Skip to main content

Daily Kos Elections Morning Digest banner
Want the scoop on hot races around the country? Get the digest emailed to you each weekday morning. Sign up here.
Leading Off:

IN-Sen: In case you somehow haven't seen this yet, well, it was Wednesday's the story of the day. Hell, it may even be the story of the week. Republican Senate nominee Richard Mourdock, at Tuesday night's debate:

I believe life begins at conception. The only exception I have for to have an abortion is in the case of the life of the mother. I struggled with myself for a long time but I came to realize life is that gift from God, even when life begins in that horrible situation of rape. It is something that God intended to happen.
The political world exploded upon hearing these remarks, with everyone with a conscience condemning Mourdock for suggesting that there's some supreme being who "intends" rape to happen. Predictably, Mourdock furiously tried to backpedal in his post-debate remarks:
"What I said was, in answering the question form my position of faith, I said I believe that God creates life. I believe that as wholly and as fully as I can believe it. That God creates life," Mourdock said. "Are you trying to suggest that somehow I think that God pre-ordained rape? No, I don't think that. That's sick. Twisted. That's not even close to what I said. What I said is that God creates life."
But that's not what Mourdock said, and that's not what anyone heard. Hell, even Mitt Romney didn't want to have anything to do with Mourdock:
"Gov. Romney disagrees with Richard Mourdock's comments, and they do not reflect his views," Romney spokeswoman Andrea Saul said in a statement.
Oh! But there's a wee problem, Governor! Just check out this video. If you're not able to watch, Romney (as you may know) just cut an ad on behalf of Mourdock. American Bridge has helpfully mashed up some of Mourdock's greatest hits (including, of course, the new rape remarks you read just above), sandwiched between Romney's words of endorsement from that new spot. Just brutal. Kind of like Mourdock's entire campaign.

Of course, the Mourdock fallout (and you knew there would be plenty) continued throughout the day on Wednesday:

"I strongly disagree with the statement made by Richard Mourdock during last night's Senate debate. I urge him to apologize," U.S. Rep. Mike Pence, the Republican candidate in Indiana's race for governor, said in a statement Wednesday morning.
Pence is almost a lock to win his race, so it's interesting that he's taking no chances and disavowing Mourdock. But NRSC chair John Cornyn is digging in:
"Richard and I, along with millions of Americans – including even Joe Donnelly – believe that life is a gift from God. To try and construe his words as anything other than a restatement of that belief is irresponsible and ridiculous," Cornyn said.
Needless to say, Cornyn's truly up against a wall. After watching Todd Akin brutally undermine one of the GOP's best pickup opportunities in Missouri, Cornyn can't afford to abandon yet another Senate candidate. He must want to strangle Mourdock, though, who turned what was an almost certain Republican hold into a very vulnerable tossup. For that alone, Democrats everywhere should send Mourdock Christmas cards.

Now, you don't really get any points for guessing that Scott Brown wants out:

"Scott Brown is pro-choice and does not agree with the views expressed by Richard Mourdock," Alleigh Marre said in a statement. "They do not reflect his thinking at all."
New Hampshire Sen. Kelly Ayotte going to ground is a little more interesting, though:
Ayotte's spokesman, Jeff Grappone, said Wednesday that the senator disagrees with Mourdock's comments, which do not represent her views. Ayotte was scheduled to campaign with Mourdock on Wednesday, but canceled her trip and is in New Hampshire instead.
Hilariously, Mourdock's campaign is claiming that they asked Ayotte not to come!

For good measure, IL-17 GOP Rep. Bobby Schilling, locked in a very tough re-election battle, also decided to call on Mourdock to apologize. For Republicans who can do a convincing job of acting non-insane, this is kind of a freebie—they get an opportunity to distance themselves from the crazies. But for Mitt Romney and every Republican who's publicly taken Mourdock's side, this is all still a very big problem.

And for what it's worth, Mourdock predictably refused to apologize for his beliefs, only offering an "I'm sorry if you understood" no-pology. I'm starting to think that Richard Mourdock losing may, in fact, be something that God intended to happen.

Senate:

AZ-Sen: Just as Indiana's remaining hot, so is Arizona. The NRSC is spending at least $2.3 million in the final two weeks of the campaign on both broadcast and cable TV in Phoenix and Tucson, to help shore up GOP Rep. Jeff Flake against Rich Carmona's surprise insurgent campaign. And for the Dems, AFSCME just jumped in with a $1.2 million anti-Flake buy.

CT-Sen (Mason-Dixon): Chris Murphy (D): 44, Linda McMahon (R): 44; Obama 49-42.

CT-Sen (Quinnipiac): Chris Murphy (D): 49 (47), Linda McMahon (R): 43 (48); Obama 55-41 (54-42). And it sure looks like someone totally set McMahon up with regard to this poll. From a press release late on Tuesday:

If tomorrow morning's release of new poll numbers from Quinnipiac University in Connecticut's U.S. Senate race hold true to recent polling trends, momentum will definitively be behind Linda McMahon.
Whoops! Turns out Quinnipiac saw a seven-point shift in Murphy's favor. So where does that leave Linda & Co.? Why, unskewing, of course! Unskewing, and, I should add, and dreaming up conspiracy theories:
I'm sure you've seen the new Q Poll in the news this morning. It's made quite the splash, but it's misleading. The model the pollsters used underestimates how many Republicans are in Connecticut by six points—in 2008, 27 percent of Connecticut's voters were Republicans, but only 21 percent of the voters sampled in this morning's Quinnipiac poll were Republicans. That six-point gap accounts for the six points they say Linda is "behind." Did Quinnipiac intentionally undersample Republicans to help Congressman Murphy? Only Quinnipiac knows for sure.
Emphasis, I must note, in the original. And wanna know something hilarious? Democrats were 43% of the electorate four years ago—but they represent just 35% of respondents in Quinnipiac's poll. So that's an eight-point gap—even bigger! Obviously it shows you just how pathetically misleading McMahon's attempts to unskew are, since the D minus R gap in this survey is only 14 net points, while according to the 2008 exit polls, it was 16.

So she's howling about a sample that's more favorable to her than the one she's citing as the proper standard. Oh, and the fact that she's accusing Quinnipiac of being in the tank for Murphy—an extraordinary charge backed by no evidence whatsoever—is just the icing.

P.S. Big Dog Alert! Bill Clinton is coming up to Waterbury, CT on Sunday to headline a rally for Murphy. If you'd like tickets, you can sign up at the link.

MA-Sen (MassINC): Elizabeth Warren (D): 50 (45), Scott Brown (R-inc): 44 (48); Obama 56-36 (52-36).

ME-Sen (Pre-General): Angus King (I): $387K raised.

MO-Sen: Turns out Todd Akin is a repeat offender:

Congressman Todd Akin was arrested at least three times in the 1980s during anti-abortion protests, not just the one time he has publicly acknowledged.

Akin's previously undisclosed arrests, in 1985, were for criminal trespass and resisting arrest at abortion clinic protests in St. Louis and Illinois.

And that one arrest Akin did disclose?
He said at that time that the campaign would later release more information about the arrest. But a campaign official later told reporters that no more information would be forthcoming.
What ever happened to those "three strikes and you're out" laws that Republicans are so fond of?

ND-Sen, -AL: Never-heard-of-`em-before pollster Pharos Research has a new survey out on all the statewide races in North Dakota. (The Hill describes Pharos's principle, Steve Leuchtman—misspelled as "Lachtman"—as a "former Gallup pollster.") Pharos suffers from the terrible tick of reporting numbers in decimals places (all the way to the hundredths, sigh), but if you can get past that, Democrat Heidi Heitkamp is up 49-48 in the Senate race over Rick Berg. Obama trails by a somewhat optimistic 49-39 margin, though the president's number is probably more important than Romney's. For the state's open at-large House seat, Democrat Pam Gulleson trails Kevin Cramer 54-42. The governor's race is not competitive in the slightest.

Wanna see something weird, though? Trolling through Pharos's website, I found half a dozen other quasi-unreleased polls, of FL, IN, MT, NE, ND, OH, PA, and San Diego, plus a national poll, too. Check out my colleague Steve Singiser's Wednesday night Polling Wrap for a full run-down of all these numbers.

NV-Sen (PPP): Shelley Berkley (D): 44 (44), Dean Heller (R-inc): 44 (47), David VanderBeek (L): 7 (4); Obama 51-47 (51-47).

OH-Sen (SurveyUSA): Sherrod Brown (D-inc): 43 (43), Josh Mandel (R): 42 (38); Obama 47-43 (45-42).

WI-Sen: Tammy Baldwin didn't waste any time in responding to Republican Tommy Thompson's desperate 9/11-themed attack ad. Baldwin's new spot is quite good, and I think Tommy's going to regret opening up this door. The narrator begins by pointing to all the Congressional roll calls where Baldwin did, in fact, vote to honor 9/11 victims, then lays Tommy out with a serious body blow:

"And Tommy Thompson? He got a government contract to provide health care to 9/11 first responders. But Tommy took advantage, leaving them without the care they were promised. Tommy Thompson personally made over $3 million off the deal. Tommy Thompson should be ashamed."
Gubernatorial:

WA-Gov: This is pretty unexpected: the first poll in many months to have Republican Rob McKenna leading the Washington gubernatorial race, and it's from Elway Research, who've been pretty volatile this cycle but were the first pollster to find Jay Inslee leading this summer. Elway puts McKenna up 47-45 (down from a 3-point Inslee lead in September). On the one hand, there does seem to be a general tightening in the race according to other pollsters... but on the other hand, this sample also finds much more conservative numbers on the ballot measures and other downballot races than other pollsters have been finding, too, which suggests a GOP-friendly sample.

To be specific, same-sex marriage is passing only 49-45 in this sample, while marijuana legalization is passing only 48-44. (Other recent polls have given these topics double-digit support.) In the statewide races, Dem Bob Ferguson leads the AG race 38-36, Dem Brad Owen leads the LG race 42-32, Dem Troy Kelley (whom the memo spells "Kelly") leads the Auditor race 34-29, and the SoS race is a flat-out tie at 34-34. (David Jarman)

House:

CA-36: How not to win elections:

Bono Mack: Latino voter outreach to come after election
"I pledge that after November, I will try my hardest to speak to Latino voters," Bono Mack said. "This election, I'm a little bit hamstrung. But I will do my best. Because I think that they deserve the attention that we need to give them."
And here's another vote of confidence in Democrat Raul Ruiz, following the release of his remarks about Leonard Peltier: The DCCC is airing a new ad attacking GOP Rep. Mary Bono Mack, saying she "voted to end the Medicare guarantee." I think the treadmill imagery ("saving for retirement is like running on a treadmill") is pretty good.

FL-02: Florida's 2nd continues to surprise. House Majority PAC is airing a new ad attacking GOP Rep. Steve Southerland (on cutting education and Medicare), which they say will "run for a week in both Panama City and Tallahassee as part of a $275,000 buy." The D-Trip is also back with another spot, also going after Southerland on Medicare. And Grover Norquist's Americans for Tax Reform is coming in large here, too, with a $504K buy targeting Democrat Al Lawson.

FL-10: Looks like Dems definitely aren't giving up on Val Demings, despite certain claims about secret GOP polls looking good in this district. The DCCC is out with a new ad attacking GOP Rep. Daniel Webster (for being "too cozy with lobbyists"), on the heels of a new poll we cited the other day that had Webster up just 2 points. And as we also mentioned, John Boehner's third-party spending groups are shelling out a monster $1.2 million here. Perhaps Webster's in need of a bailout?

FL-18 (FrederickPolls for Murphy): Patrick Murphy (D): 47 (45), Allen West (R-inc): 47 (45); Obama-Romney 48-48 (Romney 49-46). Note that the trendlines date back to May. Despite the millions that have been aired on attack ads—or perhaps because of them—I wouldn't be surprised to see this remain a game of inches.

FL-26: Funny, GOP Rep. David Rivera's ethical woes are back in the news, but this time, it's got nothing to do with the whole Justin Lamar Sternad scandal. Instead, the Florida Commission on Ethics is charging Rivera "with 11 counts for allegedly violating state rules during his tenure in the Florida legislature." Politico summarizes the allegations:

The Florida ethics commission probe into Rivera's personal finances covered a wide range of issues including: a $510,000 payment from a dog track to a company owned by his mother and godmother while he was still in the state legislature; use of campaign funds for personal expenses; and failure to disclose income in his state financial disclosure reports.
There's much more detail at the link, including Rivera's hilarious claims that the ethics commission is engaged in a conspiracy against him (driven by Democrat Joe Garcia, of course).

GA-12: Dem Rep. John Barrow could put on a clinic for Republicans on how to make an effective ad complaining about earmarks. The visuals are good throughout (and Barrow has just the right sense of humor), plus you know I'm always a sucker for anti-NYC rhetoric in campaign commercials: As ballerinas pirouette down an open road, Barrow says he "voted to get rid of funding for the ballet in New York City, too. Georgia tax dollars for that?" He also says that he voted against something called "the Perfect Christmas Tree Project" because (pointing to a stubby little shrub with a smile) "all Christmas trees are perfect."

On the merits, though, it sounds like Barrow's just being a dick, because it looks like the "Home of the Perfect Christmas Tree" is actually an effort to help economically depressed Mitchell County in of western North Carolina by promoting small businesses which make handmade Christmas products. Indeed, GOP Rep. Patrick McHenry (whose old district included Mitchell) supported the cause, and even former First Lady Laura Bush invited these artisans to decorate two White House Christmas trees back in 2006.

IL-10: Democrat Brad Schneider is taking a very interesting tack in his latest ad: It features nothing but clips of President Lyndon Johnson praising Medicare, back when it was first signed into law in 1965. Said LBJ:

"No longer will older Americans be denied the healing miracle of modern medicine. No longer will illness crush and destroy the savings that they have so carefully put away over a lifetime so that they might enjoy dignity in their later years. There are men and women in pain who will now find ease—who will now look up to see the light of hope."
Toward the end, titles appear on screen which read: "Bob Dold and the Republicans / Voted to end the Medicare Guarantee / Costing seniors $6,400 a year." I suspect this could be a very effective spot, since older voters who rely on Medicare may remember Johnson fondly over this signature achievement.

OH-16: Holy smokes. This is amazing news, but somewhat hard to interpret. GOP Rep. Jim Renacci, locked in a tight member-vs.-member re-election battle with Dem Rep. Betty Sutton in a district hand-carved for him, is cancelling all of his remaining broadcast television ad reservations—worth <$850K—and will instead "maintain a small amount of commercials on cable channels." Renacci is making the unlikely argument that voters have reached a saturation point in terms of ads and that further advertising won't be effective, but as a Sutton spokesman says, "By that logic, Mitt Romney would pull his ads, too." A good point, but is it really possible that the D-Trip's claim that Renacci's "given up" is accurate? That would be an extraordinary admission of defeat with two weeks still on the calendar.

Grab Bag:

ATR: Grover Norquist's Americans for Tax Reform just dropped an eye-popping IE report, detailing over $3 million worth of expenditures targeting Democrats in just seven House races: CA-52 ($484K), CO-03 ($392K), FL-02 ($504K), GA-12 ($404K), NY-21 ($264K), OH-06 ($1 mil) & PA-12 ($457K). (There're also some mailers against ND-Sen's Heidi Heitkamp.)

Majority PAC: The Dem-aligned Majority PAC is out with four new Senate ads, including that expected spot in Pennsylvania, where they are unexpectedly coming to Dem Sen. Bob Casey's aid. (The commercial attacks Republican Tom Smith for wanting to get rid of the Dept. of Education.) The other three are in IN, ND, and NV. Click through for links to all the ads.

Polltopia: Simon Jackman, the behind-the-scenes numbers guy for HuffPo's Pollster, is out with a newly updated graph of all the various major pollsters' "house effects." While this doesn't look backward and assess how well they've predicted previous elections, this looks at how far from the overall averages the pollsters are operating this cycle. Who's the most pro-Dem? Well, you have to dig down four slots to find a really credible pollster (Marist); the top 3 are Zogby, Suffolk (despite that not squaring with David Paleologos's knuckle-headed public pronouncements), and wildly-volatile UNH. Who's the most pro-GOP? Rasmussen, Gravis, and at the very bottom... yes, the one-time-most-respected name in American polling, Gallup. Who's closest to the arbitrary middle? Fox News, of all people, with PPP a few slots behind. (David Jarman)

Originally posted to Daily Kos Elections on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 05:00 AM PDT.

Also republished by Daily Kos.

EMAIL TO A FRIEND X
Your Email has been sent.
You must add at least one tag to this diary before publishing it.

Add keywords that describe this diary. Separate multiple keywords with commas.
Tagging tips - Search For Tags - Browse For Tags

?

More Tagging tips:

A tag is a way to search for this diary. If someone is searching for "Barack Obama," is this a diary they'd be trying to find?

Use a person's full name, without any title. Senator Obama may become President Obama, and Michelle Obama might run for office.

If your diary covers an election or elected official, use election tags, which are generally the state abbreviation followed by the office. CA-01 is the first district House seat. CA-Sen covers both senate races. NY-GOV covers the New York governor's race.

Tags do not compound: that is, "education reform" is a completely different tag from "education". A tag like "reform" alone is probably not meaningful.

Consider if one or more of these tags fits your diary: Civil Rights, Community, Congress, Culture, Economy, Education, Elections, Energy, Environment, Health Care, International, Labor, Law, Media, Meta, National Security, Science, Transportation, or White House. If your diary is specific to a state, consider adding the state (California, Texas, etc). Keep in mind, though, that there are many wonderful and important diaries that don't fit in any of these tags. Don't worry if yours doesn't.

You can add a private note to this diary when hotlisting it:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from your hotlist?
Are you sure you want to remove your recommendation? You can only recommend a diary once, so you will not be able to re-recommend it afterwards.
Rescue this diary, and add a note:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from Rescue?
Choose where to republish this diary. The diary will be added to the queue for that group. Publish it from the queue to make it appear.

You must be a member of a group to use this feature.

Add a quick update to your diary without changing the diary itself:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary?
(The diary will be removed from the site and returned to your drafts for further editing.)
(The diary will be removed.)
Are you sure you want to save these changes to the published diary?

Comment Preferences

  •  VA PPP: Obama 51-46 (15+ / 0-)

    “The country tried everything Romney says, and it brought the economy to the brink of collapse”

    by Paleo on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 05:01:10 AM PDT

  •  MA-06: HMP not giving up on this race. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    rosabw, James Allen, Woody

    20, Dude, Chairman DKE Gay Caucus! (College IN-09) (Raised IL-03, IL-09) Tammy Baldwin and Elizabeth Warren for Senate!

    by ndrwmls10 on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 05:18:32 AM PDT

  •  Looking at the opening quote (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    PassionateJus

    If life begins at conception, what does that make the sperm and egg? Are they both dead?

  •  as noted elsewhere, Colin Powell (11+ / 0-)

    endorsed Obama again, fwiw.

  •  I strongly suggest biology lessons (7+ / 0-)

    for Republican men.  Somehow they missed it in high school.

    Remember, you can't have crazy without az.

    by Desert Rose on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 05:35:55 AM PDT

  •  'Personhood' Amendment is GOP Platform Plank (5+ / 0-)

    These folks can run from Mr. Mourdock and denounce his ineloquent remark, but they agree with it.

    Mr. Mourdock merely mimicked the GOP party platform that calls for a 'Personhood' Amendment.

    It's not just a few Republicans, it's their Party Platform to outlaw all abortions (since a fetus would have Constitutional rights).

    A vote for any Republican is a vote that believes:

    Rape (that begets children) is Gods will.

    Rape is Gods will.

    Rapepublicans.

    •  problem with platforms (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Amber6541, bumiputera

      candidates rarely care what is in the platform.  Most voters, by far, don't care.  Generally the only people that care are the activists on each side who try to get their agenda into it.

      ...better the occasional faults of a government that lives in a spirit of charity, than the consistent omissions of a government frozen in the ice of its own indifference. -FDR, 1936

      by James Allen on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 05:54:28 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Honestly, I don't care. (0+ / 0-)

        I want any person who votes for any Republican to know that the offensive trash from Mr. Mourdock's mouth is a foundation of the Republican party.

        If I can persuade one vote and 537 more people like me can swing one vote to the Democrat column, then maybe Florida 2000 would have had a different result.

        I have a three year old daughter and I am pissed.

        The only other time I was this angry at Republicans is when President Bush mocked his own inability to locate weapons of mass destruction.  Brave soldiers died and he had the nerve to mock the very essence of why they were sent into battle.

        In more ways than one - Rapepublicans.

  •  So with miscarriage, that's God's "Oopsie! (4+ / 0-)

    So sorry, I didn't mean that one. Changed my mind."

    That God, such a joker.

    The sh*t those people [republicans] say just makes me weep for humanity! - Woody Harrelson

    by SoCalSal on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 05:42:43 AM PDT

  •  AZ Sen RAss: Flake 50-44 (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    James Allen

    Scotty starting the day with one of many, I'm sure, pro-Republlican polls.

    “The country tried everything Romney says, and it brought the economy to the brink of collapse”

    by Paleo on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 05:45:37 AM PDT

    •  I don't know, this could be right. (0+ / 0-)

      I think the Crowley comments will really hurt Carmona and play a role in his ultimate defeat.

      I think the final result in this race will be Flake 52% Carmona 46% Libertarian 2%.

      22/Male/ D/Native of OH-16, Attending Graduate School in NC-04. Re-Elect Betty Sutton and David Price!

      by liberal intellectual on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 05:54:44 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  It may end up being (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        James Allen

        But the last two polls had Carmona ahead, and I read somewhere that Flake's own internal had him behind.

        “The country tried everything Romney says, and it brought the economy to the brink of collapse”

        by Paleo on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 05:57:19 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Carmona always had an uphill climb (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Woody

        Arizona is far from friendly turf. And saying anything that would prevent you from opening up a big gender gap is a bad idea. And whether we like it or not, the comments he made were quite insensitive at best, and misogynistic at worst.

  •  What's the big deal? (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Joe B, Amber6541, fmrgop

    Mourdock is just saying what the majority of Republicans think (if I can use the word "think" in the same sentence as "Republican").  Why is anyone acting surprised?

    For me, the problem is not the mention of rape.  It's the mention of God.  As soon as you bring your god into it, then anything can be rationalized.  I am sick of the fanatics dominating the national conversation.  

    OTOH, I suppose I could inject Gaia into everything I say.  Then, if someone argued against me, I could ask, in faux horror, "Are you an atheist!?".

    It's long past time for people to admit to themselves that the Republican party truly is the American Taliban.

    I am become Man, the destroyer of worlds

    by tle on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 05:47:35 AM PDT

    •  A confession (7+ / 0-)

      I was once a Republican.  I am still conservative on some things.  I left the party because of these sick, demented people who have this 17th century vision of the world and use God as the backstop justification for this vision.

      They did not always dominate the GOP.  There was a time when lunatics like Mourdock and Akin would be muttering something in the back of the room.  Now they are the leaders of the party.  

      How did things get so bad?  I think it is the amoral corporatists who will pour money into any vessel that will maintain their revenue models.  Does Monsanto care if the politicians they support think that a rapist is just executing God's plan?  No.  They care about selling Roundup--lots of it--and seed that is immune to it's effect.  Monsanto is probably the worst, but there are many, many more who think the same way.

      I'm sorry for my past support of the GOP.  It now makes me sick.

      •  I agree; that's pretty much it (0+ / 0-)

        Amoral corporatists. Or even, just plain evil corporatists. But then, much of the Democratic Party could be described as compassionate corporatists. Well, at least we can try to improve it. The Rs are a lost cause.

        I am become Man, the destroyer of worlds

        by tle on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 09:34:56 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Does A Happy Dance! (10+ / 0-)

    Obama up 5 in Ohio, Endorsement by Powell, and Obama up by 5 in Virginia. Game..set..match! But I cant get too coky with two weeks to go! It seemed like a few days ago all the pundits were swooning over Romney. I tell them to go stuff it. This is great news!

  •  asdf (9+ / 0-)

    "That the people have a right to bear arms for the defence of themselves and the State ..."- Vermont Constitution Chapter 1, Article 16

    by kestrel9000 on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 05:48:29 AM PDT

  •  You're missing the point (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    gof, Woody

    I don't understand why you are going along with shifting the conversation to rape. The important point is that rape is being discussed as an exception to a hypothetical ban on abortions. I see no advantage to accepting the hypothesis to argue the exception. (Well, maybe a short term advantage. Time is short in this election and thinking is slow.)

    You wrote, "The political world exploded upon hearing these remarks, with everyone with a conscience condemning Mourdock for suggesting that there's some supreme being who "intends" rape to happen."

    You may have to trust me on this, since I've lived in Southern Indiana or Louisville, KY my whole life. The vast majority of people here did not hear Mourdock say that G_d condones rape. I don't him say that either.

    "Life begins at conception" is a conservative Catholic doctrine with nothing corresponding in Bible-based conservative Protestant theology. Catholics and Protestants are historically natural enemies, and you are letting a perfectly good wedge issue go to waste.

    Idiots, boobs and country fucks vote too.

    Romney: Stubborn, dumb, dishonest, predictable, responds poorly to pressure, and for sale. What''s not to like?

    by tomwfox on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 05:56:52 AM PDT

  •  They aren't doing God any favors (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    StrayCat, Woody

    So, it is part of God's plan for women to be raped and involuntarily pregnated.

    This ranks right up there with...

    God sacrificed his only begotten son.  

    I have always felt that a parent who would "sacrifice his son" should be arrested and face the death penalty.    

    God needs to get a new PR person.     His image is getting a bit tarnished.

  •  Everybody knows that with modern (0+ / 0-)

    science and technology, there wasn't a single case of rape.  

  •  They are ALL Mourdocks (5+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Amber6541, pattym922, itskevin, Woody, zinger99

    Every last one of them.

    From Mitt Romney all the way Down to Joe the Plumber.

    Saying that they Don't agree with Richard Mourdock
    is just another LIE
    .

    On Giving Advice: Smart People Don't Need It and Stupid People Don't Listen

    by Brian76239 on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 06:14:34 AM PDT

  •  Christianity and fatalism (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    The Caped Composer, Woody

    This whole fatalism thing going on with fundies is sketchy. God doesn't have a plan for everything, or else he is responsible for all shit happening all the time, and also human beings would have no free will.

    The world is basically chaotic and amoral, and you can believe this and still be a Christian (the world after the fall is not paradise).

    Conservatism = greed, hate, fear and ignorance

    by Joe B on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 06:23:05 AM PDT

  •  Ayotte knows NH would roast her for it (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    The Caped Composer, Woody

    NH isn't exactly bible thumping country. We like to keep our options open. Or at least those of us not in the NH House. But that's just a temporary issue.

    "I think it's the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately." -- George Carlin, Satirical Comic,(1937-2008)

    by Wynter on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 06:23:21 AM PDT

  •  I think it's pretty clear (4+ / 0-)

    that he meant that God meant the conception, not the rape, to happen. That isn't much better. It follows that God causes the 50% of pregnancies that end in spontaneous abortion (before the mother even knows she's pregnant) to happen, creating and destroying life for no good reason. It also means that we should not treat disease or injury, since those are also presumably things that God intends to happen and you can't give credit to God for creating life without acknowledging that he also brings death. It is philosophically consistent to advocate that an unborn child should not be killed for being conceived as a result of rape (because it is God's will that the rape resulted in conception, even if the rape itself was contrary to God's will), but then you also have to allow that any time we interfere in matters of life and death we are possibly acting contrary to God's will. That goes for fertility treatments as well as treating victims of gunshot wounds.

    •  Mourdock makes the logical case (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      pattym922, gof, Woody

      for rape itself as a manifestation of God's will. Mourdock doesn't have the authority to make an outrageous statement and then demand that we all ignore the logical premises of his statement. If he declares conception as God's Will, how can he state that the preceding actions that resulted in rape are not God's Will? Eh?

      Where does this knucklehead get his authority to declare what is and isn't God Will?

      Just who does he think he is? Has God told all of us that Mourdock is His official spokesman? Or is Mourdock just another in a long line of ignorant, delusional soapbox preachers who got lucky and ended up getting the backing of fascists in his run for a Senate seat?

  •  To attribute "God's Will" to anything (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    JeremiahTheMessiah

    one wishes, whether it's conception as the result of rape, or rape itself, also makes it logically plausible to attribute abortion as a manifestation of "God's Will."

    I can hear "anti-choice" readers shriek in horror at this notion. But if you go as far as to attribute pregnancy from rape, and rape itself, to God's Will, you're dancing on a land mine.

  •  The Barrow Ad is dumb (2+ / 0-)

    sorry, but this is a real sore point for me.  The notion that Georgia's tax dollars are in any supporting New York is just plain stupid.  Georgia is a taker and NY is a giver.  As a NYer, my taxes go to support the red states and NY sees very little in return.

    "He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that." - J.S. Mill

    by dmsarad on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 06:43:59 AM PDT

    •  It may be factually pisspoor (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      dmsarad, OGGoldy, itskevin

      But at least it'd probably appeal to Georgians. :P

      British guy with a big interest in US politics; -3.50, -3.18. Overheard at CPAC: A liberal, a moderate and a conservative walk into a bar. The bartender says "Hey Mitt".

      by General Goose on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 07:29:58 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  true (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        The Caped Composer, Woody

        but I really hate supporting this mentality.  The red states rail against taxes and government spending when they are the biggest beneficiaries of government spending.  As a NYer, I get the absolute worst return on investment for each of my tax dollars but yet I have to listen to a bunch of red staters complaining that their tax dollars are supporting the NY Ballet.  As if!

        "He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that." - J.S. Mill

        by dmsarad on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 07:38:59 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  When is the last time politicians spoke the truth? (0+ / 0-)

        Hell, even the politicians I like and admire lie through their teeth if it is advantageous to them and their careers. This is the nature of the political system we live in.

  •  CA-26: Got a robocall from Julia Louis-Dreyfus (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    askew

    In support of Julia Brownley. First time I've ever received a robocall.

    26, Male, CA-24 (new CA-26), DK Elections Black Caucus Chair.

    by DrPhillips on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 06:50:36 AM PDT

  •  The old Groucho joke. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Woody

    "I wouldn't be part of an organization that would have me as a member", aptly describes the GOP.

    GOP senators run away from their highest candidate; don't wanna be associated with him.

    That guy doesn't want to be associated with those of his same party and ilk.

    Some of the same rank don't want to be seen with others trying to join their ranks.

    I guess I shouldn't talk. Our Democrat running for the Nebraska Senate seat isn't wanted by progressives... Maybe they want his opponent, the tea-partier, Deb Fischer more?

    Try running as a true progressive in one of the most conservative states in the Union.

    Let us know how that works out for you.

    What is this I hear of sorrow and weariness, Anger, discontent and drooping hopes... Life is too strong for you-- It takes life to love Life

    by Nebraska68847Dem on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 06:52:00 AM PDT

    •  You mean Indiana? (0+ / 0-)
      Try running as a true progressive in one of the most conservative states in the Union.

      Let us know how that works out for you

      We have folks here at dKos who don't wanna support Joe Donnelly against Mourdock, because Joe ain't pure enuff for them.

      Who do think can win in Indiana nowadays? Bayh? Lugar? Nah, someone really liberal? Yeah, that'll do it. Sure.

      Damn, all I ask of my Congresscritters from Texas is to vote for Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi. Anything after that, I may not like it, but I can deal with it.

      Good luck with Senator Bob Kerrey. He deserves to win, and we'll all be better off if he does.

  •  Mourdock's theology (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Native Light, Woody

    Mourdock's defense was "of course God didn't preordain or cause the rape" is still a red herring in terms of the theology. But bad things happen as a result of atrocious human behavior, and a rape-induced  pregnancy is just one example. The bad things that happen are not always God's will, and not even all Christian clerics think so.

    A child gets shot and killed. God's will that the child died, or was it more likely the result of some @sshole firing a gun at the child? I'd argue the latter. People getting killed by drunk drivers, people dying by suicide. Free will, including the freedom to do something awful, has its consequences. Those of us who believe in God don't necessarily hang every bad thing on God's will, any more than we credit God for every single good thing.

    My cousin, who was gay, was killed in a motorcycle accident a couple of years ago. He was a great guy; the church where the funeral was held was huge, but there still wasn't enough room for all the mourners. The mayor of his hometown even went, and he lived in kind of a big city. It was at the Lutheran church, and I was worried about the pastor saying something about how it's all part of God's plan and I didn't want to hear that and neither did anyone else.

    The first sentence out of the pastor's mouth, and Lutherans aren't exactly well-known for tolerance of issues related to gay people, was that this wasn't God's will, that sometimes terrible things happen in spite of God.

    Anyway, I kind of wish Mourdock had attended that church, rather than the evangelical "personal relationship with God" church he obviously attends. He wouldn't have said that hurtful thing yesterday, and he'd be a better and more tolerant human being.

    The Bush Family: 0 for 4 in Wisconsin

    by Korkenzieher on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 06:55:21 AM PDT

  •  I'm Not a Real Moral Theologian (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    DrPhillips, Woody

    But I do have a Master of Divinity Degree and candidate Mourdock is nuts.

    ...(Clinton) offered more specifics of the republican plan than the republicans." Jon Stewart on the Big Dog's Speech at the DNC

    by wild hair on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 07:00:30 AM PDT

  •  they can't get off the sinking ship (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Native Light, Woody

    fast enough, but when things have cooled down they will be right back with their right wing talking points that insult and denigrate women and their right of self determination in controlling their own bodies.

    the gopers love the fetus while in the womb outside not so much, they love women at election time after not so much.

  •  Add AZ-Sen - (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Woody

    The GOP ... Government of the 1%, by the 1%, for the 1%

    by Azazello on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 07:16:47 AM PDT

  •  WA - Gov (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Woody

    If this were an off-year, then maybe McKenna would stand a chance, but not in a prez year with Romney and a "some guy" name for Senate ahead of him on the ballot. Also, all-mail works against the R "turnout advantage" of beating the bushes to get fundie congregations to vote as a bloc, etc.
    Bottom line: the R brand is just too toxic in the Puget Sound region.

  •  Why are people so perplexed? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Woody

    I cannot understand why people are so  perplexed at this.  Are they amazed that a Republican can follow a premise to its logical conclusion?  If God controls all things, then he controls rape, too.  Mourdoch gets this.  Martin Luther himself famously said that free will is blasphemy.    Nothing happens without God authorizing it!  Not rape, not war, not poverty, not famine, not slavery, not natural disaster.  A Republican just said that slavery was good, because the slaves were able to become Americans.   Was it God's plan?  Well, we don't like that explanation, because we can't understand God.  He is mysterious,  let's not question His plan.

    Let's all remember Jerry Falwell and blot out all that critical thinking. . .it annoys the powerful.

    Old Hippies Never Give Up!

    by ravenrdr on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 08:38:45 AM PDT

  •  In MA Scott Brown - is busted as a pro-lifer ...? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Woody

    While Scott Brown was all over the place trying to put spave between Mourdock and him, a pro-life group's mailer - colorful and oversized- arrived in MA voters' mailboxes declaring him their candidate - more GOP Gumby politics, bend and shape to whatever the mood .... Senator Centerfold is a REPUBLICAN who is bound to the GOP platform.
    postcard image is here:
    http://www.dailykos.com/...

    Women are 51% of the population yet are represented in congress by barely 17%! Until our representation reflects the population, we risk sliding backwards .....

    by 51percent on Thu Oct 25, 2012 at 10:45:39 AM PDT

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site