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night owls
Since tonight marks the end of the debates, consider this your place to discuss the impact of them all.

Blast from the Past. At Daily Kos on this date in 2005The War Over The Debacle:

Over at the normally cool TPM Cafe, there has been a pretty hot exchange going on between the Liberal Iraq Debacle Hawks (I use the word Debacle instead of War because I think it is important that we be clear that what they advocated for is a Debacle, whether they thought it would be one or not.) and those who opposed the Iraq conflict.

I won't get into the details of the debate - I think Matt Yglesias and Sam Rosenfeld wrote the definitive piece on the issue, but I wanted to note this churlish response from George Packer:

Sam Rosenfeld and Matthew Yglesias have written thoughtfully about the limits of liberal interventionism. They are right to say that it needs to be rescued from the tragedy of Iraq; over a year ago I said the same thing in The New Yorker when I wrote that it will take years to rescue Vaclav Havel from Paul Wolfowitz. They are also correct that some self-scrutiny among those who seem destined to go to our graves with the name "liberal hawks" is in order. Again, I would recommend a look at "The Assassins' Gate." Rosenfeld and Yglesias show no sign that they read it before they accused me of supporting the war to avoid the taint of dovishness and then employing the artful dodge. But something in their eagerness to prove that Iraq was doomed to fail tells me that they have another agenda than the salvation of liberal interventionism.
(Emphasis mine.) Holy catfish! The guy got upset when he felt accused of trying to "avoid the taint of dovishness" and then blithely accuses Yglesias and Rosenfeld of having "another agenda." Sheesh.


Tweet of the Day:

In the future, Gallup will deploy pollsters to follow each & every undecided voter around, asking "How about now? How about now? Now?"
@drgrist via TweetDeck




On today's Kagro in the Morning show, pre-game the debate with a Monday Double Shot of polling roundups, with Greg Dworkin and Steve Singiser. Plus: Armando asks if the 50th anniversary of the Cuban Missile Crisis will play a role in tonight's contest. Also: Why so much media interest in the mechanics and methodologies of polls, which don't count, but so little in the mechanics and methodologies of voting rights and voter access, which do? They've arrested a GOP operative in Virginia for doing what Republicans pay Nathan Sproul to do every year. When are they gonna arrest this guy?


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