I spent several days in an email battle with my sister after my dad copied the entire (Republican) family on an email after I asked him to stop sending hateful chain emails and sent him the facts to prove the email wrong.
Here is the exchange...
From my sister (the nice one):
With all due respect I have felt that it is not the conservatives that have made this country scary but the leftist socialist democrats who villiafy the conservatives that only want to keep us safe. No, I don't agree with a lot of things that this administration has done. A lot of conservatives have spoken out against many things that George Bush has done. However, it is the conservatives who are called racist if they dare to question any liberal. It is the conservatives who are made fun of and riteculed by the liberal media. Sarah Palin and her children have been treated very nastily and for nothing more that being conservative.
The things that mean a lot to me that the Republicans stand for are:
Right to life
Freedom of speech (which is becoming more difficult due to politically correct leftism)
Fair elections ( also more difficult due to leftist groups like ACORN)
Freedom for groups to assemble and pray if they wish.
Lower taxes ( I don't feel that we need to steal from the rich to give to the poor and make things fair. Go get a job if you need money)
Basiclly what Republicans stand for is being independent.
It is rediculaous for your friend to be afraid of conservatives unless they are trying to bomb the US>
So I fear that if the Liberals have all three branches of government we will be thrust into a socialist wellfare state and will loose many of our freedoms. Welcome to the USSA. United Socialist States of America.
My reply:
Thanks for the false caveat before continuing with anything BUT due respect. As the saying goes, we are ALL entitled to our own opinions, but not to our own facts. And let's not go down the road of "vilification," shall we? I think you are falling into a logical fallacy by claiming that "it is the conservatives who are called racist if they dare to question any liberal." Beyond being a fallacy, it just sounds whiney.
I have not attacked McCain. i have not called you racist. I have not done anything but tried to supply a few sorely lacking facts and express my OWN choice for candidacy. I have not even tried to change anyone's vote. I truly liked McCain before his delving into Rovian style campaigning. I respect his years of service. I simply don't think he is the right candidate for the times. He was absolutely the right candidate back in 2000, but that ship has sailed. And it don't think that his choice of Sarah Palin was the right choice at all.
There is no liberal media bias. That was based on a flawed study done by UCLA and there have since been studies done that actually show the opposite. http://mediamatters.org/...
Given the study's conclusions (that the media is replete with liberal bias) and the study's failure to acknowledge its authors' conservative pedigree, it is not surprising that a number of conservative news outlets picked up the story, as did a few mainstream outlets. Conservative MSNBC host Tucker Carlson interviewed Milyo about the study on the December 19 edition of MSNBC's The Situation with Tucker Carlson. The study was also cited by anchor Jack Cafferty during the December 20 edition of CNN's The Situation Room; on the December 19 editions of Fox News' Fox & Friends and Special Report with Brit Hume; in a December 19 article in The Commercial Appeal of Memphis, Tennessee; and in a December 20 Investor's Business Daily editorial by Edward R. Stephanopoulos. CBS News' Public Eye weblog also featured a post about the study.
None of the outlets that reported on the study mentioned that the authors have previously received funding from the three premier conservative think tanks in the United States: the American Enterprise Institute for Public Policy Research (AEI), The Heritage Foundation, and the Hoover Institution on War, Revolution and Peace. Groseclose was a Hoover Institution 2000-2001 national fellow; Milyo, according to his CV (pdf), received a $40,500 grant from AEI; and, according to The Philanthropy Roundtable, Groseclose and Milyo were named by Heritage as Salvatori fellows in 1997. In 1996, Groseclose and Milyo co-authored a piece for the right-wing magazine The American Spectator, titled "Lost Shepherd," criticizing the then-recently defeated member of Congress Karen Shepherd (D-UT) and defending her successor, Enid Greene (R-UT); when the piece was published, Greene was in the midst of a campaign contribution scandal and later agreed to pay a civil penalty after the Federal Election Commission found (pdf) that she violated campaign finance laws.
And specifically relating to this Presidential race...
http://www.latimes.com/...
In study, evidence of liberal-bias
Cable talking heads accuse broadcast networks of liberal bias -- but a think tank finds that ABC, NBC and CBS were tougher on Barack Obama than on John McCain in recent weeks.
I'm not sure what attacks you are referring to on Sarah Palin, but she deserves to be vetted just like any other candidate for office. i have serious issues with her as McCain's choice of VP for many reasons but least of which is her now documented abuse of power in the Branchflower Report (conducted by her own party). That has nothing to do with racism, sexism, or any other ism. I don't hate either of them or think that they are evil, I just don't choose them for office, so stop the "vilification" crap.
As for the Republican values that you claim, I too am for "right to life" - for our soldiers and the innocent civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan and for all those who could be helped by stem-cell research. I'm also for "right to death" for the terminally ill. I am for human rights and civil rights for everyone. I'm for freedom of speech for everyone and not just for some as long as they stay in protest zones, are not in the entertainment industry or are part of the Republican Party.
I'm also for fair elections, which studies have proved we have not had since 2000.
http://www.academychicago.com/...
Rep. John Conyers wrote a full congressional report on the matter of vote theft in Ohio in 2000. There have been many other studies showing more of the same. Greg Palast and Robert F. Kennedy Jr. have set up an organization to help ensure that the vote is not stolen for ANYONE (and, it has not ALL come from the Republicans, there has been some on both sides). http://www.stealbackyourvote.org/
ACORN has come under undue scrutiny and attack. They have not perpetrated voter fraud. If anything, it was registration fraud - not voter fraud. And they were the victims, not the villains because workers turned in fraudulent registrations for which ACORN had to pay. ACORN is required by law to turn in every registration they receive. They have a very strenuous mechanism for weeding and sorting out the bad ones which are then flagged. They have actually worked very hard to prosecute anyone that has turned in fraudulent registrations. McCain even addressed them with high praise way back in 2006.
Here is the fact check from Fact Check.org: http://www.factcheck.org/...
ACORN and Vote Fraud
McCain made some dire claims about a liberal group he said was out to steal the election:
McCain: We need to know the full extent of Sen. Obama's relationship with ACORN, who is now on the verge of maybe perpetrating one of the greatest frauds in voter history in this country, maybe destroying the fabric of democracy.
It's true that the voter registration wing of the Association of Community Organizers for Reform Now has run into trouble in several states. ACORN employees have been investigated and in some cases indicted for voter registration fraud. Most recently, more than 2,000 registrations in Lake County, Ind., have turned out to be falsified.
But does this constitute "destroying the fabric of democracy"? More like destroying the fabric of work ethic. There's been no evidence that the ACORN employees who submitted fraudulent forms have been paving the way for illegal voting. Rather, they're trying to get paid for doing no work.
Dan Satterberg, the Republican prosecuting attorney in King County, Wash., where in 2007 the largest ACORN case to date was prosecuted, said:
Satterberg: [A] joint federal and state investigation has determined that this
scheme was not intended to permit illegal voting.
Instead, the defendants cheated their employer. ... It was hardly a sophisticated plan: The defendants simply realized that making up names was easier than actually canvassing the streets looking for unregistered voters. ...
[It] appears that the employees of ACORN were not performing the work that they were being paid for, and to some extent, ACORN is a victim of employee theft.
The $8-an-hour employees were charged with providing false information on a voter registration, and in one case with making a false statement to a public official. ACORN was fined for showing insufficient oversight, but it was not charged with masterminding any kind of fraud.
Meanwhile, on the other side of the table, Obama wasn't entirely forthcoming about his relationship with ACORN:
Obama: The only involvement I've had with ACORN is, I represented them alongside the U.S. Justice Department in making Illinois implement a motor voter law that helped people get registered at DMVs.
He did, but that wasn't his only involvement. He also worked closely with ACORN's Chicago office when he ran a Project Vote registration drive after law school, and Obama did some leadership training for Chicago ACORN. The Woods Fund, where Obama served as a board member, gave grants to ACORN's Chicago branch; both organizations are concerned with disadvantaged populations in that city. And during the primaries of this election, Obama's campaign paid upwards of $800,000 to the ACORN-affiliated Campaign Services Inc. for get-out-the-vote efforts (not voter registration). Those services were initially misrepresented on the campaign's Federal Election Commission reports, an error that some find suspicious and others say is par for the course. ACORN's Chicago office and CSI have not been under investigation.
For more on investigations of ACORN and registration fraud, and Obama's involvement with the group, keep an eye on our home page. A longer article on ACORN is in the works.
No one's religious rights to assemble and pray have been infringed. There are churches of every denomination and every religion open everywhere in this country. No one has tried to close any of them, not even the Scientologists.
Taxes: No, I don't think we need to "steal" from the rich to give to the poor, but the wealthy and the corporations in this country do need to pay their fair share instead of skating out with loopholes and moving operation off-shore or receiving huge subsidies, which they have increasingly done over the past many years (including during the Clinton administration).
My friends may have some unfounded fears about visiting this country. I have tried to tell her for years now that we would protect her if she came, but she is not the only one that feels this way. It is a rather prevalent feeling abroad. http://www.travelagentcentral.com/...
This was my friends latest email to me:
My biggest problem with coming over there is absolutely to do with Conservatives – they are law unto themselves. And, as such, I don’t trust them as far I could throw them – not least with my family’s safety. Apart from the stuff we know about (the renditions, the torture, the war, the lying, the cheating and the stealing – did I miss anything?), where tourists are concerned, they’ve used 9/11 as an excuse to usher in all sorts of measures that make us feel like criminals even before we’ve set foot outside of the airport. And that we don’t get anywhere else!
Friends have told of all manner of horror stories (my neighbour down the street, for example, suffered a pretty horrendous 5 hour interrogation at immigration – on what was about number 10 of what used to be their annual family trip to the US with their young twin daughters. They haven’t been back since!) But I’ve also heard of others - pre-flight interrogations, epic queues at immigration, aggressive questioning at border control, even brutality (people being pushed and shoved, prodded and poked) for no reason whatsoever – not really an enticing prospect, or what you’d expect, when you’ve saved all year for the trip, and can go elsewhere (across Europe, Scandinavia, Oz ...much of the middle east...!) without suffering such gross and undeserved indignities.
I'm certainly glad that you have never found yourself in a situation where you had to borrow money or rely on someone else for any kind of help. Bravo to your independence. But the Republican philosophy comes across to me more as selfish and self-centered. I prefer a more unified and cooperative philosophy. But thanks for that little personal dig.
I'm not sure where the vile hate,anger and lack of skepticism and reason have come from in otherwise intelligent people, but it's truly disturbing to find in my own family.
My Sister:
I am sorry you are so upset about my response to the e-mails going back and forth between you and Dad. I should have thought it through better before writing it but was writing it between classes. I obviously failed in my objective.
I have no vial hate of anyone I just feel it coming my way. The job remark was not aimed at you although I should have been more sensitive. What I meant was that when We need money I get extra work tutoring. And we have had to borrow before.
I am not angry. I just don't think that socialism and big government work. The reason companies take their business off shore is so they don't have to pay the high taxes. I am definitely for making everyone pay their fair share. That is why I am for a flat tax with no loop holes or deductions.
Anyway I feel that you are very angry with me and I am truely sorry that I am so inept at making my points. I really didn't mean anything against you personally.
Me:
So this is not hateful? "the leftist socialist democrats" That's not vilification? Why don't you just go ahead and call them commie traitors as well? Limbaugh and O'Rielly do. So right now, according to the latest polling, over half of America hates America. How odd.
I have watched Fox for expended periods of time and find it to be the most biased news organization out there with possibly the exception of the online news magazine NewMax. And I actually don't have the time to do a lot of extra research right now either. I'm currently working two jobs.
I apologize if "crap" was too harsh a word for you.
I have listened to you spew hate and division for the past 16 years - usually over things that over time showed to be false. Perhaps, not being able to hear yourself, you don't realize how is comes across but it is vile. I realize you are just parroting the things you hear on hate radio, but I guess it's just worn on me. In my opinion, the candidates are men - not devils incarnate and not gods. There is no anti-Christ even though we seem to be presented with a new one every 4 years and there are no saviors that are going to sweep into office and save the world. They are men with policy differences, strengths and weaknesses. I find the religious fanaticism to be bordering on sacrilege.
The realities of the world today mean that we will have big government. The world has simply become too complex for "small government" to be effective. Whether it is the Republicans or the Democrats or anyone else, it will be big government. The question is - government for who? The wealthy and the corporation or "we the people"? But why we keep putting people into office to run the government who insist that government won't work and do their absolute best to destroy it is beyond me. And actually, socialism does work. The Netherlands is doing quite fine. It is not evil, it is just different.
The reason companies take their business off-shore is not to escape oppressive taxes, it is to make more money because they can due to deregulation. Profit is the only thing that motivates business and they have been raking in record profits over the last several years.
I'm sorry that you got involved in emails between me and Dad. That was not my choice. I had asked him to stop forwarding false, misleading and hateful emails to me and this was the result. I agree that we should not discuss politics and have tried my absolute best not to got there for the past 16 years. I know I don't fit in this family. That has always been painfully clear.
Her:
I didn't realize that you fit into the radical left category but now I do. Sorry that you have always felt I am so hateful. How could you stand me? I will try not to spew any more.
By the way I have Friday off to take mom to her Dr. Apt so you don't need to.
Send the kids my love. Hope they are all well.
Me:
Radical left has become euphemistic with all democrats for the past 8 years. And it seems that all media that doesn't follow the Republican talking points is biased liberal media.
You claimed that a sitting US President was the anti-Christ or the devil, and I"m not a Clinton fan, but really.
We do fine as long as we don't discuss politics.
Kids are great. Thanks for taking mom.
Her:
As far as I am concerned there is still far right (neo-conservative) and far (radical) left. I think most people are somewhere in between. I don't recall the comment that you refer to, and apologize for it. My biggest problem with Clinton was that he lied and fooled around.
Not to make you angry again but you have done your share of hate spewing too. You have made fun of and ridiculed Bush since he was elected, referring to republicans as neo-conservitives as if they are neo-natzis.
We are both guilty of thatbeing partizen. I will honestly try to do better even if I don't agree with the politics of the president.
If Obama is elected I will try to be more supportive of him. I do hope and pray for our countries sake that whomever is elected will have the support of the people and will try to do what is best for the country.
I agree that we do fine as long as we don't discuss politics. I just makes me very sad that you feel that I am so hateful when I have tried to help you so many times through the years. I had no idea that you disliked me that much.
I love you.
Me:
I'm sorry. This has been a very long week and I'm exhausted. I don't hate you and I don't want to fight with. It's funny - John and I have Republican friends that we are able to discuss politics with absent of all the animosity. Perhaps it's simply the familial ties that make it more difficult.
The term neo-conservative was not an attempt to make them sound like neo-nazi in any way. It is a term that the movement itself has embraced beginning with Irving Kristol, the founder of the Project for the New American Century (PNAC) and the father of William Kristol. He wrote a book in 1978 called "Confessions of a True, Self-Confessed 'Neoconservative.'" The PNAC is the group that called for a "new Pearl Harbor" in order to gain the political backing to beef up the military and extend our presence abroad. The signatories of that group include Richard Cheney, Jeb Bush, Donald Rumsfeld, Elliot Abrams, Paul Wolfowitz and many more. You can find more information about them here.
http://www.newamericancentury.org/...
As for Bush, I'm sure i have ridiculed him. The entire world has. But I apologize.
We sorely need a President that can pull the entire country together rather than tear us apart. That is one of the biggest disappointments i have with McCain right now. He and Palin are stoking a very dangerous fire.
I don't dislike you. I love you. You have been my closest sibling.
Her again:
Thank you for the reply.
Me:
Your welcome.
I just got another email from Ann, my friend who lives just outside of London. She sent me a link to an article saying, again, that this is why she won't come.
http://www.thetimes.co.za/...
i really hope that someday she will.
Her:
The incident in the article is terrible but I have to believe that this attitude is greatly in the minority. All people I know including some black friends are not voting for Obama not because of race but because of a difference of opinion.
There is terrorism on both sides. A student of mine from McKinney had their neighbors McCain sign set on fire under their front yard tree and "racist" sprayed on the lawn in paint. Again I have to hope that that feeling is in the minority.
I do hope that your friend feels comfortable visiting soon or perhaps you could visit her there. That would be fun.
I hope that we can start healing the nation by healing ourselves.
Love
Me:
I'm glad to hear that you will be supportive of whoever wins office, but I do hope that it will not be blind support. I certainly won't support Obama (or McCain) on every issue. I will however, try to limit my criticism of either of them to issues based on the best facts I'm able to find. I don't support Obama in the $700 billion bailout. I understand that something had to be done but I think we should have looked at better "somethings". I also don't particularly care for his health care plan although I like it better than McCain's. Hillary's and Edward's plans were much better. I do, however, have hope that being a reasoned, intelligent and thoughtful man, he will respond to the voices of the American people. That is one of the things I have been most impressed with in his campaign - his connection with the grassroots.
I certainly hope that the fear, anger, racism and violence is a very temporary thing. I would feel more comfortable about it if McCain and Palin would stop using tag-lines like "terrorist" and "pro-American states" and if they would take a firmer stand against such things with their base. I understand that they can't control every person that comes to their rallies, but they can certainly set the tone. Sure there has been negative advertising on both sides, but I feel that McCain's campaign has crossed a line into promoting violence.
The robo calls trying to insinuate that Obama is a Muslim are awful on so many levels. For one, he is not a Muslim. One of the biggest things that Dad was upset about (you may not have gotten that email) was that Obama wouldn't take the oath of office on the Bible. As a secular nation, that shouldn't matter as the Constitution clearly states that there shall never be a religious test in this country. So what if he is a Muslim? There is a huge population of wonderful, American-born muslims in this country and to vilify them is an injustice. But secondly, he is not a Muslim. He is a Christian and already took the oath of the Senate on the Bible, so Dad's ire is completely fabricated and unfounded. It would make more sense for him to say that he won't vote for him because he is a crazy Christian.
It's not anyone's support of a candidate that bothers me. It is the dishonesty that I have a hard time with. In fact, there are some Republican's in office that I really hope are able to hold on to their seats such as Senator Collins in Maine. In fact, the other Senator from Maine, Olympia Snowe, is incredible. She was named as one of TIME magazines top 10. I really wish McCain had chosen her to be his VP.
The violent acts and acts of vandalism are despicable no matter which side it comes from and I certainly hope the person that vandalized your students, neighbor's sign faces charges. I hope that you are right and that our country is not really not as racist as we have appeared to be this past couple of weeks.
It would be fun to visit Ann in England. Maybe someday we can afford to do that.
I'm sorry if this has delved more into territory we shouldn't go.. I think you are right. We need to heal ourselves and our families. I hope we can.
Love,
Her:
This all started with my list of reasons for leaning republican. I obviously need to clarify some things. I definitely don't mind discussing politics and your note to day was great. I too will not support blindly but I may disagree with the president on different things than you do. I have not agreed with a lot of the things that Bush has done and have discussed those with my friends. I have been frustrated with him at times. Who ever we have as president I hope that they can listen to all American voices and come up with solutions that include compromises from both sides. I hope that Obama is capable of that. I do believe that McCain could.
As far as the health plan is concerned socialized medicine worries me. It is great when you are well but if you are sick, it doesn't seem to be. I know someone who has a friend that had to get on a waiting list for 2 months to get an MRI in Canada. If we had lived there when Charles had his myxoma he would be dead. I just have to pray that it works out for the best.
As far as my comment about getting a job. I was not referring to you as I have said. You and John do work and I know that. I was referring to me working extra to pay for things. But I was also referring to people who live on welfare generationally. I realize that that is part of the flaw in the system. Once some people are on welfare they find it hard or impossible to get off so the rest of us support them.
As far as the McCain campaign I have not heard Sarah Palin but a few times andhave not heard the term pro-America states. I did hear that from Tina Fey though. I did see McCain take the mic away from a woman at one of his rallies when she started in on the muslim thing and tell her that it was not true and the Obama was not someone people had to be afraid of and that he was a good person. I have also seen people at Obama rallies with nasty t-shirts about Palin with a picture of her saying that she is a -unt, so it goes on on both sides. But I have seen McCain try to stop it. As far as terrorist is concerned I have only heard that connected to Bill Ayers.
It is funny to me that before the campaigns most democrats liked McCain and a lot of Republicans didn't as much.
Anyway I didn't mind your note at all. In fact I agree with some things you said today.
I do hope that nothing I have said today has offended you.
And, lastly - me.
We're all good. Thank you.
I know that this won't be the last conversation and it will most likely get heated again, but maybe it's a small step toward healing a family if not a nation. There's a long way to go.