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exit polls on ranking issues by importance

Paul Krugman, in "Hawks and Hypocrites" at The New York Times, relabels  the "deficit hawks" with a bullseye "deficit scolds" and isn't pleased that one of the leading members of that clique, Erskine Bowles, is being rumored as a replacement for Tim Geithner:

It’s not just the fact that the deficit scolds have been wrong about everything so far. Recent events have also demonstrated clearly what was already apparent to careful observers: the deficit-scold movement was never really about the deficit. Instead, it was about using deficit fears to shred the social safety net. And letting that happen wouldn’t just be bad policy; it would be a betrayal of the Americans who just re-elected a health-reformer president and voted in some of the most progressive senators ever.
Yes, it would be betrayal. And yet we appear to be on the verge of a negotiation in which some on "our side" will be asserting that the only thing to be decided is how much ground to give up to the guys who lost the election.

Eugene Robinson at the Washington Post is happy that "A new America speaks":

So much for voter suppression. So much for the enthusiasm gap. So much for the idea that smug, self-appointed arbiters of what is genuinely “American” were going to “take back” the country, as if it had somehow been stolen.

On Tuesday, millions of voters sent a resounding message to the take-it-back crowd: You won’t. You can’t. It’s our country, too. [...]

On Tuesday, the America of today asserted itself. Four years ago, the presidential election was about Barack Obama and history. This time, it was about us—who we are as a nation—and a multihued, multicultural future.

Charles Krauthammer at the Washington Post, having repeatedly made a fool of himself with his pre-election prognostications, continues to do so in the aftermath. He argues in "The way forward" that all the Republican Party needs to do is get Sen. Marco Rubio to put forth a policy of "border fence plus amnesty" to corral Latinos into the GOP without the party having to make any structural changes.

Ruy Teixeira at the New York Daily News might have had Dr. Krauthammer in mind when he wrote "The Grand Anglo Party":

Republicans will be tempted to think they can close their yawning gap among these voters simply by moving to the center on immigration. To begin with, of course, that won’t be easy, given the tremendous hostility to a softer immigration policy among broad swathes of the Republican party.

But the GOP’s Hispanic problem runs deeper than that: Their views on economic, budget and domestic policy issues are also way out of sync with Latino voters.

The Editorial Board of The New York Times in "The Foreign Policy Agenda":
American military commanders are expected to recommend a timetable soon for withdrawing forces from Afghanistan. After a decade of American blood spilled there, President Obama should declare that the schedule will be dictated only by the security of the troops, and the withdrawal should take no more than a year.
Christopher de Bellaigue at The New Republic says in "The Sanctions Have Crippled Iran’s Economy, But They’re Not Working" that the sanctions against Iran are hurting the nation's economy and verge on creating a humanitarian crisis. But they aren't achieving their stated purpose of getting Iran to verify to the West's satisfaction that its nuclear program is solely for peaceful purposes:
The current course bucks the hopeful trend seen during most of the first Obama term, when America adopted a sensible, hands-off approach to most of the Middle East, thus contributing to the revolutions of 2011. The irony is that, compared to most Middle Easterners, ordinary Iranians are pro-American. Sanctions threaten not only to deny these people their health, education and hope for the future, but also to feed new grievances against the United States. It happened in Iraq, as we discovered after 2003. Hasn’t that lesson been learned?
Doyle McManus at the Los Angeles Times writes that wedge issues didn't work out so well for Republicans this year in"What the GOP once used to divide now unites Democrats":
Take immigration, long a favorite wedge wielded by Republicans to rally white voters. Last week, the downside of that strategy was on display as Latino voters turned out in bigger numbers than ever before and gave 71% of their votes to the president. Chastened Republicans didn't need much time to figure out the math for future elections, when even more Latinos will register and vote.

"We've got to deal with the issue of immigration," Haley Barbour, the former Republican National Committee chairman, told me. "We need an immigration policy based on the needs of economic policy."

The Los Angeles Times Editorial Board, instead of delivering some wisdom on the subject hem and haws in another of its stodgy, committee-written editorials: "Marijuana's hazy future."

Theo Anderson at In These Times writes about the GOP's year of magical thinking in "Now that the election charade is over, will the party accept reality?":

The 2012 election was a referendum on two very different approaches to public policy. One approach is to use the best available empirical evidence. The other is to rely on faith and wishful thinking. As in their campaign coverage, conservatives consistently opt for the latter route—a choice that has often blinded them to the reality in front of their noses. Climate change and the failure of supply-side economics are the most obvious examples.

They’re no less wrong about those than they were about the election. And moving forward, one of the great questions facing the body politic is whether conservatism is capable of learning to accept actual evidence rather than relying on faith. Mercifully, there was a mechanism for settling the debate in the case of the election. But things are rarely so cut-and-dried in the realm of policy, where politicians and pundits can go on spinning their own realities for years and decades.

Katha Pollit at The Nation writes in "The You're-on-Your-Own Society" that voters apparently decided that "we're all in this together" is a more sensible approach:
The logical corollary of “You’re on your own” is “You’re your own damn fault.” Americans in general are keen on seeing social problems in terms of individual weakness—look at how we demonize fat people, as if the reason so many are overweight is just a lack of willpower. But that mindset is particularly part of the right-wing DNA. After all, if you can hold people solely responsible for their problems, you can ignore them, deprive them, even hate them. Rape victims, women with unwanted pregnancies, poor people (get a job!), drug users, children who commit crimes, people who have been imprudent or out of line in any way, have only themselves to blame. Nicholas Kristof wrote a New York Times column a few weeks ago about his friend Scott, who had a midlife crisis, quit his job to read books and play poker, didn’t buy health insurance even after he went back to work because it was too expensive, and, partly to save money but also because he was busy and had no wife to nudge him, postponed seeing the doctor about disturbing symptoms that proved to be caused by advanced prostate cancer. Kristof’s point was that we all make mistakes, and that good public policy takes that into account. In a follow-up column that noted Scott’s death, Kristof wrote that he was “taken aback by how many readers were savagely unsympathetic. ‘Your friend made a foolish choice, and actions have consequences,’ one reader said in a Twitter message.” Yes, actions have consequences, and that’s why we need society to protect us from our folly, ignorance and bad judgment—our own and one another’s.
Dan Rodricks at the Baltimore Sun explains the reasoning behind his headline, "Election Day message: The nonsense of marijuana busts," with a breakdown of the 1.5 million drug abuse arrests in 2011 in the United States, as figured by the FBI:
[Marijuana possession] accounted for 43 percent of all drug arrests in 2011.

So, just in case you were operating under the impression that the law had backed off the whole grass-possession thing, there it is: More than four out of 10 of all narcotics arrests made in United States were for people having marijuana in their possession. [...]

You don't have to be a liberal or libertarian to see how that makes little sense. You can be a conservative and see the merit in the argument to liberate the marijuana laws: The money spent on that effort could be returned to taxpayers or it could go to some other realm of law enforcement (prosecuting enterprises that pollute our water and air, or making our border with Mexico more secure). Maybe there's a new federal prison we won't have to build. Maybe our cops could spend more time working with at-risk kids to keep them from being recruited by gangs.

There's a better way to go with all this. The people in Washington and Colorado opened the door.

Peggy Noonan, still gets to be silly at The Wall Street Journal. Her latest: "Republicans got complacent. Now it's time to rethink." Pardon me. A retraction. "Silly" does not begin to cover it.

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Comment Preferences

  •  from politico (20+ / 0-)

    nice headline summary:


    USA Today: "Latino donors to Obama gain political clout; Strong Latino support for President Obama could be LEVERAGED to advance legislation, political appointees."

    Columbus Dispatch: "Cincinnati-area GOP strongholds leave Romney short."

    Cleveland Plain Dealer: "In evenly split Ohio, redistricting gives GOP 12-4 edge in congressional seats" ( and "What now, Ohio? Unlocking the soul of the battleground voter, one cold one at a time" (

    Denver Post: "Colorado marijuana activists buttoned down to win legalization measure."

    Tampa Bay Times: "Registration, turnout shaped Hillsborough election."

    Orlando Sentinel: "Critics call failed constitutional amendments too conservative, too controversial."

    Sioux City Journal: "County candidates ride Obama's coattails to victory."

    Charlotte Observer: "Democrats banished to the bench but warm up for '14; GOP wins pushed them to back bench, but all not lost, party insists."

    Raleigh News & Observer (via AP): "NC Democrats coping with all power lost in NC."

    Richmond Times-Dispatch: "Chesterfield County is not blue yet, but it is not as reliably red as it once was...Romney on Tuesday won central Virginia's most populous locality by 13,000 votes over Obama in the race for the White House, but he didn't accumulate the margins of previous Republican presidential candidates. Though no Democrat has won Chesterfield at the presidential level since President Harry S. Truman in 1948, it is no longer as Republican-leaning as it was in the last decade, when President George W. Bush twice won the county by more than 30,000 votes. Many point to Chesterfield's changing demographics."

    Roanoke Times: "Where did Democratic support drop the most? IN THE COALFIELDS." Seven of the eight counties where Democrats saw their largest vote drop-off came in coal country. "One has to wonder how much of this flip is due to the general realignment of white, working-class votes from Democrats to Republicans."

    Roanoke Times: Virgil Goode finished fourth in Virginia, behind the Libertarian candidate. He only got 13,482 votes, or 0.36 percent.

    Washington Post: "GOP's Red America forced to rethink what it knows about the country."

    Milwaukee Journal Sentinel: "The Latino vote in Wisconsin clearly isn't as big and decisive as in some states, but it's a swing state with a booming Hispanic population."

    Philadelphia Inquirer: "More Philadelphia voters needed provisional ballots in 2012 than in 2008" ( and "In 59 Philadelphia voting wards, Romney got zero votes" (

    Reno Gazette-Journal: "On election night, Nevada didn't matter."

    Las Vegas Sun: "How Heller overcame Nevada Democrats' vaunted turnout machine."

    Union Leader: "Joe McQuaid's Publisher's Notebook: In elections, as with weather, change good."

    "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

    by Greg Dworkin on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 04:34:15 AM PST

  •  Cares about people like me..... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    coppercelt, tb mare

    81% -- and there you have it!

  •  Dear Joe Scarborough.....a couple of points..... (9+ / 0-)

    1. Petraeus DID admit to the affair.
    2. Investigating the CIA must be a BITCH.
    3. It's okay for you to name the names of those in the 'GOP media elite.'

    just sayin.

  •  Deficit reduction cliff (14+ / 0-)

    Isn't it time we started referring to the 'fiscal cliff' for what it really is - a deficit reduction cliff?

    The tax increases have the least effect on the economy (per the CBO), it's the spending cuts that might lead to another recession.  We need to force Republicans and Americans in general to realize this simple basic fact: cutting government spending right now is a bad thing and everyone is in agreement on that.

    This is why we passed a stimulus package.  This is why we should have passed a larger stimulus package.  Increasing government spending is still our best shot at invigorating the economy.

    Yes we need to avoid the fiscal cliff - we need to avoid cutting government spending in an already weak economy.  Reducing the deficit right now is bad policy and we should avoid doing so - but let's be clear about what we're doing.

    •  It's the Tax Revenue Cliff. Allowing Bush cuts to (0+ / 0-)

      expiire will increase the revenues and end the starvation diet imposed on the government by Paul Ryan & GOP House and Boehner's Filibustering 40 GOP Senators.  So, we're already bruised and battered at the bottom of the cliff and have been trying to climb back up. The various stimulus efforts piled up some debri and wreckage and got us back up above sea level, but we probably need to see 10 Trillion put back into the overall economy to not just get us back to work, but to restore stolen pensions and the lingering upside down mortgage crisis where little direct aid has ever reached mortgage holders.  

      Expiring the tax cuts drops us a stairway from the top of the cliff up towards the plain of full recovery and gives our government enough funding to afford to enforce regulations, execute and follow through on projects that benefit the 99% of us.  The sad thing is, even as our own US economy seems to be improving, the exploding EU debt crisis, which kindly waited until the day after the election to explode, is pushing down hard on Wall Street's stock market and causing much fear amongst those who have been hanging onto the capital to expand the economy and hire. Add to that the IMF talking about forgiving debts for entire nations and that is making prospects for our global investors feel that much more iffy.  So even if the tax cuts expire, the net effect may be to turn our stairway to full recovery into more of a 'Down' esculator that we'll have to run double-time to climb up.

      The GOP has systematically been trying to create and maintain this cliff to push us off, to block executive functions to fix this, to collude with the biggest holders of capital to hold down hiring and prevent the expansion of our US economy, to increase their grip on our working and middle classes, to grasp and take away our Social Security & Medicare as spoils for the wealthiest fraction of the 1%.

      They've worked for 4 years to try and force Obama to be as ineffectual as they claim, via undermining, underfunding, preventing actionable budgets, pointless investigations, filibusters, legal delay tactics, spending over $1 Billion on a campaign of obfuscation, misdirection and distortion and outright lying. The GOP have religiously been following Grover Norquist's Obstinance Only Policy to prevent the US citizen's own government from conceiving, creating and maintaining any good and desperately needed benefits for the 99% of us.

      Long term the GOP cannot really afford to do this and be held responsible for it in 2014 and 2016 (besides 2012).  Continually keeping the working and middle class in a state of fear and desperation results in lowering the birthrates of the very 'majorities' they had hoped to keep them in power.  Of course, that's why the need to counter that with their War on Unwanted Voters. But especially wrenching was the unexpected War on Women, even as 99% of American women are still using birth control to delay or prevent unwanted pregnancy--very necessary in these uncertain times, and a large majority of women voted for Obama in order to drop a dime and send an unmistakeable message to the GOP (even as many still voted for local GOP officials).  The women have clearly signalled their rebellion and the GOP has finally wakened up to the fact that all that talk of legitimate rape, and how a woman's body prevents prenancy if the raped woman truly doesn't want it, was a huge costly and difficult to repair tactical mistake.  Karen Hughes (Bush 43 press secretary) has identified this failing and others in her Politico opinion piece on GOP communication and tone failures.  

      Politico 11/9/2012 - Karen Hughes - Communication lessons from the election
      "If another Republican man says anything about rape other than it is a horrific, violent crime, I want to personally cut out his tongue. The college-age daughters of many of my friends voted for Obama because they were completely turned off by Neanderthal comments like the suggestion of 'legitimate rape.'
      Many leading lights amongst the GOP leaders still seem to think it's all just a PR and messaging problem and that we'd all love austerity as the needed patriotic poisoned Kool-Aid we all have to take, if it was just given decent treatment by the treasonous 'liberal' media.  And well, it's not all gloomy on the stock market. Prices of shares in gun manufacturors has risen about 10% since the election, even as gun dealers have been offering some big discount sales to pump up demand higher. Strange discordant GOP world where we (ok, mostly men) all can have guns to protect our castles but not reproductive control to protect women's bodies.

      When life gives you wingnuts, make wingnut butter!

      by antirove on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 10:53:12 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Ruy Teixeria has been talking about this forever (4+ / 0-)

    I can remember him writing a decade ago about these demographic pattern shifts favoring Democrats.

    When morons like Karl Rove and Scott Rasmussen and Karl Rove were talking in 2004 about a permanent Republican majority, Teixeria was writing (with John Judis) books with titles like

    The Emerging Democratic Majority

  •  am I really sitting here listening to Republicans (11+ / 0-)

    Express outrage about privacy intrusion by intelligence departments in their investigation of Petreaus.

    Really?   After they sat around justifying warrantless wiretapping, national security letters, detoothing FISA, allowing data mining projects to go on after being declared illegal, and just plain sayin FU to civil liberties?


    Now, I agree with the points, but republicans have Zero foundation to stand on, and democrats will shortly realize the impact of silence back when the President decided to switch sides/positions on warrantless wiretapping, which really wound not meaning much.  This idea of Law enforcement just accessing stuff Willy nilly has consequences.   And we are about to see why it is so corrosive.  And Dems will only have themselves to blame for not standing up earlier.  And I don't just mean politicians.

    "Small Businesses Don't Build Levees" - Melissa Harris Perry

    by justmy2 on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 04:44:48 AM PST

  •  How do you see the whole Noonan piece? (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    JaxDem, skohayes, tb mare

    All I get from the link is the first paragraph and no visible way to continue. I don't think the opinion pieces are paywalled, are they?

    You know, I sometimes think if I could see, I'd be kicking a lot of ass. -Stevie Wonder at the Glastonbury Festival, 2010

    by Rich in PA on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 04:46:34 AM PST

  •  No bargains (4+ / 0-)

    Republicans must understand that they lost the election, that they have lost whatever "mandate" they may have claimed from 2010. The people have spoken, and they have spoken clearly in favor of a progressive agenda that protects the most vulnerable Americans and restores the basic functions of our government. The GOP is currently in severe demographic crisis and virtually on the path to extinction without a real change in their ideology. This is hardly a position of strength with which to negotiate from. The Tea Party needs to stop their anti-American radicalism and accept reality as it stands.   -  progressive

    •  but the Republicans control the House (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      a gilas girl, yellowdog, skohayes

      it's just a question of math, one can't get around that, no matter how much the election results indicate a broad win for Obama + Dems

      •  The question is whether the Rebubs were clipped (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        tb mare, Words In Action

        back enough that it will be easier for Boehner to find a minority of his own caucus to go along with the Dems for a deal that includes letting the tax cuts for the rich expire, than it would be to find unity in diving off the (fictional ) fiscal cliff and being roasted by Wall Street.
        Have we reached that tipping point?

        My guess is that we have, and there will be individual gop reps. who peel off and accept the expiration of the tax cuts.

        That will set the tone for other modest gains we can make by peeling away gop reps who are more interested in getting back to business as usual than they are in placating a declining tea party.

        You can't make this stuff up.

        by David54 on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 05:19:33 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Joe Biden, in an interview he did (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          tb mare, Photon Algae, JaxDem

          shortly before the election with, IIRC, Chris Matthews said he thought that there would be enough rational Republicans to get things done after a Dem win. I have my doubts, but Joe has been in politics for 30+ years so I think he is a better judge of the politics and personalities involved. I hope he is right.

          You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is "Never get involved in a land war in Asia".

          by yellowdog on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 06:38:42 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

        •  who are the key moderate Republicans in the House? (0+ / 0-)

          I don't follow the Congress very closely . I'm curious, which Republican politicians are you referring to?

          •  Any that are in a purple district and any of the (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Photon Algae

            non-teaparty ideologues who will want to go back to getting stuff for their district more than they want to posture. Because of the opposition to Obama, they've put off a lot of stuff , the farm bill, for instance, in spite of their constituents. I realize redistricting has made those people fewer, but there's more to be gained for most of them by getting along rather than obstructing at this point.
            There's some that will mouth "strong-sounding" rhetoric til the bitter end and then vote on a deal.

            You can't make this stuff up.

            by David54 on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 09:07:42 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

      •  If the President engages the public, to which (0+ / 0-)

        the public will more than amply respond, there is NO Republican majority that can withstand popular opinion on the matters of income inequality and social programs. NONE.

        Purging predominantly minority voters and requiring them to present IDs to vote in the face of VIRTUALLY NON-EXISTENT VOTER FRAUD is RACISM! I hereby declare all consenting Republicans RACISTS until they stand up and object to these practices!

        by Words In Action on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 12:24:08 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  5% cared most about foreign policy. Very (3+ / 0-)

    predictable considering the state of the economy and yet Romney seemed to think his best shot was repeating Benghazi over and over and over again. The more I read in the aftermath of the election the more I realize how damn deluded these people were.

    "I smoke. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your fuckin' mouth." --- Bill Hicks

    by voroki on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 04:49:26 AM PST

  •  Five points off for not excerpting Nooners! (4+ / 0-)

    The article is subscription-based, so those of us who refuse to give WSJ one thin dime don't get to feel the glow of her (presumably) White-Hot Fail!

    And no, one little sentence that sounds like all the other "Republicans have to make their strategy look like they're moderating" op-eds does not count as a kill!

    "If you're going to go down with the ship, make it a submarine." - Wayne Shorter

    by Oliver Tiger on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 04:49:40 AM PST

  •  How does Noonan get away with not at least (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    ratcityreprobate, tb mare, skohayes

    admitting that she was part of it? Compared to her, Scarborough made out like roses.

    Is this just math that you do as a Republican to make yourself feel better?

    by ConfusedSkyes on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 04:52:21 AM PST

  •  Important nugget (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    a gilas girl, tb mare, skohayes, celdd

    in the Tampa Bay Times piece:

    Across Florida, early voting dropped 9.4 percent from 2008 to 2012.
    First I've seen that statistic.  

    As we express our gratitude, we must never forget that the highest appreciation is not to utter words, but to live by them. John F. Kennedy

    by JaxDem on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 04:54:43 AM PST

    •  Early voting was reduced from 14 days to 8 days (7+ / 0-)

      by our Governor.....why does this statistic surprise anyone?
      That's why the lines were hours long on Nov. 6

      If a free society cannot help the many who are poor, it cannot save the few who are rich. John F. Kennedy ( inaugural address, January 20, 1961)

      by Outraged Mom on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 05:19:08 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Not suprised at all (5+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        DRo, tb mare, skohayes, celdd, Eric Nelson

        It is the first I've seen any info on whether there was a drop off from 2008 - which there was and what the % of that drop off was.  It is important info to use now to move forward in correcting those problems.  

        First reaction is to get Scott out of office -- which we need to make a top priority, certainly, but the voting problems in Florida far precede Scott.  It's past time for Florida to move into the 21st century in regards to voting.

        As we express our gratitude, we must never forget that the highest appreciation is not to utter words, but to live by them. John F. Kennedy

        by JaxDem on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 05:28:25 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  I will heartily endorse and support (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          JaxDem, Eric Nelson

          anyone with a chance of beating Rick Scott!!

          “We are not a nation that says ‘don’t ask, don’t tell.’ We are a nation that says ‘out of many, we are one.’” -Barack Obama

          by skohayes on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 06:50:45 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Same here! (0+ / 0-)

            Quinnipiac released a poll on Oct. 31st showing him at a 39% approval rating which was +1 from the last poll done.  I am eagerly awaiting the results post election!  

            His approval rating has been 40% or lower for the majority of his term.  I can't see it ever getting above that level.  It will be crucial to get people excited and out to the polls in the 2014 election because you know the Teapublicans will be doing everything they can to retain that position of power.

            Rumors have it Charlie Crist may run against Scott.  

            As we express our gratitude, we must never forget that the highest appreciation is not to utter words, but to live by them. John F. Kennedy

            by JaxDem on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 08:05:40 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

  •  Scrolled across msnbc.....Schumer and Graham (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    a gilas girl, skohayes, Eric Nelson

    announce immigration reform bill.

    •  I'm pissed Shumer let Graham in on it. (0+ / 0-)

      You can't make this stuff up.

      by David54 on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 05:23:04 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Lindsey Graham (0+ / 0-)

        and John McCain were two of the "forefathers" of comprehensive immigration reform from Republicans.
        Their cowardice overtook their sensibilities, but they should be in the negotiations to give a sense of bipartisanship.

        “We are not a nation that says ‘don’t ask, don’t tell.’ We are a nation that says ‘out of many, we are one.’” -Barack Obama

        by skohayes on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 06:52:39 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  folks, this is it. We have to fight. (13+ / 0-)

    We reelected the President.  We owe it to him to pull left as hard as possible.  They same way LGBT did with dadt, the same way Latinos did to get temporary relief.  Now is not the time to say give the President space to negotiate.  This is not the time to let the president lose all of his capital for now and the future with the base.  We have to fight him to fight for him.  And that won't mean we appreciate him any less.   This is liberals moment.   Time to step up.  We can't let the President take the same exact deal, or maybe even a bit less, than he was offered BEFORE winning a electoral landslide.   We can't let him do it.   I want his Presidency to go down in history for the right reasons.  Not because he was responsible for creating a civil war in the democratic party when that war could begin in the Republican one.

      The pundits are fighting for themselves and their tax rates.  They have no worries.   And they are taking it out on the middle class and the poor.   Will we stand up for the middle class and the poor.  Are we ready to march and make calls telling the president to no waste his leverage.

    This is the liberal moment of truth.  The results of this deal will say whether our coalition had any principals that we are willing to fight for regardless of the party in power.  Are we up for it?

    "Small Businesses Don't Build Levees" - Melissa Harris Perry

    by justmy2 on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 04:57:57 AM PST

    •  It appears that the millions Bowles and Simpson's (4+ / 0-)

      Fix the Debt campaign is spending is working; spinning their corporate catfood agenda, getting the group front page coverage in the Washington Post and other outlets, NPR this morning, too.

      IMHO, Bowles and Simpson, the gang of eight and their who's who of Wall street hedge-fund managers, bankers and CEO's are the real foes. They want to dismantle the New Deal, cut corporate tax rates too. When the effective corporate tax rate is really around 17 percent, they don't have a case.

      So, we have a fight on two fronts, Boehner and Bowles.
      Let's go, write and call the congresscritters and send letters to the editors of our newspapers.

      "Lets show the rascals what Citizens United really means."

      by smiley7 on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 05:40:05 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  The blaming of the election loss (12+ / 0-)

    on immigration issues has been the most obnoxious and short-sighted crap I've seen this weekend. And repeated - the if only we had done immigration reform Mitt Romney would have won crowd is getting bigger and louder.
    The GOP strategy of trying to head-fake Hispanics into thinking they give a shit summed up in Politico's media cocoon article this morning:

    But to many next-generation Republicans, this smacks of tokenism and is more than a tad patronizing.
    “They just want to put a sombrero on the Republican elephant,” said one Latino GOP operative, who didn’t want to be identified discussing such a sensitive topic.

    Lipstick on a pig.

    I'm pretty tired of being told what I care about.

    by hulibow on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 04:59:40 AM PST

    •  Sombrero on the elephant is even better a saying (6+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      DRo, hulibow, tb mare, skohayes, celdd, Eric Nelson

      than lipstick on a pig.

      Is this just math that you do as a Republican to make yourself feel better?

      by ConfusedSkyes on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 05:25:20 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Good one..."sombrero." a Monday chuckle (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      hulibow, tb mare, skohayes, Eric Nelson

      You can't make this stuff up.

      by David54 on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 05:25:24 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  profound failure (6+ / 0-)

      to understand issues, they still think a surface level swipe (which is what most of their coverage is, create a surface facade and hit that facade home infinitum) is how politics works.

      It is how politics worked in the 1980's when the Dems had no counter to their RWNM, but the times have changed.


      Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

      by a gilas girl on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 05:39:34 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Krauthammer exposes the right's blind spot (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      celdd, One Opinion
      The principal reason they go Democratic is the issue of illegal immigrants. In securing the Republican nomination, Mitt Romney made the strategic error of (unnecessarily) going to the right of Rick Perry. Romney could never successfully tack back.

      For the party in general, however, the problem is hardly structural. It requires but a single policy change: Border fence plus amnesty. Yes, amnesty. Use the word. Shock and awe — full legal normalization (just short of citizenship) in return for full border enforcement.

      They think it's all about illegal immigration, and they're completely wrong.
      "If we just give everyone already here amnesty, they'll vote for us"
      That didn't work for Reagan in the 1980s and it won't work for the Republicans now.
      This is why they will continue to lose Hispanic voters:
      Imagine Marco Rubio advancing such a policy on the road to 2016. It would transform the landscape. He’d win the Hispanic vote. Yes, win it. A problem fixable with a single policy initiative is not structural. It is solvable.
      They think throwing a guy up there with a Hispanic last name will get all the Hispanics to vote for them.
      It's a kind of tone deafness that really makes you wonder.

      “We are not a nation that says ‘don’t ask, don’t tell.’ We are a nation that says ‘out of many, we are one.’” -Barack Obama

      by skohayes on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 07:00:28 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  De Ja Vu -- this happened 4 years ago (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    bluezen, Patate

    No one should be surprised!

    Progressive Candidate Obama (now - Nov 6, 2012)
    Bipartisan Obama returns (Nov 7, 2012)

    by The Dead Man on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 05:01:37 AM PST

  •  Krauthammer says that this country (14+ / 0-)

    doesn't need two liberal parties.  I agree; I would be satisfied with one.  

  •  look west america (5+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    smiley7, bluezen, tb mare, celdd, Eric Nelson

    and watch what paul krugman says, he cares more about america and its future then the vast majority of the pols including 44 from the looks of it, bowles ugh!

  •  Peggy Noonan has been spiraling the drain (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    for a long time.

    You can't make this stuff up.

    by David54 on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 05:05:04 AM PST

  •  interesting short video on relationship (0+ / 0-)

    between marijuana legalization, alcohol and cost

  •  Can you state this... (4+ / 0-)
    And yet we appear to be on the verge of a negotiation in which some on "our side" will be asserting that the only thing to be decided is how much ground to give up to the guys who lost the election.
    a bit more more straightforwardly? Who on our side is asserting this? I'd like to know who I should be yelling at. If people on our side are pre-capitulating, there shouldn't be any need for weasel words.

    Thanks in advance. longer in SF.... -9.00, -7.38

    by TFinSF on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 05:21:12 AM PST

  •  I personally think that ALL of the Bush tax cuts (8+ / 0-)

    should expire.  They never should have passed in the first place.  I would also get rid of the sequester as well.

    If you let ALL of the Bush tax cuts expire there is your $4 trillion needed...Voila.  No cuts necessary.

    President Obama, January 9, 2012: "Change is hard, but it is possible. I've Seen it. I've Lived it."

    by Drdemocrat on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 05:22:06 AM PST

  •  Ugh! Replacing Geithner with (7+ / 0-)

    Bowles? I agree wholeheartedly with Krugman:

    I don’t know how seriously to take the buzz about appointing Erskine Bowles to replace Timothy Geithner. But in case there’s any reality to it, let’s recall his record. Mr. Bowles, like others in the deficit-scold community, has indulged in scare tactics, warning of an imminent fiscal crisis that keeps not coming. Meanwhile, the report he co-wrote was supposed to be focused on deficit reduction — yet, true to form, it called for lower rather than higher tax rates, and as a “guiding principle” no less. Appointing him, or anyone like him, would be both a bad idea and a slap in the face to the people who returned President Obama to office.
    I guess we only get a week for our gloating and then it is back to politics as usual. But ewwwwww!

    American Television is a vast sea of stupid. -xxdr zombiexx

    by glitterscale on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 05:39:48 AM PST

    •  Bowles is not a done deal (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      skohayes, Eric Nelson

      Jack Lew would certainly be far less disappointing to me than Bowles (after all, it has to be someone with "Wall Street cred"), and that would pave the way for Valerie Jarrett to be CoS.

      That may be wishful thinking, but it felt really nice to type at least.

      When you are right you cannot be too radical; when you are wrong, you cannot be too conservative. --Martin Luther King Jr.

      by Egalitare on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 06:52:32 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  "after all, it has to be someone with 'Wall St (0+ / 0-)


        That's like saying we need a mafia insider to deal with the mafia. Personally, I think it's time we get our heads on straight. Whether these are the smartest guys in the room or not, they can't be trusted with a cookie jar. We should make our decisions, including our selections, accordingly. Decorum and tradition are entirely beside the point...

        Purging predominantly minority voters and requiring them to present IDs to vote in the face of VIRTUALLY NON-EXISTENT VOTER FRAUD is RACISM! I hereby declare all consenting Republicans RACISTS until they stand up and object to these practices!

        by Words In Action on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 12:19:45 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  At this point, it's nothing but a rumor (0+ / 0-)

      Let's not take it seriously at all.

      “We are not a nation that says ‘don’t ask, don’t tell.’ We are a nation that says ‘out of many, we are one.’” -Barack Obama

      by skohayes on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 07:02:07 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  This says so much ... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    tb mare
    whether conservatism is capable of learning to accept actual evidence rather than relying on faith.
    It seems to tie so much together: the right wing evangelical religious connection, avoidance of evidence-based reality, anti-science attitude, an American theocracy, etc.

    For conservatives/Repubs, it all comes down to faith ... but not in a good way.  A faith-based vision of reality is what ties them together.  It accounts for their hypocrisy, illogical thinking and insular belief system.

    The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt. Bertrand Russell

    by accumbens on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 06:04:40 AM PST

  •  election could have been stolen - computers (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Words In Action

    I attended an evening with writers from the Columbus Free Press here in Columbus Ohio on Saturday evening.

    I have been in OH for almost 35 years and read one book, "Witness To A Crime: A Citizens audit of the 2004 election in OH." And was generally impressed that the 2004 election in which Kerry was defeated was stolen.

    After the meeting on Saturday, I am convinced that the election in 2004 was stolen and the election in 2012 could have been stolen.

    I was at Dem celebration in 2004 when the exit polls had Kerry behind and then when the votes came in later, it was called for W Bush. The folks who follow this said that Rove came on the line on Tuesday evening one minute before he came on the line in 2004. And he said the computers were crashed in a couple of counties. Note the words used.

    In 2004, the computers crashed and when they came up again, the election went to Bush. Several hundred thousand votes came from somewhere.

    Did you hear that Romney's son bought a voting machine company that had machines in several counties? And that these machines failed all 12 security tests? They were the worst machines which makes them the easiest to hack.

    And also, did you hear that experimental software was installed on tabulating systems here in Oh? (by the way, the final tabulations in 2004 were done outside OH by primate companies and the company who was going to do the overall tabulation in 2012 was the same company that hosted karl roves emails when he was in the white house when thousands of millions of emails disappeared). There was a  suite filed on Monday the day before the election to challenge the use of experimental software. Out of nowhere, a NSA retiree with over 30 years experience and one of the top 50 agents in the country showed up as an expert witness for the filing.

    There were justice department officials and FBI all over the state on the night of the election. The Republican officials faced criminal charges if there was a major change. It was fortunate that Obama won by a lot.

    There is a lot to this story. There are several books written by Election Integrity people.

    I am in crisis at home right now and cannot spend more time on this.

    The Columbus Free Press with no paid staff broke these two stories and their Election Protection Project with an ongoing suite.

    Here is the web site.


  •  Saw Noonan yesterday on the Sunday talking heads (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Egalitare, tb mare, skohayes, celdd

    and she spent a long time saying absolutely nothing but pabulum. Her message to Reps was "be nicer." And while keeping RW condescending, arrogant and frequently hateful thoughts to themselves would be a welcome relief, it's their POLICIES POSITIONS that need to be changed. Telling me in a nice, polite way that I can't have access to health care, marry who I love, can't have an abortion or birth control, can't have food stamps, get by on less or no SSI will not get me to vote for you.

    And BTW, putting up Pancho or Maria Last-name-ends-in-O won't get my vote either.

    Wow they never look at their policies. Just more window dressing and lies. Well, we're in the majority now. A GROWING majority, and we're not going to take their BS anymore.

    the Republican brand is totally bankrupt.

    by vlyons on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 06:53:30 AM PST

  •  I do have an online sub to the Wall Street Journal (5+ / 0-)

    and, jeez, it costs me an arm and a leg, but in case you don't, may I summarize Peggy Noonan's thought provoking piece for you:

    "I was wrong in my blog post of November 5, 2012, but I stili say everything I wrote was correct. We in the GOP were wrong about everything this year, but, in actuality, we are all completely correct. Bartender, would you hit me again?"

    •  LOL, that's pretty good (3+ / 0-)

      I love that Noonan, and others like Scarborough and Politico are talking about the media bubble the right has covered themselves in, and everyone ELSE is at fault for this.

      Here's an excerpt from the Politico article:

      In this reassuring conservative pocket universe, Rasmussen polls are gospel, the Benghazi controversy is worse than Watergate, “Fair and Balanced” isn’t just marketing and Dick Morris is a political seer.

      Even this past weekend, days after a convincing Obama win, it wasn’t hard to find fringes of the right who are convinced he did so only because of mass voter fraud and mysteriously missing military ballots. Like a political version of “Thelma and Louise,” some far-right conservatives are in such denial that they’d just as soon keep on driving off the cliff than face up to a reality they’d rather not confront.

      But if the Fox News-talk radio-Drudge Report axis is the most powerful force in the conservative cocoon, technology has rendered even those outlets as merely the most popular destinations in the choose-your-own-adventure news world in which consumers are more empowered than ever.

      Read more:

      “We are not a nation that says ‘don’t ask, don’t tell.’ We are a nation that says ‘out of many, we are one.’” -Barack Obama

      by skohayes on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 07:10:03 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  And here's the blog post (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        One Opinion, Eric Nelson, skohayes

        She still stands behind, despite its being spectacularly, incredibly incorrectomundo.

        We begin with the three words everyone writing about the election must say: Nobody knows anything. Everyone’s guessing. I spent Sunday morning in Washington with journalists and political hands, one of whom said she feels it’s Obama, the rest of whom said they don’t know. I think it’s Romney. I think he’s stealing in “like a thief with good tools,” in Walker Percy’s old words. While everyone is looking at the polls and the storm, Romney’s slipping into the presidency. He’s quietly rising, and he’s been rising for a while.

        Obama and the storm, it was like a wave that lifted him and then moved on, leaving him where he’d been. Parts of Jersey and New York are a cold Katrina. The exact dimensions of the disaster will become clearer when the election is over. One word: infrastructure. Officials knew the storm was coming and everyone knew it would be bad, but the people of the tristate area were not aware, until now, just how vulnerable to deep damage their physical system was. The people in charge of that system are the politicians. Mayor Bloomberg wanted to have the Marathon, to show New York’s spirit. In Staten Island last week they were bitterly calling it “the race through the ruins.” There is a disconnect.

        But to the election. Who knows what to make of the weighting of the polls and the assumptions as to who will vote? Who knows the depth and breadth of each party’s turnout efforts? Among the wisest words spoken this cycle were by John Dickerson of CBS News and Slate, who said, in a conversation the night before the last presidential debate, that he thought maybe the American people were quietly cooking something up, something we don’t know about.

        I think they are and I think it’s this: a Romney win.

        Romney’s crowds are building—28,000 in Morrisville, Pa., last night; 30,000 in West Chester, Ohio, Friday It isn’t only a triumph of advance planning: People came, they got through security and waited for hours in the cold. His rallies look like rallies now, not enactments. In some new way he’s caught his stride. He looks happy and grateful. His closing speech has been positive, future-looking, sweetly patriotic. His closing ads are sharp—the one about what’s going on at the rallies is moving.

        All the vibrations are right. A person who is helping him who is not a longtime Romneyite told me, yesterday: “I joined because I was anti Obama—I’m a patriot, I’ll join up But now I am pro-Romney.” Why? “I’ve spent time with him and I care about him and admire him. He’s a genuinely good man.” Looking at the crowds on TV, hearing them chant “Three more days” and “Two more days”—it feels like a lot of Republicans have gone from anti-Obama to pro-Romney.

        Something old is roaring back. One of the Romney campaign’s surrogates, who appeared at a rally with him the other night, spoke of the intensity and joy of the crowd “I worked the rope line, people wouldn’t let go of my hand.” It startled him. A former political figure who’s been in Ohio told me this morning something is moving with evangelicals, other church-going Protestants and religious Catholics. He said what’s happening with them is quiet, unreported and spreading: They really want Romney now, they’ll go out and vote, the election has taken on a new importance to them.

        There is no denying the Republicans have the passion now, the enthusiasm. The Democrats do not. Independents are breaking for Romney. And there’s the thing about the yard signs. In Florida a few weeks ago I saw Romney signs, not Obama ones. From Ohio I hear the same. From tony Northwest Washington, D.C., I hear the same.

        Is it possible this whole thing is playing out before our eyes and we’re not really noticing because we’re too busy looking at data on paper instead of what’s in front of us? Maybe that’s the real distortion of the polls this year: They left us discounting the world around us.

        And there is Obama, out there seeming tired and wan, showing up through sheer self discipline. A few weeks ago I saw the president and the governor at the Al Smith dinner, and both were beautiful specimens in their white ties and tails, and both worked the dais. But sitting there listening to the jokes and speeches, the archbishop of New York sitting between them, Obama looked like a young challenger—flinty, not so comfortable. He was distracted, and his smiles seemed forced. He looked like a man who’d just seen some bad internal polling. Romney? Expansive, hilarious, self-spoofing, with a few jokes of finely calibrated meanness that were just perfect for the crowd. He looked like a president. He looked like someone who’d just seen good internals.

        Of all people, Obama would know if he is in trouble. When it comes to national presidential races, he is a finely tuned political instrument: He read the field perfectly in 2008. He would know if he’s losing now, and it would explain his joylessness on the stump. He is out there doing what he has to to fight the fight. But he’s still trying to fire up the base when he ought to be wooing the center and speaking their calm centrist talk. His crowds haven’t been big. His people have struggled to fill various venues. This must hurt the president after the trememdous, stupendous crowds of ’08. “Voting’s the best revenge”—revenge against who, and for what? This is not a man who feels himself on the verge of a grand victory. His campaign doesn’t seem president-sized. It is small and sad and lost, driven by formidable will and zero joy.

        I suspect both Romney and Obama have a sense of what’s coming, and it’s part of why Romney looks so peaceful and Obama so roiled.

        Romney ends most rallies with his story of the Colorado scout troop that in 1986 had an American flag put in the space shuttle Challenger, saw the Challenger blow up as they watched on TV, and then found, through the persistence of their scoutmaster, that the flag had survived the explosion. It was returned to them by NASA officials. When Romney, afterward, was shown the flag, he touched it, and an electric jolt went up his arm. It’s a nice story. He doesn’t make its meaning fully clear. But maybe he means it as a metaphor for America: It can go through a terrible time, a catastrophe, as it has economically the past five years, and still emerge whole, intact, enduring.

        Maybe that’s what the coming Romney moment is about: independents, conservatives, Republicans, even some Democrats, thinking: We can turn it around, we can work together, we can right this thing, and he can help.

  •  Although I'm not holding my breath (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Meteor Blades, Words In Action

    I'd like to see Obama put together a real "Team of Rivals" cabinet of the sort we were told he wanted during his first term but obviously never got, given that his cabinet, while perhaps politically somewhat diverse, with several Repubs and his main rival in the primaries in it, was ideologically very uniform, with most of its members being establishment centrists not about to buck that establishment.

    And of those that he nominated or considered nominating who were not centrists, like Warren, Bernstein and Romer, most were either not nominated in the end, were never confirmed, or were marginalized and soon left. Obama's first term was absolutely dominated by establishment centrists like Summers, Geithner and Holder, or loyal apparachnicks like Jarret, Axelrod and Plouffe.

    Does he have the imagination and courage to nominate people like Krugman, Stieglitz, Baker, Reich, etc.? I tend to doubt it. For all his inspiring and forward-thinking speeches, he's basically still a very cautious establishmentarian at heart, and wants to be surrounded by people who share his core ideological beliefs and political ethos. I.e. incrementalism, accomodationism, centrism, neoliberalism.

    Maybe I'm wrong and will be pleasantly surprised.

    "Liberty without virtue would be no blessing to us" - Benjamin Rush, 1777

    by kovie on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 07:12:56 AM PST

  •  Ah, the Conservatives, they are different. (0+ / 0-)

    I'd love to see what would happen if the average working person did his or her job as poorly as Peggy Noonan.  Do you think, in your wildest dreams,  that an average worker, who was wrong nearly all the times in his assessment of situations around him, was still living in the era of 1980-88 and applying 30 year old plus knowledge to the world he or she is presently operating in, would still be employed.  Yet old Peg gets to write for a national daily, give her opinions on sundry national shows and remain employed even though she's still giving the same useless information that she has been giving for decades.  Ah, conservatives, they are different....and essentially have lifetime employment no matter how useless they have become.

  •  "Silly" does not begin to cover Pegum, good one! (0+ / 0-)

    "Aux ames bien nees, la valeur n'attend point le nombre des annees" Pierre Corneille.

    by Patate on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 08:21:43 AM PST

  •  The Grand Bargain is a Grand Lie (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Eric Nelson, Words In Action

    The Grand Bargain is a Grand Lie
    Why the scheme being negotiated in Washington is one-sided and totally unfair
    by Cenk Uygur

  •  The Grios Joy Ann Reid sums up the GOP (0+ / 0-)

    ..pretty well:

    And I don't sense one iota of belief that their core values, that their core belief system needs to change. They just think they need to put more window dressing on it, and find some more black and brown people to say the exact same things they believe. They don't believe they need to change their positions on issues. They just believe they need to change the decoration.
    Like a gambler after losing it all, refusing to see it, and must be forcibly removed for his own sake if not for the sake  of all - the Allen West(s)

    It seems the best move is to let the Bush tax cuts sunset. Make no "bargain" with the republicans. Then hammer constantly for as long as it takes for the payroll tax cut return, middle income tax cuts and any other Democratic policy on the agenda - pass the f*cking Rebuild America jobs Act - talk about that
    Then talk about it some more

    There is no upside to negotiating now:
    Mitch McConnell hostage taker:

    “I think some of our members may have thought the default issue was a hostage you might take a chance at shooting,” he said. “Most of us didn’t think that. What we did learn is this — it’s a hostage that’s worth ransoming. And it focuses the Congress on something that must be done.”
    Let’s unpack this a bit.

    First, after this brutal fiasco undermined the economy and made the United States an international laughingstock, the leading Senate Republican fully expects to do this again. McConnell believes his party has “learned” the value in pursuing this, regardless of the consequences.
     - emphasis added
  •  Kruman's comment that Bowles is rumored to (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Words In Action

    be tapped for Treasury is really frightening.  If this is the direction the President intends I'm done with him.  Bowles has done nothing for this country that I can see.  He's a right-wing 1 %'er.  Same old same old.  How about something new?  Like hope and change.

    You have the right to remain silent. If you waive that right you will be accused of class warfare.

    by spritegeezer on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 11:22:51 AM PST

    •  I agree. (0+ / 0-)

      Purging predominantly minority voters and requiring them to present IDs to vote in the face of VIRTUALLY NON-EXISTENT VOTER FRAUD is RACISM! I hereby declare all consenting Republicans RACISTS until they stand up and object to these practices!

      by Words In Action on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 12:12:55 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  "And yet we appear to be on the verge of a (0+ / 0-)

    negotiation in which some on "our side" will be asserting that the only thing to be decided is how much ground to give up to the guys who lost the election."

    Yes. It would essentially dare the left to split and re-create 2010. Replacing Geithner with Bowles would be a dead giveaway. The act itself would rend the fabric that took nearly a year to mend.

    Whether a Grand Bargain is used to reduce the debt or secure tax increases on the rich, or both -- after winning tremendous, crucial support on a clear, unequivocal message in support of populist disgust with destructive income inequality, it would be supreme betrayal to unnecessarily sacrifice social programs to do so, when a mandate is in hand.

    Purging predominantly minority voters and requiring them to present IDs to vote in the face of VIRTUALLY NON-EXISTENT VOTER FRAUD is RACISM! I hereby declare all consenting Republicans RACISTS until they stand up and object to these practices!

    by Words In Action on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 12:11:44 PM PST

  •  American Exceptionalism - Empathy Edition (0+ / 0-)
    Nicholas Kristof wrote a New York Times column a few weeks ago about his friend Scott, who had a midlife crisis, quit his job to read books and play poker, didn’t buy health insurance even after he went back to work because it was too expensive, and, partly to save money but also because he was busy and had no wife to nudge him, postponed seeing the doctor about disturbing symptoms that proved to be caused by advanced prostate cancer. Kristof’s point was that we all make mistakes, and that good public policy takes that into account. In a follow-up column that noted Scott’s death, Kristof wrote that he was “taken aback by how many readers were savagely unsympathetic. ‘Your friend made a foolish choice, and actions have consequences,’ one reader said in a Twitter message.”
    This anecdote and the "let him die" response during the TeaParty/GOP primary debates are a feature (not a bug) of the medicine for profit system chosen by the USA. In the past half-century, I don't recall a single comment complaining about freeloaders in the Canadian socialized medicine system. "It serves him right" is not part of the dialogue - if anything, governments actively encourage the poor, sick, and yes, the fool-hardy, to get medical treatment.

    The only laments seem directed at aging - which no one has found a cure for - smoking and obesity. Governments have heavily taxed cigarettes and some have provided subsidies to quit smoking. As a non-smoker, I've no idea if this linked map is correct but $111 for a pack of 200 sounds like quite an incentive! (CAD currently near par with USD)

    Governments have no easy solutions to the obesity epidemic; it's not easy to get individuals to step away from their computers (and DailyKos), their TVs and their dinner tables. It's not a problem limited to countries with socialized medicine...

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