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Mitt Romney says military and troops are the same thing.

He's dead wrong, for the same reason that corporations are not people.

People have hearts. They have kids. They get jobs. They get sick. They thrive. They dance. They live. They love. And they die. And that matters. That matters. That matters because we don’t run this country for corporations, we run it for people.
Romney continues to deny the fundamental humanity of human beings, while promoting the lie that non-human entities deserve the full rights of citizenship.

Republicans largely agree with him, in practice if not in theory.

Why does this matter?

It matters because we are at a fundamental crossroads in American history, where unborn children are given more rights than the women whose bodies are nurturing them.  We're at a time in history where money is treated as speech, and therefore can be used to drown out the voices of ordinary Americans like Elaine Brye.

Funding our "military" could mean paying government contractors for no-bid contracts, while denying veterans access to jobs, housing, and education.  Funding "troops" means ensuring that we don't put them in harm's way without giving them the compensation, protection, and dignity they deserve.  Funding our "military" could involve funding the machinery of war without protecting the human rights of warriors.

War is bad enough, in all the ways that it dehumanizes us.   Wars force warriors into life and death decisions that go far beyond anything that the "pro-life" movement should be able to tolerate.

I've been a therapist with military families for the past several months, and I've heard the stories.  One gunner told me of the time that he lost it and indiscriminately shot into an Afghan village, killing a family's goat in cold blood because he was tired of the insurgent's bullets whizzing over his head.  Another soldier told me of the time that his helicopter lost control and he nearly died as a result of the equipment failure. The nightmares haunt him to this day.

Helicopters don't have nightmares.

What irritates me most is this idea from the Republicans that "peace through strength" means entitlement to bully other human beings in order to obtain military advantage.  On this point, even Joe Biden's claim that we should pursue Bin Laden "through heaven and hell" is troubling to me.  And while I agree that those who commit atrocities should be brought to justice, I'm still troubled sometimes by the knowledge that Bin Laden was never brought to trial and we have detainees in Gitmo who are still being held simply because they're suspicious - not because they committed crimes but because they know someone who has.

There is no true peace that comes from killing civilians.  There is nothing "pro-life" about cheering when soldiers urinate on dead corpses, no matter what was done by the persons whose bodies were used as urinals.

No, Governor Romney.  "Military" and "Troops" are not the same thing.

"Military" is a term that allows us to see in generalities, but ignore the specifics.  And we understand why you use the terms you use, because you say you want a strong "military" in the same way that you wanted Bain Capital to be profitable.  Your version of capitalism is amoral, in ways that would turn the stomach of Adam Smith and the other moral philosophers who saw the power of capitalism to unleash human potential.  You use people as means of profit.  You don't treat them with dignity and respect.  You exploit people.

I won't vote for you and I won't support anyone who endorses you.  I won't do it because I know that being "pro-life" is not about forcing rape victims to bear the fruit of their victimization.  Being "pro-life" involves protecting life from conception to grave, and that includes providing healthcare and housing and education, not as privileges for those who can afford it but as basic human rights for which we the people are responsible.  

Being "pro-family" is not about discriminating against the minority of families who don't fit your preferred Mormon viewpoint.  It's about protecting those who are most vulnerable and understanding that the Pledge of Allegiance is more than just words.  To support America is to support liberty and justice for all, not just for those who can afford to donate to your campaign or who agree with your viewpoint.

And so, I extend liberty and justice to you.  You're free to lie, you're free to spend hundreds of millions of dollars attacking our President, and you're free to put your money in offshore accounts to evade paying your fair share of taxes.

And I'm free to call you a coward, a traitor, and a sociopath.

God bless America.  And may God have mercy on your soul.

Originally posted to Benintn on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:06 AM PDT.

Also republished by Military Community Members of Daily Kos, DKos Military Veterans, and Community Spotlight.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Mitt continues to demostrate why his is not fit (27+ / 0-)

    to be commander in chief. The list is long and everytime he opens his moouth he proves it again and again. The Republicans can package and promote the same tired ideas better than almost anyone, but when you open the shiney new package with the words new and improved on it what is in the package is the same old rotten shit they have offered our country since Reagan. It didn't work then and its not working now. Maybe QVC or Fox can offer them jobs after this sales pitch fails too.

    •  Willard seems to be the typical CEO (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      JanetT in MD, radical simplicity

      PROFIT ABOVE ALL..

      .Romney does not consider humans as other than a interchangeable --disposable resource! He relates to profit and numbers..not people!   Personal profit!

      This is prime indication that he is not fit to govern...he is an aspiring dictator..that does not want anything but the 'title!

  •  And I believe he only mentioned "military" twice (20+ / 0-)

    And both times were in reference to the triggered cuts and how that will cost jobs (read Military Industrial Complex, not troop levels) and make us less safe (generic scare tactic).  

    We have a greed with which we have agreed. -Eddie Vedder "Society"

    by Jacoby Jonze on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:15:23 AM PDT

    •  The political name calling season (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      cassandracarolina, kyril, rb608

      With record expenditures for negative ads, American voters will likely be the most misinformed ever--with both sides demonizing the other side. And everyone getting their individual spin from their favorite and biased talking head.

      Romney in my opinion is not "a coward, a traitor, and a sociopath." Both parties showed in their conventions that the mindless wrapping of everyone around the flag is a something all politicians are very good at doing.

      Both Romney and Obama really want America to succeed.  The major difference is how we get there.

      We have a wasteful, bloated military that is dragging our economy down the toilet. Yet, neither party even talks about that.

      War is costly. Peace is priceless!

      by frostbite on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:11:13 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Sorry, no (8+ / 0-)

        Mitt Romney does not want America to succeed. If America succeeds, he'd have less of a chance of conning his way into the White House.

        That he wants wealthy investors to succeed I can readily believe. But there are other people in America besides those who have invested in Mitt Romney's campaign. And he doesn't give a flying fig about any of us.

      •  Some speaker at the Dem Convention... (4+ / 0-)

        ...(can't remember who now) made a statement about the 'Pubs "putting money in the budget for weapons the generals don't even want."

        There is a difference between the two parties. It's almost negligible, given the size of the Pentagon's budget... but it's there.

        Have you noticed?
        Politicians who promise LESS government
        only deliver BAD government.

        by jjohnjj on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 10:26:18 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Mitt Romney wants to own America (6+ / 0-)

        He wants it as part of his Bain portfolio.   Like the steel mill, the paper companies, and all the others, Romney wants more than anything to go on a borrowing binge  using the good credit of these United States.  

        Then, like at Bain, he will transfer all that wealth, our wealth, into his own and rest of the 1% by business agreements that he has in quiet rooms.  That would be much like Bush's energy policy.  He would certainly sign Lyin Ryan's budget and let the wealthy suck even more of our national treasure up for just themselves through their tax cuts.  He wants that less than 1% tax rate.  

        Then in order to pay for the few scraps of services that will be left to us our taxes will go up.  

        I can imagine attempts at using our social security to finance his war of choice and then we would loose both.  

        Romney is a financial disaster for 99% of us.

      •  thank you for making the point (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        frostbite, Meteor Blades

        that we have a wasteful, bloated military that is dragging our economy down the toilet.  moreover, that has been the case since the end of wwII.  every politician/political thinker who has  warned us of the dangers of a standing army has been proven 100% correct.

        i would much prefer that our citizens stopped volunteering to be mercenaries for our political elite and quite honestly i won't even pretend to have any respect for the choice.

        it's one thing to make the choice to become a soldier for the money.  i guess that's a rational choice given the dearth of employment opportunities, but i don't think of soldiering as an honorable profession.

        The "Good" Soldier
             Young men: The lowest aim in your life is to become a soldier. The good soldier never tries to distinguish right from wrong. He never thinks; never reasons; he only obeys. If he is ordered to fire on his fellow citizens, on his friends, on his neighbors, on his relatives, he obeys without hesitation. If he is ordered to fire down a crowded street when the poor are clamoring for bread, he obeys and sees the gray hairs of age stained with red and the life tide gushing from the breasts of women, feeling neither remorse nor sympathy. If he is ordered off as a firing squad to execute a hero or benefactor, he fires without hesitation, though he knows the bullet will pierce the noblest heart that ever beat in human breast.

             A good soldier is a blind, heartless, soulless, murderous machine. He is not a man. He is not a brute, for brutes only kill in self defense. All that is human in him, all that is divine in him, all that constitutes the man has been sworn away when he took the enlistment roll. His mind, his conscience, aye, his very soul, are in the keeping of his officer.

             No man can fall lower than the solder—it is a depth beneath which we cannot go. Keep the boys out of the army. It is hell.

             Down with the army and the navy. We don't need killing institutions. We need life-giving institutions.

        No System of Justice Can Rise Above the Ethics of Those Who Administer It. (Wickersham Commission 1929)

        by No Exit on Sat Sep 08, 2012 at 12:02:57 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I rec. this for your bravery (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          No Exit

          Seeing and anti-soldier comment on Kos is a relief from all of the pro-military stuff that I see here.

          If you watched the convention, it can be seen that the name soldier has gone out of style. Now those who wear the uniform are all "heroes." Having pricked up the bodies of real heroes in a real battlefield, this devalues the value of their lives and it makes me puke.

          Also, that the Democratic party should praise the assassination of an old man as one of their prize achievements for the past four years is pretty sad.

          However, having served four years in the infantry, like most of my buddies, we came from poor families who joined to get a job. Your perspective is a distortion of what soldiers really feel, and a distortion of reality. I do not know any soldier who enjoyed the killing of women and of the elderly.

          War is costly. Peace is priceless!

          by frostbite on Sat Sep 08, 2012 at 12:39:33 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  We do have a wasteful, bloated military... (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        No Exit, frostbite, WakeUpNeo

        ...and neither party (as a whole) wants to talk about that, especially 58 days before an election. But there IS a difference because a fair number of Democrats do seek to cut the Pentagon's budget. It seems only two congressional Republicans do and they share a surname. Unfortunately, most of the rest of what they support is manure.

        Don't tell me what you believe, show me what you do and I will tell you what you believe.

        by Meteor Blades on Sat Sep 08, 2012 at 12:34:23 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  He didn't thank "the military" (5+ / 0-)

      either.  He didn't say he appreciates "the military" for their sacrifice.

  •  Mitt continues to prove why he is unfit (12+ / 0-)

    to be commander in chief. The list is long and everytime he opens his moouth he proves it again and again. The Republicans can package and promote the same tired ideas better than almost anyone, but when you open the shiney new package with the words new and improved on it what is in the package is the same old rotten shit they have offered our country since Reagan. It didn't work then and its not working now. Maybe QVC or Fox can offer them jobs after this sales pitch fails too.

  •  My wife used to have a bumper sticker on her car (11+ / 0-)

    that asked, "How can you be pro-life and pro-war?". One day someone left a note on her windshield that said, simply, "Because one is innocent and one is guilty"...which, I think, speaks to your point.

    Thanks for writing this.

    Conservatives seem to believe that the rich will work harder if we give them more, and the poor will work harder if we give them less. E.J. Dionne

    by blueyescryinintherain on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:16:18 AM PDT

  •  "National Security" (13+ / 0-)

    is a commodity we purchase from a corporation called The Military.  The employees are fungible.

    I just genetically engineer them, I don't nominate them for President.

    by happymisanthropy on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:50:58 AM PDT

  •  still troubled sometimes? (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Benintn, eztempo, kyril

    I agree with you when you say:

    And while I agree that those who commit atrocities should be brought to justice, I'm still troubled sometimes by the knowledge that Bin Laden was never brought to trial and we have detainees in Gitmo who are still being held simply because they're suspicious - not because they committed crimes but because they know someone who has.
    To say that you are"still troubled sometimes" is probably true for many of us, and that is what is deeply troubling. We like to see Joe Biden slam the Republicans but to equate justice, as he does, with summary execution shows how corrupted even the Democratic party has become. There was clearly no attempt to seize Bin Laden, although he was not holding a weapon when he was killed. If they could carry out his dead body, they could have carried him out alive. But that would have meant a trial and, unfortunately, in the USA we seldom make use of fair trials for anyone deemed a terrorist. It is sad to contemplate that the Obama administration almost certainly decided before the raid that a trial would create huge political problems, whereas a simple act of murder would be a giant political asset in the current election campaign.

    If my soldiers were to begin to think, not one would remain in the ranks. -Frederick the Great

    by Valatius on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 12:18:49 PM PDT

    •  I really am double-minded here. (9+ / 0-)

      Bin Laden clearly took credit for the attack, clearly planned other attacks, clearly took responsibility for the bombing of the USS Cole, etc.

      I cannot imagine a scenario in which Bin Laden could have been taken alive, or brought to trial, where it wouldn't have turned into a media circus, a recruiting tool for Al Qaeda, an increased national security risk, and a massive PR nightmare for an Obama Administration which I respect and admire for countless reasons that go beyond the "War on Terra".

      I appreciate your statement, agree with what was said about Biden, and also at the same time believe that justice was done.

      Alas, the executioners have blood on their hands.  An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.  But the trains run on time and I can still buy gas for less than $4 a gallon.

      Stop clapping. Stop screaming. Open your mind. Listen. (Oh, and I support President Obama in 2012.)

      by Benintn on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 02:22:10 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Mentioning bin Laden (6+ / 0-)

        Was going to hold this till an open, a friend found and posted on FB, but while talking about:

        The wayback on the once good bud, especially of the reagan and daddy bush, CIA operative and weapons supplier to the Mujaheddin, bin Laden!

        One of the reasons jr bush abandoned the main missions for even sending troops into that region and much of the country did with the first drum beat pointed at Iraq, Saddam was also a very good friend, and CIA operative, of those mentioned above till they felt he was going to blow the whistle on them!

        Vets On FLOTUS and SLOTUS, "Best - Ever": "We haven't had this kind of visibility from the White House—ever." Joyce Raezer - Dec. 30, 2011

        by jimstaro on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 04:33:07 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  According to the book by the Seal (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        wasatch

        that the Pentagon is now concerned about, bin Laden had already been shot when they entered the room. If I remember the details correctly, one or more added two further shots as a precaution. I think the description was he had enough head damage before they fired for brain matter to be visible.

        I did not go back to read any articles, the first time was enough. Like you, I've heard the stories from vets, for 35 years, as far back as WWI. They're all ugly beyond belief. Like with other experiences that create PTSD, letting people  tell it again is therapeutic. Of the 3 or 4 other diaries on this, you covered it more thoroughly IMO. Thanks.

        "People, even more than things, have to be restored, renewed, revived, reclaimed and redeemed; never throw out anyone. " Audrey Hepburn "A Beautiful Woman"

        by Ginny in CO on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:14:48 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  He might have been armed, and he might (5+ / 0-)

      have been wearing a bomb vest that he could detonate, taking out the American Seal team who came to get him. It's happened with other, less high level members of Al Qaida.

      Would you be willing to make this criticism to the SEAL team members and their family? Would you ask them to take this kind of risk to their own lives in order to take Bin Laden alive, give him a trial, convict him, and then execute him?

      I certainly would not. Bin Laden was already responsible for the deaths of too many innocent civilians. I don't think we should bend over backwards to give him the opportunity to add a few more to this total.

    •  Terrorists are "seldom" given a fair trial? (5+ / 0-)

      Really?

      OK City bombers Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols; the Unabomber Ted Kaczynsky; Omar Abdel-Rahmen, the "blind sheik" who planned the 1993 World Trade Center bombing; and Atlanta Olympic Park Bomber Eric Robert Rudolph were all handled by U.S. District Courts, not by military tribunals.

      I submit that an alleged "terrorist" perpetrator is more likely to get a "fair trial" in federal court than in some states' courts.

      And people in uniform, military or law enforcement, may use necessary force in self-defense of themselves or others while trying to apprehend a perpetrator.

      It's a little unrealistic to expect them to assure themselves, especially in dim light or in the dark using night-vision goggles, that the perpetrator is unarmed in seizing him or her.  It's a judgment call for them when to use force, even deadly force.

      And you are pretty quick to throw around the word "murder."  Neither the members of SEAL Team 6 nor the "Night Stalkers" of the 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment (Airborne) who flew the helicopters deserve such an insult to their professionalism and years of training.

      •  Okay, let me take back the word "murder" which (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        No Exit

        is a legal term and I do not intend to accuse the Seals of any crime.  Do you then agree with this:

        It is sad to contemplate that the Obama administration almost certainly decided before the raid that a trial would create huge political problems, whereas a simple act of killing would be a giant political asset in the current election campaign.
        I feel safe in making this assertion based simply on how the Bin Laden killing has been used by the administration ever since.

        As to your other point : Of course, federal courts can and have provided fair trials to many terrorists in the past, and could have done so for Bin Laden. But the Military Commissions set up by Bush and continued by Obama are not fair nor open proceeedings by any national or international standard.

        The current trial at Guantanamo of Khalid  Sheik Mohammad, who by most accounts brought the 9-11 plan to Bin Laden, is the kind of faux judicial process to which I am referring. KSM is almost certainly guilty and could have been tried right here in downtown New York. The Obama administration wanted to do this but faced such a firestorm from both parties that they backed down.

        If my soldiers were to begin to think, not one would remain in the ranks. -Frederick the Great

        by Valatius on Sat Sep 08, 2012 at 07:57:23 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  I'm not going to lose any sleep over it (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      kyril, Ginny in CO

      There are a lot of things that I lose sleep over -- the "patriot" act, torture, drone attacks, support for Israels indiscriminate attacks on civilians and protesters, and the ever expanding federal "security" apparatus.

      I ain't gonna lose any sleep over Bin Laden's death -- especially as the military's preferred option was to bomb the hell out of the house and hope to kill everybody (and the previous administration's option was to bomb the hell out of a wholly unrelated country.)   Bin Laden was one of a very small number of people who had it coming to them.

    •  Sometimes a plan can only guess what will cause (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      OrdinaryIowan, ladybug53

      the least harm. As I pointed out in another comment, the Seal who wrote the unauthorized book on the raid claims bin Laden had already been fatally shot when they entered the room.

      I personally can't stretch my imagination enough to believe

      If they could carry out his dead body, they could have carried him out alive.
      with equal ease and lack of problems. Yes they use sedatives to do that - tricky when his weight and other factors (renal disease) make it difficult to accurately calculate a safe and effective dose. Let alone the time it would add.

      I am not comfortable with the lack of trials, and I am fully aware this had been going on for a long time before Iraq and Afghanistan. Unfortunately, when you are up against people who don't follow any rules, it may be close to impossible to succeed in getting them to any form of justice if you hold as closely to every rule as your ideals dictate. BushCO clearly were untrustworthy in this and no one at the top hierarchy can be sure the troops in the field don't make really bad mistakes in the fog of war. (Reread Benintn's paragraph on the stories soldiers told him.)

      These are the tough decisions that taught Obama the truth of Lincoln's lesson. We deal with them a lot in health care, some have very similar moral conflicts.

      "People, even more than things, have to be restored, renewed, revived, reclaimed and redeemed; never throw out anyone. " Audrey Hepburn "A Beautiful Woman"

      by Ginny in CO on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:42:35 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Many good points raised above, but (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Ginny in CO

        I am still troubled by the ease with which Biden and others equate execution with justice. The Nuremburg trials, the Eichmann trial, the Milosevic trial at the Hague are all examples of justice meted out to mass murderers. and I can understand if a suspect is killed while resisting arrest. However, the sparse details released are unclear as to whether Bin Laden could have been taken alive. On May 2, 2011 the president simply said:

        Today, at my direction, the United States launched a targeted operation against that compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan.  A small team of Americans carried out the operation with extraordinary courage and capability.  No Americans were harmed.  They took care to avoid civilian casualties.  After a firefight, they killed Osama bin Laden and took custody of his body.
        According to No Easy Day, the memoir purportedly by a Navy Seal involved in the raid, Bin Laden was already dying by the time Seals reached the body, apparently mortally wounded by the firefight with his bodyguards.

        Whatever the actual facts of that night, I have not yet heard the president say, "We would have preferred that Bin Laden be taken alive to face justice, but he was killed resisting capture." Such a simple statement would make our essential values clear and would preclude a dangerous precedent for future presidents.

        If my soldiers were to begin to think, not one would remain in the ranks. -Frederick the Great

        by Valatius on Sat Sep 08, 2012 at 07:36:08 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Unfortunately my experience marrying into (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          QDMacaw

          an AF family, working with many vets and reading a lot on how the military has functioned, especially since WWII, the communications and transparency piece is a huge problem. While some of it is understandable and even justified in an overabundance of caution at times, the overall record is dismal. The book I found the most thorough is House of War by James Caroll.

          Not sure how difficult it would be to change that even as POTUS, he will be gone in 8 years. OTOH, he has earned a lot of respect for what he did in reopening the pursuit of bin Laden, successfully concluding it, and getting the VA and military to start dealing with the inadequate treatment vets have been getting. Second term might see some effort there that could begin some changes.

          Which will be harder than DADT as far as I am concerned. The major changes in forces, engagement, use of drones, and other issues such as the sexual assault problem, are building the need for some major rethinking of the military codes, practices, etc. One I would like to see is not sending anyone under the age of 25 with any weapon into a war zone. They have not completed essential upper cortex brain development. I think this kind of change is where more of our feedback needs to be directed.

          Maybe Obama's withholding the statement reflects his unwillingness to lie. A clean kill was easily the outcome with fewer repercussions internationally and at home. Whether he was killed or captured, elements in the Muslim world would use it to foster more hatred and violence. Imprisonment and trial would have kept that flame even hotter, taking his time, effort and negotiations away from all the other problems that needed it. Despite an inconsistent story, I think it turned out to be a kill based on circumstances beyond the Seals control.  

          I would not want to be in the position of making those calls. Especially since I don't have a higher authority to consult, whether sitting or on my knees.

          "People, even more than things, have to be restored, renewed, revived, reclaimed and redeemed; never throw out anyone. " Audrey Hepburn "A Beautiful Woman"

          by Ginny in CO on Sat Sep 08, 2012 at 09:15:57 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Another reason to take Osama alive (0+ / 0-)

            I tend to agree with you that the president's failure to claim there was an attempt to take Bin Laden alive  may well reflect his "unwillingness to lie." However, the fact that Bin Laden was not taken alive is a lost opportunity to explore more deeply the network that facilitated the 9-11 attacks, in particular possible Saudi connections. 15 of the 19 hijackers were Saudis and there have been lingering questions over high level Saudi funding of Al Queda before 9-11. Last year Lloyds, the giant British insurer, sued a number of prominent Saudi individuals and charities for responsibility in the attacks. (and Lloyds is hardly an example of crackpot  9-11 trutherism)

            Some might argue that Bin Laden would not have revealed any more than his flunkeys did, but a megalomaniac like him is often inclined to brag about his greatness and be quite eager to talk.

            If my soldiers were to begin to think, not one would remain in the ranks. -Frederick the Great

            by Valatius on Sun Sep 09, 2012 at 03:26:55 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  As a long standing member of scientific (0+ / 0-)

              9/11 trutherism, Lloyds action was totally unsurprising and understandable, possibly laudable. Whoever insured the towers should have done some suing as well.

              I wonder if bin Laden would have cooperated, his zealotry struck me as a deep conviction. If the truth is that bin Laden had already been killed before the Seals got to him, and probably to ensure he was not taken prisoner, it further renders the issue moot.

              Expanding on my first sentence of that comment. My FiL was a NORAD Wing commander for decades. His oldest son was the civilian head of the Elmendorf AFB electronic repair shop for all the fighter jets in the state. My ex is an Environmental Engineer (MS) who has worked in that field at top State, municipal, and industry jobs, as well as being an independent contractor in AK. My dad is a PhD in physical chemistry, did R&D in building materials. His brother, a physicist, was on the team that developed the Poseidon, Polaris, and Trident nuclear sub missiles (aka, rocket scientist) who retired to join the Smithsonian team that screened new features for accuracy, etc. Working myself in science based and driven health care for 35 years as an RN. I only own 2 degrees in BS, a hyperfocused  ADD brain, and a mouth one dentist insisted is so small he used pediatric tools. I test dot connection strengths.

              The information about the Saudi funding may help tell us stuff we mostly already know. The internationally coordinated laws for pursuing criminals across those boundaries and successfully prosecuting them, as John Kerry proposed in The New War, are not in place. (Reason #1 for him to go to SoS.)

              Meanwhile, we do not have a scientifically valid, official forensic investigation of the 9/11 events. We have official investigation reports that clearly show the people involved were unable to come up with any kind of valid explanation of those events. We do have plenty of scientific information, developed, collected and applied by scientific method to those events; by physicists, architects, structural engineers, chemists, geologists, mathematicians, military and commercial explosive experts, pilots, firefighters, and other scientists. Using the national codes for forensic investigation criteria, that were not used by any official investigation, the independent researchers have found conclusive evidence that supports an independent, better funded and truly scientific forensic investigation. Which the firefighters professional journal called for in 2/02, with a bit of outrage.

              [Just found out today that since a Denver PBS station used the professionals' video on their work for the fundraising campaign a few weeks ago, subsequent runs two weeks ago made it the 3rd most watched and #1 most shared program for the station. Digital Journal article  9/3, Yup, those ignorant, foolish PBS watchers are spreading it.]

              Having gone into massive debt for two unjust wars, and put protections of our liberty like habeus corpus in jeopardy, we are also facing big fights over cutting the exorbitant military budget. Seems to me we need to be focusing on some more important information about 9/11 than why bin Laden should have been taken alive and whether the plan was as in line with our values as we would like.

              In order to significantly disable the MIC, we need something even bigger than the financial crash to get effective and lasting change there. Besides, the culprits are 99% likely to be 1% American, so we wouldn't need anything but US laws.

              "People, even more than things, have to be restored, renewed, revived, reclaimed and redeemed; never throw out anyone. " Audrey Hepburn "A Beautiful Woman"

              by Ginny in CO on Mon Sep 10, 2012 at 03:06:16 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  Just found this. FWIW (0+ / 0-)
              From CBS 60 Minutes Overtime interview with Mark Owen (pseudonym) author of No Easy Day.

              Scott Pelley: Was this a mission...was the plan to kill Osama bin Laden or capture him before you went in?

              Mark Owen: This was absolutely not a kill-only mission. It was made very clear to us throughout our training for this that, "Hey, if given the opportunity, this is not an assassination. You will capture him alive, if feasible."

              Scott Pelley: That was the preferred thing?

              Mark Owen: Yes.

              Scott Pelley: To take him alive, if you could?

              Mark Owen: Yeah, yeah. I mean, we're not there to assassinate somebody. We weren't sent in to murder him. This was, "Hey, kill or capture."

              "People, even more than things, have to be restored, renewed, revived, reclaimed and redeemed; never throw out anyone. " Audrey Hepburn "A Beautiful Woman"

              by Ginny in CO on Mon Sep 10, 2012 at 04:24:11 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

  •  Romney sees the military as a tool (8+ / 0-)

    or a department of USA Inc.

    Romney doesn't care about the average worker. Why would he care about the average soldier?

  •  Helicopters do not have nightmares (13+ / 0-)

    I would love to use that title sometime for a diary title or a bumper stick right under Corporations ARE not people and
    Helicopters do not have nighmares.  You diary is good !

    We the People have to make a difference and the Change.....Just do it ! Be part of helping us build a veteran community online. United Veterans of America

    by Vetwife on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 04:10:49 PM PDT

  •  Sorry I missed this earlier. (7+ / 0-)

    You probably published while I was writing. Didn't even think to check the recent list.

    Thanks for this.

  •  romney is a candy ass sociopath (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    kyril

    "...i also also want a legally binding apology." -George Rockwell

    by thankgodforairamerica on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 04:13:10 PM PDT

  •  Romney sees ships, planes, tanks and all sorts of (7+ / 0-)

    goodies that bring money to the war industries and jobs to constituents.

    Obama sees people and families affected by long deployments, grievous wounds and death.

    We need to get our 'defense' department down to size where it is actually a defensive force, not a means of force projection and intimidation.  And it requires a concurrent adjustment in our foreign and economic policy.

  •  This pissed me off to no end. Romney (4+ / 0-)

    Has thrown our troops under the bus, he has disrespected every veteran in this country.

    Romney is simply unfit to be commander in chief.

    •  Mitt is unfit (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      kyril, a2nite

      to carry a duffel bag. His own love of wearing uniforms is further evidence of his twisted priorities.

      More than any other time in history, mankind faces a crossroads. One path leads to despair and utter hopelessness. The other, to total extinction. Let us pray we have the wisdom to choose correctly. -- Woody Allen

      by cassandracarolina on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:45:13 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Get ready to scream at me! (0+ / 0-)

    Unpopular as it may be I'm having a hard time with this one.

    Yes, it was a COLOSSAL fuck up.

    But...

    While his gaffe is definitely further proof that he's out of touch, disconnected, cold, impersonal, etc., on the other hand, I'm sure if asked to elaborate he wouldn't say, "Yes of course, I mean the troops are unimportant."

    Sometimes what you say and what you mean aren't the same thing.

    Obama made a poor word choice--"that" instead of "those"--and Conervatives obliterated him. They planned an entire day of their convention around it. They looked like idiots and it's a huge turn off to sensible people.

    I'm cautious not to do the same thing because I think its petty and has damaging long term effects to the democratic process. High road and shit.

    Yes he's a frigid cyborg. But does a candidate for POTUS think the troop are unimportant? Even if only for selfish purposes, nah.

    “The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser men so full of doubts.” ― Bertrand Russell

    by r fisher on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:00:52 PM PDT

    •  I disagree He did not just choose the wrong (6+ / 0-)

      word.  Here is some context.
       

       BAIER: A few more things, Governor. To hear several speakers in Charlotte - and I don't think this is just - they were essentially saying you don't care about the U.S. military because you didn't mention U.S. troops and the war in Afghanistan in your nomination acceptance speech. We understand you went to the American Legion the day before and you talked about the service and sacrifice of the military there. Do you regret opening up this line of attack, now a recurring attack, by leaving out that issue in the speech?

          ROMNEY: I only regret you repeating it day in and day out. (LAUGHS)

          BAIER: Well I mean, what just came from Charlotte -

          ROMNEY: Because when you give a speech, you don't give a laundry list. You talk about the things that you think are important.

      Here's the video, which includes his smug laugh at the end when he says, "I think they mean the same thing."
      Calling for a strong military (in the vid, not the quote above) is not the same thing as caring for the troops and their families, and thanking them for their service and enormous sacrifice in waging wars that enrich one.

      "On their backs were vermiculate patterns that were maps of the world in its becoming. Maps...of a thing which could not be put back. Not be made right again."

      by middleagedhousewife on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:52:55 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  It would be nice if I included the video I (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        cassandracarolina, wasatch

        mentioned:
        Sorry about that!

        "On their backs were vermiculate patterns that were maps of the world in its becoming. Maps...of a thing which could not be put back. Not be made right again."

        by middleagedhousewife on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:57:08 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I watched it live (0+ / 0-)

          and I cringed.

          And I'm not trying to say it's exactly the same as Obama saying "that" instead of "those". But I think if the lesson we draw from this is that Mitt Romney hates American troops I think we're guilty of the same kind of hysterics we accuse the Conservatives of.

          “The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser men so full of doubts.” ― Bertrand Russell

          by r fisher on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 07:45:01 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  The lesson I take (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            middleagedhousewife

            is that the more candid he attempts to be, the more frightening he gets.

            and I wait for them to interrupt my drinking from this broken cup

            by le sequoit on Sat Sep 08, 2012 at 04:46:29 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  Ignores, Not Hates (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            middleagedhousewife

            Sorry, Romney's casual dismissal of the question of the apparent lack of concern for American troops being in harm's way merely doubled-down on his totally lack of empathy for the troops and their families.  You chose the wrong term.  Romney doesn't "hate" American troops. Even worse, Romney doesn't even take them into his calculations.  

            He confirmed that he is, more than anything else, the modern equivalent of those military donkeys who supposedly "led" the armies in the trenches on the Western Front almost a century ago.  We all joke about how Romney is an android.  Well, answering this question is the equivalent of responding to questions from Blade Runner's Voight-Kampff test and Romney failed the test.  Replicant he is.

            "Love the Truth, defend the Truth, speak the Truth, and hear the Truth" - Jan Hus, d.1415 CE

            by PrahaPartizan on Sat Sep 08, 2012 at 06:58:09 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

    •  I might be willing to give him the benefit of (3+ / 0-)

      the doubt overlooking the troops in his convention speech. But he's doubling down on it with these latest remarks.

      And I think it's false equivalence worthy of Fox News to compare this to "you didn't build that." We aren't taking Romney's words out of context and twisting the meaning to be something the opposite of what he actually said.

      What you are doing is taking his actual words and suggesting that he doesn't mean what he actually said. That's mighty generous of you.

      Just realize that the Romney Ryan team is spending millions of ads flat out blatantly lying about Obama cutting Medicare, trying to take away the right of troops to vote, and eliminating the work requirement from welfare.

      •  Yeah (0+ / 0-)

        "Just realize that the Romney Ryan team is spending millions of ads flat out blatantly lying about Obama cutting Medicare, trying to take away the right of troops to vote, and eliminating the work requirement from welfare."

        This is exactly why I think it's important to keep the high ground. They look bad enough. Especially with the RNC you didn't build that bullshit. I don't think we should do them any favors by resorting to a simliar--not identical--hysteria. I mean, do you really think that he just admitted that he doesn't give a shit about American troops?

        He fucked up by not mentioning the troops in his acceptance speech. No doubt. We did a very Republican thing by making up a patriotism rule and hammered him on it. And not wanting to look spineless in front of a party that already questions the make of his spine he tried to weasel out of it without looking weak.

        I'm not apologizing for him. Honestly, I think that this is somewhat revealing about his priorities. I just don't think it's strategically advantageous to run with it.

        Go ahead and try to beat him to death with this but it's not a good look.

        “The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser men so full of doubts.” ― Bertrand Russell

        by r fisher on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:07:04 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  He is causing a problem for the Republicans (4+ / 0-)

          From my point of view they are already hypocrites, but now it is brought into even sharper relief.          If a Republican fails to beat up on Romney for this they are admitting that about %30 of what it means to be a Republican is a sham.  

          Remember "Support the troops, support the President ?"   Oh, yeah, that only applies if the President is a Republican.   Remember when a singer could get cut out of radio and media because she said she was ashamed of the President?   Oh, right, different president.   Ted Nugent anyone?

          The right wing went completely nuts when a photo surfaced of Obama not holding his hand over his chest at the singing of the national anthem.   Even lefty vets brought it up to me.   We just expect higher "patriotism" standards from our President --- unless they are a Republican, apparently.

          This is a very powerful issue, and Romney's response to it makes it even worse.   He is unable to admit that he was wrong, and parses and makes up lies to cover it.   That is not a quality that we want in our leaders.

          •  Love this (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            wasatch, middleagedhousewife

            And I think it makes a lot of sense to put the onus on Republicans to put pressure on Mitt for this seeing as how they're the patriotism rule makers.

            “The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser men so full of doubts.” ― Bertrand Russell

            by r fisher on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 09:12:45 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

  •  I would really much rather (5+ / 0-)

    have been called a "servicemember" than a "troop", which is an ugly word that conjures up images that don't represent today's military. As a veteran, the proper term for me is "veteran."

    That said, your point is correct: funding the military institution is not the same as taking care of the people in it.

    "Let’s just move on, treat everybody with firmness, fairness, dignity, compassion and respect. Let’s be Marines." - Sgt. Maj Michael Barrett on DADT repeal

    by kyril on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:48:27 PM PDT

  •  He said "military" twice: (6+ / 0-)

    "That America, that united America, will preserve a military that is so strong, no nation would ever dare to test it. "

    "His trillion dollar cuts to our military will eliminate hundreds of thousands of jobs, and also put our security at greater risk"

    Neither of which has anything remotely to do with thanking, acknowledging or showing concern for American troops.

    He's basically mentioning the military because he's upset that defense contractors will be short some cash.

  •  A candidate trying to be Commander-in-Chief (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    cassandracarolina, WakeUpNeo, wasatch

    who cannot bother to mention, let alone give the troops in harms way the respect they deserve? He's not fit for the job. Period. When you consider all the sacrifice of our men and women (and their families) who have served and are now serving overseas, it is not too much to ask. When you consider all the men and women who have died or been injured in these two wars, it fills me with disgust for Romney and Ryan that they had no words of thanks, support and gratitude and encouragement for them.

    Shameful, really shameful.

    "extreme concentration of income is incompatible with real democracy.... the truth is that the whole nature of our society is at stake." Paul Krugman

    by Gorette on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 07:58:24 PM PDT

    •  What is shameful is that he is not trying (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      r fisher, wasatch, Gorette

      Stepping back, as a player in this partisan game the overall shame to me is that Romney is not even pretending to try to play by the rules.  

      Candidates acknowledge the troops in time of war, they always have (to my knowledge.)   Candidates release their tax records to show that they are not taking bribes.    Candidates pretend to like the cookies and say nice things about what people are wearing.   Candidates praise teachers, firefighters and all those hard working "little" people who make our country so great.

      I'm sort of wondering if Romney is going to forget the flag next time, or hold it upside-down, or walk all over it.    "Crimeny, get that gosh darn ugly baby away from me and if it spits up I'm going to beat it into a bloody pulp!"   (I'm sure more than one candidate has thought that...)    I think he is so convinced of the invincibility of the super-pacs that he doesn't believe that he has to expend any effort to get this job.

      It is puzzling, and scary at the same time.   I hope he loses big.

  •  All Republicans Suck. Especially Romney. eom (0+ / 0-)

    Two hundred million Americans, and there ain't two good catchers among 'em. --Casey Stengel

    by LongTom on Sat Sep 08, 2012 at 03:11:17 AM PDT

  •  To parse the language even further... (0+ / 0-)

    Back when the phrase "Support our Troops" was code for "Stop Criticizing President Bush", I started using the term "soldiers" in place of "troops".

    It's still a good habit, because it suggests that we're talking about individuals, not faceless rows of uniforms.

    In some contexts you may want to make it clear that you're not just talking about members of the Army, so "service members" or "men and women in uniform"  would be a better choice.

    Have you noticed?
    Politicians who promise LESS government
    only deliver BAD government.

    by jjohnjj on Sat Sep 08, 2012 at 07:34:00 AM PDT

  •  I had the same thought about Rmoney's remarks (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    WakeUpNeo

    "Military" does NOT equal troops, it equals the corporate part of the Military-Industrial Complex.

    Rmoney probably doesn't realize that there are military families who get gov't assistance, he doesn't know what it's like to have Mom/Dad/Son/Daughter deployed to a place where there is no Secret Service protection and folks just don't like you because you represent something they hate.

    Mitt is a despicable pig who is trying to become the POTUS because he thinks he deserves it. The men and women who serve this country 24/7/365 do not deserve him, and it's up to us to make sure he's not inflicted on them.

    Oh, and "Helicopters don't have nightmares." True, but from experience i can tell you that Helicopter Pilots do.  Some of them look like Mitt Romney and Paul Ryan.  

    A celibate clergy is an especially good idea, because it tends to suppress any hereditary propensity toward fanaticism. -Carl Sagan

    by jo fish on Sat Sep 08, 2012 at 11:51:37 AM PDT

  •  Well done. n/t (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    WakeUpNeo

    Don't tell me what you believe, show me what you do and I will tell you what you believe.

    by Meteor Blades on Sat Sep 08, 2012 at 12:30:33 PM PDT

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