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It doesn't seem to me there's enough diaries on the upcoming vice-presidential debate between Joe Biden and Paul Ryan (aka the cocky yuppie/self-centered brat) so thought I'd chime in on my views:

Arguably, the vice-presidential debate between Biden and Ryan may be an important debate although by all means it won't be the end of the world for President Obama if say Biden looses the debate.  

That being said, I think there's a number of things Joe Biden is capable of doing that Barack Obama never did this past Wednesday which we can definitely look forward to:

1)  Joe Biden is no-nonsense and is not a wimpy Democrat by any means.
2)  Biden won't hesitate to challenge those who disagree with him on a number of issues.  That's who he is and how he's been as vice-president, in addition to being in the U.S. Senate.
3)  Biden understands foreign policy a lot better than Paul Ryan and would be able to pin him down for his "I voted to send troops to war" stance on international relations.
4)  Biden understands the middle class and the poor better than Ryan.  He is more straight forward, less cocky and more direct with people when he talks to them.  He comes with a less fortunate childhood than Ryan does and can relate to those who have had their share of struggles in their lives.
5)  Biden really has fire in his belly.  If he gets fired up, it's going to make Ryan look like a wimp.
6)  Biden can actually defend the stimulus plan better than Ryan and even point out Ryan's flip-flopping on the stimulus.
7)  Biden would also NOT hesitate to mention (even to Ryan directly) Ryan's statement of the plant in Janesville closing down and Obama not doing anything about it.  He'd argue that Obama wasn't even president when this happened and that Ryan didn't even fight for the plant to stay open given that Ryan represents the district of the former plant.

Now here's something we can not look forward to with regards to Paul Ryan:

1)  Although he flip-flops, he's not as wishy-washy as Mitt Romney is.
2)  He is very competitive and will fight to the death to defend his economic views.
3)  He will lie in a very sneaky way, like he usually does, to try to present himself and Mitt Romney as a more viable team to run the White House.
4)  He will point out that there was a debt agreement with those in Congress and the White House to avoid a default and that it was a very bipartisan deal (even while the deal itself did very little to avoid a downgrade in the U.S. credit rating).

Here's a suggestion for Biden:

MODERATOR MARTHA RADDATZ:   Congressman, what would you and Governor Romney do in the White House that would be different than what President Obama has done that helps bridge bipartisanship with Congress?
RYAN:  I would reach out to members of both parties, both Democrats and Republicans, and come together with them to compromise on some of the most important issues that this country is facing today.  The most immediate action we'll need to take is to address the debt problem.  We have $16 trillion dollars in debt which we cannot pass to the next generation.  Businesses aren't hiring.  We have already been hit with a debt downgrade by the S&P and soon, if no significant deal is reached, another downgrade will worsen the outlook for the economy.  We could end up like Greece.
MODERATOR MARTHA RADDATZ:  Vice-president, two minutes.
BIDEN:  Thank you Martha.  Look, I appreciate Congressman Ryan's willingness to be bipartisan but I think his record is a completely different story.  He talks about bipartisanship but for many years before Barack Obama took office, Congressman Ryan voted for a number of spending increases and was completely in line with his own party when it turned the U.S. surplus into debt more and more overtime.  Yes, bipartisanship was present when the hunt for Osama Bin Laden was present but instead of criticizing the Bush administration for abandoning the mission in Tora Bora, he ended up supporting them for the Iraq War and never once spoke out against the problems we were facing in the mishandling of the mission, Rumsfeld's mismanagement or even questioned the original reason why we invaded Iraq, which was for weapons of mass destruction.  This continued support of the Iraq War by him and a number of people in his own party increased the debt unlike anything we've seen in history and made us less prepared to send troops body armor, let alone handle the financial crisis in 2008.  Democrats in Congress tried to raise these problems with people in Congressman Ryan's own party but they wouldn't budge.  Congressman now says he's ashamed over those years he voted for all these spending increases and now wants to claim he's really conservative but his record is still his record.  I'm amazed at his audacity for now putting a lot of the blame on President Obama for the debt.  What he really should do instead is apologize directly to the American people for voting the way he did in those years, particularly to those thousands of Iraqis, U.S. troops and a number of foreign troops who died from our continued presence in Iraq.

What do you think about Joe Biden?  Can he beat Paul Ryan at the debate or will it be tricky?  Any suggestions on what he should do?

In the meantime, here's a video of Joe Biden, then senior U.S. Senator in Delaware, criticizing the Bush administration's policy in Iraq.

Lastly, while we all wait for the debate, we might as well show support for Rob Zerban's campaign against Paul Ryan in the race for the Congressional seat in Wisconsin's 1st Congressional District:



By the way, Rob Zerban has out raised Paul Ryan in the third quarter!


Is Joe Biden going to kick Paul Ryan's ass on October 11th?

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| 138 votes | Vote | Results

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Comment Preferences

  •  Joe Biden waiting tables. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    "So, am I right or what?"

    by itzik shpitzik on Sun Oct 07, 2012 at 06:45:14 PM PDT

  •  It's a win for Biden IF... (3+ / 0-)

    ...he doesn't let his mouth run too long. Biden has a tendency to talk himself in to gaffes... or, at least, comments the GOPhers can use as examples of gaffes. (Biden was right: The middle class HAS been buried in the last four years, but it's not Obama who's shoveling the dirt!)

    That said, he can't expect the same result he got with Sister Sarah. rYAN's smarter, sneakier, and (a little) more shrewd. But he will lie. He has to, just like Mittens had to Wednesday night to even hope to get this race even remotely back on track. And while Obama could afford to play Rope-a-Dope all night long (which is MY explanation for what happened), Biden doesn't have that luxury. He has to keep paraphrasing Elizabeth Warren at her second debate with Brownie:

    "Once again, Congressman Ryan is MAKING STUFF UP!"

    "If you're going to go down with the ship, make it a submarine." - Wayne Shorter

    by Oliver Tiger on Sun Oct 07, 2012 at 06:48:03 PM PDT

  •  Frigg lyin ryan..... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    zesty grapher

    I would say that all Biden has to do is attack rmoney...... and attack and attack and attack..... point out all of the flaws and especially all of the lies of rmoney, and he has so many of them, and use the word "lie" and don't be afraid of it.... and if lyin gets in the way, smack him down a couple of notches as well.....

  •  Negative-spin, people. *LOWER* expectations. nt (0+ / 0-)
    •  Uhhh... why? (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Calamity Jean

      Biden is the best defender Obama has. Contrarywise, rAYN is an even worse liar than Mittens, if that's possible. I don't want to go into this thinking, "Ho hum, more of the same." The first time rAYN tries to run that "Obama's stealing from Medicare" line, I want Biden to turn into Hanover Fist from the "Captain Sternn" comic:

      But maybe that's just me. :)

      "If you're going to go down with the ship, make it a submarine." - Wayne Shorter

      by Oliver Tiger on Sun Oct 07, 2012 at 07:05:44 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Politics 101 (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        zesty grapher

        You want people (especially 'winnable voters' but apparently the 'base' as well) to be pleasantly surprised at how well Biden does, not disappointed.

        Biden is known most-of-all for sticking his foot in his mouth, for  not always getting it right, or for being too candid for his own (and Obama's) political good.

        Lyin' Ryan is as slick a liar as his wretched running mate. And he's got the fire in his belly. That means he's going to come across (to pundits, GOP, and low-info voters) as the 'winner' in the veep debate.

        I don't like it, but it's what I expect. And I hope the rest of America does, too.

        I'm not voting for the best debaters, I'm voting for who I think are the best leaders for the USA, and that's Obama-Biden (not Romney-Ryan).

  •  While not an original Biden fan, I have come to (4+ / 0-)

    admire the man's abilities...he has a disarming half smirk/half smile that conveys volumes.  I hope he schools Koch-owned Boy-Wonder.

    Robber Baron "ReTHUGisms": John D. Rockefeller -"The way to make money is to buy when blood is running in the streets"; Jay Gould -"I can hire one half of the working class to kill the other half."

    by ranton on Sun Oct 07, 2012 at 06:57:30 PM PDT

  •  Ryan not used to be challenged (4+ / 0-)

    My prediction: he will come across as extremely petulant and smarmy. In town hall meetings and forums he has this annoying habit of rolling his eyes and saying "you don't understand" when someone disagrees with him. Very condescending.

    Biden will rip him on Medicare and Ryan will dig his own grave by petulantly explaining his Medicare coupon scheme.

    •  Ryan also has Zerban to deal with (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      Rob Zerban is pushing Paul Ryan to debate him so the pressure on Ryan is to not only do well in the debate but also retain his seat in Congress.  If I were in Ryan's position as a Democrat and would be facing the same kind of pressure he's dealing with, I wouldn't like to be in that situation at all.

  •  Joe Biden will be great. (0+ / 0-)

    My only worry is he will say "literally" too much. Other than that, he will win the debate, no problem.

  •  When Ryan starts his speed-lying I want Joe to say (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Maverick80229, zesty grapher

    "Slow down so we can see through you".

    "I was a big supporter of waterboarding" - Dick Cheney 2/14/10

    by Bob Love on Sun Oct 07, 2012 at 07:32:26 PM PDT

  •  Pussy democrat? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    Yuck. You can't come up with any better description than an 8th grade gender shaming slur?

    Poverty = politics.

    by Renee on Sun Oct 07, 2012 at 07:32:59 PM PDT

  •  I hope Joe has a great night, but.... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Sharon Wraight

    he doesn't inspire confidence with his lack of discipline re staying on script. He's a gaffe machine. Love him as a guy who can really come across as understanding middle America, but I don't feel he's going to be sharp enough catching Ryan's lies, half-truths, and sloughing off of details.

    Hope Joe proves me wrong.

    •  Oh believe me, Biden will fight (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      zesty grapher

      Look at a whole load of C-Span videos of Biden as a U.S. Senator, particularly when he served as Ranking Member and even Chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.  Biden has a good eye for remembering statements other people have made.  He's no Ted Kennedy but he has Kennedy's fighting power.

  •  Biden is the "sharp tip of the spear" that the (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Buckeye54, zesty grapher

    campaign has been waiting to unleash, according to this lengthy but readable article from last month. More:

    To listen to Biden, it’s not hard to grasp why Chicago has made him the campaign’s arrowhead. At a moment of pervasive economic anxiety and roiling ire at the one percent and its political enablers, Biden is the only person on either party’s ticket genuinely fluent in the language of populism. And at a juncture at which the Romney-Ryan operation has concluded that running up its margins with working-class and elderly white voters is its sole path to victory, Biden is the only one who can, you know, go there and not seem like a big fat fraud.
    When the press confers honorifics on the V.P. such as “Obama’s de facto ambassador to white working-class America,” this is the kind of scene that leaps to mind. A scene featuring Regular Joe Biden, born in Scranton, Pennsylvania, son of a used-car salesman, graduate of the University of Delaware, honest-to-God hot-rod aficionado—“My first car was a ’51 Plymouth”—who didn’t blanch when The Onion spoofed him in 2009 with a story headlined “Shirtless Biden Washes Trans Am in White House Driveway.” (Biden’s only gripe was that they got the car wrong: He owns a 1967 Corvette, which the Secret Service won’t let him drive.) A guy, in other words, who can talk the talk and walk the walk, who can go places that his superior can’t. (Italics in original; underscoring is mine)
    Obama had to remain Presidential and overall, I think he pulled it off in spite of being gobsmacked by the volume of bullshit spewed into his face. Biden can speak more directly, both because of his office and because of who he is.

    Will there be a cringe-inducing Bidenism? Maybe. But Ryan has sometimes come across as a hothead and Joe might rattle him into saying something even more cringe-worthy for their side.

    I look forward to the debate with some trepidation, but also knowing that if Ryan tries the same "baffle 'em with bullshit, and then bury them in it" that Romney did, Biden could "attack" him in ways that Obama could not attack Romney.

    At least, not in the first round...

    We’re not generating enough angry white guys to stay in business for the long term.” - Sen. Lindsey Graham (AWG-SC)

    by 1BQ on Sun Oct 07, 2012 at 08:14:54 PM PDT

  •  I'm just very nervous (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Sharon Wraight

    At times Biden does put his foot in his mouth. The only thing is that Ryan has been so ineffective in this campaign for Romney he's barely registered as a blip on the radar. I remember when Palin was on the ticket how no one could stop talking.

    •  It'll be just like he's been in the U.S. Senate (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      zesty grapher

      I suggest you go look back at a bunch of old videos of Joe Biden in the U.S. Senate, particularly with regards to the Iraq War handling.  In studying, you'll find that Biden does not go down without a fight.

      Sure, Biden does speak off the cuff but he's not Mitt Romney.  At least when Biden says nonsense things, he clarifies them later with humility.  Romney on the other hand doesn't do such a good job at that.

  •  Just watching that (0+ / 0-)

    video reminded me of how powerful Joe Biden can be when he speaks out. I know everyone is a little nervous about a gaffe. I think the media is always waiting to pounce on his every word and blow it out of proportion too.

    However I do believe overall that he will expose Ryan and his smarmy policies. I think he will call Ryan on his BS and yes in my dream of dreams goad Ryan into doing or saying something really damaging.

    Thanks for the diary. I'm looking forward to Thursday night.

    "I think of the right-wing Republicans as jihadists; they’re as crazy as those people. They want to destroy the country that we want to save." Paul Auster

    by zesty grapher on Mon Oct 08, 2012 at 04:46:17 AM PDT

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