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In the bi-partisan Senate(sic) negotiationsbroke down today on figuring out how to accomplish background checks for hand held weapons.... By an overwhelming majority, Americans support the notion that every gun be registered to a single owner, and if a crime occurs, that owner can be charged with a conspiracy to that crime, provided he had not reported that weapon stolen....

A reader has brought up the major fear all gun owners have on getting their guns registered.  They hide behind the Constitutionality that registering guns with the Government, is the first step to confiscation.   This is not their real reason.

Their guns are illegal.

Not to them, But at some point in the past, they bought a gun in a shady private deal that did not require a background check, and the possibility lurks that their weapon they've had for years, probably in all fairness, was actually the stolen property of another gun owner....and with a registry, that fact will be found out.!!!

As soon as a registry goes into effect, computers will begin matching the numbers....
And, it is not these law abiding gun owner's fault.  They performed their transactions legally, and the seller of the weapon probably in good faith performed the transaction legally.... But with the ability to trace weapons, a gun registered in 2013 can be found to have been stolen in 1989.....

Obviously this is a real fear.  I think all of us would feel the same.  I know I would. Likewise, for us to move forward in taking effective action to prevent future tragedies like Newtown, we need to solve this issue.

The reality is that these once-stolen guns are now in new homes, and those new owners are law abiding citizens... Without the registering of firearms, this criminality, possession of stolen merchandise would never have been determined...

So by declaring no one will be prosecuted for having stolen merchandise, would go a long way to make sure fixing one injustice, does not create another...

We need amnesty against any legal action taken to retrieve ownership of a long lost gun. In most cases a statue of limitations would be long in effect, but we need a blanket Federal amnesty protection given priority over state an local laws on criminal prosecution....

We need this amnesty because we need universal background checks.
That accountability is key to holding criminals responsible..  As we go forward into the future, we will  need that clear accountability to control which guns confiscated from criminal belong to law abiding citizens who can then get return of their stolen possession, and which guns confiscated can lead us to more criminals who are using the current holes in our system to funnel guns to 7-11 and convenience store robbers....

We need oversight and accountability to accomplish this....

And putting law abiding citizens at risk for crimes of the past of which they were unaware,  gets in our way of doing what an overwhelming number of Americans want....  closing the ability of criminals to get possession of guns.....
I think tacking amnesty for gun owners covering any issues a gun registry may illuminate,  needs to be in any gun legislation bill put forward....  It is no different from granting immunity, which across this nation prosecutors do every single day........

So let's get it done.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Eh, why not? We forgive every other crime... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    that's committed for the most part by Republicans.

    What's one more?


    I don't blame Christians. I blame Stupid. Which sadly is a much more popular religion these days.

    by detroitmechworks on Thu Mar 07, 2013 at 11:53:16 AM PST

  •  I don't buy that. (0+ / 0-)

    It may restrict the ability for someone to sell their illicit weapon, but so what?

    We were not ahead of our time, we led the way to our time.

    by i understand on Thu Mar 07, 2013 at 11:57:52 AM PST

  •  Are you sure about this one? (3+ / 0-)
    .... By an overwhelming majority, Americans support the notion that every gun be registered to a single owner, and if a crime occurs, that owner can be charged with a conspiracy to that crime, provided he had not reported that weapon stolen....
    I hope you are right.  
  •  How are the guns traceable now? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    There is no registry, so no way to tell if a gun is stolen.

    •  BL - I am no expert at this (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      nextstep, notrouble

      but I think that law enforcement checks the serial number with the manufacturer, learns where the gun was sold on a wholesale basis and then check with that retailer to see who purchased the gun. If the original owner does not still own the gun, I think the trail is much more difficult to follow.

      "let's talk about that"

      by VClib on Thu Mar 07, 2013 at 12:17:59 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Majority are not stolen, they are converted (0+ / 0-)

    from legal to illegal guns by being sold by unscrupulous dealers, straw purchasers, or even relatives to people that shouldn't have them.  That is how a gun that started its life as a happy legal gun makes its way into those illegal guns that the NRA & Republicans blames for all the problems.  It's a two-fer for them, they distance themselves from the carnage and every legal gun converted into an illegal gun reduces FFL inventory, thus triggering demand for - you guessed it - the gun manufacturers that the NRA represents!

    Then they came for me - and by that time there was nobody left to speak up.

    by DefendOurConstitution on Thu Mar 07, 2013 at 12:42:22 PM PST

  •  Which poll are you referring to? (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    noway2, FrankRose, Kentucky Kid

    "By an overwhelming majority, Americans support the notion that every gun be registered to a single owner, and if a crime occurs, that owner can be charged with a conspiracy to that crime, provided he had not reported that weapon stolen...."

    I think you're mixing up your fantasy ideal with reality here. At least, this is the first I've heard about any majority supporting the idea that someone whose gun was stolen should be treated as a co-conspirator with anyone who commits a crime with said gun.

    "A reader has brought up the major fear all gun owners have on getting their guns registered.  They hide behind the Constitutionality that registering guns with the Government, is the first step to confiscation.   This is not their real reason.

    Their guns are illegal."

    This part's not mixed up at all, though: it's 100% fantasy.

    •  Do you have a problem (0+ / 0-)

      with the idea that owners should be held responsible if their firearms are used to commit a crime?

      Its OK I see that you are in the RKBA group so the question was  rhetorical.

      It would make for a more interesting discussion though.

      •  It's not about what the commenter believes (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        FrankRose, Kentucky Kid

        It's about a statement being made that an opinion is held by an "overwhelming majority" of Americans, when no proof is offered; and most of us who have been following this issue have reason to believe there is no majority, let alone an overwhelming one, for that particular policy. And I can save you checking my profile or searching my comment history - I'm on the "other" side from most of the RKBA folks here.

        "No one life is more important than another. No one voice is more valid than another. Each life is a treasure. Each voice deserves to be heard." Patriot Daily News Clearinghouse & Onomastic

        by Catte Nappe on Thu Mar 07, 2013 at 02:24:39 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  I'm not in the RKBA group, but I too (0+ / 0-)

        have a problem with the diarist making statements such as the one noted by andalusi. That claim/statement is either false, or an lie - call it what what you will. If the diarist can give an link to an credible poll that proves his/her assertion I will gladly give them an apology.

        Why didn't you address andalusi's concern about the misleading statement, rather than deflect it by saying he/she is in the RKBA group?

    •  Thanks for your question. (0+ / 0-)

      In urban areas where there is high gun crime, when the gun is confiscated, and traced back to its owner, 9 times out 10, it belonged to an well known acquaintance of the shooter.  His excuse, "it must have been stolen"....

      In these areas there are laws being proposed and enacted after this year's legislative session, which will require notification of stolen guns within 24 to 48 hours, depending upon the municipality.

      Failure to comply to this notion, opens up the possibility that the gun owner knowingly lent his gun to be used for the crime.  Prosecutors then have the option of  pressing charges against that gun owner.... Had he complied and listed his weapon as stolen, he would not be held in conspiracy....

      The law will be on the books.  It will be up to each prosecutor to decided if he wishes to press charges in each case...

      Although it won't completely stop the borrowing of someone's gun to "take someone out",  it will put a damper and cause less weaponry to roam the streets.   Every person lending his gun for a killing, will now at least no longer have the option to get out of it by saying..." It was stolen" if he didn't go through the process of reporting it stolen at the time...  

      Quite possibly if he had reported it stolen, and police were "reasonably knowledgeable" of whom had taken it,  it could be found, proved to be stolen, and the thief could be incarcerated, long before the "hit" occurred....

      I understand this is a big country and not everyone here is aware of everything going on in all 50 states and 3033 counties...  

      The poll provided on the front page of Daily Kox simply shows that an overwhelming majority of human beings want universal background checks enacted now!  The point of this diary simply brings up several gun owners concerns expressed in private as to why they fear background checks and offers an antidote that could facilitate the majority's opinion into action...

  •  Before anyone posts gun control blogs (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    They should take the time to inform themselves as to how the current system works (or fails to work), and the problems that may be encountered, as well as monetary costs associated with updating the system.

    This site has a brief overview:

  •  For cross checking, (0+ / 0-)

    a list of stolen firearms by serial number would have to be collected, right?
    So instead of getting to the bar and finding that the gun you bought 15 years ago was stolen, you should be able to check the list from the comfort of your own home, online. And if it turns out you have a dirty gun, either dispose of it or find a way to turn it in.
    That way, you don't reward owners of stolen property and in some cases, might even get that property restored to it's rightful owner.

    If I ran this circus, things would be DIFFERENT!

    by CwV on Thu Mar 07, 2013 at 01:48:46 PM PST

  •  No (0+ / 0-)

    None of my firearms are registered but all my firearms, except a family heirloom, where purchased from dealers. The serial numbers where checked as a part of that process.

    The current dealer system doesn't function as a gun registration system. It does goes check guns sold against guns reported missing or stolen.

    A conservative is a man with two perfectly good legs who, however, has never learned how to walk forward. Franklin D. Roosevelt

    by notrouble on Thu Mar 07, 2013 at 07:21:28 PM PST

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