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This just came through a few hours ago.  I know it's a short piece, and I'm not going to quote it all --- but this may well present truly meaningful, progressive Catholicism in the U.S. a wide-open door.  Read for yourself; think for yourself; discuss for yourself and for all humanity; contemplate the possible earth-shattering impact on the misogynistic, papal dynasty in Rome if enough progressively-minded people were to send this church $10 each for a building fund.

Imagine a cathedral not under the boot of Rome.  A diocese, even.  Even more....


Women as priests in the RCC?

79%35 votes
11%5 votes
9%4 votes

| 44 votes | Vote | Results

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Comment Preferences

  •  Tip Jar (8+ / 0-)

    Proponents of gun violence own guns. Opponents of gun violence do not own guns. What part of this do you not understand?

    by Liberal Panzer on Sun Apr 28, 2013 at 06:18:28 PM PDT

  •  what do you call Catholics who refuse to (8+ / 0-)

    acknowledge the authority of the Pope?

    Protestants.  Isn't this re-inventing Martin Luther's wheel?  After all his Theses was not intended to start a counter religious movement but to reform the existing structure

    •  Rome called them "Protestants." (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      marykk, rebel ga

      Rome waged war on them, too.  This isn't about "reforming" the "octogenarians;" the article itself cites this.  This isn't about merely "reforming the current RCC" --- it's taking Catholicism out a whole new door, and damn the existing hierarchy....

      Proponents of gun violence own guns. Opponents of gun violence do not own guns. What part of this do you not understand?

      by Liberal Panzer on Sun Apr 28, 2013 at 06:41:01 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  No. "Episcopalians." (5+ / 0-)

      And it's reinventing King Henry VIII not Martin Luther.

      In some Episcopal churches, waiting around to play wedding or funeral music,  I have read introductory literature stating that Episcopalians are not "Protestants" because their origin traces to the English king not Martin Luther.

      We are called to speak for the weak, for the voiceless, for victims of our nation and for those it calls enemy.... --ML King "Beyond Vietnam"

      by Gooserock on Sun Apr 28, 2013 at 06:41:50 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Heretics (0+ / 0-)

      Without some scrap of apostolic succession in the ordination, the whole process has no real meaning.  Somewhere there's a bishop who realizes the whole structure is going to come crashing down and is courageous enough to offer his chrismed services.

      "Love the Truth, defend the Truth, speak the Truth, and hear the Truth" - Jan Hus, d.1415 CE

      by PrahaPartizan on Sun Apr 28, 2013 at 07:58:18 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Please explain why progressively minded (4+ / 0-)

    people should fund any religion or church? How about the palm reader down them street, them too?

    That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

    by enhydra lutris on Sun Apr 28, 2013 at 08:11:36 PM PDT

  •  Intriguing story, but (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    rebel ga

    why doesn't she just come to the Episcopal Church? We ordain women and have the apostolic succession. A lot of the service will be familiar (though usually our music is better :-))

    I'm not joking - I really don't understand why an RC woman who wants to be ordained would do it this way.

    Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary? . . . and respect the dignity of every human being.

    by Wee Mama on Sun Apr 28, 2013 at 08:19:08 PM PDT

    •  That's how "faith" works. (0+ / 0-)

      You don't abandon what you believe in for someone else's belief.  That's what's wrong with the world today --- we negotiate ourselves away for the good of society.  We lack both courage and conviction to be "the square peg" facing the proverbial round hole, so we break out the carving knife and whittle away at ourselves until we're just another round peg.  I reject this form of socially-acceptable "self-mutilation."

      Proponents of gun violence own guns. Opponents of gun violence do not own guns. What part of this do you not understand?

      by Liberal Panzer on Mon Apr 29, 2013 at 06:35:26 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  The most significant difference of belief between (0+ / 0-)

        the RCs and the Episcopalians (though not the only one) is the authority of the pope and in general the sources of authority in the church. Clearly these women don't accept the authority of the pope and do assert the authority of their consciences - so again, why not become Episcopalian?

        I think it is not belief but community ties - if they grew up in the RC church and have family there still, they would have to leave all that behind.

        Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary? . . . and respect the dignity of every human being.

        by Wee Mama on Mon Apr 29, 2013 at 11:24:35 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  This exists in the United States as well--not new (0+ / 0-)

    The American Catholic Church has disassociated itself from the "money boys." Unfortunately, the nearest in Florida is hours from us but we've communicated and feel there is something good growing there.

    Will they end up "excommunicated" like Luther? They are a lot more Catholic in the Pauline way than Opus Dei, but time will tell.

    •  Why would any progressive want to be "Pauline" (0+ / 0-)

      rather than Christian?  Many of the worst aspects of Christianity in general and Catholicism specifically come from "Paul" -- the bad one, assuming there were two, as many scriptural scholars do today.

                Obviously most Christians, if not functionally brain dead, pick and choose what they see as divinely inspired in the OT and what they see as merely the accidental components of the cultures of bronze-age tribes and an minor iron-age principality.  So why not treat the NT the same way -- I.e., throw out the blatantly barbaric components of the epistles, which were, in fact, mostly just  the PR of hustlers trying to sell a new Jewish sect to the goys?  

               As for reforming the Catholic Church, it seems to me the only real possibility was the councilor movement, but the ultramontane reactionaries have obviously won that round.  Even if a new council were called today, it would be so packed with theological thugs appointed by John Paul and his Rottweiler that it would do absolutely nothing substantive.  The Church will live on unchanging for a century or so like a vampire sustained by the blood of its converts in Asia and Africa.  But as those societies become progressively more modernized it will become a more conventional corpse, as it is in Western Europe today.

      "If you don't read the newspapers, you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- M. Twain

      by Oliver St John Gogarty on Mon Apr 29, 2013 at 07:09:36 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Not all "Paul" is Paul (0+ / 0-)

        The first chronological documents of the Christian Church (Corinthians) have such a heavy emphasis on socialist-style charity that you can hardly recognize today's "Christians."

        There are some pretty sexist letters classified as "from Paul" by clerics in the third and fourth centuries (those guys who let the Library of Alexandria fall to rubble and killed Hypatia). They are not Paul's. Some say "Timothy" (although all these names may be fictitious, and the "TImothy" letters certainly had a sexist agenda.

        After feeling horribly betrayed by "official" Catholoc hierarchy, I've been doing a lot of reading analyzing the original documents and philosophy. If you pull away from the old, rich men who grasp power, you can find something very respectible there.

  •  Well since both Catholicism and Protestantism (0+ / 0-)

    are based on sheer mythological woo, why does some small step of "progress" like this even matter?

    Just throwing in a view from the outside of it all.

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