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Here the Oakland Police Department claims they were attacked by protesters.

Do they really not know they are being recorded? In some cases on livestream?

Update on Occupy Activities in Downtown Oakland – 4:30 pm(PDF)

Oakland, CA – By 12 pm, a crowd of approximately 250 had gathered in Frank
Ogawa Plaza for the Occupy rally. Just before 1:30 pm, the group started
marching southbound on Broadway. As the group of approximately 450
marched, traffic disruptions occurred on downtown streets. At approximately
2:15 pm, some of the marchers entered the campus of Laney College.
At 2:30 pm, marchers began tearing down perimeter fences around the Henry J.
Kaiser Convention Center.

At approximately 2:50 pm, the first dispersal order
was given as the crowd began destroying construction equipment and fencing.
Officers were pelted with bottles, metal pipe, rocks, spray cans, improvised
explosive devices and burning flares. Oakland Police Department deployed
smoke and tear gas.

By 4 pm, the bulk of the Occupy crowd of approximately 500 has returned to
Frank Ogawa Plaza.

As of this release, 19 protesters have been arrested. Most of the arrests were
made on Oak Street when protesters ignored the dispersal order and assaulted
officers. Three officers are confirmed to have been injured.
Mutual aid has been requested.

See for yourself that the only objects thrown at the Oakland Police department were after they were fired upon and began returning gas canisters to the police line.

From OakFoSho's feed 14:00 Minutes in is when the police attack:


Video streaming by Ustream

BTW OPD shooting tear gas up wind is a tactical fail. But your learning curve is slow and you will be policing with radios only soon since you obviously do not know how to handle weapons in a manner that does not escalate force.

Originally posted to Occupy Wall Street on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 12:20 AM PST.

Also republished by The Rebel Alliance.

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Comment Preferences

  •  How much of this is black bloc? (6+ / 0-)

    and how much is mainstream occupy?

    •  black block is endemic around here. (9+ / 0-)

      Their tactics have been the same for the past 30 years:  Start something with the police, subtly provoke a riot, and then claim they're victims.  All in the vain attempt to hit the trigger point for The Revolution.

      Whether the present "festivities" are black blockers remains to be seen, but if I wasn't working tonight (writing these comments while waiting for connections to go through and batches to load) I'd review some of the videos.  The ones from the shitstorm of window-smashing last year: those were definitely black blockers, in "uniform" no less.

      There is no reasoning with these people any more than with the religious right.  The do it because it gives them immediate visceral and emotional gratification.  The political explanations are just the "explanation," but the emotions come first.

      Okeydoke, me go back to work now...

      "Minus two votes for the Democrat" equals "plus one vote for the Republican." Arithmetic doesn't care about your feelings.

      by G2geek on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 02:15:38 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  and that is well known (4+ / 0-)

        A smarter police response would have been blaring blame at black block, emphasizing the awkward position it puts them in trying to police peaceful protests while a violent minority destroy civility for others. Except that would have been informed - whoops! Can't have that, huh?

        •  that would be the obvious thing to do (2+ / 0-)

           if you actually had

               a) a Black Bloc that actually was determined to provoke and initiate acts of violence whatever the police do, and

               b) a police department that did not wish to attack peaceful protestors as a way of discouraging political opposition.

          The problem is not once, ever, have the police ever adopted the strategy you recommend, despite it being obvious. Ever occur to you to ask why? Do you really think that ever single time every police department in America is guilty of exactly the same sort of cluelessness?

          Or might it be that cops actually do attack non-violent protestors for political reasons and Black Blocs tend to form because people get angry about it - and angry about people like you who make excuses for them and always come up with some way to blame the victims.

          That might for instance explain why Oakland, which has one of the most notoriously violent police forces in the country, also has the biggest Black Bloc

          •  The Problem (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            philipmerrill, G2geek

            Is when they are not local and get arrested: "Outside Agitators".

            But then, free expression and/or civil disobedience is ultimately a personal choice, wherever, whenever, no?

            And, ultimately, decisions to shoot tear gas and/or rubber bullets.

            Politics: 2 or more people.

            What about my Daughter's future?

            by koNko on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 10:34:10 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

          •  yeah, I thought of that (0+ / 0-)

            Actually, I also assumed some of the agitators were undercover law enforcement. I also assume the play is dictated by 1%-ers, who are the real intended audience for the press releases. But if public regard for police was the goal of the PR, they could at least issue more well-informed and sophisticated press releases even if their actions were corrupt all the same. I still say the PR language was primitive, misguided, and ill-informed.

            •  all it takes is 1 provocateur and a dozen hotheads (0+ / 0-)

              ... to start a riot.

              The hotheads need to take responsibility for the fact that they've been playing into provocateurs' hands.  And they need to take responsibility for their own behavior rather than bleat the usual BS about "those people made me do it."

              Nobody made them do anything, unless they have no free will of their own.  
              Or perhaps they're all provocateurs.  

              "Minus two votes for the Democrat" equals "plus one vote for the Republican." Arithmetic doesn't care about your feelings.

              by G2geek on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 09:31:44 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  you still seem to think (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                An Affirming Flame

                that the protestors started it and the police responded

                since every time the Oakland police claimed this in the past it later ensued that they were lying, why are you accepting their story now and assuming some "hothead" provoked them?

                this is what I don't understand. We go through this again and again. The police tell one story. The protestors tell another. You guys believe the police. Evidence is produced which shows the police were flagrantly lying. Another event. The police tell one story. The protestors tell another. You guys still believe the police. Evidence is produced which shows the police were flagrantly lying. Another event. The police tell one story. The protestors tell another. You guys still believe the police. Evidence is produced which shows the police were flagrantly lying....

                when are you going to learn?

                •  IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO STARTED IT, DAMMIT! (0+ / 0-)

                  What matters, the ONLY thing that we have control over, is how WE conduct OURSELVES.

                  That means no provocation, no throwing shit, no smashing shit, no spraypainting on shit.  No calling "PIGS!," no burning flags, no other violent rhetoric.  And it damn well also ought to mean no drinking or other drugs at protests, because people whose brains are addled can't be counted on to handle themselves in rapidly-changing situations.  

                  The only legitimate purposes of protests are a) to get elected officials to change policies, b) to change voters' opinions and win votes to replace those elected officials, c) to change consumers' behaviors (such as by moving their money out of BofA and into credit unions), d) to encourage more people to join a specific cause, or d) with peaceful civil disobedience, to obtain court judgements that force elected officials to change policies.  

                  Option (a) has been blown as far as Oakland city gov is concerned.  Option (b) is rapidly losing ground with every riot that breaks out.  

                  When a tactic doesn't work, change the damn tactic.  To keep repeating a failed tactic over and over again is a sign of being insane, or having a different agenda.  Like the agenda of provoking a Tienenman Square affair in order to trigger The Revolution.  Or the agenda of provoking riots to the point of persuading voters to vote Republican.  And those are not legitimate goals, all the more so when they're being done with unsuspecting people as pawns.

                  Protest, like poetry, isn't about self-expression.  It's about using communication in a precise manner to convey an intended message.  

                  But here's a little secret: the message that's conveyed, is assumed to be the message that's intended.

                  "Minus two votes for the Democrat" equals "plus one vote for the Republican." Arithmetic doesn't care about your feelings.

                  by G2geek on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 11:50:35 PM PST

                  [ Parent ]

              •  I maintain my primary source of frustration with (0+ / 0-)

                violence is that it's used in an otherwise peaceful protest. IF the black block wants to start it's own shit, they should get their own fucking protest and call it "smash shit 2012." not "occupy oakland" these assholes hijack otherwise peaceful movements which in turn allows the media to blame violence on Occupy, thus discrediting the movement. IT wouldn't be nearly as detrimental if these "violent assholes" did us the decency of at least getting their own protest instead of hijacking an already existing one, and that, my friend, is why I currently hate them.

                I Can sympathize, with the emotional response of said individuals. I too am EXTREMELY frustrated.. But I Will say this: there is a thick line between fantasy and action.  While I might ildly wish I could smash some shit, I Have never, and will never actually do it, and even if I did I would never, hurt Actual people, just property. all of that said I condemn said tactics, just because I can sympathize with the rage behind them doesn't mean I personally condone them. And that's been a very hard line for me to personally walk, as I'm sure you saw evidenced in the message I Sent you (For which I apologize)

                I still strongly believe that what makes the black block so toxic is that they don't start their own movement, they hijack existing ones, for which I cannot forgive them.

       If the dnc dscc or dccc send you mailers, send that link back to them and tell them you won't send money to people who defend democrats who betray progressive principals! up yours!

                by daeros on Mon Jan 30, 2012 at 08:33:27 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

  •  Seems like flares went toward the cops... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    elwior, Horace Boothroyd III that second video.

    Is that an optical illusion or something?

    If Obama doesn't deserve credit for getting Bin Laden because he didn't pull the trigger, Bin Laden doesn't deserve the blame for 9-11 because he didn't fly the planes.

    by Bush Bites on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 01:10:55 AM PST

  •  Oh jeez... stop the presses... (8+ / 0-)

    The police are lying and attacking protestors... again...

    Whaddya think?  Small mention underneath Ziggy this time?

    Oh wait, there was protestor retaliation.  Front page!  Evil people!  Time to trot out the "Wounded" officers and give them medals for attacking innocent people.

    God FORBID one of them might get hit with a rock.  As opposed to the troops in Iraq who had orders not to fire back even if they got SHOT at...  (No specifically identified target, No fire.  And NO, I'm not kidding)

    One of these days, I'm gonna learn that I'm only really good at convincing people when I'm being a wiseass.

    by detroitmechworks on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 01:13:40 AM PST

  •  In the fourth video down, the videographer (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    G2geek, elwior, erush1345

    comments to the crowd he is in, "Stop throwing things at the cops, you'll just piss them off"

    Occupy The Voting Booth - vote for candidates that represent your Occupy values.

    by mumtaznepal on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 02:01:05 AM PST

    •  now what we need is the time-stamp on that video (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      philipmerrill, erush1345

      ... because I'm willing to bet that it came before a bunch of nastiness set in and shit escalated.

      Thanks again to the black block, who are neither black nor from around the block, for stirring up more shit to get their jollies at the expense of the rest of the movement.

      "Minus two votes for the Democrat" equals "plus one vote for the Republican." Arithmetic doesn't care about your feelings.

      by G2geek on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 02:18:18 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  I guess this is what happens (2+ / 0-)

        when someone is so biased by vitriol against one group of protestors he dislikes that he already knows they must be guilty, and the police, therefore, innocent, and looks at evidence only long enough to find something that looks like it might affirm his biases

        real credible there

        •  oh BS. (0+ / 0-)

          I've been around here long enough to have seen this bullshit play out time and time and time again.

          To paraphrase the tired old RCP slogan,

          "A tactic - defeated - will always be repeated!"

          "Minus two votes for the Democrat" equals "plus one vote for the Republican." Arithmetic doesn't care about your feelings.

          by G2geek on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 09:23:58 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  you also (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            An Affirming Flame

            seem to have a bizarre inability to notice when the police tell lies, claiming provocation, it's proved that they were lying, they tell them again, it's proved that they were lying, they tell them again, it's proved that they were lying... There's a certain willful blindness here it seems to me.

            •  did you see the video yesterday... (0+ / 0-)

              .... where one of the protesters is heard saying to another, "don't throw stuff at the cops, you'll piss 'em off!"....?

              Look, cut the Israeli/Palestinian-style bullshit.  Oh, it's THEIR FAULT!  Right, I've heard it a million times and after the first 800,000 or so times it starts to wear thin.  

              I don't give a flying fuck if the cops are lying, because WE have no control over what they do.

              What I give a flying fuck about is what WE are doing and aren't doing, because WE have control over what WE do.

              And that includes setting up an affinity group structure where every single last person who comes to a demonstration has had the full 8-hour nonviolence training, and where people who throw shit and break shit are thrown the hell out and not allowed to come back.  As in, "If you're going to be part of this, you have to live by our rules, and those rules include no throwing shit, no breaking shit, no provoking shit.  Otherwise if we see you doing anything like that, it's going to be us who surround you and prevent you getting away until you can be arrested.  And it's going to be us who testify about it in court."

              If we can't be well-enough organized to prevent provocateurs and their useful idiots from spotlight-stealing and pissing all over a demonstration, maybe it's time to reformat the proverbial hard drive and start from scratch.

              "Minus two votes for the Democrat" equals "plus one vote for the Republican." Arithmetic doesn't care about your feelings.

              by G2geek on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 11:36:37 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  you don't seem to be part of that "we" (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                An Affirming Flame

                   as far as I'm concerned

                   I was there. I saw the cops attack non-violent protestors as far as I'm concerned.

                The fact that you are more full of hate at your fellow protestors you basically don't care about that, say its irrelevant, but get furious when people who've been attacked, or see people they love be attacked, respond even by insulting police, and say that's all that matters, shows to me you have no sense of solidarity with your brothers and sisters and probably shouldn't be going to these events at all.

                    There is a classic stereotype in protest movements - the violent pacifist. Rarely have I seen anyone who so perfectly fit that stereotype. On the streets I saw beautiful people who loved each other and loved humanity supporting each other and trying to change the world. Then I get on the internet and I see someone like you spewing hate and vitriol, cursing and yelling - not the cops, who attacked people trying to exercise their constitutional rights, but the victims, but some of them didn't respond in ways that you would have preferred.

                    I think you need to take a serious look at how you got to this place. Your behavior is helping no one. You might think the presence of a Black Bloc makes it easier for the cops to attack non-violent protestors - but you yourself admit they lie, make up provocations, and attack anyway. In fact it's mainly PEOPLE LIKE YOU who make it easy for the cops to attack non-violent protestors, because you refuse to form a common front and denounce the cops for doing so. I wasn't part of the Black Bloc. I was a totally non-violent protestor. But I also see you as endangering my personal safety in the streets a thousand times more than a bunch of black-clad insurrectionaries with plastic shields, and if I had gotten injured, I would have put the blame first squarely on the shoulders of the cops, second, on the media, and third, on people like you.

      •  I was watching almost non stop (3+ / 0-)

        from the time the cops got there to "protect" that defenseless building. They lined up with their forces and put that orange fencing in front of them. Realizing that the cops wouldn't let them complete the action the marchers left and started downtown. It didn't take the cops long to leave the defenseless building and start protecting innocent downtown intersections. And they started with their "this is an unlawful assembly....." bs. The confrontation was begun by the cops because people didn't disperse. So they shot flash bangs.

        Again, somebody got hurt and marchers went to their aid and the cops fired on them even though they were shouting for a medic. Almost identical to Scott Olsen's attacks from the cops.

        When the cops fired tear gas they wound up gassing the journalists who were close to their line because the wind was in their faces.

        From then on the marchers were pursued by the cops harassing them. The cops didn't arrest them until hours of chasing them through downtown. The cops would suddenly swoop down on somebody, running up on the group and cutting somebody out and then they would arrest the person and go back to harassing everybody else.

        There were two things I saw pitched at the cops. One was a smallish something that somebody speculated was a rubber bullet and another was a plastic chair. Neither presented any danger to anybody at that point.

        Congress is at 9% approval rating - within the +/- of making herpes more popular than congress! - Webranding

        by glitterscale on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 11:15:28 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  the "let's take over a building" stuff.... (0+ / 0-)

          ... is 100% guaranteed to trigger an overreaction from OPD.

          Anyone who's been around here longer than six months knows it.  And anyone who knows it and persists, is effectively doing the provocateurs' work for them.

          "Minus two votes for the Democrat" equals "plus one vote for the Republican." Arithmetic doesn't care about your feelings.

          by G2geek on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 09:26:32 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  S'okay (0+ / 0-)

            First off protests are done for a purpose. That purpose is to highlight injustices and wrongs.

            Second without protests we remain lodged in the status quo. You are free to open up your  ideas and your strategy for change. You can even create an entire diary! Go for it. Tell us why nothing need be done or tell us what you think will be successful.

            Third, the idea of the Occupy movement is to connote the willingness to stay with the ideas and protest agendas. Too many times we have had civilized protests and then went home and nothing happened.

            Fourth, protests cannot be successful if a) there are no complaints about how things are done or b) if nobody shows up. If you think there are no justifiable complaints you may be in the minority on the streets of Oakland.

            Fifth, the best kinds of protests are those that actually are able to highlight the ills that are created by the ptb. This particular scenario that the protesters were using was to point out that there ARE community resources that are not being put to use to benefit the 99%. I believe that the ptb feared this immensely. None of the 1% supporters ever want people to feel that the community and its resources actually belong to the community. There were a lot of folks touting property rights yesterday. This points out how that knee jerk or dog whistle was used by the city and the ptb. This was not about a man and his beloved and sacrosanct castle (although several million Americans are finding out how sacrosanct THAT is anymore.) This was all about the community supporting its members. This is not something that the 1% can allow to take hold.

            Sixth, everybody has options in these cases but appear not to have any at all. The protesters had more than one fallback plan. The city and the cops only had one plan. Their plan was to make it appear as if the protest movement was violent and to create and much noise and havoc as possible and then beat protesters and abuse them and then, if cornered, arrest them. The latter plan worked beautifully. You seem to be caught up in the scenario that they have painted and if there is one of you there are many.

            Seventh, it is best to keep everything transparent as much as possible (on the protesters side at least) and ensure as much footage was taken of the event as possible.

            Congress is at 9% approval rating - within the +/- of making herpes more popular than congress! - Webranding

            by glitterscale on Mon Jan 30, 2012 at 11:26:53 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

    •  I've watched it twice (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Horace Boothroyd III

      Where does he say that?

      "I've had all I can stands, and I can't stands no more." - Popeye the Sailor Man

      by congenitalefty on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 08:08:07 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  and they should have credibility why? (4+ / 0-)

    Seriously - not among us - but our message outside our group: How is Oakland PD credible at this point? Their views are as solid as Romney's stated convictions. No matter how much good might exist in that department or struggle on despite the demands of the job, this is already a department in disgrace, mismanaging their local policing demands. The situation called for better. Their mismanagement is PR nightmare #1. Their PR-lies is PR nightmare #2. The Oakland PD is a sad force. Encouraging others not to give their statements credibility is a shoe others will discover fits.

  •  People lacking in self-awareness do not (5+ / 0-)

    know they are being watched.  These cops live in a bubble.  They have been selected for their jobs because they do what they are told, when they are told.  If there's a break-down in communications, most are not able to act on their own.  They do not know the law; they do not know how to use discretion; they have been trained to obey commands.  If they expect anything, it's that those to whom they pass on the commands will obey, as well.  That citizens have no obligation to be compliant doesn't register.  It's obviously not part of their training.

    If you watched the Capitol Hill police, you might have noticed that they framed their interactions as requests.  "Please" is short hand for "if it pleases you."  In other words, there's a condition that recognizes a person's right not to act and ask that the reluctance be overcome. "Please" implies respect.  The cops in Oakland have no respect. That the Mayor has been co-opted by the bureaucracy suggests a systemic problem.  All segments of public and private corporations are liable to being corrupted by the lust for power.

    People to Wall Street: "LET OUR MONEY GO"

    by hannah on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 03:31:38 AM PST

  •  That's kind of what I was trying to say last (2+ / 0-)

    night in another post that I wrote regarding the AP release.  The facts didn't really match the videos, and that the PR damage that AP took upon themselves to relaease was blatenly slanted against the OWS protesters.  

    Just the first of the lies about just what really happened as we have read from other sources.

    "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible, will make violent revolution, inevitable." - President John F. Kennedy (1917 - 1963)

    by LamontCranston on Sun Jan 29, 2012 at 08:35:05 AM PST

  •  what's the story with the flag burning (0+ / 0-)

    All the news outlets are posting and my conservative friends have already starting echoing ...

    If this is true, it's not very helpful. Exactly what Faux News would wish for.

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