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My email inbox is exploding with repeatedly forwarded and, no doubt, fossil fuel industry generated climate denial propaganda.  The nutjobs are out in force because it's cold and snowing in January.  Yup, imagine that.  It gets cold in winter.  Shocker.

They're using winter weather, as usual, to continue to promote their fossil fuel industry bought and paid for meme that Climate Change is some kind of hoax perpetuated on the people of planet Earth.  They're whooping it up because brutally cold weather is about to descend on a large portion of the US and, in their twisted strategy, that is enough to convince the dull-brained masses that climate change is again "proven" wrong.

They're virtually dancing on their desks while covering stories about ships getting stuck in the ice in Antarctica.  And, of course, expressing delight that many of those stuck in the ice are scientists in the Antarctic to study climate change.  "Take that, climate scientists - your climate change hoax has just bitten you in the butt" is the typical meme.  

They're so well compensated for catapulting that level of propaganda and BS into peoples homes it's no surprise that there's so much of it.  The truth and reality are often more difficult to report and go unrewarded.

Far too many Americans believe the stories of denial because it lets them off the hook for their own impact on the environment and climate.  It makes it easier for them to continue to refuse to make the small changes in their lives that would make things better for everyone.  Small changes like consolidating our trips in vehicles so errands can be done all at once rather than one at a time, looking for energy efficiency when replacing appliances and vehicles, recycling so metals, plastic, and glass can be re-used at lower energy cost than newly made, and replacing burned out light bulbs with those that consume less power but give the same amount of light.  

Going along with denialists, though, is like whistling past a graveyard;  a pretense that we'll live forever and that we have no impact on our planet.

If you listen to RW sources, you'd think Al Gore cries every time the mercury drops on a thermometer or a flake of snow falls.  He's become their poster boy whenever climate change is discussed.  The real poster boys should be our future generations that face a more difficult future because of our unwillingness to change.

It was probably a mistake to initially call climate change "global warming".  Yes, the average temperature of the planet does rise, but the effect of that isn't generalized warming, but the creation of extremes.   We don't see climate change every day, but the trends are being seen more and more as storms get bigger and deadlier, drought gets worse, and massive forest fires erupt every year.  

Yes, it gets cold in winter.  And where I am it's going to be so brutally cold by Monday that schools and stores have already announced closures.  It's not because climate change is a hoax.  It's because climate change is real and this is just one of the extremes that's being caused.  

Just as the sun doesn't die or get eaten by dragons at night, climate change isn't proven wrong just because it gets cold and snowy in winter.  And just as the sun will rise again in the morning, climate change will continue to get worse until we do something about it.  And that won't happen unless people wake up from their RW money-induced propaganda coma and start demanding change so the planet we leave for future generations is a better one.

We all have our parts to do.  When you get one of those oft-circulated climate change denial emails, click "reply to all" and tell people how it's wrong.  When Uncle Charlie spouts his Fox News climate change denial talking points, open your mouth and debunk it.  Eye rolling and heavy sighs on our part are no longer enough.  We have to become active in changing peoples minds.

Weather is not the same as climate.  Weather changes day by day.  Climate is a progression over extremely long periods of time.  The "doubt" and "uncertainty" are over.  Scientists agree. Repeat often to the deniers.  

Climate Change Denial is following the same strategy used by the monied tobacco industry to deny that tobacco caused health problems.  They create "doubt" and lots of it with the use of propaganda, impressive sounding bought and paid for "studies", and bought and paid for "experts".  It was successful in creating decades of "debate" and "doubt" while far too many people became their addicted, paying customers.  And that was the reason for the strategy.

They're doing it again.  We can't let them get away with it.  Sitting on the sidelines is no longer an option in an age when our politicians and media are more responsive to whoever inserts the most coins than they are to truth and reality.  Each one of us must become part of the change we want to see and do our part.

.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Just say NO to deniers (39+ / 0-)

    Enough of the BS.  Enough of the doubt.  Enough of the debate.

    It's time to actually do something.

    There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

    by Puddytat on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 01:53:08 PM PST

  •  I figured out (4+ / 0-)

    That you can't reach them.  They're too ignorant.  I'm serious.

    Ask any of them to define what a greenhouse gas is, and you'll be lucky to get any coherent answers.

    Look, if you can delude yourself into believing that you pray to God and the laws of nature change, then you simply don't believe in the laws of nature.  And how can you when you don't comprehend that gasses are matter.

    Republicans: Taking the country back ... to the 19th century

    by yet another liberal on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 02:02:54 PM PST

    •  It's up to us to educate them (10+ / 0-)

      They're not ignorant, they're propagandized.  

      The fossil fuel industry is spending millions to keep people stupid, promote doubt and buying ad time on our media to stop them from doing actual real reporting on climate change.  

      We're the only game in town and if we throw up our hands and just sit there, they win and the planet loses.  

      There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

      by Puddytat on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 02:10:44 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  The global warming deniers I've encountered (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        a2nite, mystique mist, Puddytat, Creosote

        It's hopeless.  It's the most frustrating thing ever.

        "They don't want to change their way of life"

        "They're just going to tax us"

        My Dad now believes that "Things seek a balance".  I wanted to ask him how hot the Earth would be if it balanced out with the sun, but I just said something else so I wouldn't go down the path of being pissed off and give the old man a break.  And, yes, he's highly propagandized by the TV pundits.

        Republicans: Taking the country back ... to the 19th century

        by yet another liberal on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 02:17:44 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  Not them, generally speaking (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Puddytat, Creosote

        Their children, who increasingly cannot be kept in a fact-free bubble while growing up, due to such influences as TV and the Net, and are falling away on the full range of issues at the rate of several million a year, although not at the same rate on each.

        The fossil carbon industry propaganda has been increasingly successful at capturing those predisposed to disbelieve science, notably Creationists and White Supremacists (with some overlap). The Republican Party base is increasingly made up of such people, because so many of the others (mostly among the young) are leaving. So they will get louder and nastier about it until they shrink to irrelevance, like the Federalist Party of old, from the Jefferson vs. Adams campaign of 1800 to their final local victories in 1815. There followed 18 years of single-party government, until the Democratic-Republicans fractured completely. Thus this period is known ironically as The Era of Good Feelings.

        I am ready to have a fight between Progressive/Populist and Corporatist Democrats once the Republicans are out of the way.

        Ceterem censeo, gerrymandra delenda est

        by Mokurai on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 10:43:43 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  I fully agree (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Creosote

          I'm watching the Democrats occupy more and more of the ideological ground the Republicans used to inhabit instead of becoming more populist and progressive.  They're reliant on the same big money donors.

          Until we get the money out of politics and elections, there won't be real change (just look at the failure of Congress to do anything about guns after dozens of kids were murdered in Sandy Hook and polls showed the vast majority of Americans wanted something done).  Money talks, common sense walks.

          There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

          by Puddytat on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 11:18:31 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  On guns, it was loudness and nastiness (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Puddytat

            on the part of Gun Owners of America and the National Association for Gun Rights that spooked the NRA away from further negotiations with Manchin, and from actually backing the bill they were negotiating on background checks and some other hugely popular policies.

            Fewer and fewer people are buying more guns each and demanding that nobody can say, "Boo!" to them, not even the NRA. The suggestion has been made that we put them under an arsenal law when they get up to more than 20 guns, and require them to get dealers' licenses if they want to sell.

            Although both hunting and target shooting are in long-term decline, I suspect that gun safety legislation depends not so much on that as on the implosion of the rest of the Republican Party that is apparently coming first.

            Ceterem censeo, gerrymandra delenda est

            by Mokurai on Sun Jan 05, 2014 at 08:54:00 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

    •  I think most people are onto the idea that (8+ / 0-)

      there is climate change afoot. But then the deniers simply fall back to a position that it's a natural phenomenon, and mankind's activity has little or no effect.

      Of course the earth's climate has changed a lot over billions of years. However....never has there been such a rapid ramp-up of greenhouse gases as in the past few generations.

      You have to be a complete idiot not to see what's happening. For example: The oceans are becoming increasingly acidic. There have been local MSM reports, such as its affect on oyster farming here in WA...here and here. Climate change is here, it's real and it affects the economy. And we all are causing it.

      But too many folks seek only the news that comforts them. We need to make sure that our politicians give us the regs. to deal with the problem and let the deniers bitch and moan, they always do.

      •  California just had the driest December (6+ / 0-)

        on record -- snowpack is at 20% of normal levels. This isn't just a headache for a few ski resort operators...it's a future disaster when we get to planting season when farmers need to water their crops and peak fire season when too many people are too careless with fire.

        Mr. Scribe is trying not to worry.

        There's only one rule that I know of, babies -- goddammit, you've got to be kind. -- Kurt Vonnegut

        by Cali Scribe on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 04:33:57 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  And this summer there will be more fires (4+ / 0-)

          We lost crops in Wisconsin the past few years because we've been much drier than usual.

          Time to get going and stopping it before it's too late.

          There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

          by Puddytat on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 05:09:04 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

        •  I noticed that recently (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Puddytat, desert rain

          When looking at the NWS's snowpack maps (although I was concentrating on Wisconsin).  Compare and contrast this year:

          With the same time last year:

          Fake candidates nominated by the GOP for the recalls: 6 out of 7. Fake signatures on the recall petitions: 4 out of 1,860,283.

          by GeoffT on Sun Jan 05, 2014 at 09:34:57 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  It got real snowy really early (0+ / 0-)

            That's pretty good news considering how dry it's been in the past few years, but sux big time for shoveling.  I'm doing a "snow" diary for Top Comments tonight on how we deal with snow.

            There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

            by Puddytat on Sun Jan 05, 2014 at 05:22:44 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

  •  And It's SO Much More. (9+ / 0-)

    Earlier springs, later falls; species migrating toward the poles and higher in elevation; polar ice shrinking; almost all mountain glaciers shrinking; ocean becoming more acidic.

    We are called to speak for the weak, for the voiceless, for victims of our nation and for those it calls enemy.... --ML King "Beyond Vietnam"

    by Gooserock on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 02:14:27 PM PST

    •  We're seeing the impacts (6+ / 0-)

      and that's what's so alarming.  Diseases like malaria are spreading to larger areas because the climate has changed, insects are increasing their survivable ranges, and agriculture is being affected.  

      We can't sit back anymore and educating the propagandized is imperative.

      There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

      by Puddytat on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 02:22:28 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  The air is warmer; the oceans are warmer, (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Puddytat, Creosote

      and more acidic, and are rising as a result of thermal expansion; the land is warmer; the ice is melting; and we have more and bigger storms from warmer ocean water. That includes more snow on average in winter because the moisture comes from the tropics, which don't have seasons. But then the rain and snow and storms occur in different places than they used to, so we get longer and worse droughts.

      All of those are easily-measurable facts.

      Meanwhile, all of the climate models are wrong. The reality has been consistently worse than predicted.

      Ceterem censeo, gerrymandra delenda est

      by Mokurai on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 10:50:27 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  I do agree with your point about naming (14+ / 0-)

    it global warming. Climate change is much better.  However, too many wingers forget that when they're mocking global warming, they're forgetting the "global" part of the phrase.  It isn't "United States Warming". It isn't "Amurika Warming".  It's GLOBAL in dimension. While it may be -4f where you and I are tomorrow, in Poland on the same day, a location further north than either of us, it will be pushing 50. Some parts of Russia bordering the Arctic Ocean, such as Murmansk, it'll be in the upper 20s. Shit's happening. People in tune with their environments know that it is.

    To hannity, trump and their cohorts, all weather must stop at the edge of the sea.  Sorry sean, it don't work like that. There's a big world out there and it doesn't follow climate change denialist orders.

    A learning experience is one of those things that says, 'You know that thing you just did? Don't do that.' Douglas Adams

    by dougymi on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 02:17:01 PM PST

  •  It's driving me batshit crazy (5+ / 0-)

    I cannot believe these people are willing to blab their fucking ignorance on Facebook. It's one thing to joke amongst friends over a Pabst, but to publicly post HAHAHA to the "global warming enthusiasts" because of the current deep freeze? WTF. It's a partisan badge of honor to scoff at science, glad I'm on the side with some brains.

  •  Uh, it's winter so it's time to pretend that there (5+ / 0-)

    Isn't climate change.

    This time of year is to make sure that the evil climate deniers have stupid on their side.

    nosotros no somos estúpidos

    by a2nite on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 02:28:19 PM PST

  •  If every person would make even the tiniest (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Puddytat, mystique mist, Creosote

    effort to reduce their carbon footprint, we could somewhat reverse the harm we have done. It's almost too late, but if everyone started today there is a chance for reversal. Sadly, with ignorance like you are witnessing in those emails, it's not going to happen. Education is the only answer, as you say.

    I do not know even one person who denies climate change. Or, if I do, they don't say it to me. I can't imagine hearing those words out of someone's mouth.

    We worked hard for years to get the lights in the skyscrapers turned off overnight. These big buildings blaze with light throughout the night. We used to work overnight and would go around turning the lights off. Now, some of the buildings have timers and the lights automatically go off at eleven PM. If someone is working through the night, they have to get up and turn the lights back on. They go off every two hours until time for the normal work day to begin. If this feature existed in every huge building in this country, the amount of electricity consumption would be decreased enormously.  

    What a world.

    Thanks, Puddytat, for another outstanding diary. You could not be more correct about this.  

    "Southern nights have you ever felt a southern night?" Allen Toussaint ~~Remember the Gulf of Mexico~~

    by rubyr on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 03:14:07 PM PST

    •  I'm less concerned about (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      rubyr, mystique mist, Creosote

      building lighting (most of it's fluorescent in skyscrapers) than in their other waste like massive AC use to keep buildings below 70 degrees in summer (employees have to wear sweaters), keeping computers and other electricity greedy appliances on continually, and lack of attention to insulation and recycling.   The farming and ranching industries as well as the manufacturing sector could do a lot better, too.

      Cities and states have been cutting back on mass transit instead of expanding it, adding to the use of cars for travel.  And recycling should be a lot easier than it is now, especially for electronics.

      But the biggest problem is the fight against the bought and paid for ignorance that the fossil fuel industry is heavily promoting.  It's up to us to change that.

      There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

      by Puddytat on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 03:30:15 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Electricity demand in the US has shrunk a little (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Puddytat, Creosote

      in recent years. Nearly all new electricity generation plants in the US last year were renewables. Goldman-Sachs is advising against investments in coal, including coal export terminals. We are at or near Grid Parity in much of the US, where renewables, particularly wind, cost less than natural gas, coal, and oil.

      We have a lot more R&D to do, but the path to all-renewable electricity over several decades is becoming clearer all the time. Transportation fuel is harder, but a shift to electricity for more and more cars and trains is easy to project, while airplanes and large trucks require low-cost zero-net-carbon alternatives to jet fuel and diesel. Research in those areas has started, but has not gotten far enough to make a dent in either market. Carbon emissions from making steel have been significantly reduced, and there is progress on other uses, too.

      Ceterem censeo, gerrymandra delenda est

      by Mokurai on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 11:09:55 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Our grid wastes energy (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Creosote, Mokurai

        and needs to be replaced.  There isn't a single factory making some essential parts (like transformers) in the US - a fact that can bite us in the butt in the future.

        Think of all the good jobs that would come from fixing our crumbling infrastructure.

        There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

        by Puddytat on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 11:16:00 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  If everyone does a little (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Puddytat

      we’ll achieve only a little. We must do a lot. What’s required are big changes in demand and in supply.

      We need big things, or lots and lots of little things (and I doubt there are enough little things to make much of a difference).

      Fake candidates nominated by the GOP for the recalls: 6 out of 7. Fake signatures on the recall petitions: 4 out of 1,860,283.

      by GeoffT on Sun Jan 05, 2014 at 09:55:59 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  I don't know. The statistics re: everyone cutting (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Puddytat

        back in little ways show great potential for change through conservation. This would probably not be as true if this weren't such an extreme energy consumptive country.

        Every person using one less light a day changes a lot, people  refraining from eating meat one day a week changes a lot, people biking, walking and using mass transit changes a lot, car pooling, recycling as a way of life, taking cloth bags for shopping, using energy efficient appliances and light bulbs. I could go on and on. These small things really do add up, if everyone does them, or if the majority does them.  

        "Southern nights have you ever felt a southern night?" Allen Toussaint ~~Remember the Gulf of Mexico~~

        by rubyr on Sun Jan 05, 2014 at 10:56:16 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  The point is that they don't (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          rubyr, Puddytat

          Even if raising meat animals were responsible for 100% of GHG emissions, cutting out meat one day a week could only cut GHG emissions by 1/7th.

          The United States uses, on average over the course of a year, roughly 500GW of electricity.  If 100 million homes switch off a 100W light bulb that would otherwise be on for 8 hours/day, demand would be reduced by less than one percent.

          Now I'm not saying that we shouldn't do what is within reach to do overnight; what I am saying is that everyone doing a little doesn't solve the problem: the bad news is that emissions of the industrialized world have to be cut by 80% by 2050 to avoid the largest risks the globe has seen for millions of years.  Switching off a lightbulb and meatless Mondays are nowhere close to being enough.

          Energy efficient light bulbs can just about get us there, but only for that section of energy demand that currently goes into lighting light bulbs, which simply isn't a very large fraction of the total.  But that's hardly a cultural shift: getting Americans to give up meat almost entirely would be, and an extremely hard nut to crack inside of a single generation.

          Ubiquitous carpooling would have to be combined with vastly increased fleet average mpg's to get to the 80% emissions cut needed.  But that level of cut needs to happen across all sectors: transporting food, travel for leisure, concrete use (emits CO2 as it sets), agriculture, manufacturing, electricity production, etc etc etc.

          Making small gestures now can be good politically, but certainly aren't going to stop us from blowing through 450ppm CO2 and so can't be allowed to become an excuse for not making the huge cultural shifts necessary in the near future ("what do you mean, go vegetarian, sell the car and use the bus, pay for extra house insulation, not eat strawberries in midwinter, switch to a green electricity provider and hang laundry out to dry?  I installed a CFL just last year!").

          Fake candidates nominated by the GOP for the recalls: 6 out of 7. Fake signatures on the recall petitions: 4 out of 1,860,283.

          by GeoffT on Sun Jan 05, 2014 at 12:31:00 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  I am not arguing with you. Your snark at the end (0+ / 0-)

            is totally uncalled for.

            "Southern nights have you ever felt a southern night?" Allen Toussaint ~~Remember the Gulf of Mexico~~

            by rubyr on Sun Jan 05, 2014 at 02:38:48 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  What snark? (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              rubyr

              If people get the impression that global climate catastrophe is going to averted simply by their lightbulb choices, they're going to be very pissed off if not disbelieving at the lengths that are actually necessary.

              And with respect, you are arguing with me: whether a lot of people doing a little makes a little or a lot of difference to the climate prognosis.  The actions you've listed are a good start, but that's all they are: a start, not a complete solution by any means.

              Fake candidates nominated by the GOP for the recalls: 6 out of 7. Fake signatures on the recall petitions: 4 out of 1,860,283.

              by GeoffT on Sun Jan 05, 2014 at 03:45:44 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  I never said a word about "complete solutions". (0+ / 0-)
                "...("what do you mean, go vegetarian, sell the car and use the bus, pay for extra house insulation, not eat strawberries in midwinter, switch to a green electricity provider and hang laundry out to dry?  I installed a CFL just last year!")."
                I hoped this was snark, maybe it was just arrogance, whatever it was, it was uncalled for. Carry on. I don't waste time with people like you.

                "Southern nights have you ever felt a southern night?" Allen Toussaint ~~Remember the Gulf of Mexico~~

                by rubyr on Sun Jan 05, 2014 at 07:53:16 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  I probably should have put (0+ / 0-)

                  "Live in an apartment without much external surface area, not a house" instead of the midwinter strawberries (by the latter I was hoping to emphasize far shorter food transportation distances), but it is what I believe we need to avoid people saying in future by giving the impression that minor adjustments are sufficient, which I thought was clear from the context, and I apologize if I made it anything other.

                  Just can't afford to have frustration at apparently shifting goalposts leading to popular pushback with stakes this high.  And my fear is that telling people that each of them doing a little makes a big difference to the climate prognosis sets up exactly that.

                  Fake candidates nominated by the GOP for the recalls: 6 out of 7. Fake signatures on the recall petitions: 4 out of 1,860,283.

                  by GeoffT on Sun Jan 05, 2014 at 11:14:13 PM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Well, let's have everyone do nothing. Good plan. n (0+ / 0-)

                    "Southern nights have you ever felt a southern night?" Allen Toussaint ~~Remember the Gulf of Mexico~~

                    by rubyr on Mon Jan 06, 2014 at 09:42:58 AM PST

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  I am not the enemy (0+ / 0-)

                      All I have said is that if a lot of people do a tiny bit each, the global impact is tiny and backed that up with some numbers based on your own examples and that we shouldn't pretend otherwise.  We simply need big things.  That's... rather different than what you claim I have said.

                      On the supply side we have coal-fired electricity generation being anathema to investors.  We shouldn't pretend that's due to too much other than the fracking boom (which has its own problems of course) leading to low natural gas prices, but nonetheless this can become a big thing if the trend continues.  Increasing CAFE standards are set to make significant inroads on vehicle emissions.

                      These don't add up to all or even most of what we need, but they're free and you'd certainly notice their impacts on a pie chart.  A carbon tax of $25/MTCO2e could drop emissions 40% by 2040.  That's a huge chunk of what we need, and if properly couched (e.g. with the proceeds being redistributed per-capita and it being pointed out that c. 80% of voters would be better off as a result) it also has big potential for public support.

                      That's a far cry from having everyone doing nothing.  That's taking some big things that are free (has Obama paid even a political price for the CAFE standards change?) and also something that could gain large public support and get us halfway to where we need to be by 2050, all off the top of my head.

                      These are things that are both big and very very possible.  Sure, let's celebrate and encourage all the small things, but let's make damn sure we don't forget to do the big things too.

                      Fake candidates nominated by the GOP for the recalls: 6 out of 7. Fake signatures on the recall petitions: 4 out of 1,860,283.

                      by GeoffT on Mon Jan 06, 2014 at 01:29:45 PM PST

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  ... (0+ / 0-)

                        Why don't you just write a comment expressing your beliefs and stop talking to me, since what you are saying has nothing to do with what I was talking about. I never said that I was addressing the big things. I never said anything like that. I never encouraged anyone to "forget to do the big things". I never even mentioned the big things. I was saying that if we do the small things as a country that it will help. These are not my thoughts, many experts agree. Also, awareness of the small things tends to raise awareness about the big things.

                        You just want to put someone in their place. I cannot be put in my place. I am already in my place.

                        "Southern nights have you ever felt a southern night?" Allen Toussaint ~~Remember the Gulf of Mexico~~

                        by rubyr on Mon Jan 06, 2014 at 02:11:19 PM PST

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  Tiny efforts by everyone (0+ / 0-)

                          As you advocated in your original comment, lead to tiny results, not the chance of reversal you mentioned there.  I don't see how pointing that out is anything other than relevant.  Indeed you didn't mention the big things, and that's a huge - and even dangerous, I fear - omission when you use terms like "reversal" in relation to this subject.

                          If you desire to interpret all that as advocacy of inaction or somehow a disrespect of your personal efforts or a claim that if every modestly-sized group of people came up with (independent, importantly) similar scale plans to the one you mentioned in your original comment that could be applied globally it wouldn't add up to significant inroads, that's up to you.  But it doesn't make it so.

                          Fake candidates nominated by the GOP for the recalls: 6 out of 7. Fake signatures on the recall petitions: 4 out of 1,860,283.

                          by GeoffT on Mon Jan 06, 2014 at 03:11:23 PM PST

                          [ Parent ]

  •  A corollary of the Dunning-Kruger effect (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Puddytat, nice marmot, mystique mist

    Those too stupid to understand climate change are the most sure that there is no climate change.  

    Science has progressed so far since the Enlightenment started, that it has left the majority of the population behind.  Less than 10% of the population retain any understanding of science after they finish their formal education, and of the other 90%, it divides equally between those who trust science and those who don't.  I'll venture that those that do trust science take account of all the things that science gets right, while those that don't resent the fact that they don't understand it.

    •  Yes, denial is easier (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      mystique mist, Maverick80229

      and the masses are given the slogans and talking points to parrot that ignorance.

      There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

      by Puddytat on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 03:31:23 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  No, they understand it clearly enough (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Puddytat

      to know exactly what they object to. They resent Gubmint tyranny that tells them that they can't oppress everybody else and destroy our health and the environment, and Secular Humanist Libruls telling them that Jeebus didn't have to save them from that nasty old Original Sin in the Garden of Eden 6,000 years ago, plus they are descended from Black Africans just like the rest of us. Also mainstream Christians who have gotten over a historical Fall, whom they consider just about as bad.

      So Evolution and Global Warming are the hottest targets, particularly since there is so much money available for denying Global Warming. Of course that means denying large chunks of physics, chemistry, and biology, and the entire scientific method. Which to many of them go into the balance against their immortal souls. If you believe that that is the contest, it is in fact no contest.

      Ceterem censeo, gerrymandra delenda est

      by Mokurai on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 11:20:27 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Posted on facebook with a question (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Puddytat, mystique mist

    Are You A Climate Change Denier ?

    Thanks for all you DO !

  •  I guess only the weather on the east coast... (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    mystique mist, jan4insight, Puddytat

    counts. Here in Phoenix over the past few days, we've had temperatures in the 70's - well above normal.

    Just another faggity fag socialist fuckstick homosinner!

    by Ian S on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 05:21:16 PM PST

    •  It's weird everywhere (0+ / 0-)

      Weirder weather, stronger storms, more rain someplaces and less elsewhere.  Enjoy being summery.

      Want some snow?

      There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

      by Puddytat on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 09:41:40 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  A better term than "Climate Change" (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Puddytat, Creosote, GeoffT

    Is "Climate Breakdown":

    The second is that we have to stop calling it climate change. Using "climate change" to describe events like this, with their devastating implications for global food security, water supplies and human settlements, is like describing a foreign invasion as an unexpected visit, or bombs as unwanted deliveries. It's a ridiculously neutral term for the biggest potential catastrophe humankind has ever encountered.

    I think we should call it "climate breakdown". Does anyone out there have a better idea?

    (Hat tip to George Monbiot)

    "If you are still playing for Team Republican and want to have any honor whatsoever, you need to leave the Republican Party now, apologize to America, and work to remove it from our political system." - Brad DeLong

    by radabush on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 06:43:59 PM PST

    •  I do like that term even better (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Creosote

      and it's even more descriptive of what's happening.  Thank you.

      There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

      by Puddytat on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 09:42:36 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Monbiot is excellent! (0+ / 0-)

      And I am going to start using Climate Breakdown from now on. Not only is "Breakdown" already firmly defined in the basement level rock 'n' roll vocabulary, it is also immediately understandable on its own, from dropped dishes and broken relationships to cars that won't run.

  •  I think of when our species was much newer ... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Puddytat, Creosote

    Becoming conscious of how we reproduced had to have required some leaps of intuition. I can imagine the problems we would have had with that progression had there been Republicans, then, saying, oh no, we had sex nine months ago and ... no baby! So that CAN'T be the answer!

    That really is the level of their thinking on this.

    Thank you, Puddytat.

    "The opposite of war isn't peace, it's CREATION." _ Jonathan Larson, RENT -9.62, -9.13

    by BeninSC on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 10:11:15 PM PST

    •  Thanks for stopping by (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      BeninSC, Creosote

      We can no longer just hit the delete button on the volumes of crap that's forwarded to us.  We have to take the time to counter it.  

      We're losing the war on science to meme and money.

      There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

      by Puddytat on Sat Jan 04, 2014 at 10:38:22 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Excuse me, but RW talk showhosts (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Puddytat

    Are experts in climate science just by their opinion alone. Jeez hasn't Charlie Sykes outraged you enough against the liberal media conspiracy!;)

    •  I'm one of those "eggheads" (0+ / 0-)

      that isn't welcome on RW radio.  They need a great big broadcast signal to carry that whopping pile of bullshit to the Tea Baggers in the Ring of Fire.

      There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

      by Puddytat on Sun Jan 05, 2014 at 05:24:50 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  The denialists realize.. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Puddytat

    exactly what the implications are.  Some creature comforts would need to be given up, and some lines of work
    will no longer be possible.

    Think back to the civil war.  The entire economy of the south was dependent upon having slaves to do the manual labor.  And they were willing to fight to the death to preserve what they had.

    •  And their monied backers are buying (0+ / 0-)

      up water supplies and what will be good agricultural land after climate change wrecks everything else.  They're always in it for the M-O-N-E-Y!

      There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

      by Puddytat on Sun Jan 05, 2014 at 05:26:09 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

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