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Originally posted to Comics on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 06:50 AM PDT.

Also republished by Daily Kos.

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Comment Preferences

  •  all the US prattling about "democracy" is BS (5+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    corvo, shaharazade, quill, JesseCW, Lily O Lady

    We were always entirely happy with tinhorn murderous dictators who supported our interests, and we were always entirely against democracy when it elected people we don't like.

    •  As a general rule, we PREFER dictatorships, (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      quill, JesseCW, AoT

      and precisely for the reason you mention.

      Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

      by corvo on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 07:42:53 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  That's a fine description, right up until 2011. (0+ / 0-)

      If I had told you that the Obama administration would refuse to lift a finger to save Mubarak, would make public statements in favor of the protesters, would call for Mubarak's ouster, and would work closely with a succeeding Muslim Brotherhood government to rein in an Israeli attack on Gaza, you would have called me crazy.

      Art is the handmaid of human good.

      by joe from Lowell on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 08:20:08 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  January 25th 2011 (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        bobdevo
        "Our assessment is that the Egyptian government is stable and is looking for ways to respond to the legitimate needs and interests of the Egyptian people," she added.
        H. Clinton, SecState

        "But the traitors will pretend / that it's gettin' near the end / when it's beginning" P. Ochs

        by JesseCW on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 12:05:48 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Obama's conversion to the anti-Mubarak side (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        JesseCW, bobdevo

        was about as eleventh-hour as it was unconvincing.  His administration's embrace of the most recent coup (which somehow miraculously isn't a coup) only confirms this.

        Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

        by corvo on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 12:06:26 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  You are so full of it when it comes to Obama. (2+ / 0-)

          Obama didn't endorse the coup, quite the opposite.  Even Chris Hayes said he was surprised at how negative the official US statement on the coup was.

          And btw, the pure progressives need to get their story straight for once.  When Obama admin was working with the duly elected government of Egypt, pure progressives were bashing them for "backing" the Muslim Brotherhood against the "people".  And progressive were on this site cheering the public demonstrations against their government and cheering the military stepping in to oust the elected MB government.  Now pure progressives condemn Obama for not officially calling it a "coup" and accuse Obama of "backing" the coup.  Which is it?  Are pure progressives just like Repubs, that no matter what Obama does, they knee-jerkly take the opposite view just so that they can bash the President?

        •  What bizarre spin. (0+ / 0-)

          So now we're talking about when and how much he kicked a longtime ally who had been the cornerstone of our regional security alliance to the curb.

          You know, just like Dulles and Kissinger used to do. Wait, what?

          And if Obama "embraced" the coup, why is making threats about the aid package towards the military government that he never made towards Morsi?

          You remember Morsi; he's the guy that Obama worked with to negotiate the cease-fire in Gaza.

          Art is the handmaid of human good.

          by joe from Lowell on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 02:01:21 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  ? (0+ / 0-)
            And if Obama "embraced" the coup,
            I wrote
            His administration's embrace of the most recent coup
            Apparently you missed the pronouncements made by Obama's Secretary of State?  Remember: We continue to refuse to recognize this coup as a coup, even though by law we're supposed to.  And why? precisely to keep the aid gravy train flowing.

            Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

            by corvo on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 04:29:42 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Ah, "statements." Never mind actual policy. (0+ / 0-)

              Art is the handmaid of human good.

              by joe from Lowell on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 07:40:23 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  actual policy? (0+ / 0-)

                like continuing to arm the Egyptian military to this very day?

                Actual policy like that?

                Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

                by corvo on Thu Sep 19, 2013 at 06:21:26 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

            •  Which coup? The one against Mubarak? (0+ / 0-)

              Are you saying that the US should have cut off aid to Egypt after the overthrow of Hosni Mubarak by Field Marshal Tantawi and the Supreme Council of the Armed Forces?

              Or are you saying, because of your oh-so-principled commitment to the law, that we should only have recognized that second transition of power to a military government as a coup, but not that first one?

              You're not a hypocrite, are you, corvo? You aren't using one standard for the overthrow of a pro-US government, and a completely different standard for the overthrow of an anti-US government, and then pretending your position is based on principle and the objective application of the law, are you?

              Hey, trivia question: which government held legitimate elections that the opposition won, and then peacefully handed over power, the Morsi government or the military government?

              Why, that would be the military government.

              Art is the handmaid of human good.

              by joe from Lowell on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 08:08:42 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  The first time around (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                JDsg

                it wasn't the military that led the revolution; it followed -- after gunning down pro-democracy supporters for weeks.  It switched sides shortly before the Obama administration itself did.

                The second time, it led.  That's what made it a coup.

                Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

                by corvo on Thu Sep 19, 2013 at 06:22:47 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  The military didn't lead the second time, either. (0+ / 0-)

                  The crowds in the streets against Morsi were as large, and lasted as long, as the crowds in the street against Mubarak.

                  And no, Mubarak's military wasn't gunning down protesters. They rather notably refused Mubarak's orders to open fire on protesters. Don't you remember the tanks driving around throwing smoke to hide the protesters from the mobs that attacked them? Don't you remember the camel charge, when mobs of thugs had to try to drive the protesters out of Tahrir Square because the military refused to?

                  You seem to be basing your understanding on what your ideology would predict, instead of grounding it in the facts.

                  Art is the handmaid of human good.

                  by joe from Lowell on Thu Sep 19, 2013 at 10:38:09 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

      •  well that's not new (0+ / 0-)

        We have a long long history of supporting tinhorn murderous dictators until they are no longer conveniently useful for us, then we throw them under the bus.  Reference Ngo Dinh Diem, Ferdinand Marcos, Manuel Noriega, Saddam Hussein, Moamar Qadafi . . .

        Heck, even Osama Bin Laden was our BFF back when he was shooting at Soviets.

        Apparently it's almost as dangerous to be our friend as it is to be our enemy.

        •  Mubarak was still very useful. We dumped him. (0+ / 0-)

          The US was not, by any means, out in front with the Egyptian public during the demonstrations, but we were consistently, throughout the developing situation, friendlier to the opposition and harsher on Mubarak than we needed to be.

          BTW, bin Laden was never our BFF. Far from working with the Americans, he set up his organization (first as a fundraising effort, then as a fighting force) specifically to operate as a pure Islamic alternative to working with the Americans.

          Art is the handmaid of human good.

          by joe from Lowell on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 02:05:14 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  ONLINE Working.... (0+ / 1-)
      Recommended by:
      Hidden by:
      Lenny Flank

      my friend's aunt makes $64/hr on the computer. She has been fired for six months but last month her check was $21973 just working on the computer for a few hours. go to website.....

      --->>> W­W­W.C­N­N­1­3.ℂ­O­M

  •  position (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LilithGardener, rbird

    Not all coups are bad--overthrowing Hitler would have been a good thing--and no, the Brotherhood is not the Nazi party, but they were zealots--they do believe in theocracy.  Democracy is not always gonna result in good government--the Confederacy was duly elected by the rules of the day.
    I can't think of any ME government that should be acclaimed--even Turkey seems to being going theocratic.
     It's easy to dis every government, yet hard to conjure much improvement.  Put another way--there are no easy decisions--look at our beacon--we're loaded with bat-shit crazy congressmen/women who are threatening to default on our debt.  Democracy in action?

    Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite. John Kenneth Galbraith .

    by melvynny on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 07:12:57 AM PDT

    •  So what's so good about this coup? (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      shaharazade, JesseCW

      and why does Our Leadership insist on praising its commitment to -- of all things -- democracy?

      Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

      by corvo on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 07:19:10 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  not good (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        joe from Lowell

        Just not reflexively bad.

        Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite. John Kenneth Galbraith .

        by melvynny on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 07:46:47 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  It need not be reflexively bad (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          shaharazade, JesseCW

          to be bad.

          Sorry, but the Egyptian military is a known quantity with a long history of corrupt and repressive behavior.  Not even el-Baradei will play along with this coup.

          This one's bad.

          Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

          by corvo on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 07:59:38 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  The overthrow of Mubarak was a military coup. (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            melvynny, rbird

            The Egyptian Supreme Council of the Armed Forces removed Mubarak from power and its head, Field Marshal Mohammed Tantawi, served as the Egyptian head of state for a year. It was under that military government that the elections were organized and held, at which time Tantawi peacefully turned over power the winners of the election, the Muslim Brotherhood.

            Which rather throws a wrench into your narrative, no?

            Art is the handmaid of human good.

            by joe from Lowell on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 08:17:53 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  What throws the old monkey wrench (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              JesseCW

              is just how long Tantawi and Company chose to tolerate anything resembling democracy in Egypt.

              Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

              by corvo on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 08:40:04 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  results (0+ / 0-)

                Democracy doesn't always result in a viable solution--especially when a country doesn't have a history of democracy.  The root to almost all the problems in the ME is ethnic and religious bigotry--and no form of government seems able to eradicate that--even ours.

                Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite. John Kenneth Galbraith .

                by melvynny on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 08:55:23 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  In the case of Egypt... (0+ / 0-)

                  a military coup overthrew a military dictator after massive protests in the streets. They then installed a democratic system.

                  The elected President then set out to dismantle the democratic system. Again, massive protests in the streets, and again, the leadership of the military staged a coup, overthrew him, and promised to hold new elections.

                  So, who are the democrats in this story?

                  Art is the handmaid of human good.

                  by joe from Lowell on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 09:00:58 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

              •  Tantawi retired with Morsi took office. (0+ / 0-)

                Look, I know you're in love with this black and white narrative, but this might be a good time to delve into the details of Egyptian politics since the military coup that overthrew Mubarak, including Morsi's contempt for democracy and the massive protests against his growing dictatorship, instead of jamming everything into a comfortable narrative.

                Art is the handmaid of human good.

                by joe from Lowell on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 08:58:09 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  Exactly what election did Morsi cancel (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  JesseCW

                  or fake?

                  Talk about black-and-white narratives.

                  Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

                  by corvo on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 11:31:58 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  What election has the GOP canceled or faked? (0+ / 0-)

                    Would that answer be good enough for you on the question of voter suppression?

                    I really suggest you develop a stronger information base about this topic. Read up on Morsi's rigging of the constitutional assembly, his attempt to take over the courts, the refusal of the judiciary to oversee the election because of fraud and rigging by the MB, and Morsi's seizing of legislative power and declaration that his edicts could not be challenged in court.

                    Oh, but he didn't cancel the elections he rigged. That's nice.

                    Art is the handmaid of human good.

                    by joe from Lowell on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 02:08:21 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  So you're endorsing armed coups (0+ / 0-)

                      against Republican administrations?

                      And again it's your information base that's lacking.  Who appointed the courts Morsi was dealing with?  Why, Mubarak and his guys.  Somehow that escaped your notice?  It was, in fact, a grave error on his part not to have dissolved the old corrupt judiciary in the first place.

                      Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

                      by corvo on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 04:32:48 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  No, I'm knocking down your argument. (0+ / 0-)

                        You don't get to assign me a position just because I point out holes in yours.

                        And while saying, "No, you are!" might feel good when you get called out, it's really pretty obvious who has a good grasp on the detail here, and who is checking his gut.

                        You've decided to pick a side - pro-Morsi - instead of dealing with the messiness of the situation. That's nice; it seems to be just about the limit of your talent.

                        Art is the handmaid of human good.

                        by joe from Lowell on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 07:38:16 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  You're not dealing with the (0+ / 0-)

                          "messiness of the situation"; you're supporting an armed and manifestly undemocratic coup, brought to you by the same folks who gave Egypt elections that were rigged beyond Morsi's wildest fantasies.

                          Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

                          by corvo on Thu Sep 19, 2013 at 06:20:07 AM PDT

                          [ Parent ]

  •  If the people voted - then the legitimacy has to (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    JesseCW, corvo

    be protected.  Of course, the US generally doesn't believe this with other countries - note the 40th anniversary of Chile's 9/11 last week.  

    Of course what happened in Egypt was that the people had to choose between a bunch of awful candidates - and so the voter turnout was more akin to an American midterm election than the first free election in eons ...

    •  it would be more akin to... (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      midnight lurker

      An election in an America where one party was promoting a Dominionist (theocratic) government,  and the majority of voters were fundamentalist christians. Would we have to respect the predictable "democratic" outcome of such a scenario: a repressive theocratic regime?

      Since the early days of nation building in the middle east this paradox has been commonly understood. An imperfect solution has been to create a secularized military that is mandated to step in and restore democracy whenever a theocratic government is installed (the Ataturk model). Of course, the side effect of that (with help from the West and Soviets during the cold war) is the rise of corrupt  military strongman-style regimes.

      I don't know which is worse, but it isn't as simple as respecting the will of the majority to choose a repressive theocratic regime.

      "Tell the truth and run." -- Yugoslav proverb

      by quill on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 08:58:41 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  "Imperfect solution" is some pretty mild language (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        quill

        for describing horrifically repressive torture states.

        "But the traitors will pretend / that it's gettin' near the end / when it's beginning" P. Ochs

        by JesseCW on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 12:08:25 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  yes, many are repressive (0+ / 0-)

          I'm not saying they're OK, but theocratic states are just as repressive and brutal. Egypt currently has a menu with two shitty choices: a repressive theocratic state or a repressive secular/military state.

          "Tell the truth and run." -- Yugoslav proverb

          by quill on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 01:07:54 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  asdf (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        quill
        Would we have to respect the predictable "democratic" outcome of such a scenario: a repressive theocratic regime?
        Who exactly is this "we"?  

        Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

        by corvo on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 12:08:43 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  everyone (0+ / 0-)

          I'm not defending autocratic rule, just saying it's overly simplistic to say "the people have spoken: they voted for a theocracy and they should be able to have what they want".

          Even our laws were designed to protect against rule by the tyrany of the majority, because the founders recognized that danger - including the possibility of our own theocratic state, given our historic radical christian leanings.

          "Tell the truth and run." -- Yugoslav proverb

          by quill on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 01:28:30 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Seems to me that Egyptians (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            quill

            should have the final say in their own government.

            They should've been allowed the opportunity to vote Morsi out.

            If Morsi had forbidden them that opportunity, then a popular revolution would have inspired sympathy.  

            This is just another coup led by the same old authoritarian nomenklatura.

            Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

            by corvo on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 04:27:21 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  but not all Egyptians want a theocracy (0+ / 0-)

              Morsi was moving quickly to consolidate power and it's questionable whether he could have been voted out through a normal democratic process. Maybe it would have been healthier for the (secular) people to have revolted again, but clearly the military lost patience.

              "Tell the truth and run." -- Yugoslav proverb

              by quill on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 07:14:38 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

    •  Since the US has nothing to do with Egypt's (0+ / 0-)

      protests or Egypt's military deciding to step in and give ultimatums to their own government and then overthrowing it, I'm unsure what your point is.

  •  The US is (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    corvo

    committed to fighting extreme, radicalized jhadist Islamist's. Because? Seems to me it's illogical since our so called 'foreign policy' in this region has created and fostered the mayham carnage and destruction that 'breeds terrorism'. Our covert and overt dirty wars in the ME that treat human beings as collateral damage or would be militant extremist's seems designed to make sure that we have an endless supply of newly minted radicalized extremist's and their aiders and abettors.

    The thing I don't understand is why ordinary people in the US buy this shit as 'national security', humanitarian intervention or stabilizing.  After the Shock and Awe, invasions, occupations, 'regime changes' and terror we have inflicted on the people who live in these lands where we ply our version of democratization and stability what do we expect? Do we have national amnesia? Cause and effect are at play, and it's not random it's a feature not a bug in our GWOT.  

    The Irag war spilled thousands of refugees into Syria. Sectarian violence was stirred and used in Irag by our dark ops, and bloody spooks. Surges on humans who we called insurgents and the enemy as we rain bombs and unleash boots on the ground does tend to 'radicalize' the people who are being terrorized, killed and tortured. Far as I can see this is just an extension of the Great Game, which morphed into the PNAC and is now ludicrously billed as the GWOT. All for what? Oil (resources) and  neocon geopolitics that are killing humans and the planet.

    Madness as Alec Guinness says at the end of The Bridge on the River Kwai. This time around the US and their 'clients' are the power mad want to rule the world are 'bringing it on'. What a sick farce passed off as national security. Blaming the militant Islamist's while we stir the pot of sectarian violence and reek havoc on peoples lands and lives makes no sense if you look at the past and even if you just look at what we are now doing.

    Look at Irag where the war is over, yeah right. What happened to the roses that we we're told would be thrown at the US liberating troops? We broke it we own it. We're still busy breaking it, and we have the nerve to say what we do is because it's a dangerous scary world where we need to protect our 'interests'.                    

         

  •  On a serious note... (0+ / 0-)

    Democracies are not suicide pacts.  But on the other hand, a democracy can't function if parts of the electorate are banned from the process or oppressed.

    You want to allow Socrates to speak, but once his most devoted students take over the government, create a totalitarian state, and execute hundreds of people - to make matters worse, it happens TWICE - is it appropriate to allow the enemies of democracy inside a democracy the same rights as the rest of the citizenry?

    We faced this in the Civil War, but we didn't get a resolution of the dilemma.  Lincoln initially tried conciliation, not force.  The South, the enemies of democracy, fired the first shot.

    Is this the eternal dilemma of democracy?  Are we stuck with it?  And how does the present struggle in Egypt fit into this ancient, fundamental problem in democracy?

    I enjoyed the cartoon, in part because it stirred up these thoughts in my head.

    Tell me what to write. tellmewhattowrite.com 'To know what is right and to do it are two different things.' - Chushingura, a tale of The Forty-Seven Ronin

    by rbird on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 11:29:11 AM PDT

    •  Yes. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      rbird
      is it appropriate to allow the enemies of democracy inside a democracy the same rights as the rest of the citizenry?
      If not, you first have to identify the " enemies of democracy".
      By choosing to do so, you become one.
      •  But you see the problem... (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Remembering Jello

        ...this is faced by every democracy.  It doesn't go away, either, this dilemma is always with us.

        That's why I have hope that the people of Egypt will muddle through this, because we had to do the same.  We still do.  

        Funny, we think on the British, the French, even the Germans as being "naturally" democratic.  It took the French a long journey through monarchy, revolution, terror, junta, dictatorship, a second dose of monarchy, false starts, and military defeat to get where they are today.  The Germans are the same: monarchy, military dictatorship, military defeat, brief democracy, tyranny, and a second defeat in war to get there.  The British, it was a much, much longer process, through kings, revolt, more kings, revolution, restoration, overthrow, aristocracy, colonial revolt, incremental reform, more aristocracy, even more incremental reform, more and more reform, until, at last, democracy.

        More musings on my part, not meant to be argumentative.

        Tell me what to write. tellmewhattowrite.com 'To know what is right and to do it are two different things.' - Chushingura, a tale of The Forty-Seven Ronin

        by rbird on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 02:40:03 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  I find this a bit snide . . . (0+ / 0-)

    Monday I had an appointment with a primary care doctor for the first time in like 13 years. My doctor is a Cairo-born woman, who got her MD from U of Cairo and did her residency at Cleveland Clinic.  Her husband is also a doctor.

    We talked a lot about the situation is Egypt, as well as Syria, where I spent about 30 weeks working in Damascus, Aleppo and a couple other locations.

    She still has family in Egypt, she in touch with them frequently.  Her take was the military had no choice but to act.  In her universe, Morsi opened the borders to Islamist fundamentalists, allowed them to take over Sinai, and put the entirety of Egypt up for grabs to fundamentalist extremists.

    If the Muslim Brotherhood takes over, how many female doctors will come out of the University of Cairo?

    Similarly, if Assad is deposed, who the fuck takes over in Syria?

    These are complex issues, not necessarily lending themselves to comics.

    Fiat justitia ruat caelum "Let justice be done though the heavens fall."

    by bobdevo on Wed Sep 18, 2013 at 02:12:19 PM PDT

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