Republican presidential contender, and former CEO of Godfather's Pizza, Herman Cain was a guest on CNN's In the Arena with Eliot Spitzer on Tuesday evening.
Now the shorter version, I used for my title, and that was basically the entire interview with Mr. Cain. Eliot Spitzer would say 'Well, how about X?' Cain's answer each time was some version of 'I'm not gonna answer that...' or he would go off on some tangent that had nothing at all to do with the question.
It's rather difficult to understand Cain's platform because he either a)Doesn't really have one or b)He has one, but he isn't going to tell anyone about it.
For those of us who do appreciate facts and specifics, here's that exchange. Perhaps in the comments you can tell me if you learned anything new about Herman Cain. ;)
SPITZER: Look, you are running a campaign these days, both untraditional and also it's going to revolutionary when it comes to what government does and how it does it. I want to ask some specifics here to see if we can get a better sense of what it's going to be all about.
CAIN: Right.
SPITZER: You have said that excessive regulation is inhibiting innovation.
CAIN: Yes.
SPITZER: Which regulations?
CAIN: Try this one, Shell Oil did a study off the coast of Alaska, they spent $2 billion. They were all ready to go and to do some drilling.
At the last minute, the federal government said we will not give you a permit when they had an indication earlier that they were going to get a permit. Now why did the government say that they wouldn't give them a permit after they spent $2 billion?
Because they say that a study that they have indicates that it's going to do some harm to a town that's located, you know, 70 miles away as the pro flat.
SPITZER: I don't know those facts, I'll defer to you on those facts. Let's me ask you since we're talking - let's stick with innovation for a second.
Move outside the energy sector where I think most folks would say environmental regulation, given what happened in the gulf and with BP. Some reasoned environmental regulations appropriate. Give me another area where regulation has stymied innovation.
Silicon Valley or something related to the tech sector, something relation to - even Wall Street, give me one example.
CAIN: Let's take what the National Labor Relations Board did recently to Boeing in South Carolina.
SPITZER: Right.
CAIN: The National Labor Relations Board is trying to intimidate Boeing --
SPITZER: That's not innovation --
CAIN: Job expansion is innovation.
SPITZER: No, I want to focus on innovation here.
CAIN: Job expansion is innovation.
SPITZER: This is where they were going to put a plant.
CAIN: Yes, this is where they were going to put a plant.
SPITZER: But that's a separate issue. I want to talk about any -- any one regulation that you think is stifling innovation?
CAIN: Elliot, I can't give you one innovation, I'm speaking generally, and you're trying to pin me down on one.
SPITZER: Well, you're running for president, I think it's fair to do.
CAIN: I'll make the deal with you. The next time I come, I will have a specific point for you.
SPITZER: That's a deal.
CAIN: Let's do it that way. Here's the other danger about me walking in here with one specific one.
SPITZER: Right.
CAIN: Because then people will focus on that one, when there are many of them. We need to address the problem -- let me say this, Eliot. My approach to every issue is to make sure we're working on the right problem, not working on one piece of the problem.
Secondly, make sure that we assign the right priority, not the one piece of the priority. This is what I'm saying we have to do a proper assessment, generally speaking based upon the feedback, the people closest to the problem based upon the feedback.
We feel as if they're overregulated. This is why I'm coming to the conclusion that we did --
SPITZER: Jeff Immelt, the CEO of GE is the chair of the president's Job Creation Commission, right?
CAIN: Right.
SPITZER: As part of what the Obama administration is doing, they've just looked at all the regs out there with an effort to eliminate the regs that were cumbersome.
CAIN: What did they find?
SPITZER: I'm asking you that. Do you know what they found?
CAIN: I don't know what they found.
SPITZER: Did you look at the report?
CAIN: I have not seen the report.
SPITZER: If they got business folks involved, do you think they did an adequate job?
CAIN: I don't know, because I haven't seen the report.
SPITZER: OK.
CAIN: But I have looked at the Debt Commission report and some of the items that were in there --
SPITZER: OK, let's switch to that. Do you think they did a good job there?
CAIN: I think they identified a number of items, but they didn't produce a plan.
SPITZER: I think it's a plan. I mean, I saw a plan to cut $4 trillion over a 10-year period, is that enough?
CAIN: No.
SPITZER: How much should we cut this year?
CAIN: Eliot, I can't tell you how much we need to cut this year until I look at the programs in detail as a person who has access to all the information.
SPITZER: But wait a minute.
CAIN: Eliot, you keep trying to pick a number a group, a rule, an item and make that the whole case. This is why we don't solve problems in Washington, D.C.
SPITZER: No, no, no. Just so it's clear, I'm trying to solve problems by drilling down on facts and specifics, because generalities don't solve problems.
CAIN: I agree with you. SPITZER: Saying you want to get rid of excess regulation sounds good, but it doesn't mean anything if you can't tell me which one, Herman. All right, tell me which one.
CAIN: I would be able to which ones, Eliot. I can't tell you which ones right now.
SPITZER: So let's do this on the budget, $4 trillion over 10 years you said is not enough.
CAIN: I think the -- it's not enough because we added $4 trillion in two years.
SPITZER: OK, so how much is enough? I'm just asking you a simple question, how much is enough?
CAIN: Eliot, that is not an answerable question.
SPITZER: Sure it is.
CAIN: No, it is not. No, it is not.
SPITZER: Unfortunately, it is not enough.
CAIN: Eliot, because we grew it by $4 trillion in two years, OK, and I happen to believe that if you approach solving the right problem, which is what I'm proposing, I am not going to let you pin me down on a specific.
Listen to me for a moment in terms of what my approach to problem solving is. At least give me that. The first thing you do is to make sure you are working on the right problem.
Secondly, that you sign the right priority. This is my approach and this is the approach of a lot of successful business people. Thirdly, you surround yourself with the right people so you can put together the plans.
Now you can't put together a good plan to solve the problem until you do the analysis and you're trying to extract one thing out of many in order to say, OK, yes, I might be -- I would be able to give you -- I'll be able to give you a specific of some of these things in the future.
SPITZER: Are you saying you have not done the analysis yet?
CAIN: I have done some of the analysis on some of these issues, Eliot.
SPITZER: OK, so that's why I'm just asking for -- this is a number that you have to have some ballpark sense, how much do you think we need to cut over the next 10 years so we can bring ourselves back toward balance?
CAIN: I think $5 trillion.
SPITZER: We have to cut?
CAIN: I believe we will have to cut. I believe we need to be $5 trillion because we've already added $4 trillion. We need to bring that down as well as start to dig into what we've already done.
SPITZER: Let me ask you a question. Let me take something off your web site. These are some of you said in the interview. I just want to make sure we can understand - I apologize I'll put my glasses on.
It says here, we're going to prioritize paying interest on the debt. Then the defense, Social Security, Medicare bills and then put everything else on the table for dramatic cuts, right?
CAIN: If they had done it a year ago.
SPITZER: But is that a fair approach?
CAIN: That's a fair approach.
SPITZER: How much -- the things I just listed, do you know roughly what percentage of the budget that comes to?
CAIN: Probably about 50 percent.
SPITZER: It's actually closer to about 65 percent, but fair enough. It's actually $2.367 trillion out of $3.8 trillion. Now that leaves a bit over $1.4 trillion left total. How much do you want to cut out of that?
CAIN: I would have to look at it, Eliot.
SPITZER: What I'm trying to understand is, I want to know -- right now the negotiations at the White House?
CAIN: Right.
SPITZER: They're trying to deal with concrete hard numbers.
CAIN: Yes.
SPITZER: To figure out if we should raise the debt ceiling.
CAIN: Right.
SPITZER: If it were up to you, would you vote right now to raise the debt ceiling without cuts?
CAIN: I would not vote to raise the debt ceiling, Eliot. The point I'm trying to make is that a year ago, you could have put a plan in place where you would not have to raise it --
SPITZER: But, we're not a year ago. I'm just trying to understand --
CAIN: No, I'm not going to say what I would do in a crisis that I would not have allowed to happen.
SPITZER: OK.
CAIN: I would not have allowed this crisis to happen.
SPITZER: I'll accept that as a given, but now it has happened. You're going to president if you win this race on January 20th of 2013. We have the crisis, how much do you want to cut in next year's budget?
CAIN: What I'm going to say, Eliot, I'm not going to answer that question for you because I would not have allowed it to become a crisis. You're not going to pin me on that, OK? I'm not going to answer that question.
SPITZER: OK, you know, we have got to wrap. Herman Cain, it is always a pleasure to chat with you. It is fun and it is feisty and I hope you'll come back and have those specific answers for us.
CAIN: I will come back, I hope you have the right questions for me.
SPITZER: I always will. Thank you for coming in.
Transcript via LexisNexis, and video via MOXy's MoxNews on Youtube.