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February 16, 2014-Albany - Governor Andrew M. Cuomo delivers remarks at Black, Puerto Rican & Asian Legislative Caucus Weekend Church Service.
A growing number of New York Dems don't like him either.
Surprising numbers out of Siena Research Institute:
In a head-to-head matchup, Governor Andrew Cuomo continues to hold a better than two-to-one lead over Westchester County Executive Rob Astorino, 58-28 percent (down a little from 61-26 percent last month). However, if the race includes a Working Families Party candidate perceived to be more liberal or progressive than Cuomo, his lead falls to 15 points, with 39 percent for Cuomo, and 24 percent each for Astorino and the unnamed WFP candidate, according to a Siena College Poll of New York voters released today.
And anti-Cuomo discontent has plenty of room to grow.
Although 84 percent of voters say corruption in Albany is a serious problem, less than one-third have followed the Moreland Commission closely and only one-quarter have heard or read at least some about the disbanding of the Commission. Nonetheless, by a 61-23 percent margin, voters side with a federal prosecutor that the Moreland Commission should have continued investigating state government corruption rather than the governor, who says that the new ethics law passed as part of the budget justifies disbanding the Moreland Commission.
More on that Moreland Commission here, but in short, the governor created this anti-corruption commission with great fanfare a couple of years ago, meddled with its activities during its existence, then abruptly shut it down several weeks ago when it started getting close to the governor's buddies.

With a WFP candidate in the race, 30 percent of Democrats opt out of Cuomo's camp, proving significant discontent with a great deal of New Yorkers. And with news of Cuomo's corruption still seeping out, that bleed could worsen. For their part, Republicans have to be bummed that in a three-way race, they can't even stake out a clear second place. The only reason they have any relevance in the state is because of their Senate gerrymander. A gerrymander, of course, happily signed into law by Cuomo himself. And even then, they still lost the majority, and are only in power thanks to turncoat Dems.

So New York Dems have plenty to be dissatisfied about.

Originally posted to kos on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 09:29 AM PDT.

Also republished by New York City and Daily Kos.

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Comment Preferences

    •  I think it's ok (24+ / 0-)

      to say it would be great if Cuomo were challenged from the Left, even a Third Party here, mainly because there is zero chance Cuomo can lose this race.

      That said, I still would prefer the message sending to occur in a primary. What if Cuomo were held to 60 percent in a Dem primary? What that be a strong message?

      Or is really only deliverable in a general election?

      Either way, Cuomo is not losing so I do think it is not counterproductive and important to send a message on some level.

      Indeed, if I felt confi9dent that Hillary Clinton would definitely win in 2016 with a third part progressive coandidate in the race, I would not be that upset either.

      I just think that's not the case.

      I think the messaging has to come in the primaries and in downballot races.

      •  I think it'll be a closer race than pundits... (20+ / 0-)

        ...expect, living here on the ground in Westchester County (home to not only Cuomo and Astorino, but the Clintons and many other big political names).

        That being said, Astorino's a tool (anti-abortion, etc.) and a stereotypical D'Amato-type GOP'er. Money-wise, it's not a race yet; it may never be; and it is the end of April. Cuomo's outraised Astorino something like 15-to-1.

        But, anyone who follows NY state politics knows Westchester and Long Island are where a lot of statewide elections are won, especially in a non-presidential year, with significantly lower turnout in NYC (than 2012) being the norm.

        "I always thought if you worked hard enough and tried hard enough, things would work out. I was wrong." --Katharine Graham

        by bobswern on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 09:55:54 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Watch for the NRA money here... (7+ / 0-)

          ...and similar rightwing PACs. I'm pretty sure it'll be huge. The Q2 '14 campaign finance reports will tell us a LOT about what's going to happen in this race.

          "I always thought if you worked hard enough and tried hard enough, things would work out. I was wrong." --Katharine Graham

          by bobswern on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 10:04:00 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Astorino is a very savvy pol...even his first... (8+ / 0-)

            ...win (I believe it was his second attempt) as Westchester County Exec, a year after Obama won the White House, was a rather big upset. I would not underestimate this guy. (And, yeah, all that being said, I still think he'll lose in November. But, again, he's not to be underestimated.)

            "I always thought if you worked hard enough and tried hard enough, things would work out. I was wrong." --Katharine Graham

            by bobswern on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 10:11:12 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Wouldn't that depend on voter turn out, too? (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              bobswern, tardis10

              Nothing suppresses voter turn out than apathy with the candidates, although that doesn't seem to apply to conservative/right wing voters, as it does to Democrats who aren't married to the party and Independents who are more discerning.

            •  Agree except (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Aquarius40, isabelle hayes, bobswern

              That with the The Donald and Carl Paladino supporting and working on his behalf he'll probably lose voters who see both of them as total jerks.  

              Never be afraid to voice your opinion and fight for it . Corporations aren't people, they're Republicans (Rev Al Sharpton 10/7/2011) Voting is a louder voice than a bullhorn but sometimes you need that bullhorn to retain your vote.

              by Rosalie907 on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 11:44:16 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

          •  Not NRA--Eva Moskowitz. THAT is where the cash (15+ / 0-)

            will be coming from. Cuomo wants to do a Brownback in New York when it comes to Education.

            "Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." --M. L. King "You can't fix stupid" --Ron White -6.00, -5.18

            by zenbassoon on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 10:32:14 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  That would be awesome! (0+ / 0-)

            If a left-wing challenger to Cuomo could make the race close enough for the NRA and the conservative PACs to waste a load of money losing to Cuomo, that would be ideal!

            Art is the handmaid of human good.

            by joe from Lowell on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 02:48:00 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  no way the WFP does it (0+ / 0-)

              Not gonna happen.  The WFP doesn't take risks in elections now that they are in the money.  Anyone who talks about a WFP candidate entering this election has no idea what they are talking about when it comes to NY politics or about why the WFP exists.  I'm looking at you Kos.  

              Cuomo wins this.  Maybe the Working Families Party would have some credibility if they hadn't endorsed him last time.  But they did and now they need to lie in the bed they made.

              •  As an extremely active union member in New York (10+ / 0-)

                I think you underestimate just how pissed off the WFP people are - considering we are essentially the WFP.  We created it.  We built it.  We essentially control it.

                And yes, our leaders are discussing using the WFP to mount a primary.  We're pissed at this asshole.  Royally pissed.

                You are right in that there is a concern about the loss of the line - but that is the only thing you're right about.  The only real question is how those concerns play out within the party.

                "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

                by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 03:20:48 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  I don't underestimate (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  AlexDrew

                  what you are feeling.  Are you in WFP management?  I've been a card carrying WFP member.  I've donated thousands of dollars to them.  I've worked on campaigns for candidates they have endorsed.  

                  When has the WFP ever mounted a third party challenge?  Never.   They support dem primary challenges and then very strongly discourage their candidates running in the general election even if they have done very well in the primary.  

                  They also expect their endorsed candidates to pay a bunch of money to them for that support.  They make money off of this.  Who is going to donate that money for a statewide race against a candidate who is going to win and already has close to $40 million?  

                  No one.  

                  Thus, the WFP can't make money off of this race. So they won't get involved.   If you think as a party member you have any real say in what happens with the party decisions, I'll point you to the Dem party for evidence to the contrary.   Remember how the WFP sat out and watched Bloomberg narrowly win a third term.  Perhaps if they were involved the results could have been different.  But they stayed out.  When big money is in the game, the WFP makes sure not to anger big money.  

                  •  "WFP management" (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Mannie

                    is essentially elected union leaders.

                    I'd expect you'd know that, as you state you were a "card carrying WFP member."

                    So if they've never done it before, they won't do it now?  Priceless logic.

                    Meanwhile, what's being floated around in the state political press even indicates otherwise.  For example:

                    http://www.nystateofpolitics.com/...

                    Inside the unions the debate is even more intense.  The only thing that is preventing the WFP from running another candidate is the concern over the loss of the line - and that concern is far from unanimous.  In fact, it causes heated debate.

                    And as I noted - that's about the only thing you were right on.

                    But believe what you will.

                    "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

                    by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 04:29:16 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  sure (0+ / 0-)

                      union leaders are concerned about the loss of the line and not their own personal gain.

                      Believe what you will.

                      If the only concern was the loss of the line, they'd run.  Because it is the right thing to do.

                       The concern is about their own personal financial position. So they won't run a candidate.  Perhaps you will no longer be a member of the WFP once you realize they are a front for the unions and protecting democratic party candidates. Unions who have supported Republicans in NY.

                      Please point to all of the WFP third party races they have run based on their challenges to corrupt dems.
                       

                      •  Spoken like (3+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        Mannie, poco, orestes1963

                        any run-of-the-mill Republican anti-unionist, who also tend to do nothing but talk about "union leaders" and their "personal gain."

                        /golfclap for you on your devolution.  That is, if you ever were a WFP member in the first place - which based on what you've said so far, I highly doubt.

                        "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

                        by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 04:42:39 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  well (0+ / 0-)

                          The WFP does not support third party challenges.  You have not provided any evidence to the contrary.  They support democrats in primaries.

                          I didn't vote for Cuomo because he is a right wing hack.  The WFP endorsed him.  And the Koch Brothers gave him money.  And i'm the anti union republican?  

                          It must be nice to support candidates like him when it is convenient and then call people like me anti union.  You supported him, not me.  

                          Where was the anger from the WFP members four years ago?

                          •  also (0+ / 0-)

                            I think it would be great for the WFP to run a candidate.  And for the unions to all join together and work for the greater good.  I just don't think it will happen.  

                            One reason it won't is because when there was talk of a primary challenge to Cuomo last year, WFP leadership shut that down quick fast in a hurry.  That is when they should have been vetting candidates.

                            So, I look forward to you proving me wrong and for the WFP to put all of their time and effort and money into doing the right thing even though they have no chance of winning.  Perhaps that will help with the guilt from their Cuomo endorsement in a race where he was unchallenged and didn't need their endorsement and was taking money from the Koch brothers.  Tell me how that helped working families.

                            I look forward to being proven wrong and will happily vote for the third party candidate.  However, that will be Hawkins as the WFP ain't gonna do it.

                          •  You are an ignoramus. (0+ / 0-)

                            Article after article in the political press contradicts what you continually state.

                            Pull your head out of your ass and try reading some of them.  I linked you to one.  Surely you have enough Google-foo to find others.  There are new ones that just popped up today discussing this.

                            Like I said, believe whatever you want.  But the possibility of this happening is real.

                            "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

                            by Darth Stateworker on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 08:35:26 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  sure (0+ / 0-)

                            articles are discussing this.  But it has never been done.   So it would be a complete break from the model the WFP has used.  

                            Good luck.

                          •  here is an article for you (0+ / 0-)

                            just out today.

                            http://www.capitalnewyork.com/...

                            Looks like the unions that control the WFP might be having second thoughts.  Shocking!

                          •  lipton (0+ / 0-)

                            FYI - when you are reading articles, check out this one from December. Bill Lipton, the WFP State Director, says the idea that the WFP would challenge Cuomo was "absurd"

                            Bill Lipton, the WFP’s state director, had a brief response to that idea: “It’s absurd.”
                            Perhaps you can change Bill's mind.
                          •  "Some of" (0+ / 0-)

                            You also ignore where they explain its not the unions making the statewide decision, but the activists.

                            Try actually reading your links, dumbass.

                            "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

                            by Darth Stateworker on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 12:55:36 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  like i said (1+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            Alice Olson

                            perhaps you can change bill's mind.  

                            Nice to see that a WFP member like yourself conducts themselves in such a professional manner.

                            I've seen the activists in WFP be overruled by the people in NYC like Lipton as I was one of them.  Been on the receiving end of that.  I can understand why you are so frustrated.  

                            Good luck accomplishing the absurd.

              •  Cuomo wins this but I think... (3+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Mannie, bobswern, Darth Stateworker

                That a large dissatisfied left wing portion of the Democrat party voting third party could help Democrats in the long run in New York. Get the Green party line above the 50,000 threshold again so that they can fusion with Democrats in other elections. Do the same for a progressive party, etc etc.

                We only think nothing goes without saying.

                by Hamtree on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 05:01:40 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  One quibble. (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Mannie, bobswern

                  We can't do that with the Progressive Party.  They no longer have a line - and essentially no longer exist.  Worse still - scuttlebutt around the Capitol is that if the WFP does run a challenger, Cuomo has threatened to revive the Progressive Party to give himself a second line and cut into the WFP vote enough to cause them to lose their line.

                  He's a shifty, shady, sneaky, underhanded bastard.

                  "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

                  by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 07:15:30 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Not the Progressive Party (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Darth Stateworker

                    If there ever was a party in NY by that name it was before we were born. It's the Liberal Party Cuomo is threatening to resurrect as a home for the unions who are currently in WFP, but want to support him because he controls the goody bag.

                    "The only thing we have to fear is fear itself."........ "The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little." (yeah, same guy.)

                    by sidnora on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 05:29:47 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  You're right. Wrong name. n/t (1+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      sidnora

                      "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

                      by Darth Stateworker on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 05:50:34 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  Funny but sad story (0+ / 0-)

                        My parents were registered Liberals. I think they'd made that decision in the late 40’s, when the Liberal Party was the same kind of union-fueled Force To Be Reckoned With that WFP is right now. But by the time I was old enough to have a political mind of my own, it was a sad shadow of its former self.

                        When I came of age, I registered as a Democrat, and then began a campaign to get my folks to realize that all their precious registration was doing for them was closing them out of voting in primaries. And as I'm sure you know, most of the action in NYC elections is during the primaries. I think they finally registered as Democrats when they moved to FL. No Liberal Party there.

                        "The only thing we have to fear is fear itself."........ "The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little." (yeah, same guy.)

                        by sidnora on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 07:11:02 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

              •  The WFP hasn't taken chances, ever, in my (0+ / 0-)

                estimation, in the money or not. Since 1998 when, right out of the gate, they endorsed Peter Vallone, Sr. I haven't taken them seriously as a progressive force.  Someone might convince me to re-think this, but so far, I don't see it.  Putting a candidate up against Cuomo would be fabulous start, though I doubt that convincing me of anything is on their priority list.  

                They always just seemed to me to be another group of ambitious NY politicos who created their own organization so they could be at the head of something. It's a populous state and there's not a lot of room at the top, so young people have to do what they have to do to clamor up the ladder of influence, whatever their politics.  

                The good we secure for ourselves is precarious and uncertain, is floating in mid-air, until it is secured for all of us and incorporated into our common life. Jane Addams

                by Alice Olson on Thu Apr 24, 2014 at 01:21:01 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

      •  To anticipate a question (10+ / 0-)

        What message is being sent, you might ask, if Cuomo knows he's not going to get beat.

        The message would be 2 fold imo - number 1, Cuomo like most pols, sees a President when he looks in the mirrior. IF he is to pursue that conceit he will know that his swerve to the right is hurting him in progressive circles nationally as well as locally and that his name may be enough in New York to win, but not to gain momentum for an eventual national run.

        It also is a message to New York pols NOT named Cuomo that they will be playing with fire if they play Cuomo's game. He can;t lose but they certainly can.

        Consider the trajectory of Gillibrand as the positive example to this negative example of Cuomo's.  

        •  How is Gillibrand a positive example? (3+ / 0-)

          She is a right as Cuomo.  

          •  Gillibrand?!?!? (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            grrr

            really?!?!?

            •  Yea pretty much. (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Justanothernyer

              New York Dems aren't lefties.  90% of elected Dems aren't lefties, which I why I'm perpetually mystified at the Cumo hate around here.  

              When we talk about war, we're really talking about peace.

              by genethefiend on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 04:23:50 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Weeeell... (3+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Mannie, poco, orestes1963

                ...not being a little disingenuous, are we? Do you really believe that Cuomo is right in the middle of the Democratic party?

                But, more importantly, if you're really surprised by the Cuomo hate, then you haven't been paying any attention. This is a place about electing Democrats and getting them into power. It doesn't matter if they suck, it doesn't matter if they are mass murderers: as Kos says above, if they are Democrats, then we will back them, although we might not 'engage'. (Which is to say, we will probably only give money to Cuomo through all of the organizations that take money from us to give to crappy Democrats, instead of giving it directly.)

                And Cuomo committed a major sin there: he basically helped hand control of NY over to the Republicans. Since Republicans aren't Democrats, a lot of people here hate him. But not enough to actually back a third party candidate against him, because the only thing dKos hates more than a Republican is a credible left-of-center third party candidate.

                •  I assure you I'm not being disingenuous at all. (0+ / 0-)

                  I am being completely sincere.  Is the main criticism of Cuomo the acceptance of the gerrymandered districts?  If so, I agree and will not argue.  That's a big one.  Shutting down the anti-corruption commission he's got a reason for (law passed, commission was intended to close with the passing of that anti-corruption law), I'm not opining whether its a bs reason.

                  All I'm saying is Cuomo has an over 60% approval rating, consistently.  68% at one point.  Find me a Dem with those numbers.  Find me any politician in America with those numbers.  Not too many.

                  Cuomo also got busted pretending to fight the toll increases with Christie, when the whole think was kabuki theater.  So he's got screw ups, but NY is functioning, better than our neighbors.  Really because finance is centered here, but he's trying.  He went with the flow and signed into law equal marriage.

                  I'm pro working party, but I am against the random crap on the Dem Governor with the highest approval ratings in the nation.  There is no need for it.  It's crap.

                  When we talk about war, we're really talking about peace.

                  by genethefiend on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 05:15:40 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

              •  I agree (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                genethefiend

                Cuomo is no different than Clinton or Gillibrand.   But it is in Kos' financial interest to attack Cuomo.

                So he does.

                And it pays well.

          •  her trajectory (0+ / 0-)

            Amazing question.

    •  So iow (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Simplify, ChuckChuckerson

      As long as you deem the D candidate worthy of support or not worthy of that support as appears is the case here...then it's ok to discuss a potential third party candidate openly.

      So if Cuomo was the national D candidate? I assume you would support.

      I get that it's your site, your rules...but you do see how this pick and choose approach can be a challenge for others who may see most likely national team D candidate Former Sen and Former SOS Hilary Clinton in the same situation as Cuomo. What about primaries?

      Government of, for, and by the wealthy corporate political ruling class elites. Elizabeth Warren Progressive Wing of political spectrum.

      by emal on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 09:57:35 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I think it's always been ok (4+ / 0-)

        To discuss third-party candidates in terms of analysis and how they affect the race.  You can talk about what you like about them and why you might dislike the Democrat in the race.  You don' t have to be a rah-rah supporter of the Democrat.  You can even say you are staying home.  It's just not okay to advocate actually voting for the third-party candidate.

        •  Well ... THERE's a conversation killer (0+ / 0-)
          It's just not okay to advocate actually voting for the third-party candidate.
          Is that "Official" ?
          •  As official as anything (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            joe from Lowell

            Not sure what is going at dKospedia, where I did have info that would link to explicit statements.

            Here's one diary by kos promising to treat third party advocacy the same as racism:

            If you accuse someone of being racist just because they criticize Obama? Zap! If you actually say something that is even borderline racist? Zap! If you advocate for third party? Zap! This is a Democratic site. Advocating primaries is okay. Advocating third party is not.
            which includes some exceptions:
            Actually, there are two exceptions -- places with fusion voting like NY when the Working Families Party has endorsed the Democrat.

            Or, in those rare cases where an election doesn't have a Democrat on the ballot.

            My guess is that the more likely a third-party candidate is to become a spoiler who could cost a Democrat the election, no matter how progressive the third-party candidate is or how non-progressive the Democrat is, the more scrutiny will be placed on someone who seems to be supporting the third-party candidate.
            •  In States Like New York (4+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Mannie, emal, poco, orestes1963

              where Republican and Democrat frequently are one and the same, it would be useful for Kos to support a conversation parsing which candidates are basically Republicans who can't get elected unless they are positioned in the Democratic party.

              Newt 2012. Sociopath, adulterer, hypocrite, Republican.

              by tikkun on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 04:05:00 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  There should be an exception... (5+ / 0-)

              ...for the Working Families Party.

              I can't think of any other group that is more aligned with Progressive ideals.

              I would urge Kos to consider making an exception for New York.

              •  In this individual case, I'd agree. (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Mannie

                Especially as is pointed out downthread a bit by Mets102 that there is a possibility that the Republicans could be relegated to minority party statusin New York if the WFP candidate finished in second.

                At the end of the day, that downgrade wouldn't mean much practically (we'd essentially control all county boards of elections for the next 4 years, but as we don't cheat on elections like the GOP does, I think we'd gain little from that control), but I suspect it would have a huge demoralizing effect on the GOP in New York - and perhaps even send a signal nationally of how weak the GOP is/can be - perhaps leading to a huge amount of turmoil in the national party overall as well.

                I can see the headlines now on mainstream broadcast news in November:  "Republicans take 3rd place in NY, become minor party in the state after union-controlled WFP candidate places 2nd."  I think many of them would go apeshit.

                It would also demonstrate some union power to the Turd Way and other Democrats around the country that aren't very friendly to labor - which would also be helpful.

                I see that potential for psychological damage on the GOP and boon to unions and think it's well worth it to create an exception in this case.

                But at the end of the day - it's his sandbox.

                "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

                by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 07:30:19 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

          •  How is it a conversation killer? (4+ / 0-)

            It's a big internet. Lots of places to have that conversation.

            Just not here.

      •  Huh? (10+ / 0-)

        We talk about races. Races are impacted by various factors, including serious third-party challenges.

        But I knew people would try to interpret writing about WFP as advocating for it, because people read non-existent stuff in places in order to fit their biases or notions. That's why I added the first comment, to make sure that people wouldn't misconstrue things.

        So yeah, talking about the impact of a third party is fine. It's kinda the point of the place. ADVOCATING for that third party is not.

        And if I don't advocate WFP candidate over Cuomo, who I think is the worst Democrat since Joe Lieberman, if not WORSE than Joe Liebeman, then there's no reason for anyone else to advocate third party for anyone else.

        •  reasons (0+ / 0-)

          "And if I don't advocate WFP candidate over Cuomo, who I think is the worst Democrat since Joe Lieberman, if not WORSE than Joe Liebeman, then there's no reason for anyone else to advocate third party for anyone else."

          Then there is no reason for anyone else to advocate third party for anyone else unless they are unhappy with continuing to support the status quo where spoiled children of former high level democrats get to hold powerful positions and think they are presidential material and family members of other high level democrats are leading candidates for president.

          Nice system you are supporting there, Kos.  Certainly no thinking person would expect change from that approach.

          Certainly no reason to want anything but status quo.  

      •  Oh, it's fine to DISCUSS them (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        emal, Mannie

        You just have to belittle them at every opportunity. And hurl abuse at anyone who might choose to support them.

    •  I just wish IRV were in place. (3+ / 0-)

      Plurality elections are, IMO, idiotic.  I've made the mistake of voting third party once.  Never again.

      I am become Man, the destroyer of worlds

      by tle on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 10:41:05 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  A little clarification please (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      tardis10

      Okay, so under no circumstances will the site work for the WFP candidate. But, since you have made your disgust with the sitting Democrat quite clear, you will also not rush to defend him.
      Okay, then if someone here starts advocating in favor of the WFP candidate do they still fall under the ban hammer?

    •  We need a name (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Aquarius40, cybrestrike, Loge, poco

      Attached to the WFP candidate.  Without that it may just be a WFP pipedream to run a candidate against Cuomo.

      Never be afraid to voice your opinion and fight for it . Corporations aren't people, they're Republicans (Rev Al Sharpton 10/7/2011) Voting is a louder voice than a bullhorn but sometimes you need that bullhorn to retain your vote.

      by Rosalie907 on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 11:41:13 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Hawkins. (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        ColoTim, tikkun, Ohkwai, poco

        Howie Hawkins of the state Green Party has suggested a joint effort with the WFP where they cross-endorse him.

        Personally, I think that's a good idea.  Hawkins did well enough in 2010 to earn a line for the Greens for 4 years.  So he has a bit of name recognition already.  Additionally,  WFP has no real big name Democrat to run on their line.

        The question is the WFP itself.  They may endorse Cuomo anyway because they fear losing their ballot line by not getting enough votes on it.  They may simply run one of the union heads.  They haven't come to a decision yet.

        But I think if they take Hawkins up on his idea,  this poll becomes reality in November, and Cuomo doesn't simply get to crush Astorino by a wide margin.

        Some within the Democratic party might even work behind the quietly scenes to help a challenge from the left. Let's face it - Cuomo has surely pissed off many other prominent Democrats here - de Blasio, Silver, DiNapoli, Schneiderman...  These guys owe no loyalty to him, so cutting him (and his ego) down a few notches by helping someone who could eat into his margin of victory and make him appear weaker would be beneficial for them - and a bit of political payback for them too.

        "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

        by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 12:44:06 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Find a Jesse Ventura (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          GreatLakeSailor, Rosalie907

          You want to wake up a fossilized, arrogant, inbred, political party? Demonstrate to them that if they keep putting bozos on the ballot, you're going to elect clowns.

        •  Problem is (4+ / 0-)

          I think WFP is more likely to get 50,000 votes without Cuomo than with him.

          How many WFP will pull the level for Cuomo on it? Everyone else will just vote for him on the D line.

          •  Bingo. (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            SCFrog, poco, DROzone

            It's union members that typically pull the lever on the WFP line.  It's essentially a union created, union controlled party here.  He got about 150k on that line in 2010 - but the largest unions in the state largely endorsed him in 2010, with only CSEA sitting out of the notable ones I can recall.  Today - even SEIU 1199 - a union Cuomo largely favored to this point in his stint as governor - doesn't seem all that enamored with him at this point.

            On top of the leadership being pissed, most union members in New York hate Cuomo - or at best, don't like him very much.  Generic polling of "union households" up until now seems to say differently, but it's largely because they favor Cuomo over a Republican, and they haven't been polled about a 3rd party prospect challenging him from the left.  Essentially, the disgust with Cuomo in union circles is palpable and ready to boil over.

            So it seems they don't have much to lose when looking at it from that perspective - they might just be better off running their own candidate, because the members might not pull the lever for the WFP otherwise.

            "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

            by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 03:35:41 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  they'll have a candidate, (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        tikkun

        but to put a scare into Cuomo they need a credible Governor.  

        Difficult, difficult, lemon difficult.

        by Loge on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 02:41:15 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Given the reality that Cuomo really isn't likely (0+ / 0-)

          to be defeated, I think the WFP would accomplish a whole lot more by letting go of the Governor's race and identifying six or so State Senate Districts to turn.

          If all the WFP energy and resources were put to making a real Democratic majority in the State Senate, Cuomo would be seriously handicapped. Then, with the Legislature insisting on progressive policy, he either signs on or gets defeated law by law, appropriation by appropriation, issue by issue.  

          The good we secure for ourselves is precarious and uncertain, is floating in mid-air, until it is secured for all of us and incorporated into our common life. Jane Addams

          by Alice Olson on Thu Apr 24, 2014 at 01:49:45 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  you have a way with words (0+ / 0-)

      thanks for staying on this story.

      An ambulance can only go so fast - Neil Young

      by mightymouse on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 12:34:04 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  kos, if cuomo loses to a republican, then it is (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Aquarius40, Matt Z, fcvaguy

      more of a "fuck new york" than "fuck cuomo".

      think of the damage a rethug could do in that liberal state.

      it isn't pretty to imagine.  

      another case of hold your nose and support the creep on our side rather than regretting it later.

      IF another dem had a decent chance of winning, i'd be all for primarying the bastard, however, the very apparent danger of a third party idiot really screwing the people once again raises its ugly spectre.

      i am grateful to you for banning those who push third parties on this site just BECAUSE of the damage those short-sighted ideologues do to this nation.

      EdriesShop Is it kind? is it true? is it necessary?

      by edrie on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 12:48:51 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  New York had a Republican Governor for years. (9+ / 0-)

        George Pataki didn't too THAT much damage, as far as I could see.

        Also, keep in mind that being a Republican Governor of a very liberal state does NOTHING for your own national profile [see Romney, Mitt] so there's no use in becoming one just to further some sort of conservative agenda.

        I mean, you can try [see Christie, Chris or Erlich, Robert] and watch as the legislature lines up against you to block you over and over and over again.  

      •  Meh. (8+ / 0-)

        New York is a different animal.  Look at what we did to Pataki.
        By the time he left office, he could have been confused for a Democrat in many other states.  The Assembly - and Sheldon Silver - essentially beat him in to submission.

        Paladino was batshit crazy - like many GOPers are now nationally.  He scared the shit out of me.  While the Assembly could have limited the damage he did legislatively, he could have caused tons of damage in state agencies.

        But for New York, he's the exception.  For the most part, NY GOPers are weaksauce and can't be too batshit insane, or they don't last too long in office..  Unless they live way upstate in an equally batshit crazy rural area.  Astorino is that same kind of weaksauce you see from most downstate and Long Islan GOPers.

        Essentially - the politics of this state are just as weird as Jerseys.  What you see in other states doesn't always apply here.  As such, Astorino wining would equate to little to no actual, measurable damage here.  He couldn't pass abortion restrictions.  He couldn't pass right to work.  He couldn't pass any voter disenfranchisement.  Basically,  other then executive power he wields with state agencies, he'd be a figirehead.  The only real danger I see is he could direct state agencies to approve fracking.

        "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

        by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 01:11:56 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  "We" didn't do anything to Pataki. (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          AlexDrew, edrie

          "As such, Astorino wining would equate to little to no actual, measurable damage here."

          BULLSHIT.  I'm a 53 year old Black woman, living in Bklyn, and I've been living here all my life. I've seen the bad things that could happen here in the State and I can tell you right now you're deluded.

          •  What major (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            ChuckChuckerson

            GOP initiatives of Patakis time did he successfully implement?

            "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

            by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 01:25:34 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  I lived in NY during the Pataki days (9+ / 0-)

            I think DS has it pretty much right - while Pataki certainly wasn't the best thing ever to happen to the state, he also wasn't damaging in the way that some Republicans (see Tom Corbett just to the south in PA for an example) have been.

            Between legislative Democrats and the force of Man that is NYC, a relatively moderate Republican like Pataki will get dragged along rather than forging out on his own.

            I also agree that the amount of damage depends on the level of crazy in any particular Republican. I certainly wouldn't want to see Giuliani or Paladino in the office.

            Frankly, I have to say I've been very disappointed in Andrew Cuomo's stint as governor. A moderate Republican wouldn't be much different than what you have right now.

            Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves. - William Pitt

            by Phoenix Rising on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 01:55:15 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  for one thing Pataki f*ked pensions and hospitals (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              edrie

              By de-regulating insurance/hospital pricing, the smallest hospitals (often in the poorest areas) got hit hardest by insurerers cutting payouts to them.  Didn't happen to 1% hospitals in the East 70s.  Did happen in Bkln, Queens, and Saint Vincents.

              And then Pataki said market  is high, we'll save money and reduce pension contribs.

              •  And under Cuomo... (5+ / 0-)

                You have the charter school sellout, redirecting of foreclosure settlement money away from foreclosure prevention, and tax breaks for Wall Street.

                I fail to see a substantial improvement.

                Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves. - William Pitt

                by Phoenix Rising on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 03:32:30 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

              •  When did Pataki (0+ / 0-)

                fuck pensions?

                "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

                by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 03:36:42 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  Number one republican ploy (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Mannie, edrie

                  They always go after pensions.  When market is up, they cut contributions(saying there's a surplus) when market is down...they cut benefits (saying we can't afford to restore prior cuts)

                  See for instance

                   http://www.nytimes.com/...

                  http://www.nytimes.com/...

                  •  Note (3+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Mannie, poco, orestes1963

                    both items were blocked.  He was unsuccessful in raiding the funds.  One article clearly states Pataki was unsuccessful (basically, Hevesi told him to bugger off on an artificial lowering of the ECR), the other states McCall filed suit simply to get some case law on the matter of dipping into an ancillary fund, but could have blocked Pataki administratively (OSC/McCall ultimately triumphed in the case).  So Pataki tried - but failed - both times.  So we could say - and it would be more accurate to say - he attempted to fuck the pension trust funds.  He just never succeeded.

                    That's the beauty of New York:  Constitutionally, the Comptroller is in charge of the pension trust funds - making it difficult to near impossible for those funds to become the governors plaything.  Additionally, the state Constitution for the most part prevents any monkey business with the trust funds - including shortchanging the annual contributions on them.  The state Constitution essentially mandates the full, actuarially required amount has to be paid each and every year.  TBQH, if more states had a pension system like NY had - with the strong Constitutional protections built in we do - far fewer states would be having pension problems right now.  Pew tends to rate our plan as the strongest or one of the strongest on a perennial basis.  But that's a subject for a diary all its own.

                    Also note:  attempting to take pensions funds isn't just a Pataki/Republican thing.  Cuomo the elder - the guy lionized by some as a "liberal hero" in the way Reagan is lionized as a "conservative hero" by the cons - attempted to play games and get his hands on some of the funds as well - and was swatted down just like Pataki was.  Andrew hasn't tried to directly take funds already in the trust fund (yet), but his amortization plan he put in place a year or two ago is sketchy enough that a Constitutional challenge could have been mounted in state court.  For whatever reason - and it pisses me off - the unions did not file such a case.  I think it was largely because the plan that was enacted was less Cuomos plan and more DiNapolis alternative plan, and they didn't want to be seen taking a legit Democrats plan to court.  

                    It still irks me though.  Allies with DiNapoli or not, short-changing contributions in any way always tends to be a dark path, because when the bill comes due, no one wants to pay it.  I brought this point up to our union officers who simply dismissed it.

                    "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

                    by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 06:54:28 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

      •  You seem to be unaware (0+ / 0-)

        that the Dems achieved control of both houses of the legislature and the governorship in the last election, but then promptly allowed five of them to cross party lines and select a republican to head the senate.  This ensured that the Dems could not be compelled to actually deliver for the people.  A republican governor would only perpetuate the same comfy divided government.

    •  So why do you bother..... (0+ / 0-)

      ...venting your spleen at Cuomo if you won't do anything about it, besides kvetch I mean.

      Or as Meteor Blades has in his sig line...

      "Don't tell me what you believe, show me what you do and I will tell you what you believe. "

      Or as I would paraphrase:

      Don't tell me what you will do, show me.

      We Glory in war, in the shedding of human blood. What fools we are.

      by delver rootnose on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 04:45:15 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  who would be that WFP candidate... (8+ / 0-)

    Ambassador Kennedy, Anthony Weiner....

    “While Cuomo continues to hold a dominant position in a head-to-head matchup against Astorino, his lead is cut in half when a WFP candidate perceived to be more liberal or progressive than Cuomo is added to the mix,” said Siena College pollster Steven Greenberg. “More than 30 percent of Democrats, liberals, union households, New York City and black voters opt for a liberal WFP candidate. In a three-way race, independents are virtually evenly divided with 31 percent supporting Cuomo, 29 percent the WFP candidate and 27 percent Astorino.

    Warning - some snark may be above‽ (-9.50; -7.03)‽ eState4Column5©2013 "I’m not the strapping young Muslim socialist that I used to be" - Barack Obama 04/27/2013 (@eState4Column5).

    by annieli on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 09:36:21 AM PDT

  •  Good (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    jmknapp53, tardis10, Egalitare

    nosotros no somos estúpidos

    by a2nite on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 09:43:17 AM PDT

  •  Is he a bully, too? Just like his pal CC? (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Armando, Rosalie907, LilithGardener

    I wonder if the NY contingent was every bit as "dirty" as their NJ counterparts.

    Happy little moron, Lucky little man.
    I wish I was a moron, MY GOD, Perhaps I am!
    —Spike Milligan

    by polecat on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 10:09:24 AM PDT

  •  There's something else you need to add, kos... (25+ / 0-)

    New York State law designates the two lines that receive the highest votes as major parties and the remainder of parties with guaranteed access are categorized as minor parties.  Among the effects of this is that the county boards of election have representatives only from the major parties on them.

    New York allows electoral fusion and the Astorino vote is likely to be a combination of his votes on both the Republican and Conservative lines.  Therefore, if a Working Families candidate were to finish within about 100,000 votes of Astorino (to say nothing of if that candidate outright beat Astorino), the GOP would likely lose major-party status in New York.

    Enacting our agenda requires winning elections. Oh, and me on Facebook and Twitter.

    by Mets102 on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 10:19:00 AM PDT

  •  Can WFP candidate primary AC? (0+ / 0-)
  •  WANG! (0+ / 0-)


    If life weren't so damn hard, we’d have no need for fabric softeners.

    by glb3 on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 10:28:27 AM PDT

  •  If you get a real progressive running in the (13+ / 0-)

    Democratic primary, with a REAL progressive message, you can be damn sure that:

    1. The rank and file teachers will support that person.

    2. They will get the parents of their kids to support that person.

    "Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." --M. L. King "You can't fix stupid" --Ron White -6.00, -5.18

    by zenbassoon on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 10:31:02 AM PDT

  •  I hope so! (9+ / 0-)

    If I lived in NY I would be hard pressed to vote for Cuomo in a general election.  He is doing everything he can to screw DiBlasio and make the oligarchs happy.  I certainly would not vote for him in a primary.
    But I live in CT where we likely have our work cut out for us getting Malloy re-elected.

  •  Somebody's gotta do the work. (12+ / 0-)

    You cant beat somebody with nobody. If Schneiderman jumped in, he could pull it off. It'll take some heavy lifting though.

  •  The Koch Brothers Funded the Candidacy (6+ / 0-)

    Of this vile person last time around.  He probably should not be re-elected.

    "I'll believe that corporations are people when I see Rick Perry execute one."

    by bink on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 11:01:25 AM PDT

  •  when does the about face occurr? (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Rosalie907, a2nite

    anyone want to take bets on when he tries to "rehabilitate" his image with the left...frankly I think he can take his self righteous indignation and shove it!

    I can't force you to do anything, I can just make you regret it!

    by restondem on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 11:25:58 AM PDT

  •  The more I learn about Andrew Cuomo... (8+ / 0-)

    ...the less I like him.  And I've been learning a lot.

    All that is necessary for the triumph of the Right is that progressives do nothing.

    by Mystic Michael on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 11:52:16 AM PDT

  •  As A New York Voter (10+ / 0-)

    Count me in the "ABC" crowd.

    "Anybody But Cuomo"

    "Some men see things as they are and ask, 'Why?' I dream of things that never were and ask, 'Why not?"

    by Doctor Who on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 11:59:59 AM PDT

    •  I wouldn't go so far as anybody (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Aquarius40, raboof

      The Short-Fingered Vulgarian and Carl Palomino would certainly be worse, as would Astorino. However, unless the polls are really, really close, I won't vote for him.

      Hige sceal þe heardra, heorte þe cenre, mod sceal þe mare, þe ure mægen lytlað

      by milkbone on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 12:42:36 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Exactly. I really don't want to vote (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        milkbone, PinHole

        for Cuomo BUT - we could do worse.

      •  Crazy Carl? (6+ / 0-)

        Yes.  Because he was so crazy he was unpredictable.

        Astorino - not quite as clear.  Shelly Silver would likely be able to essentially control him.  He certainly couldn't do squat legislatively - Silver would stop that.

        The one thing he could do - approve fracking, because at this point, approval is in state agencies hands.

        But still, he's not batshit insane and unpredictable like Crazy Carl.  I'd dub him as Pataki-esque or Skelos-esque.  A typical weaksauce, controllable NY Repub.

        Not that I would vote for Astorino. But Astorino couldn't strongarm stuff through the legislature like Cuomo can, so idiotic things like the cohabitation crap for NYC charter schools Cuomo got through for Moskowitz in this years budget.

        "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

        by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 01:21:52 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Be careful what you wish for (0+ / 0-)

          Accepting a Republican governor who's allegedly controllable by the Assembly and the voters is a bit like accepting a nuclear powerplant on an active fault line, based on the argument that you can always shut it down.

          While I'd like to have a governor who actually governs like a Democrat, at least Cuomo pays lip service to some progressive social justice issues. A Republican would be just as awful as Cuomo, only more so.

          About that hope-y, change-y thing. It was going great until the Republicans fucked it up.

          by Permanent Republican Minority on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 03:42:08 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  A Republican governor (6+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Mannie, Jay C, rexxnyc, emal, poco, orestes1963

            in this state would never get the following through the legislature:

            1.  Charter co-habitation (as I mentioned above).
            2.  A hare-brained property tax cap.
            3.  A reduction in school aide funding.
            4.  Nonsensical teacher evaluations.
            5.  A dangerous pension amortization plan.
            6.  A reduction in pension benefits.
            7.  A tax cut for corporations.
            8.  A ludicrous "tax free" plan for businesses.
            9.  Billions in appropriations for various business subsidies (Nanotech, et al).
            10. Gerrymandered lines for state Senate, Assembly, and US Congress seats that protect entrenched Republicans.

            Should I continue?

            Point being - Cuomo is, in many respects, more dangerous than a weaksauce GOPer like Astorino, because Astorino couldn't get any of this shit through the legislature, and Cuomo can.  

            "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

            by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 03:53:06 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

    •  Same here! (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Mannie
  •  So sorry to see his life "complicated." (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    wrights, tikkun, orestes1963

    Perhaps his Republican friends in the State Senate can help simplify matters by asking the Republican in the race to cede the governorship to Cuomo.  Oh...what? They're not willing to give a quid pro quo for that little business last election cycle? Huh, funny, they seemed so friendly back then.

    Sure once I was young and impulsive, I wore every conceivable pin. Even went to socialist meetings, learned all the old union hymns. Ah, but I've grown older and wiser. And that's why I'm turning you in. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u52Oz-54VYw

    by SouthernLiberalinMD on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 01:24:10 PM PDT

    •  Actually (4+ / 0-)

      I suspect they would if they could.  They just can't and save face.  They need to keep up the appearance they're at odds with Cuomo.  

      "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

      by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 01:59:08 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Afraid of the Tea Party? (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Mannie

        Sure once I was young and impulsive, I wore every conceivable pin. Even went to socialist meetings, learned all the old union hymns. Ah, but I've grown older and wiser. And that's why I'm turning you in. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u52Oz-54VYw

        by SouthernLiberalinMD on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 02:11:06 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I don't really think so. (5+ / 0-)

          The Tea Party had some muscle here in 2010 during the height of the Tea Party phenomenon...

          But today, they're really just a very vocal annoyance with an elected crackpot here or there (IE: State Sen Greg Ball).  The mainstream GOP doesn't really fear them all that much here.  Even after Cuomo bludgeoned the SAFE Act through, few GOPers were primaried, and fewer still lost their seats.

          I think it's more because they need to save face with their mainstream voters - who are generally pretty pissed off the GOP is such a joke in this state and holds no real power at the state level.  Even when it comes to them totally controlling the state senate instead of this co-control nonsense we have now, they GOPers in the senate were usually pretty quick to roll over for the most part, only acting as foils on major issues.

          Funny thing is, take away the SAFE Act and gay marriage - and many of the the mainstream, rank-and-file GOPers in this state love Cuomo.  They won't come right out and say it, but reading the state level political blogs are interesting to say the least.  It's like they want to embrace him, but they just won't because his last name is Cuomo and he's a "heathen" on social issues.  Though some outright have - IE: the whole "Republicans for Cuomo" think organized by Ken Langone.

          TBQH, the politics of our state are.... weird.  Largely because we have a different breed of Republican here than what you see in other states.

          "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

          by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 03:07:23 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  That seems to happen in the NE. (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Darth Stateworker

            Sure once I was young and impulsive, I wore every conceivable pin. Even went to socialist meetings, learned all the old union hymns. Ah, but I've grown older and wiser. And that's why I'm turning you in. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u52Oz-54VYw

            by SouthernLiberalinMD on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 03:35:40 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Well, somewhat. (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              SouthernLiberalinMD, poco

              Maine and NH are as much oddballs from us as we are from the rest of the nation.  IE:  Maine electing LePage the crackpot as governor.

              And New Hampshire - its politics and the attitude of voters there remind me of Texas.  They're all "rugged individualists" that "don't need government."

              That may or may not be the case, but the last time I was there on a trip to Hampton Beach, I took a ride up the coast and around the state a bit on a non-beach day, and well, their roads were shit.  It was a bone-jarring ride through Pothole City.

              So I think they need just a bit more government and a just a bit less "freedumb" "freedom."

              "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

              by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 04:01:42 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

          •  Thanks for the local info (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Darth Stateworker, poco

            Local always trumps general knowledge, and kicks conventional wisdom to the curb :-)

            Sure once I was young and impulsive, I wore every conceivable pin. Even went to socialist meetings, learned all the old union hymns. Ah, but I've grown older and wiser. And that's why I'm turning you in. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u52Oz-54VYw

            by SouthernLiberalinMD on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 03:36:07 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  My pleasure. n/t (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Mannie, SouthernLiberalinMD, poco

              "There was no such thing as a "wealthy" hunter-gatherer. It is the creation of human society that has allowed the wealthy to become wealthy. As such, they have an obligation to pay a bit more to sustain that society than the not-so-wealthy." - Me

              by Darth Stateworker on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 04:02:06 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Which, by the way, was how I won (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Darth Stateworker

                a campaign in 2010 that was supposed to be a landslide defeat. I listened to my candidate, who knew the district. and boy was it hard:  I had to go against my training in the conventional wisdom of how you run a successful electoral campaign.

                But I trusted her to know her district, and she was right.

                Sure once I was young and impulsive, I wore every conceivable pin. Even went to socialist meetings, learned all the old union hymns. Ah, but I've grown older and wiser. And that's why I'm turning you in. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u52Oz-54VYw

                by SouthernLiberalinMD on Wed Apr 23, 2014 at 09:38:56 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

  •  Need More Liberal Candidates To Run Against (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Mannie, tikkun

    the turncoats.  Those democrats I could get behind to help NY get a real democratic state senate.  I don't live in NY now, but I did live in Rome, NY for 4 years and am still interested in NY politics because what happens in NY sets the debate for what happens in the rest of the country.

    "Don't Let Them Catch You With Your Eyes Closed"

    by rssrai on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 01:47:49 PM PDT

  •  I live about a 20 minute walk from the NY State (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Mannie, tikkun

    line. I'd love to be able to cross that line and vote against Cuomo.

    The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy;the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness

    by CTMET on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 02:30:53 PM PDT

  •  Absolute faith in omniscience corrupts absolutely (0+ / 0-)

    "And with news of Cuomo's corruption still seeping out, that bleed could worsen."

    "Cuomo's corruption?"  What does THAT mean?   No one's accusing Andrew Cuomo of being corrupt, only of caving in to the Legislature and party leaders who'd much rather there were no Moreland Commission breathing down their necks (which is bad enough).

    So, Kos, how about proofreading this stuff before you post it?

    •  Enabling corruption (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Mannie, poco

      Is itself corrupt.  

      Consider the Commodity Futures Modernization Act (2000) or the repeal of Glass-Steagall.  Nobody can prove those who voted for these bills were on the take, but they still led to massive corruption in the energy and banking sectors.

  •  another Maine? GOP slips in with under 40% of vote (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    mightymouse

    Cuomo and Working Families Party nominee split the majority 60+%.

    That would be a bummer.

    •  The Cuomo Democrats and WFP Divorce (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Mannie

      is fait accompli.  Cuomo made it clear he wanted no part of us.  We aren't hanging about where we aren't wanted and our campaign skills are proven.

      Newt 2012. Sociopath, adulterer, hypocrite, Republican.

      by tikkun on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 03:41:09 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Since I became a Democrat (4+ / 0-)

    I have only voted ONCE against a Dem (and I voted third party)

    guess WHICH guy I couldn't pull the lever for?

    CUOMO!

    I went with Kristin M. Davis :)

    I truly despise Cuomo!
    (See my profile comments)

    Never underestimate stupid. Stupid is how reTHUGlicans win!

    by Mannie on Tue Apr 22, 2014 at 03:02:09 PM PDT

  •  I think Cuomo is a Republican. I've never liked (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    tikkun, Mannie, spritegeezer, poco

    him or his policies.  Years ago my son roomed in college with someone whose family knew Andrew very well.  He was already corrupt.

  •  kos is right but (0+ / 0-)

    for different reasons.  let's get something straight about Andy. first he is not Christie. both are ambitious and both can be bullies. but Andy is too risk averse to be as obvious and corrupt as Christie.  Plus to be frank he surrounds himself with better and smarter yes men.
    he is a social liberal because it is safe to be it in New York almost through out the state. he is much more conservative on economic issues because it plays to Wall Street and it is still a state that is caught up with property and income taxes. so he plays both sides. and he gets away with it. Plus the Democratic Party is very aneemic and has a weak bench.
    he has only one goal right now and that's to be re elected by the largest margin you possibly can...lke Christie.  he sees this as his best way to raise the national profile.  If he perceived that a challenge from the left where to cut into his perceived margin of victory he would tack  left on economic issues as quick as you can spell populism. Or opportunism.

  •  Cuomo is a Repulican piece of crap (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Mannie

    I will not vote for him again. I will write in the name of a Liberal if I have to. No, of course I don't want a Republican to win but I am tired of voting out of fear for the lesser of two evils. Even the lesser of two evils is still evil. All it ever did was make true Democrats rarer than a hen's tooth. Why should they be for the people and not line their pockets with corp money if they will win no matter what they do. Where is the incentive?

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