruction causing limited policy success.

            At the time, they thought the recovery had sunk in (even though Geithner always said it would take a long time as CYA).  If they really had urgency, they would have been fighting.  It has just been an incompentent political team.  The President has to take some blame, but he can't do everything.  The team he chose has really steered him wrong, and that was pretty predictable when you basically choose a core DLC/Republican team, with limited progressive access.

            "But once John Boehner is sworn in as Speaker, then he’s going to have responsibilities to govern. You can’t just stand on the sidelines and be a bomb thrower." - President Obama, 12-07-2010

            by justmy2 on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 10:28:53 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  Of course its difficult. (10+ / 0-)

          But what you don't do is start repeating the words of your opponents because all that does is add to the conditioning and make your task more difficult.

          This is why President Obama has made a key mistake by repeating the Republican deficit rhetoric when what should be said is that we cannot fix the deficit without a strong economy.

          It should be obvious this should be said and said often, but he doesnt say it.

      •  Also known as "pissing into a prevailing wind". (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        drmah, irmaly

        "Because I am a river to my people."

        by lordcopper on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:36:34 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Because In 2 Years Obama Can Undo 40 Years (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        lordcopper

        Of propoganda.

        He's just not talking HARD enough!

        This post is dedicated to myself, without whom, I'd be somebody else. Though I'd still be an asshole. My Music: [http://www.myspace.com/beetwasher]

        by Beetwasher on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:58:47 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  He certainly can't do it... (6+ / 0-)

          ...by reptitiously adopting Republican talking points, like that stupid attempt to compare the government's budget to a family budget and saying that tax cuts create jobs.

          •  He Speaks In The Language People Have Learned (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            lordcopper

            For over 40 years.  99.99% of the public doesn't really understand these concepts any other way, so you have to speak to them in the language they understand.

            If you want to teach someone a new language you have to first start with the language they know and are used to and it doesn't happen overnight.

            This post is dedicated to myself, without whom, I'd be somebody else. Though I'd still be an asshole. My Music: [http://www.myspace.com/beetwasher]

            by Beetwasher on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 09:18:07 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Multiple years is not "overnight". (0+ / 0-)

              Obama didn't just get sworn in a few months ago; he's only got one year guaranteed left in his presidency.  It's time to get to some new language, not ambiguous suggestions that maybe we can do so some day in the distant future.

              •  Compared To 40 Years Of Propoganda, It Sure As (0+ / 0-)

                Hell is. 40 years of damage and you think one man alone should be able to just turn the conversation on it's head in two years?

                You don't want a President, you want either a dictator or a superhero.

                This post is dedicated to myself, without whom, I'd be somebody else. Though I'd still be an asshole. My Music: [http://www.myspace.com/beetwasher]

                by Beetwasher on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 12:17:54 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

      •  Tell the truth --- is this snark? (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        lordcopper
    •  i don't see that...but if I did...could it be (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Palafox

      because Democrats have aided and abetted

      "But once John Boehner is sworn in as Speaker, then he’s going to have responsibilities to govern. You can’t just stand on the sidelines and be a bomb thrower." - President Obama, 12-07-2010

      by justmy2 on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 10:12:24 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Ratings (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    psilocynic, snoopydawg, Palafox

    The continued interest in polls like this mystifies me. The president and congress (with a few exceptions, such as Bernie Sanders) not only don't care what the general public thinks -- they don't need to care.

  •  Maybe we need a ballot option (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Geekesque, rcnewton, blueoasis, schnecke21

    'fire everyone'.

  •  That's why he should be making significant (7+ / 0-)

    demands of Congress, not the other way around. They have dragged him into the abyss they are in.

    "How I hate those who are dedicated to producing conformity." William S Burroughs

    by shmuelman on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:07:14 AM PDT

  •  plus the PL should be (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    atdnext, PittsburghPete, jazzyjay, drmah

    happy his numbers are down. I mean that's what you wanted ....right? This should teach him to go against his "base."
    And his speech won't solved nuthin cause there was no public option and we are still mad.

    ok did I get all the talking points right??

    "This country was founded on compromise. I couldn't go through the front door at this country's founding" - President Barack Obama

    by AAMOM on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:07:34 AM PDT

  •  Who could have guessed.... (12+ / 0-)

    ...that focusing on the deficit would be so unpopular?

    The bond market is pricing the 10-year note at 1.92%, so it's very clear that it's not concerned about the deficit/debt.

    So why is President Obama so obsessed about it?

    Learn about Centrist Economics, learn about Robert Rubin's Hamilton Project. http://www1.hamiltonproject.org/es/hamilton/hamilton_hp.htm

    by PatriciaVa on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:07:40 AM PDT

  •  Well-deserved in both cases. (10+ / 0-)

    Fiddling the debt tune while our economy burned.

    On the deficit, which was at the heart of the pitched battle over the debt ceiling earlier this summer, Obama has reaped no dividends for trying to produce a compromise agreement with Republicans. Six in 10 disapprove of Obama’s work on the federal budget deficit, a percentage that is relatively unmoved in recent surveys and basically where it was a year ago.

    The WH is the Republicans' to lose in 2012, and the only comfort is that they are more than capable of doing just that.

    "[R]ather high-minded, if not a bit self-referential"--The Washington Post.

    by Geekesque on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:08:05 AM PDT

  •  I daresay that a significant percentage of (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    drmah, blueoasis

    those currently housed in the Wayne County jail awaiting arraignment would poll better than this Congress.  Of course, the 2010er TP reps think it means all the other reps, not them.  They've brought the class average way down.  And the other "class" average as well.

  •  It's the economy stupid :) ... I think once the (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    crescentdave, blueoasis

    country of 9% unemployment (and the 91% scared of slipping into the 9%) mixed with the collective ostrich act of the federal government ... extreme disapproval is both expected and frankly commendable.  American People know where the priorities ought to be.

  •  The headlines should read . . . (0+ / 0-)

    Obama twice as popular as Congress.

    Republicans are like alligators. All mouth and no ears.

    by Ohiodem1 on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:10:38 AM PDT

    •  But he won't be running against Congress (9+ / 0-)

      He'll be running against a GOPer who will argue that both the Legislative and Executive branch need fixing.

      Learn about Centrist Economics, learn about Robert Rubin's Hamilton Project. http://www1.hamiltonproject.org/es/hamilton/hamilton_hp.htm

      by PatriciaVa on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:17:01 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  that's like saying the Cincinnati Bengals (8+ / 0-)

      were twice as good as the Carolina Panthers in 2010.  And it's true, they were: Bengals won 4 games, Panthers won 2.  But neither record was good.

      •  The Bengals are never good, their management (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        rcnewton

        is not committed to winning, or that's my opinion based on long observation since the old man died.

        My comment was simply about the media spin and framing.  If Obama's ratings were 62 per cent positive one week, and dropped to 60 per cent the next, the headlines would read "Obama's ratings plummeting".

        Republicans are like alligators. All mouth and no ears.

        by Ohiodem1 on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:43:02 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  well, if you're complaining about spin, (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          DaveVentura, rcnewton, blueoasis, farbuska

          I would say that framing it as "Obama is twice as popular as the GOP" qualifies very much as spin, because that's trying to put a positive spin on a 43% approval rating.  It's possible that a 43% rating for a president is normal 32 months into his first term, but I don't see how anyone can look at it and conclude that things are going well without spinning it, regardless of how bad the Republicans are.

          •  I didn't say GOP, I said Congress. (0+ / 0-)

            Bush was re-elected (or should I say re-selected) in 2004 with the help of a bunch of wedge issues on state ballots in swing states.  His poll numbers were somewhat less than th 43 per cent we see here for Obama.  I'm not trying to make his case, he has to do that himself.  Only Pollyana would conclude that things are going well, and that doesn't describe me.

            In these times of 24/7 media attacks, it is likely a 43 per cent approval rating president has a reasonable chance to win the election.  Reagan also had low ratings at this point in his presidency.

            Take it or leave it, I was commenting about the presentation of the news, not the news itself.  I'm done here.

            Republicans are like alligators. All mouth and no ears.

            by Ohiodem1 on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 09:03:22 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Reagan & Obama not comparable (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Bailey2001, Alexander G Rubio

              At this point, in President Reagan's presidency the economy was adding over 1 million jobs a month and the public quickly gave the President confidence of the boom.  

              There is simply no evidence of any sort of recovery under President Obama, in fact, most/many of us believe the recession never really ended and we are slipping into a more difficult situation.

              Therein lies the difference.

  •  He's getting what he deserved for capitulating (8+ / 0-)

    to the Tea Party, and not doing what the people want.

    With his fetish for deficit reduction, he is repeating the mistakes of 1936-37 and is driving this country into a deeper recession.  Even without good economic advisers, one would think that he had studied history, so that he would know what happened when they tried to balance the budget as recovery was just begining.

    He either doesn't know history, or his eagerness to please Republicans (and a minority of them, at that) has trumped his interest in doing what's right for the country.

    •  The last three years (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      rcnewton

      have seen the three largest deficits in the history of the country. Not much of a fetish imo.

      •  Why are our deficits so big? (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Palafox, cpresley, farbuska, schnecke21

        One, Bush tax cuts.  Two, multiple wars.  All of which to this day continue.

        •  Sorry, that doesn't cut it (0+ / 0-)

          The Bush cuts have been in place since 2002.  The Wars have been raging since 2001.  So why have the deficits only exploded since the Democrats took the Congress in 2006? And accelerated since the President took over in 2009?

          Yes, the economy has faltered making tax receipts run flat, but spending is up almost 30%.  That is the root cause of our huge deficits.

          •  "Spending is up", yes, on wars. (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Palafox, schnecke21

            When Bush was in office, we didn't keep the war on the budget, it was all payed for with "suplimental" spending bills, not the budget bill.  When Obama came into office, one thing he changed was that we were going to stop pretending we weren't spending a shitload on war by fuding it through those suplimentals; the costs that we had been accruing throughout the Bush years from the wars were finally counted as part of our budget.

            And you might want to ignore the effect the Bush tax cuts has had on the deficit, but it's huge and is the biggest driver of the deficit now.

            •  Increased Spending is problem per gov't budget fig (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              runners glen

              The claim that the wars are the primary driver of increased spending doesn't jibe with gov't budget figures.  Tax revenue has been flat basically since 2007 - when the Bush tax cuts were already 5 years old.  The deficit is being driven by increased spending.

              Revenue is down due to the recession, but the declines pale in comparison to the huge growth in the deficit because gov't spending is so much higher than even five years ago.

              Supporting Figures:

              FY 2011 (Est)
              Total revenue $2.17 trillion (estimated)
              Total expenditures $3.82 trillion (estimated)
              Deficit $1.65 trillion (estimated)
              Iraq/Afghanistan  159 Billion

              2010
              Total revenue $2.381 trillion (estimated)
              Total expenditures $3.552 trillion (estimated)
              Deficit $1.171 trillion (estimated)
              Iraq/Afghanistan 139 Billion

              2008
              Total revenue $2.7 trillion (estimated)
              Total expenditures $2.9 trillion (estimated)
              Deficit 454.8 billion (actual)
              Iraq/Afghanistan 190 Billion (Iraq surge)

              2006
              Total revenue $2.41 trillion
              Total expenditures $2.66 trillion
              Deficit $248.2 billion
              Iraq/Afghanistan 122 Billion

  •  Have those polled seen teh awesome photo (11+ / 0-)

    diaries?

    No?

    That must explain it.

    It couldn't possibly have anything to do with Obama's policies and acting as the Plutocrat's hand-maiden, could it?

    Mr. Shared Sacrifice = the Pied Piper of Austerity. Such a beautiful performance, I can hardly resist clapping.

    by Johnathan Ivan on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:14:40 AM PDT

  •  Obama Can Come Back, Repubs Can't (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    atdnext, PittsburghPete, AAMOM, drmah

    That's the dynamic that has been set up. Obama can and IMO, will turn this around starting with the Fall offensive that we are beginning to see emerge.

    Repubs are dug in and entrenched. They aren't moving and they aren't going to improve their standing one bit.  The are going to do more of the same, and possibly even slide further into the abyss as Obama clearly contrasts himself and Democrats against the lunatic, Repub Obstruction.

    This post is dedicated to myself, without whom, I'd be somebody else. Though I'd still be an asshole. My Music: [http://www.myspace.com/beetwasher]

    by Beetwasher on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:17:29 AM PDT

    •  One Problem with that (0+ / 0-)

      The R's as a group don't have to come back. Assume for a minute Perry is the nominee - the R's will rise if Perry does well. And he should not be under-estimated. He has shown he can win elections, albeit at the state level. I think Obama will have his hands full. If Perry does well, the rest of his party will benefit. Of course, if he doesn't, I think we are kind of back where we are - because I don't see Obama having coat tails this time around.

      The liver is evil - It must be destroyed

      by somewhere in ohio on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 12:03:12 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  aren't they besties? They should have the same (0+ / 0-)

    approval.

    Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell. --Edward Abbey

    by greenbastard on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:17:56 AM PDT

  •  Time to nationalize Congressional elections (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    TheCrank, blueoasis

    Every other approach having failed, maybe the geniuses in the WH will finally turn to what they should have been doing from the beginning -- offering an alternative to the other party's solutions.

    The president needs to offer a plan to increase spending -- dramatically -- in order to finance a New Deal style jobs program, because we are in the Lesser Depression.  Of course this plan is going nowhere as long as the Rs hold the House.  Therefore, if the electorate wants to at least halt, if not reverse, the Lesser Depression, it needs to throw the bums on the R side of the House out.

    Sure, this might not work at winning the next election.  It might backfire, resulting in an R trifecta.  The electorate may buy the part about it being time to let one party or the other have a chance to get us out of the ditch, but decide to try the Rs first.  But, win lose or draw, you can't expect the electorate to trust us over the Rs with this battered economy until and unless our side is willing to differentiate itself from them.  Only then do we get a chance at trying our solutions, if only the second chance after the R "solutions" have made the country hit bottom.

    We should have destroyed the presidency before Obama took office. Too late now.

    by gtomkins on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:21:20 AM PDT

  •  Obama Needs To Renounce His Use of GOP Strategies (5+ / 0-)
    For the last decade America has been on a grand experiment to prove that cutting taxes for the wealthy produce jobs.   America is now united on one point - eliminating taxes on the rich do not create jobs. I join America in renouncing this nonsensical Republican ideology that threatens to destroy the nation.

    There’s always free cheddar in a mousetrap, baby

    by bernardpliers on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:21:23 AM PDT

  •  looks like Clinton will remain the (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    rcnewton

    only Democrat to have won presidential re-election in my lifetime.

  •  if I were in the WH (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Palafox

    since the douchebag brothers make all their money off the public/govt contracts, I would have the IRS, SEC, FBI and every other regulatory agency that even has the slightest to do with them up their asses 24/7.

    Fuck them.

    Bad is never good until worse happens

    by dark daze on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:22:26 AM PDT

  •  Here's what I don't understand. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    drmah, blueoasis

    The Goopers took the economy and confidence off a cliff with their absolutism on the debt ceiling this summer.

    They caved the market and killed job creation.

    Why is no one on our side pointing this out, over and over and over and over and every fucking time they get on TV?

    They are not only NOT the party who will save our economy, they are ACTIVELY WRECKING IT AS WE SPEAK.

    What is so hard to say about that?  Sheesh.

    Still enjoying my stimulus package.

    by Kevvboy on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 08:26:27 AM PDT

    •  this might work (0+ / 0-)

      if the economy were  perceived as doing well beforehand. But it was not, so the strategy won't get very far.

      The republicans actually could play that hand better, saying look how things were going until the democrats took congress in 2006.

      •  No. (0+ / 0-)

        A large majority of Americans agree that Bush is much more responsible for the beginning of the economic disaster than Obama.  What has not been pinned successfully on the Goopers is their sabotage THIS YEAR of the recovery, which was actually rather well underway until they created uncertainty with their debt ceiling debacle.

        And yet, somehow, they are not made to OWN it.

        Still enjoying my stimulus package.

        by Kevvboy on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 09:07:31 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  because a nonzero number of Democrats (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      blueoasis

      with bullhorns (and some cases, those with the largest bullhorns of them all) kinda sorta endorse the GOP version here.

  •  This Was Expected In The Sense That (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    rcnewton, blueoasis, farbuska

    the administration continued to reject the base but embrace an improper direction.

  •  It's going to come down to the Baby Boomers.... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    drmah, Alexander G Rubio

    Now that they will be benefitting from social security...Will they vote to keep it solvent for the next generation....???

  •  Trouble with these polls is that the GOP Jihadists (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    drmah

    would rather commit suicide than to have Obama win another term.

  •  Don't pay attention to the Polls (5+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    drmah, TheCrank, rcnewton, blueoasis, farbuska

    Didn't you see the diary with the pretty pictures of Obama in Detroit yesterday surrounded by millions of people the love and adore him.

    "The farther you enter the truth, the deeper it is" Bankei Zenji

    by treeuggerIT on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 09:14:15 AM PDT

  •  Poll Numbers NOT "Collapsing" (0+ / 0-)

    Look, I don't approve of the way Obama is handling the economy in the sense that the Deficit reduction deal is a major land mine for recovery. But I approve of the vast majority of Obama's main poicies. And so, according to the SAME POLL CITED HERE (see Greg Sargent's column in today's Washington Post) do the MAJORITY OR PLURALITY OF AMERICANS POLLED on EVERY ONE OF THE PRESIDENT'S INDIVIDUAL POLICIES.

    Dissatisfaction with the economy is not the metric of good policy or electability. How many people were satisfied with the economy in 1936, before FDR won a landslide re-election?

    Let us NOT get caught up in a self-defeating cycle of self-fulfilling prophecy. Democrats win on domestic policy, and hidden away in all this is the traditional weakness, foreign policy and military affairs, shows Obama with huge support. (Deservedly so.)

    The simple fact is that if we STAY ON THE ISSUES, and don't get sucked into the usual combination of horse race obsession and debate about non-issues that is the Republicans' only real tactic (from flag burning to Al Gore is a Liar to October Surprises) the message will win.

    Some people are intolerant, and I CAN'T STAND people like that. -- Tom Lehrer

    by TheCrank on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 09:47:53 AM PDT

  •  the public engages in magical thinking (0+ / 0-)

    How can Obama do anything about the economy with the do-nothing republican House. The republicans want the economy to do baldy, and unemployment to remain high, so they can blame Obama ,and win the next election..then they will dismantle the fed government, and destroy our democracy.

    •  Obama Said He Was With Smog, No Congress Needed (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Palafox

      Obama himself is saying that he can unilaterally do things about jobs because he himself just did that with the smog regulations. Obama can't be both powerless to being able to independently do things about jobs, while at the same time he has the power to do something about jobs. Regardless of whether or not the smog regulations were good, Obama by his actions is stepping on the I'm powerless message by showing that he isn't powerless.

  •  A month ago, the day after the debt (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    rcnewton, Jazzenterprises

    deal, there were a bunch of diaries about the President's poll numbers going up.  And I said show me the number's 1 month from now when the details sink in.  I said I doubt we will see a bunch of recced diaries.  As anticipated...

    But I also said, the only number that matters in UE in June 2012.  I still stand by that.

    "But once John Boehner is sworn in as Speaker, then he’s going to have responsibilities to govern. You can’t just stand on the sidelines and be a bomb thrower." - President Obama, 12-07-2010

    by justmy2 on Tue Sep 06, 2011 at 10:04:04 AM PDT

  •  Obama's Last Chance (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    farbuska, Alexander G Rubio

    Looks like Obama's jobs bill is his last chance. If he caves to Republicans on this one, or worse, if he lets Republicans again run the entire show, he's politically dead.

    America now perceives Obama to be too weak and cowardly for the job. Another public confirmation of this suspicion will finish the guy.

    Obama doesn't seem to understand that Republicans don't like him and will never cooperate with him, and that it's to the Republican advantage to see him fail. I find this incredible, but the more I watch, the more this seems to be the case.

    All the GOP has to do next week to finish off Obama is to promise cooperation - like Boehner did with the jobs speech - and then pull the rug out from under Obama one more time. Like Boehner did last week with the jobs speech.  

    And the idea that Republicans are too nice to finish off their political enemy this way is just silly.

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